posted June 18, 2015 06:50 PM            

For example, let's take Venus - it represents the way we express our love to others, our relationship likes and what we appreciate, etc.

But Venus doesn't rule the 7H in every chart - it can rule the 1st, or the 2nd, or 3rd house... So how do you know what "meaning" to apply to Venus, in X chart?

Would Venus as ruler of the 6H have a more important effect on how I view daily chores and duties / routine / health rather than my relationship likes / way of expressing love, etc? Or does it affect both areas equally?

Or should I look to the ruler of the 7H to see how I view "Venusian" themes, instead of looking at Venus (which rules the 6H)?

posted June 18, 2015 06:52 PM            

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posted June 18, 2015 07:00 PM            

What's the effect of Venus in a house versus Venus as the natural ruler of the 7H (mentioned above), versus Venus as the ruler of a house different than the 7H?

Oh dear, I'm probably losing y'all.

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Ami,

Hi!

You can look at any chart, really.
The principle is the same...

But to illustrate my point, here's an event chart drawn for today (my time and location):

Here, Venus rules the 3H and the 8H (and not her natural house - i.e. the 7H).
AND it's in the 6H.

So what I'm asking is: how do I know what meaning I apply to Venus in this chart?

Does it rule 3H stuff and 8H, and expresses itself in 6H stuff?
Does it still hold significance as to 7H matters ("Venusian" matters)?

posted June 18, 2015 07:06 PM            

First I would look at the sign, then the house. This will be the main functions of Venus.

Next it will share a little with the houses that it's signs are in. (3rd and 8th in this case). It will bring themes from those houses to the six, mildly.

The fact that it naturally rules the seventh I would consider the least important.

posted June 18, 2015 07:07 PM            

This one fact can make House Rulers very hard. The HR does not identify as a PLANET. In it's usage in the strict House Level domain, it is simply the RULER OF THE 7th, for example.

If it is Pluto, the Moon, venus or Mars, it does not matter when figuring out STRICT House Rulers.

So, you take the Ruler of the 7th and see what it does.

What other House Rulers does it aspect. What are the aspects? Squares, Trines, Conjunctions etc

Hence, we see the SPHERES of life interface with each other and it is only showing us spheres of life.

This can show us the life of the person with respect to serious relationships/marriage

However, there are levels in which we identify Venus as Venus. However, this is not strict House Rulers.

I hope that answers something lol

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posted June 18, 2015 07:12 PM            

Do I take matters of the 3H and the 8H, ruled by Venus, to the 6H - is that where/how they are expressed?

Would communication for that person (3H) be oriented towards practical things and give an analytical mind (6H);
and would their way of being intimate / "merging" with another / sharing resources also have a 6th house flavor? And how would the sign of Leo be manifested here?

Lastly, would that person still appreciate 6H stuff in others and their relationships (Venus in the 6H) or would they be more into 3H stuff (where their Mercury, DSC ruler is)?

Another thing, I have trouble "synthesizing" the meaning of a house ruler and the planets that reside in said house.

Here, Cancer rules the 6H, so the Moon rules the 6H and it's in the 5H... But there's Venus in Leo in the 6H (and it rules the 3H and 8H) - how do I make sense of all that?

posted June 18, 2015 07:21 PM            

Yeah, it surely does seem complex.

posted June 18, 2015 07:43 PM            

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posted June 18, 2015 07:45 PM            

In Vedic, it's supposed to be that the house the planet rules will set agenda for where the planet locates.

In the chart you post, moon is in cancel in 5th. Moon rules cancer so all the activities related to self expression and romance are in and for themselves. They also fulfill the inner needs of the person (moon)

Venus in Leo rules 2nd and 8th. So activities related to resources, shared values, taboo subject, sex set agenda for the person to find their partner (7th) who embodies Leo qualities. So this person gain their self worth, resources and have sex in order to find their partner... If that makes sense.

posted June 19, 2015 03:15 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
How does one know what "role" the planets play in a chart, given that planets rule specific houses in every chart (in addition to their "archetypal" meaning)?

