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Author Topic:   what orb/degree do you use at maximum for the square?
next to neptune
Knowflake

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From: The Moon
Registered: Aug 2013

posted April 13, 2014 05:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for next to neptune     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If I use 130% on astro.com some interesting aspects pop up in my chart such as mars square neptune(12 degrees) and moon square jupiter (9 degrees) I just wonder if these aspect have a minor influence in my chart even though they seem so far from each other?

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manderin
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posted April 13, 2014 05:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for manderin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Saturn aspects need a wider orb than normal because they are felt at 100% and even beyond.

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LucieLemonade
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posted April 13, 2014 08:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for LucieLemonade     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by manderin:
Saturn aspects need a wider orb than normal because they are felt at 100% and even beyond.

What kind of orb are we talking about?

I have a wide orb Saturn Venus opp and if I read about other people's experience with this aspect my experience has been nothing at all like that. Many say said the orb it too wide to be felt. But I believe this is opp of what you are saying.

Out of curiosity, what orb do you think these aspects are still felt at?


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Ceridwen
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posted April 13, 2014 08:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
oh why donīt we just take a 15 degree orb for everything, so we have everything covered?
And then can verify (and if we choose to falsify) anything we find in a chart?

Actualy I think if we use these big orbs, we should simply do away with orbs and return to using whole sign aspects like in Vedic astrolog y (some branches at least). Of course it will work, it just will need a different set of rules or markers or whatever, than you would need if you used tighter orbs.
Different kind of astrology.

However by mixing it all up, all we will get is some astrology-sauce.


And yes I know, what will follow: "but I DO feel it at 17 degree orb even."

Yeah if this is so, who am I to tell you what you feel? If you feel it, fine.


Of course I do think that it is not THAT 17 degree orb of Saturn you feel, but something else is going on, you donīt see.
But that is just MY perspective on things. And at the end of the day, you have to decide what makes sense to YOU. Even if it certainly doesn`t make any sense to me using these wide orbs, but that is a result of my personal approach to astrology. Yours might be a different one.

So for the dilemma of orb, probably look for an astrologer you trust and find consistent and effective, and see what his approach to astrology is. His interpretation system. Most probably he will do something right. Mixed the right ingredients in right measure to get his results.


For me my maximum orb for a square is 6-7 degrees. But i differentiate between different orbs, and I differentiate aspects depending on if there are midpoint pictures involved, parallels/ contraparallels or if they are part of a pattern, or if one of the planets is conjunct another one which makes a closer square.

So my preferred orb is 3-5 degrees, but it depends a lot on the texture of the whole chart.

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next to neptune
Knowflake

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From: The Moon
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posted April 13, 2014 09:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for next to neptune     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ceridwen:
oh why donīt we just take a 15 degree orb for everything, so we have everything covered?
And then can verify (and if we choose to falsify) anything we find in a chart?

Actualy I think if we use these big orbs, we should simply do away with orbs and return to using whole sign aspects like in Vedic astrolog y (some branches at least). Of course it will work, it just will need a different set of rules or markers or whatever, than you would need if you used tighter orbs.
Different kind of astrology.

However by mixing it all up, all we will get is some astrology-sauce.


And yes I know, what will follow: "but I DO feel it at 17 degree orb even."

Yeah if this is so, who am I to tell you what you feel? If you feel it, fine.


Of course I do think that it is not THAT 17 degree orb of Saturn you feel, but something else is going on, you donīt see.
But that is just MY perspective on things. And at the end of the day, you have to decide what makes sense to YOU. Even if it certainly doesn`t make any sense to me using these wide orbs, but that is a result of my personal approach to astrology. Yours might be a different one.

So for the dilemma of orb, probably look for an astrologer you trust and find consistent and effective, and see what his approach to astrology is. His interpretation system. Most probably he will do something right. Mixed the right ingredients in right measure to get his results.


For me my maximum orb for a square is 6-7 degrees. But i differentiate between different orbs, and I differentiate aspects depending on if there are midpoint pictures involved, parallels/ contraparallels or if they are part of a pattern, or if one of the planets is conjunct another one which makes a closer square.

So my preferred orb is 3-5 degrees, but it depends a lot on the texture of the whole chart.


I see your point but I do feel like it's a pattern in my chart, so it might have some minor influence, not like a big influence like my mercury square neptune exact. This aspect indeed plays a lot of tricks with my mind though.
But my mars and moon are close together in degrees (27 and 29 degrees) and my outer planets jupiter, saturn and neptune are also close in degrees - 7 and 9 degrees) so even though they are far from each other, all the outer planets still make the square to my mars and moon. And the interesting part is that it's out of sign, cause it's my pisces moon and virgo mars square my cancer jupiter and capricorn saturn + neptune.

So it's not like it's just a little aspect that could be interesting to have, it's actually a pattern that makes sense to me…

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manderin
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posted April 13, 2014 10:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for manderin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LucieLemonade:
What kind of orb are we talking about?

I have a wide orb Saturn Venus opp and if I read about other people's experience with this aspect my experience has been nothing at all like that. Many say said the orb it too wide to be felt. But I believe this is opp of what you are saying.

Out of curiosity, what orb do you think these aspects are still felt at?


Even though I believe Saturn can still be felt at a wide Orb I almost never put it as a wide orb on Synastry charts because closer aspects will mean more in the relationship anyway. However if you don't have other more powerful Saturn aspects very often a wider orb Saturn can be felt. If you have a DW Saturn trine moon at 2 degrees then a Saturn square mars at 11 degrees isn't going to matter or be felt. But if it's the only Saturn aspect you'll feel that square alright. It's not like that with other planets. Anyway that's my opinion.

