posted October 06, 2020 11:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Travelman:
There is really no way to tell. It depends on the topic of the debate, the people's knowledge about said topic, and even then, it is subjective. In general, too many (unknown) factors to account for to really know.

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Hey Travelman! Thank you for your reply.

posted October 06, 2020 12:27 PM            

assuming someone is interested in x over y or knowledgeable about it due to their mercury placement is ultimately senseless

also making better points and so on is reliant on many factors including audience

multiple people can watch a debate and who "wins" is purely opinion

posted October 08, 2020 06:22 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
I'm pretty sure Mercury in Leo is the Master debator...because they have so much practice with it....

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Lol thought the same, not necessarily cuz they're better at it, but in this case it's tied in with their ego so they'll do whatever it takes to win 😁. While the other one might be more passionate about winning, the Sun/Mercury Leo will definitely make it known that they've beat the other (based on how they go about it/their Mars). (the Aquarius will more so look at the facts ultimately, but might also bring more persuasive facts to the table - but the Leo will definitely be sure to charm everyone over)

At the end of the day, it'll be a dynamic debate cuz of the opposing planets Leo/Aquarius.

Edit
Actually just noticed the title... That 12th house Leo Mercury and Aquarius rx Mercury... Both of these (12 House and rx) play a large role when it comes to Mercury and debating. I think the 12th house might have more interesting insights although will have to really tune into the audience/be on their same wavelength in order to bring their point across, otherwise will lose their train of thought. Shyness is also a thing with 12h Sun (I have it) but the topic at hand they should feel pretty comfortable with.

I don't know much about rx planets, but I know they come with their own set of characteristics.

posted October 08, 2020 12:12 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Brenda_S:
Lol thought the same, not necessarily cuz they're better at it, but in this case it's tied in with their ego so they'll do whatever it takes to win 😁. While the other one might be more passionate about winning, the Sun/Mercury Leo will definitely make it known that they've beat the other (based on how they go about it/their Mars). (the Aquarius will more so look at the facts ultimately, but might also bring more persuasive facts to the table - but the Leo will definitely be sure to charm everyone over)

At the end of the day, it'll be a dynamic debate cuz of the opposing planets Leo/Aquarius.

Edit
Actually just noticed the title... That 12th house Leo Mercury and Aquarius rx Mercury... Both of these (12 House and rx) play a large role when it comes to Mercury and debating. I think the 12th house might have more interesting insights although will have to really tune into the audience/be on their same wavelength in order to bring their point across, otherwise will lose their train of thought. Shyness is also a thing with 12h Sun (I have it) but the topic at hand they should feel pretty comfortable with.

I don't know much about rx planets, but I know they come with their own set of characteristics.

Leo will still win lol especially with this topic (specifically the arts), I think they're gonna own the show honestly. Also the sextile to MC (Gemini?) Yeah they definitely at least come off as very knowledgeable (Gemini, as well as Aquarius are both scientifically oriented), but with the sextile between each other it'll come forward nicely. And if Virgo rules the first, they have an eloquent disposition.

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i have leo mercury, i generally stick to facts when discussing things because there's no point in doing otherwise

i find appeals to people's feelings distasteful when discussing things if you can't win with facts then you have nothing to speak about, that simple

there's always facts for both sides of anything anyway it's not like facts are limited to one side where opinions can be had

i don't rub it in if i'm right either, no point in being that person it's just sort of ******

always being right just makes other people feel bad when you rub it in 😉

your point about ascendants and **** was good though part of winning anything is how you're perceived not just facts, people responding a particular way to one person over another can change everything regardless of who's right, who has better facts, who's more intelligent etc

posted October 08, 2020 07:39 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
i have leo mercury, i generally stick to facts when discussing things because there's no point in doing otherwise

i find appeals to people's feelings distasteful when discussing things if you can't win with facts then you have nothing to speak about, that simple

there's always facts for both sides of anything anyway it's not like facts are limited to one side where opinions can be had

i don't rub it in if i'm right either, no point in being that person it's just sort of ******

always being right just makes other people feel bad when you rub it in 😉

your point about ascendants and **** was good though part of winning anything is how you're perceived not just facts, people responding a particular way to one person over another can change everything regardless of who's right, who has better facts, who's more intelligent etc

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Hey Dumuzi

posted October 09, 2020 02:30 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
Sorry, that wasn't a serious answer.

(Sorry, not sorry).

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posted October 09, 2020 03:00 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Brenda_S:
Lol thought the same, not necessarily cuz they're better at it, but in this case it's tied in with their ego so they'll do whatever it takes to win 😁. While the other one might be more passionate about winning, the Sun/Mercury Leo will definitely make it known that they've beat the other (based on how they go about it/their Mars). (the Aquarius will more so look at the facts ultimately, but might also bring more persuasive facts to the table - but the Leo will definitely be sure to charm everyone over)

At the end of the day, it'll be a dynamic debate cuz of the opposing planets Leo/Aquarius.