For example, let's take Venus - it represents the way we express our love to others, our relationship likes and what we appreciate, etc.

But Venus doesn't rule the 7H in every chart - it can rule the 1st, or the 2nd, or 3rd house... So how do you know what "meaning" to apply to Venus, in X chart?

Would Venus as ruler of the 6H have a more important effect on how I view daily chores and duties / routine / health rather than my relationship likes / way of expressing love, etc? Or does it affect both areas equally?

Or should I look to the ruler of the 7H to see how I view "Venusian" themes, instead of looking at Venus (which rules the 6H)?

I hope I'm making sense.

---

I get you

IME,I have found that the planet in the house dominates the energy of that house.

So if you have Gemini on the cusp of the 8th, the usual interpretations suggests that you don't take life/death issues seriously. And may even intellectualize and reason them out a lot.

But I have noted that this is not the case when someone has Saturn there.Then there is a tendency for one to have a conservative/serious view of death or see it as something quite fearful(Saturn).

You must also take in mind that the interpretations or metaphoric meanings of the planets do not have a stopper.

In other words, the interpretations will be varied and contrasting- so long as they have the "flavour" of that planet concerned,they can also be considered as relevant.

Venus represents many things and the list is not exhaustive. But for me, Venus always represents that part of us that wants "ease".

This is the area of life where we are likely to want things to work out beautifully- Very similarly to Neptune. We may also delude ourselves with illusions and unrealistic goals.

So for someone who has Scorpio Asc,the 3rd house cusp is probably in stoic Capricorn. Not much of a "small talk" kinda girl really-as Saturn rules the 3rd house.

But when that same person has Venus in the 3rd, this softens this house greatly that the person often contradicts the nature of their 3rd house cusp.

We may not get an individual who is vivacious( as the Venus in Capricorn is not known for its vivacity).

But we may get someone who does enjoy talking to other people(Venus) a great deal. They may pay attention to how they convey a message and build a very good reputation on this *Capricorn*.

I.e "Steve have you met Mpho? She has an outstanding vocabulary and beautiful way of putting words together(Venus in 3rd)"

Because of the serious nature of Capricorn,this person may likely succeed as an orator in a professional environment because even though they enjoy talking(Venus). That does not mean that they enjoy superficial subjects (Cap).

They just enjoy talking about subjects that build towards a definitive end(Capricorn 3rd Venus).

And they also have a way of disarming others so that they feel that the conversation is not as formal as it really is(Venus in Capricorn in 3rd).

This person is also likely to be a very effective job interviewer(3rd); professional(Cap),yet not intimidating (Venus).

If we want to get more about this person, we go to the Libra,Taurus cusp houses(Venus rules them).

Are there any planets on those cusps that change the "flavour" of that house? Pluto/Mars will definitely change the flavor.

So say there is no planets in the 7th house of Taurus, but there is a planet(Mercury) in the 12th house of Libra.

Then that means that Venus enjoys dominion ruler-ship over the affairs of the 7th house(together with the outer planet aspects to Venus). But enjoys limited dominion over the affairs of the 12th house(Libra)- As Mercury is there.

So to summarize. Say the individual perhaps has Venus square Pluto.

Venus in in the 3rd and enjoys ruler-ship of the 7th.

Venus-Pluto square means that the persons needs to communicate nicely(Venus in 3rd) and enjoy the exchange of words,is disrupted by Pluto.

Perhaps here-with this added aspect-the individual may feel misunderstood or she may have to watch how she communicates- as not to be misinterpreted.

With Pluto square Venus, there is also a potential for notoriety and scandal; probably through what she says(Venus in 3rd) or a relationship she has(Venus rules the 7th)

So this person should really steer clear from twitter when angry- as they may say things in a manner that others misinterpret which gains them notoriety or infamy i.e "her words are racist" or "her statement is homophobic" etc.

