posted December 14, 2020 03:22 PM            

When a person has a planet conjunct the ASC, and to a lesser degree the Chart ruler, especially if it's 5 degrees or less, it will strongly alter/modify the basic Sign archetype of the Rising both in a physical and energetic way.

I'll give a couple examples. Taurus ASC is the darkest/swarthiest Rising Sign in an archetype sense. But say a person has Taurus ASC closely conjunct Taurus Moon. It will correlate with a much paler skin tone than Taurus naturally has.

Or say, take two of the shortest Rising Signs in an Archetype sense--Taurus or Cancer. If they have Jupiter closely conjunct the ASC, the are likely to be quite tall (unless something is offsetting this like South Node or Saturn). However, they will not be as tall as a tall Rising Sign (Sagittarius, Gemini, etc) with Jupiter conjunct same.

First House planets do not make a person more Aries like (unless it's Mars, or Mercury to a lesser extent). Houses and Signs are very different. Houses are just areas of life, and Signs are like personality patterns and sometimes some outer life patterns.
The ASC and the 1st House means "self/body and immediate environment". Think of these as a giant magnifying glass. Any Planet near same is going to get very amplified. In other words, someone with Venus conjunct the ASC or in the 1st House closest Planet to the ASC, is usually uber Venusian. If it's close to the ASC, then it will strongly modify the Rising Sign indications of looks, and some also of personality.

On a deeper, more spiritual level, a Planet conjunct the ASC or in the 1st closest to the ASC, often represents the nonphysical dimension that the Soul came into the 3rd, physical dimension from.
For Venus, it represents the 4th dimension, which is faster vibratory i.e. more "spiritual" and more "loving" than the physical. Individuals in the 4th dimension get along well with each other, there is a lot of harmony, a lot of communication, there are a lot of nature creations (thought forms), there is a lot of focus on creative expression there, etc. And in the higher levels of the 4th dimension (i.e. the 6th and 7th sub levels, individuals are training to become guides and retrievers). So when a Soul comes from that dimension to this one, they usually bring over strong inner traits and tendencies to those kinds of conditions. Hence, we often see a sweet, friendly, kind, frank, all around attractive and harmonious type of personality unless the rest of the chart strongly counterbalances same (like say, really strong and stressed Mars, Saturn, and/or Pluto). Often loving, but in a more personal way, rather than a very Universal way.

Btw, we're not literally "going to the Planet" after our body dies, but rather it's a Carl Jung "Synchronicity" thing that is connected to the Oneness/interconnection of the All/Whole. The physical planet "stands in for" symbolically, the nonphysical dimension/consciousness level.

Most people don't talk about this level of astrology, because most people are unaware of it, but the well known and verified psychic source, the Edgar Cayce "Readings", talks A LOT about this hidden, deeper level of astrology.

Some Planets represent nonphysical dimensions that are actually slower vibratory than the physical level (think of slower vibratory as meaning, less and less awareness, concern for, and expression of Love, which corresponds to fear, selfishness, etc states). These are Saturn, Mars, and sometimes Pluto. These correspond to what some afterlife explorers (like Bruce Moen) called the temporal hell regions.

They are not "the hell" as in Christian theology. No one or no thing sends anyone to these levels, but it is a Soul attraction reaction type thing. The great Law built into all Creation is, "Like attracts, begets, resonates with, and (psychologically) likes Like" on the deeper, energetic, Soul levels. We humans recognize this when we say things like, "birds of a feather tend to flock together".

The other difference between these lower levels as compared to Christian theology, is that none of these are "permanent" and there are many different levels within these unpleasant levels (some worse and some better than others depending on the rate of vibration). Retrievers/helpers/guides are constantly trying to retrieve individuals from these levels, but they can't until the individuals are ready to and want a change. I have had very intense dreams about being in these levels and trying to move individuals out and into the higher, lighter, and happier levels.

Saturn corresponds to the levels where the really nasty, psychopathic people go when their bodies die. These are the "hard cases". Tend to be hard to retrieve. Some eventually experience a true and final death--i.e. they unconsciously destroy their own Soul structure and then cease to exist as a self aware, individual, choosing, consciousness.

The Mars levels are lighter and not quite so horrific. It's where angry warriors/soldiers, narcissists, petty thieves, suicides, and the like often end up. Individuals focused here are often much easier to retrieve (help move out) than the Souls in the Saturn levels.