Edit
Actually just noticed the title... That 12th house Leo Mercury and Aquarius rx Mercury... Both of these (12 House and rx) play a large role when it comes to Mercury and debating. I think the 12th house might have more interesting insights although will have to really tune into the audience/be on their same wavelength in order to bring their point across, otherwise will lose their train of thought. Shyness is also a thing with 12h Sun (I have it) but the topic at hand they should feel pretty comfortable with.

I don't know much about rx planets, but I know they come with their own set of characteristics.

Leo will still win lol especially with this topic (specifically the arts), I think they're gonna own the show honestly. Also the sextile to MC (Gemini?) Yeah they definitely at least come off as very knowledgeable (Gemini, as well as Aquarius are both scientifically oriented), but with the sextile between each other it'll come forward nicely. And if Virgo rules the first, they have an eloquent disposition.

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Hey Brenda! That’ a very nice and complete answer 😁

The Leo mercury person has sun in Leo, rising in Virgo and MC in Gemini. And as you said, if is in tune with the audience has more chances to win. Not exactly because of ego (part of) but because of passion regarding a topic.

Additionally, the third house of the person is in Scorpio, maybe it adds more deepness to the research of the topics.

However the Aquarius Mercury person, ironically has Leo in the third house. I’m not sure how’s is exactly that placement but I always felt (maybe because mercury is rx here) that the Leo person sometimes is faster answering clever questions but harder to get concentrated. While the Aquarius mercury can focus quicker and take their time to learn something.

Also the debates from these two were kinda fighty. Even is the mars of the Mercury in Leo is in Libra, when they disagreed in something, they disagreed. None of them would give up their position and the discussion would be left unresolved. The Mercury in Aquarius was like a wall not wanting to see the facts shown by the Mercury in Leo and the Mercury in Leo didn’t understand how the Mercury in Aquarius got into that conclusion (and felt that was always lying or making up things from nowhere).

But in general but have their strong points, Leo Mercury is very cultured in arts and also sensing other people’s feelings and following their gut feeling (specially in the 12H). And Mercury in Aqua in sciences and mathematical or structure thinking (8H). But still, I think the Mercury in Leo when tried to learn anything with passion and dedication could achieve many things.

posted October 09, 2020 03:23 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
i have leo mercury, i generally stick to facts when discussing things because there's no point in doing otherwise

i find appeals to people's feelings distasteful when discussing things if you can't win with facts then you have nothing to speak about, that simple

there's always facts for both sides of anything anyway it's not like facts are limited to one side where opinions can be had

i don't rub it in if i'm right either, no point in being that person it's just sort of ******

always being right just makes other people feel bad when you rub it in 😉

your point about ascendants and **** was good though part of winning anything is how you're perceived not just facts, people responding a particular way to one person over another can change everything regardless of who's right, who has better facts, who's more intelligent etc

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Hi Dumuzi! Thanks for your perspective on the topic.

That’s true, all the Mercury in leos that I know try to stick with facts as much as possible. I also know a Mercury in Leo girl in the 10H that’s very into the facts and objective and a Mercury in Leo guy in the 7th house that when speaking about the things that he likes is objective as well. But sometimes depends on in which house the Mercury in Leo is. If is in a water house sometimes can be a little bit more emotional. A pattern seen in Mercury in Leo is that they are proud full of their knowledge and if they can add/improve it they will do it.

But the ones that can come off nasty or more emotional (in my opinion) in a debate are Mercury in Scorpio and Mercury in Sagittarius. Even if the facts are totally wrong, they will still fight their point of view.

posted October 09, 2020 10:25 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Brenda_S:
Hey Dumuzi

You're right that's not for Leo Mercury in itself, it's specifically for the conjunct Sun,I think that's a very powerful placement when both are conjunct in Leo. Your Sun being in Virgo translates it's meaning a whole lot differently I think. Leo Mercury (in itself, disregarding aspects) would communicate in an asserting manner without the need to achieve anything if their Sun is in Virgo. Although you definitely can't miss the prideful tone in which they communicate (afterall Leo Mercury Virgo Sun are in mutual reception). However Leo Mercury Sun conjunct is naturally not really the same at all. Maybe the fact that it's in the 12th house their attempt to win people over won't be as in your face, but I'd be surprised if they didn't at least try. Subconsciously, not consciously (that would be a Leo Venus trying to attract people). The Sun does it naturally as part of their nature without thinking how they'll go about doing it 'correctly' if you know what I mean.