It is also likely that she may enjoy research(Venus-Pluto conjunct in 3rd).

Perhaps investigative journalism that involves corporate or government (Capricorn)? Which goes well with her Scorpio Asc.

And since Pluto aspects Venus by square(7th house in Taurus and empty). She is likely to be in very confrontational relationships with others(Pluto influences the 7th house ruler-Venus).

She may even enjoy a controversial(square) relationship with someone very powerful(Pluto) or be involved in some relationship scandal(Venus-Pluto square)

The one lady I know who has Venus-Pluto square once sued he ex-boss for sexual harassment(Venus-Pluto square).

posted June 19, 2015 05:11 AM            

Especially Aries23, that was helpful.

But let's say that in the example you mentioned, Venus is in the 3H but not in Capricorn - it's in Aquarius. Would the person then have a mix of Capricorn and Aquarius energy, in addition to Venus energy *and* the aspects to Venus, play out in matters of the 3H?

And lastly, you don't look at the ruler of the 3H much (if at all), then? (Saturn?)

Would you only pay attention to Saturn if the house was empty?

posted June 19, 2015 05:33 AM            

Planets always retain their original meaning no matter what house they rule. Venus will always say something about our artistic taste and our relationship preferences in general, and Mars will always say something about our energy level and assertiveness.

When a planet rules a house it does not change it's original meaning. Rather it ADDS to it. A planet's natal position show our general attitudes with regard to that planets traditional meaning. The houses, and the planets ruling them, show the details of the types of experiences we have in that area of life.

A planet ruling a house is like an ambassador for that area of life, but it still retains it's original meaning. So if Venus the planet of comfort and beauty happens to get the job of being in charge of the department (house) of communications, She will apply her diplomatic talents to that area of life. If Mars the planet of passion and assertiveness is given the job of being in charge of the department (house) of health, Mars will apply his energy and forwardness to that area of life. The planet ruling a house is like the head of a department in a company, you could get a stern manager like Saturn, or a 'fun' manager like Jupiter in charge of different areas of life. But Saturn still acts like Saturn, and Jupiter still acts like Jupiter. The area of life ruled a planet shows where we express the tendencies of that planet. But not matter what, Venus will still be preoccupied with relationships, and Saturn will still be preoccupied with security and position. If Libra is on the 11th house cusp, then the manager of that area of life is one that's interested harmony and relating. The person who has this natal chart may see marriage as an issue that needs to be addressed and improved upon in society, they may have strong views they like to share with their peers about how they think relationships/marriage impact all humanity. They may also see joining a group as the perfect way to meet a partner. The sign of Venus will show both the person's general relationship style, and how they fit into groups and receive feedback from others socially.

About the 7th house...

As I said, no matter what Venus will always show our generalized artistic taste, and relationship style preferences. The 7th house ruler is more specific to our individual experiences in relationships though, and to the type of person we are attracted. The 7th house tells our personal story of what happens for us in close one on one relationships. Venus shows our general likes and dislikes in connection with style and relationships. The 7th house shows the details about who we wind up with, and how that goes.

We might have Venus in light and breezy Gemini and like fun, chatty relationships in general. But if our 7th house ruler is square Pluto we might attract a possessive, moody partner anyway. We might try to charm them out of their moodiness with our airy wit. They are likely to be clever somehow even if they are moody because that's what our Venus would be attracted to. Perhaps the partner's moodiness is combined with a sharp wit of their own, for good or ill. Both Venus and the 7th house need to be assessed to see a complete picture. There's no leaving either one out.

A simple way to look at it is to see Venus as our basic set of preferences, and the 7th house as the story of who we fall for and what happens in that area of life for us.

posted June 19, 2015 01:43 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
Thanks, everyone!

Especially Aries23, that was helpful.

But let's say that in the example you mentioned, Venus is in the 3H but not in Capricorn - it's in Aquarius. Would the person then have a mix of Capricorn?

---

If Venus was in Aquarius for the person, then the description changes.