Many of us helper, service Souls--those of us that gravitate to helping professions like teachers, counselors, nurses, in home care workers, psychologists, etc do retrieval work during their sleep state. Most though, only really work with those that we call "ghosts". Those that are not in the lower and unpleasant levels, but overly attached to the physical and while they could move to the lighter, nonphysical levels, they are stuck (often times, they don't even know they are not in the body anymore).

This, btw, corresponds to the Moon. (Some suicides end up here, rather than the Mars levels). Some poor Souls, spend what we perceive as centuries in the "in between" Lunar level before they are able to move out and go where they truly belong (usually Venus or Mercury). This is why people with very strong Moon, tend to be so emotional. Because the physical is the emotional level to begin with, but those emotions get heightened and amplified when you're detached from the body, but still strongly resonating with the physical energies. And the Souls at this level, often replay their traumas, fears, etc, over and over, and over again. You can imagine that builds up quite the habit of dwelling in certain emotional states (often, unpleasant ones--probably why the Moon has associations with lunacy/mental health imbalances).

I believe Cayce's clues about how all this works, is some of the most important astrological knowledge there is. Cayce's guidance does not go into all the specifics that I have mentioned in the above. I have had to go within, do some exploring and communicating with guidance, and figure out a lot of this on my own (though with the help of nonphysical guidance).

Jupiter, Neptune, and Sun btw, correspond to the very fast vibratory levels that are hard to put into words and material concepts. But basically, these are Guidance levels, where a more Universal Love is more conscious and strong.
Uranus is an odd level. It seems to correspond to a very fast vibratory level, that is cleansing and balancing in nature, and which a Spirit whose connected Soul has experienced the Saturn Soul death, creates another Soul with part of the old, non existing Soul (memories, lifetime patterns, etc) in it, and then sends them to the Uranus dimension for sort of a cleansing, balancing process. Then that Soul usually immediately incarnates, and then has tendencies towards both very loving/fast vibratory expressions and attunements, but also some of their other Soul's (the one that died) much more selfish and destructive tendencies.

posted December 14, 2020 03:39 PM            

(Why? Because we are running out of time).

Because I just wasn't making enough through my part time jobs, I had to decide to make a change. I was supposed to start a new, old job beginning of December, but a series of very Mercury retrograde like events developed (maybe correlated with T Pluto and Saturn are in my 6th, with T. Pluto squaring N. Pluto in the 3rd) , and longer story shorter, I'm starting this week instead. This job will take up MUCH of my time and energy unfortunately. Like 11hr days away from home, manual labor, 5 to 6 days a week kind of stuff.

And what little time and energy I will have, I really should devote to writing the book I've begun. And I'm finding the Siren call of Pluto in the 3rd in relation to forums too tempting and powerful, so probably need to go cold turkey like I did for 6 months or so previously. (Y'all had a nice vacation from da preacher man).

posted December 14, 2020 04:35 PM            

As I thoroughly enjoy what you share.
I read your post but will need re-read as I am less immediate to absorb often.
I do wonder your thoughts on a Cayce question I forgot a few wks back.

He was known as the Sleeping Prophet. Could that relate to any of us nearly Awaking as well? Ok my thoughts are re when we experience what is extrasensory or psychic type energy, could it be much like the *sleeping patient* in a hospital bed. They report seeing nurses, hearing conversation and smells etc EVEN when they were in comas. could our sleep and waking be nearer if we are experiencing extrasensory effects? Thank you for your kind thoughts. As always- they are appreciated.

posted December 14, 2020 07:53 PM            

To answer your question, if I'm understanding it correctly, I think it relates more to how when we go to sleep, our Souls phase their vibratory rates to experience other dimensions and levels. Some dreams are a symbolic remembrance of experiences or perceptions from these other, nonphysical levels/dimensions. We can think of it as "going out of our bodies", except that this is not really accurate. In the true reality, there is no linear time and space, and thus one isn't actually "going" anywhere. It's a matter of vibrational phasing. You can experience this while focusing from the body, but its harder to do.

With EC, he needed to "submerge" his conscious, personality-egoic mind, and become unconscious to that part of him, to act as a mostly clear channel. He just didn't have the spiritual/Love attunement and balance to do it fully consciously in his waking state. He was quite psychic as well in his waking state, but he wouldn't have been able to tap in like he did without his essentially "going asleep" process.