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my closest friend has leo mercury conjunct his sun (he has leo mars conjunct his sun too from the other side too far from mercury to count) his retrograde (his sun and mercury conjunct my mercury) and he isn't like that either

when he discusses things it's generally from the standpoint of exploring possibilities and he'll drop an idea quickly if better points are raised against it

he's not so tied to ideas that he can't step away and the achievements are like i said about exploration not winning

that's not to say his opinions aren't strong, they are, just not in an "against all sense and proof" sort of way

he can sound like an arrogant ******* i suppose but moreso when you don't know him well, and him and i can have a similar issue there where people interpret things as condescending or arrogant when there's no real judgment attached or anything really

he's an easy person to level with even when it comes to bad arguments because stepping away and revisiting is possible

i fully respect very few people's opinions generally speaking (particularly when i disagree, i'm an ******* like that) but i respect his and will give them weight, consideration, and even take his advice to see how it pans out the respect there is mutual though or there wouldn't be any

my father also has this placement (mercury sun conjunct mercury leo also conjunct my mercury) and while his ego is definitely more of a factor he also will prefer to stick to facts in a debate (though if his emotions get pulled in he'll have trouble with that, his moon is in cancer my friend's is in taurus which makes a big difference there) he isn't the sort to try emotional arguments to get his point across

not like "think of the children" while saying something only vaguely related forcing the other person to have to be like "**** 'em" you know? that sort of appeal to the emotions

posted October 09, 2020 10:47 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by cindymenp95:
when they disagreed in something, they disagreed. None of them would give up their position and the discussion would be left unresolved. The Mercury in Aquarius was like a wall not wanting to see the facts shown by the Mercury in Leo and the Mercury in Leo didn’t understand how the Mercury in Aquarius got into that conclusion (and felt that was always lying or making up things from nowhere).
.

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i like unresolved debates so does my friend i mentioned with leo mercury, because it gives things to think about rather than the person just bending (which in my view can make their thoughts worthless on top of being wrong, there's respect lost for me if someone caves too easily from their position rather than it taking a lot to get them to step away from a view and time for it to fully solidify) and the purpose is like i said to make noise and generate thoughts

there's a confidence with leo mercury where it really just is "well i'm right and i know it" so winning is less important because of that, nothing outweighs us knowing we're right (and very little can shake that) and that happened before the discussion took place

it's not that it's impossible to change a leo mercuries mind, it's that it will generally happen after the debate and more thought has been put in and the conclusion becomes slowly reached (unless it wasn't a solid opinion to begin with because one thing i do that i've noticed in other leo mercuries is take an opinion with no real conviction behind it and then defend it as if there's a lot of conviction just to think about it, but we'll let you know it wasn't really important)

in response to the other stuff sticking to facts is important when it comes to being right so if you care about being actually right you'll stick to them over opinions

scorpio mercuries are bad with that though yeah, they'll lie and gaslight and nitpick things to change the subject etc in my experience both my mother and my ex fiancee have scorpio mercury and it's something i've encountered a lot

posted October 12, 2020 01:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
my closest friend has leo mercury conjunct his sun (he has leo mars conjunct his sun too from the other side too far from mercury to count) his retrograde (his sun and mercury conjunct my mercury) and he isn't like that either

when he discusses things it's generally from the standpoint of exploring possibilities and he'll drop an idea quickly if better points are raised against it

he's not so tied to ideas that he can't step away and the achievements are like i said about exploration not winning

that's not to say his opinions aren't strong, they are, just not in an "against all sense and proof" sort of way

he can sound like an arrogant ******* i suppose but moreso when you don't know him well, and him and i can have a similar issue there where people interpret things as condescending or arrogant when there's no real judgment attached or anything really

he's an easy person to level with even when it comes to bad arguments because stepping away and revisiting is possible

i fully respect very few people's opinions generally speaking (particularly when i disagree, i'm an ******* like that) but i respect his and will give them weight, consideration, and even take his advice to see how it pans out the respect there is mutual though or there wouldn't be any

my father also has this placement (mercury sun conjunct mercury leo also conjunct my mercury) and while his ego is definitely more of a factor he also will prefer to stick to facts in a debate (though if his emotions get pulled in he'll have trouble with that, his moon is in cancer my friend's is in taurus which makes a big difference there) he isn't the sort to try emotional arguments to get his point across

not like "think of the children" while saying something only vaguely related forcing the other person to have to be like "**** 'em" you know? that sort of appeal to the emotions

it's just something i haven't personally encountered with mercury in leo in my experience it's more like make noise to make it because no minds are being changed usually anyway "i'm right and if you disagree you're wrong but it's ok that you're wrong even after we discussed this some people just have bad views" tends to be the mindset, but it's not like a big deal or anything

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I believe additional aspects to their Mercury would further modify their response style or how open they are to changing their mind. I'm thinking a soft aspect to Jupiter would change it a lot. (not saying he has it, just a thought)