Venus in 3rd still enjoys communication- probably has good relationship with siblings etc.

But with Aquarius as the sign of the 3rd house cusp,the communication style may be different.

The person may communicate in an unusual fashion,have an eccentric sibling/share a very unusual relationship with his/her sibling.

But even with all this said, Venus is a beneficial and so in the 3rd house, it does promote friendly relations, communications and a "buddy/buddy" way of relating.

In addition to Venus in Aquarius energy *and* the aspects to Venus, will these all play out in matters of the 3H?

Yes. If there are harsh aspects to Venus, much of what I said may change.

The square of Venus in Aquarius to Saturn for instance,stifles this energy and makes it more "heavy".

So when we see this play out in the 3rd, we may find that the person had unusual ways of learning(Aquarius 3rd house).

But instead of being encouraged to explore these(Venus in 3rd), the individual battled in early education with stern teachers and task-masters that may have made early life more challenging(Venus square Saturn in 3rd).

Or perhaps there was a talent in 3rd house matters(Venus in 3rd) and the person was made to feel that the talent was just not good enough(Venus-Saturn square)

So this may be the novelist dying to write(Venus in 3rd) but very easily discouraged by slights and rebuffs that come with being published(Saturn square).

And since Venus also rules self-esteem, the sqaure with saturn makes that a very big issue for the person.

The person may know themselves to have a beautiful mind and a unique way of expression(Venus in 3rd).

But there is also guilt,shame or some level of feeling "less than" that accompanies that(square Saturn).

So they may even be very shy in relating to others verbally and feel like they don't have a voice or are not that smart/ interesting to talk with(Venus in 3rd square Saturn).

And lastly, you don't look at the ruler of the 3H much (if at all), then? (Saturn?)

Would you only pay attention to Saturn if the house was empty?

In this example, the ruler of the 3rd house is Uranus.

If Uranus is also in 3rd, it will also add its influence and since being an outer planet,its influence will be the strongest.

posted June 19, 2015 02:09 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
How does one know what "role" the planets play in a chart, given that planets rule specific houses in every chart (in addition to their "archetypal" meaning)?[quote]

Their archetypal 'natural' meaning is never lost. The core meaning of each planet stays the same. The planet determines the dynamics of a particular arena/house, not the other way around.

[quote]
For example, let's take Venus - it represents the way we express our love to others, our relationship likes and what we appreciate, etc.

But Venus doesn't rule the 7H in every chart - it can rule the 1st, or the 2nd, or 3rd house... So how do you know what "meaning" to apply to Venus, in X chart?

---

Venus remains the natural principle of love, affection, visual aesthetic, appreciation of beauty. Further, it represents vulnerability, softness, tenderness (of senses, tissues), resonates to cyan/light blue, etc. Venus' natural (archetypal) meaning is not changed because a sign it rules (Libra, Taurus) is over the cusp of a house other than the 7th (or 2nd). Even using this language of rulership, we see the planets are in charge -- in their archetypal form.

quote:

---

Would Venus as ruler of the 6H have a more important effect on how I view daily chores and duties / routine / health rather than my relationship likes / way of expressing love, etc? Or does it affect both areas equally?

---

If Libra is over the cusp of the 6th, the Venus principle simply determines where physical health issues may be emphasized, the kidneys, genito-urinary system, heart, skin, etc, the nerve-skin sensory relations. (Often the paired organs/senses).

Venus does not become only a 'health & habits' planet in your chart.

quote:

---

Or should I look to the ruler of the 7H to see how I view "Venusian" themes, instead of looking at Venus (which rules the 6H)?

I hope I'm making sense.

---

Look to the planetary principle(s) of the 7th to understand your relational dynamics. If Libra is over the cusp of the 6th, it may be that a person feels relational stressors in those places of the body more than usual, but this should not be over-emphasized.

