Thread Closed  Topic Closed
  Lindaland
  Global Unity 2.0
  2012 isn't the end of the world, Mayans insist

Post New Topic  
profile | register | preferences | faq | search


This topic has been transferred to this forum: The Spider Line.
next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   2012 isn't the end of the world, Mayans insist
jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 08:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
2012 isn't the end of the world, Mayans insist
Oct 11, 3:58 AM (ET)
By MARK STEVENSON

MEXICO CITY (AP) - Apolinario Chile Pixtun is tired of being bombarded with frantic questions about the Mayan calendar supposedly "running out" on Dec. 21, 2012. After all, it's not the end of the world.

Or is it?

Definitely not, the Mayan Indian elder insists. "I came back from England last year and, man, they had me fed up with this stuff."

It can only get worse for him. Next month Hollywood's "2012" opens in cinemas, featuring earthquakes, meteor showers and a tsunami dumping an aircraft carrier on the White House.

At Cornell University, Ann Martin, who runs the "Curious? Ask an Astronomer" Web site, says people are scared.

"It's too bad that we're getting e-mails from fourth-graders who are saying that they're too young to die," Martin said. "We had a mother of two young children who was afraid she wouldn't live to see them grow up."

Chile Pixtun, a Guatemalan, says the doomsday theories spring from Western, not Mayan ideas.

A significant time period for the Mayas does end on the date, and enthusiasts have found a series of astronomical alignments they say coincide in 2012, including one that happens roughly only once every 25,800 years.

But most archaeologists, astronomers and Maya say the only thing likely to hit Earth is a meteor shower of New Age philosophy, pop astronomy, Internet doomsday rumors and TV specials such as one on the History Channel which mixes "predictions" from Nostradamus and the Mayas and asks: "Is 2012 the year the cosmic clock finally winds down to zero days, zero hope?"

It may sound all too much like other doomsday scenarios of recent decades - the 1987 Harmonic Convergence, the Jupiter Effect or "Planet X." But this one has some grains of archaeological basis.

One of them is Monument Six.

Found at an obscure ruin in southern Mexico during highway construction in the 1960s, the stone tablet almost didn't survive; the site was largely paved over and parts of the tablet were looted.

It's unique in that the remaining parts contain the equivalent of the date 2012. The inscription describes something that is supposed to occur in 2012 involving Bolon Yokte, a mysterious Mayan god associated with both war and creation.

However - shades of Indiana Jones - erosion and a crack in the stone make the end of the passage almost illegible.

Archaeologist Guillermo Bernal of Mexico's National Autonomous University interprets the last eroded glyphs as maybe saying, "He will descend from the sky."

Spooky, perhaps, but Bernal notes there are other inscriptions at Mayan sites for dates far beyond 2012 - including one that roughly translates into the year 4772.

And anyway, Mayas in the drought-stricken Yucatan peninsula have bigger worries than 2012.

"If I went to some Mayan-speaking communities and asked people what is going to happen in 2012, they wouldn't have any idea," said Jose Huchim, a Yucatan Mayan archaeologist. "That the world is going to end? They wouldn't believe you. We have real concerns these days, like rain."

The Mayan civilization, which reached its height from 300 A.D. to 900 A.D., had a talent for astronomy

Its Long Count calendar begins in 3,114 B.C., marking time in roughly 394-year periods known as Baktuns. Thirteen was a significant, sacred number for the Mayas, and the 13th Baktun ends around Dec. 21, 2012.

"It's a special anniversary of creation," said David Stuart, a specialist in Mayan epigraphy at the University of Texas at Austin. "The Maya never said the world is going to end, they never said anything bad would happen necessarily, they're just recording this future anniversary on Monument Six."

Bernal suggests that apocalypse is "a very Western, Christian" concept projected onto the Maya, perhaps because Western myths are "exhausted."

If it were all mythology, perhaps it could be written off.

But some say the Maya knew another secret: the Earth's axis wobbles, slightly changing the alignment of the stars every year. Once every 25,800 years, the sun lines up with the center of our Milky Way galaxy on a winter solstice, the sun's lowest point in the horizon.

That will happen on Dec. 21, 2012, when the sun appears to rise in the same spot where the bright center of galaxy sets.

Another spooky coincidence?

"The question I would ask these guys is, so what?" says Phil Plait, an astronomer who runs the "Bad Astronomy" blog. He says the alignment doesn't fall precisely in 2012, and distant stars exert no force that could harm Earth.

"They're really super-duper trying to find anything astronomical they can to fit that date of 2012," Plait said.

But author John Major Jenkins says his two-decade study of Mayan ruins indicate the Maya were aware of the alignment and attached great importance to it.

"If we want to honor and respect how the Maya think about this, then we would say that the Maya viewed 2012, as all cycle endings, as a time of transformation and renewal," said Jenkins.

As the Internet gained popularity in the 1990s, so did word of the "fateful" date, and some began worrying about 2012 disasters the Mayas never dreamed of.