I use Tropical for individuals i.e. their character, personality, etc. Guidance has told me that Vedic/Sidereal is more accurate for collective, event type level of astrology. For example, when Pluto moves more fully into Sidereal Capricorn, along with Jupiter and Saturn which are already there, I expect things to get rather interesting as far as world events. By further in, I mean past 7 degrees or so, S. Capricorn.

Capricorn is the World shaker/mover Sign par excellence, being the last of the Cardinal Signs, being the last of the Earth Signs, and being a Universal/collective Sign. Also, it is a testing Sign. And then Saturn and Pluto being the testers and challengers par excellence.

I see Saturn as being both. Saturn, the Universal symbol, for everyone, is the karmic taskmaster and balancer. It represents that part of our Expanded Self that really wants us to grow and mature, and so it puts us through tests, challenges, sudden major changes that are difficult, etc. In that sense, that level or part of Saturn is very positive and necessary.

But Saturn can also represent, when it's very highlighted in an individuals chart, like say conjunct the ASC or in the 1st and only Planet in same, a "devil" like energy. Rather I call it a ASPD type energy/symbol (sociopathic/psychopathic). I have done a lot of charts of known and suspected psychopaths from serial killers to folks like Dick Cheney, and when the charts are accurate or adjusted to be accurate (fit looks, personality, life patterns, synastry and/or life events), Saturn is almost always the most highlighted Planet at the same time with a lack of focus on Venus, Neptune, Jupiter, and Sun. It has to be the specific combo for it to express that negatively from what I've seen.

This strongly aligns with what Cayce's guidance said about Saturn representing the lower levels and the rare, true, permanent Soul death. His guidance sometimes said things like, "Saturn, to that which all insufficient matter is cast for the remolding". Meaning, if a Soul becomes so cut off from Love, from positivity, from its inner Source, it experiences a chaotic, entropic consciousness unraveling, which leads to true death--Soul death.

Yeshua warned some of the psychopaths incarnated in his time who were in positions of power and corruption as Pharisees, Sadducee's, etc that if they kept up their negative, power hungry, destructive ways, that their fate/destiny would be the above. He compared it to them going to Gehenna, which was a place where children had been sacrificed and burned (some say it was a trash dump, but apparently there is less evidence for that).

There are some sources that say that this just happens naturally on its own (Bruce Moen), and some sources (Tom Campbell) say that a spiritual authority being facilitates the process at times. What I've been told so far, leans more to what Bruce Moen has said, but I don't rule out completely the latter sometimes happening either.

Think about it this way. Say there is a rabid animal that is just causing destruction and mayhem all the time. You've tried everything to help the animal, from behavior therapy to medical treatment and no matter what you do, the animal doesn't change but keeps attacking people and other animals. What is the most kind, compassionate, and practical thing to do, both for the animal (which is obviously suffering) and for those it has, is, and will attack? The only real choice in such a case, is putting it down.

posted December 14, 2020 10:27 PM            

Thank you GCE for a wonderful explanation.

In terms of aquarius in tropical it is not then the true Awakening sign? Rather it is Capricorn in vedic?
In tropical, is Aqua a bad sign as some say? My last response was much better thought out.

In terms of sleeping, I have been OOB before and even been so deeply asleep, my hubby couldn't bring me to awaken. Truly I would be filled with rejoice if I awoke to find all this has been an elaborate dream we all are in together. The bigger question if as you say we are in essence dreaming or living like the dreamers in 3D while our guides are in 5D - were we born this way or somehow it was triggered for us? As though we fell into it. Much like we hear in a certain book of *fallen Angels*?

Sorry my mind is a bit all over. Funny as the new user puts it "So few words, so little time".

Anyway I have more. Maybe I'll leave this and see what your thoughts are.

Some or a lot criticize Aquarius. I've heard Anti.Ch philosophy as well from the Religious sector. Yet to my understanding of self, as well other Aquarius energies, they aren't types to want a flock. Maybe Oprah, I've forgotten, maybe Elon Musk*, but I haven't seen many. Unless I'm just unaware of the current known people in the world of
Arts/Politics. Actually imo Aqu is the last, most ascended Air sign. I believe it must be the most underestimated to actually be the lightest. Feather lightest .

posted January 01, 2021 05:23 AM            

quote:

---

Lost my writing. I'll try to add a new
response in awhile.