Don't get caught in the confusing merry-go-round of the 'chain of rulerships' approach to chart interpretation, which is another sign-based red herring. Yes, there is some validity there. But it is of far greater value to first make sure the chart you are using is accurate as to sign and degree on the Asc. Unless you have that certainty, you may be barking up the wrong tree with specific sign/planet descriptors of the various sectors of your chart.

posted June 19, 2015 05:32 PM            

Your venus would manifest in that house and the themes of the house. The persons particular Venusian inclinations would show themselves in their work environment, dealing with animals and health, if in the 6th house. In the 1st house, their personality and their facial features,(especially close to the ASC) would have venusian qualities. The house shows where your Venus shows itself. Not how your venus functions though, it will still function as Venus depending on which sign. Aspects can alter how your Venus functions. Not the house, however Venus in the 6th will obviously be a place where Venus is uncomfortable (fall house). Whereas Venus in 7th, Venus would feel at ease putting it's energies into matters concerning that house.

Venus is not to be read with the DSC, unless she is aspecting the DSC, ruler of the 7th or planets in the 7th aspect, alter or even support Venus. Even then, if a planet from the 7th squares Venus, say Mars, then you would first look at the planet and then the house. The 7th house should be read with planets in the 7th and the sign. If the 7th is empty, look at the ruler of the 7th.

I agree with Kannon, house ruler ship should be used after the ascendant is 100% verified. I hope this was clear.

posted June 20, 2015 05:47 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lotis White:
Hi Doux Rêve,

Planets always retain their original meaning no matter what house they rule. Venus will always say something about our artistic taste and our relationship preferences in general, and Mars will always say something about our energy level and assertiveness.

When a planet rules a house it does not change it's original meaning. Rather it ADDS to it. A planet's natal position show our general attitudes with regard to that planets traditional meaning. The houses, and the planets ruling them, show the details of the types of experiences we have in that area of life.

A planet ruling a house is like an ambassador for that area of life, but it still retains it's original meaning. So if Venus the planet of comfort and beauty happens to get the job of being in charge of the department (house) of communications, She will apply her diplomatic talents to that area of life. If Mars the planet of passion and assertiveness is given the job of being in charge of the department (house) of health, Mars will apply his energy and forwardness to that area of life. The planet ruling a house is like the head of a department in a company, you could get a stern manager like Saturn, or a 'fun' manager like Jupiter in charge of different areas of life. But Saturn still acts like Saturn, and Jupiter still acts like Jupiter. The area of life ruled a planet shows where we express the tendencies of that planet. But not matter what, Venus will still be preoccupied with relationships, and Saturn will still be preoccupied with security and position. If Libra is on the 11th house cusp, then the manager of that area of life is one that's interested harmony and relating. The person who has this natal chart may see marriage as an issue that needs to be addressed and improved upon in society, they may have strong views they like to share with their peers about how they think relationships/marriage impact all humanity. They may also see joining a group as the perfect way to meet a partner. The sign of Venus will show both the person's general relationship style, and how they fit into groups and receive feedback from others socially.

About the 7th house...

As I said, no matter what Venus will always show our generalized artistic taste, and relationship style preferences. The 7th house ruler is more specific to our individual experiences in relationships though, and to the type of person we are attracted. The 7th house tells our personal story of what happens for us in close one on one relationships. Venus shows our general likes and dislikes in connection with style and relationships. The 7th house shows the details about who we wind up with, and how that goes.

We might have Venus in light and breezy Gemini and like fun, chatty relationships in general. But if our 7th house ruler is square Pluto we might attract a possessive, moody partner anyway. We might try to charm them out of their moodiness with our airy wit. They are likely to be clever somehow even if they are moody because that's what our Venus would be attracted to. Perhaps the partner's moodiness is combined with a sharp wit of their own, for good or ill. Both Venus and the 7th house need to be assessed to see a complete picture. There's no leaving either one out.

A simple way to look at it is to see Venus as our basic set of preferences, and the 7th house as the story of who we fall for and what happens in that area of life for us.

I hope that helps.

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Brlliant Lothis as usual.. best