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Kerosene
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posted April 13, 2014 11:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kerosene     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey there are some aspects that I found out from really wide degrees

Like I have Venus opp pluto 15 degrees which makes a quincdecile.. which is like an opposition..
http://www.noeltyl.com/techniques/990801.html

The more you know...

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ueharaa
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posted April 13, 2014 11:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ueharaa     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So what orb is recommanded regarding each aspect?
Can we still consider a 10° orb conjunction? a 8° trine? a 12° square? Or is it better to see if it's more likely to be "minor" aspects? Are theses aspects still relevant?

Sorry if this doesn't answer the original question but I've also been struggling with this especially with charts where planets are close but not close enough to make major aspects.

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 13, 2014 11:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Could orb also depend upon the strength of the planet in the chart? For example, if Mars is strong in a chart, could it’s orb be wider than normal (10 degree for square, instead of 8 degree ) ?

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anonymidarkness
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posted April 13, 2014 11:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Could orb also depend upon the strength of the planet in the chart? For example, if Mars is strong in a chart, could it’s orb be wider than normal (10 degree for square, instead of 8 degree ) ?

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Kerosene
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posted April 13, 2014 12:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kerosene     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Idk logically I think 10 degree orb would count as in sign aspect.

Which I think has some influence!
Like Moon and Venus are in incompatible signs etc.
But the 5 degree square would be more in your face with the incompatibility of these two planets.

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LucieLemonade
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posted April 13, 2014 12:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LucieLemonade     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I agree with Ceridwen. 11o is too wide. I know in my personal experience I don't even feel or relate to an 8o aspect to Saturn.

And I'd hate to start mixing up all different styles of astrology.

Going back to the OP though, 9 & 12 degrees on a square is really alot. Perhaps look if they are applying or separating and how you relate to the one vs the other.

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Kerosene
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posted April 13, 2014 12:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kerosene     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ceri how do you feel about oppositions like is 7'38 degrees too wide?

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Kate August
Newflake

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posted April 13, 2014 12:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kate August     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here's my experience: I have moon square Saturn with an 8 degree orb. The moon conjuncts the IC and Saturn conjuncts the descendant - I feel this one big time. So maybe if planets are angular or strong in the chart, a higher orb will still be felt.

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LucieLemonade
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posted April 13, 2014 12:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LucieLemonade     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kate August:
Here's my experience: I have moon square Saturn with an 8 degree orb. The moon conjuncts the IC and Saturn conjuncts the descendant - I feel this one big time. So maybe if planets are angular or strong in the chart, a higher orb will still be felt.

Don't know. I have Sat conj dsc opp Venus conj asc with an 8o opp, my life has not at all been like this aspect has been described as or how others have said they experience it.

But, I have an 10o conj with sun/jupiter which I don't feel at all and a 7o sun/neptune conj which i feel gets in the way a lot.

Who knows. Maybe I'm just not that self aware.

ETA: having said all this about too wide orbs I've set Astro to 150% which makes an interesting chart. I now have 7 planets all conjunct one to the next through 3 houses and 4 signs. LOL

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lifefullofwords
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posted April 13, 2014 02:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lifefullofwords     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It really depends on the square but I wouldn't go beyond 8 degrees or so, and then only the planets were also in declination or part of the same midpoint configuration or there were some other reason for the aspect to be activated. If none of these or several other factors are present I usually use a 6 degree orb. Really there's no hard and fast rule and I figure that if you can feel then it's in orb.

quote:
Originally posted by Kate August:
Here's my experience: I have moon square Saturn with an 8 degree orb. The moon conjuncts the IC and Saturn conjuncts the descendant - I feel this one big time. So maybe if planets are angular or strong in the chart, a higher orb will still be felt.

I have Moon square Pluto and I feel it strongly unfortunately. I really wish I didn't. But my Moon conjuncts my IC and my Mercury, both of which square Pluto in tighter orb so I think that's why. My Moon and Pluto are also linked by a midpoint configuration. So I think it really depends on what else is going on in the chart.

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LucieLemonade
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posted April 13, 2014 03:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LucieLemonade     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:

I have Moon square Pluto and I feel it strongly unfortunately. I really wish I didn't. But my Moon conjuncts my IC and my Mercury, both of which square Pluto in tighter orb so I think that's why. My Moon and Pluto are also linked by a midpoint configuration. So I think it really depends on what else is going on in the chart.[/B]


I have moon sq pluto as well, not on an angle, but it's under 2o. This and the sun conj nept are my two most parts of my chart.

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lifefullofwords
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posted April 13, 2014 04:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lifefullofwords     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by LucieLemonade:
I have moon sq pluto as well, not on an angle, but it's under 2o. This and the sun conj nept are my two most parts of my chart.


I have Sun-Neptune too... a contraparallel but unfortunately it's the tightest aspect in my chart. It's caused many problems, that's for sure. I can't even imagine having the conjunction, that seems really tough. Definitely those are my two most difficult planetary aspects.

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LucieLemonade
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posted April 13, 2014 05:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for LucieLemonade     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lifefullofwords:
I have Sun-Neptune too... a contraparallel but unfortunately it's the tightest aspect in my chart. It's caused many problems, that's for sure. I can't even imagine having the conjunction, that seems really tough. Definitely those are my two most difficult planetary aspects.

They are tough but I think we're OK! I've seen worse.
Hang in there!!

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