I actually can't think of anyone at the moment with this specific aspect (only vice versa, Leo Sun Virgo Mercury). So of course, it's solely based on how I perceive this aspect to be. But it'd actually be interesting to know that the only aspects to his Mercury is Sun, and Sun to Mars. Mars especially would add passion to his character traits and make him way more opinionated, even just to his Sun. So yeah, Mercury to Sun itself in Leo = stubborn opinions. Or does he have them in his ninth house? (But even then, I think one aspect that would explain this a lot is a trine or sextile to Jupiter, maybe Venus, but not really Venus cuz that would make him give in not necessarily cuz of facts outweighing his, more so in order to keep the peace which doesn't seem to be the case based on how you're describing him, unless maybe it's in Gemini.)

posted October 12, 2020 09:40 AM            

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posted October 12, 2020 11:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:
Aqua----more detached

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Yes! I know at least couple of them. They both in 12th so I thought 12th house might be a problem. They often end up talking about what they wanna. It doesn’t matter what’s a subject. They give bunch of unrelated details and could be so vague. One example: “Maybe, you can come for lunch”. -“Maybe”.
Later that day.
Aqua. “Why didn’t you come? I waited”.
“ Because there were 2 words suggesting uncertainty and No time. It didn’t sound like the set meeting”
Sometimes I lose patience and end up with “Just text me” Also, it’s useful for a prove and nitpicking when they gonna argue and deny it later.

posted October 12, 2020 12:00 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Brenda_S:
I believe additional aspects to their Mercury would further modify their response style or how open they are to changing their mind. I'm thinking a soft aspect to Jupiter would change it a lot. (not saying he has it, just a thought)

I actually can't think of anyone at the moment with this specific aspect (only vice versa, Leo Sun Virgo Mercury). So of course, it's solely based on how I perceive this aspect to be. But it'd actually be interesting to know that the only aspects to his Mercury is Sun, and Sun to Mars. Mars especially would add passion to his character traits and make him way more opinionated, even just to his Sun. So yeah, Mercury to Sun itself in Leo = stubborn opinions. Or does he have them in his ninth house? (But even then, I think one aspect that would explain this a lot is a trine or sextile to Jupiter, maybe Venus, but not really Venus cuz that would make him give in not necessarily cuz of facts outweighing his, more so in order to keep the peace which doesn't seem to be the case based on how you're describing him, unless maybe it's in Gemini.)

Just FYI I'm actually surprised by his Moon in Taurus, lunar Taurean are hella stubborn. My grandma has this placement, also her Sun in Leo (Mercury Virgo). I don't think anyone can ever change her mind. Unless she likes them I think lol.

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posted October 13, 2020 08:18 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Brenda_S:
I believe additional aspects to their Mercury would further modify their response style or how open they are to changing their mind. I'm thinking a soft aspect to Jupiter would change it a lot. (not saying he has it, just a thought)

I actually can't think of anyone at the moment with this specific aspect (only vice versa, Leo Sun Virgo Mercury). So of course, it's solely based on how I perceive this aspect to be. But it'd actually be interesting to know that the only aspects to his Mercury is Sun, and Sun to Mars. Mars especially would add passion to his character traits and make him way more opinionated, even just to his Sun. So yeah, Mercury to Sun itself in Leo = stubborn opinions. Or does he have them in his ninth house? (But even then, I think one aspect that would explain this a lot is a trine or sextile to Jupiter, maybe Venus, but not really Venus cuz that would make him give in not necessarily cuz of facts outweighing his, more so in order to keep the peace which doesn't seem to be the case based on how you're describing him, unless maybe it's in Gemini.)

Just FYI I'm actually surprised by his Moon in Taurus, lunar Taurean are hella stubborn. My grandma has this placement, also her Sun in Leo (Mercury Virgo). I don't think anyone can ever change her mind. Unless she likes them I think lol.

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i have a leo sun virgo mercury friend hate arguing with that ***** it's endless and gets nowhere and there's never any way to resolve stuff

the leo guy with leo mercury though we can always talk things out and get to some kind of understanding even if we ultimately disagree

he is stubborn, but he can still be convinced of things sometimes it takes a bit of reflection after the discussion is had but he does give in

at least he does with me but it's a matter of respect, if he doesnt respect someone he's less likely to give their thoughts weight and i'm the same in that sense so that's why we can discuss things and will listen to each other

his mercury is aspected aside from the sun conjunction it's square saturn, trine uranus, quintile pluto, and opposite jupiter

his moon is heavily aspected too sextile his venus/ascendant conjunction, opposite pluto, square sun, square mars, square jupiter, trine neptune, biquintile uranus

in placidus his mercury is 3rd house with his sun and mars

my sun is exact on his ic which probably helps with us connecting on some level

posted October 13, 2020 09:39 PM            

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