Thank you GCE for a wonderful explanation.

In terms of aquarius in tropical it is not then the true Awakening sign? Rather it is Capricorn in vedic?
In tropical, is Aqua a bad sign as some say? My last response was much better thought out.

In terms of sleeping, I have been OOB before and even been so deeply asleep, my hubby couldn't bring me to awaken. Truly I would be filled with rejoice if I awoke to find all this has been an elaborate dream we all are in together. The bigger question if as you say we are in essence dreaming or living like the dreamers in 3D while our guides are in 5D - were we born this way or somehow it was triggered for us? As though we fell into it. Much like we hear in a certain book of *fallen Angels*?

Sorry my mind is a bit all over. Funny as the new user puts it "So few words, so little time".

Anyway I have more. Maybe I'll leave this and see what your thoughts are.

Some or a lot criticize Aquarius. I've heard Anti.Ch philosophy as well from the Religious sector. Yet to my understanding of self, as well other Aquarius energies, they aren't types to want a flock. Maybe Oprah, I've forgotten, maybe Elon Musk*, but I haven't seen many. Unless I'm just unaware of the current known people in the world of
Arts/Politics. Actually imo Aqu is the last, most ascended Air sign. I believe it must be the most underestimated to actually be the lightest. Feather lightest .

---

For the individual psyche, Tropical Aquarius can symbolize the awakened/awakener. But for the collective and event type level of astrology, that would be S. Aquarius i.e. most of tropical Pisces.

Who says that Aquarius is a bad sign in tropical astrology? I have mentioned it before, but while generally Cayce's guidance didn't pay much attention to Zodiac Signs, they did pay Tropical Aquarius a very high compliment one time when they said that Yeshua's mother and twin soul was an Aquarius Sun, and was essentially perfect in her perception. Meaning, she perceived things in a very clear, balanced, expanded, and fast vibratory way.

Did she actively live the truth as well as her son and twin soul? Perhaps not quite to the same degree, otherwise she would have ascended earlier. Also, would he have contradicted her even as a child?

But like E.C.'s guidance, I also don't put as much focus on Signs, but more on Planetary strengths. Aquarius will express very differently depending on which Planets are strongest and which are most passive or least conscious. For example, when Saturn, Mars Pluto, and/or Mercury are strongest but Venus, Neptune, Jupiter, and Sun are passive, you can get a monster like Dick Cheney who not only has Aquarius Sun but also Pisces Moon! Very different than what these Signs normally might indicate.

You can't focus too much on the Signs alone. They are only a very partial picture. The foundation of a chart are the relative Planetary strengths, as these relate more to Soul development or lack, while Signs relate more to earthly patterns and things like "personality".

As to the larger nature of reality. It feels like the deeper truth is, we all exist in all levels simultaneously, but are focusing on parts at different points for different reasons. Hard to put it into material terms. The trick is, to bring these all into balance and conscious awareness simultaneously, which unlocks our true, original nature--i.e. our Source like nature which can be symbolized by the clear/white Light.

If the various different colors are like the different planets, the different dimensions, the different centers/glands in our bodies, etc, then note--these are all attributes and parts of the clear/white light. What is the clear/white light--them all integrated, balanced, merged simultaneously or in spiritual terms, all conscious and balanced simultaneously. EC's guidance summed it up in the example of Yeshua, and that his Soul has mastered all the lessons and attributes of the different Planets as symbols of Consciousness. For example, they said of Yeshua "in wrath (Mars) made perfect, in death (Saturn) made perfect, in mind (Mercury) made perfect, in flesh (earth) made perfect, in love (Venus) made perfect", etc, etc

This is a physical analogy or metaphor that has so much deeper truth. And how do we get there? Through living, choosing, and opening up to pure, Universal Love. This is also the nature of the clear/white Light. Love and balance are what primarily unlocks/unveils that true and original Source like nature of our consciousness.

As to living Love, to some extent, that will be different for each individual, as each individual bears and has a relative and unique relationship to its Source, and yet, there are more similarities than differences all in all (between us as Souls and Spirit) and hence, there are somewhat "Universals" or "average tendencies" too.