Author Lawrence Joseph says a peak in explosive storms on the surface of the sun could knock out North America's power grid for years, triggering food shortages, water scarcity - a collapse of civilization. Solar peaks occur about every 11 years, but Joseph says there's evidence the 2012 peak could be "a lulu."

While pressing governments to install protection for power grids, Joseph counsels readers not to "use 2012 as an excuse to not live in a healthy, responsible fashion. I mean, don't let the credit cards go up."

Another History Channel program titled "Decoding the Past: Doomsday 2012: End of Days" says a galactic alignment or magnetic disturbances could somehow trigger a "pole shift."

"The entire mantle of the earth would shift in a matter of days, perhaps hours, changing the position of the north and south poles, causing worldwide disaster," a narrator proclaims. "Earthquakes would rock every continent, massive tsunamis would inundate coastal cities. It would be the ultimate planetary catastrophe."

The idea apparently originates with a 19th century Frenchman, Charles Etienne Brasseur de Bourbourg, a priest-turned-archaeologist who got it from his study of ancient Mayan and Aztec texts.

Scientists say that, at best, the poles might change location by one degree over a million years, with no sign that it would start in 2012.

While long discredited, Brasseur de Bourbourg proves one thing: Westerners have been trying for more than a century to pin doomsday scenarios on the Maya. And while fascinated by ancient lore, advocates seldom examine more recent experiences with apocalypse predictions.

"No one who's writing in now seems to remember that the last time we thought the world was going to end, it didn't," says Martin, the astronomy webmaster. "There doesn't seem to be a lot of memory that things were fine the last time around."
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20091011/D9B8P09O0.html

IP: Logged

Eleanore
Moderator

Posts: 112
From: Okinawa, Japan
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 10:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Eleanore     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I posted this same article on a thread by BR in UC!

IP: Logged

jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 10:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I didn't know you already posted that Eleanore.

IP: Logged

shura
Knowflake

Posts: 227
From:
Registered: Jun 2009

posted October 13, 2009 11:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for shura     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
oh look! two great minds thinking alike.

i don't subscribe to the 2012 = worldwide catastrophe philosophy either. perfect example of supposedly 'spiritual' thinkers caught in a materialistic mindset.

IP: Logged

Glaucus
Knowflake

Posts: 5819
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 02:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Glaucus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

I don't believe in that 2012 stuff either.
I mean...I don't believe that it will be the end of the world.

I believe that it could be a time of transformation,renewal. a shift of consciousness for many.


we'll see though.


Raymond

------------------
"Nothing matters absolutely;
the truth is it only matters relatively"

- Eckhart Tolle

IP: Logged

jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 05:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Most of the self loathing need a catastrophe like this to look forward to. Otherwise they have to resort to belief in dunces like Algore and his loony-tunes nonsense of "Global Warming" to get their doomsday fix.

I bow to the great mind of Eleanore.

IP: Logged

shura
Knowflake

Posts: 227
From:
Registered: Jun 2009

posted October 13, 2009 08:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shura     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
some are just drama queens. myself included.

someone sent me this a few days ago ...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091011/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_mexico_apocalypse2012

IP: Logged

Eleanore
Moderator

Posts: 112
From: Okinawa, Japan
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 13, 2009 10:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Eleanore     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Aw, shucks. Jwhop and shura, you're two of the brightest I've ever come across and part of the reason I keep coming back to LL. Okay, ~now~ I get to go run and hide.

IP: Logged

shura
Knowflake

Posts: 227
From:
Registered: Jun 2009

posted October 14, 2009 03:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for shura     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ok ok ... I was hoping she'd come in and claim the crown, but she didn't so .... the third great mind was juni

it must be a sign

A triumvirate of great minds!!!

IP: Logged

jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 14, 2009 11:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hear, Hear!

The Mensa Chapter at LindaLand
Eleanore
shura
juni

I'll drink to that.

IP: Logged

juniperb
Moderator

Posts: 1982
From: Blue Star Kachina
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 24, 2009 02:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for juniperb     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A truely great mind, TS Elliot, said it quite aptly (paraphrased)

We have become hollow men, stuffed men, heads filled with straw; no convictions or higher purpose.... and for hollow men the world will end not with a bang but a whimper.
... the yahoo article put it very snidely er nicely as well

quote:
But most archaeologists, astronomers and Maya say the only thing likely to hit Earth is a meteor shower of New Age philosophy, pop astronomy, Internet doomsday rumors and TV specials such as one on the History Channel which mixes "predictions" from Nostradamus and the Mayas and asks: "Is 2012 the year the cosmic clock finally winds down to zero days, zero hope?"

Cheers !

------------------
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

- George Eliot

IP: Logged

jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 26, 2009 11:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There could be any number of reasons the Mayan calendar ended in 2012.

Perhaps the Mayans had a public school system which mis-educated their kids..not unlike America and when the elders died off there was no one left capable of doing the calculations to produce the calendar or...

Perhaps the Mayan astronomers...and stone masons joined a labor union and struck for higher pay...or

Perhaps their civilization decayed to the point they had a whole lot of other imperatives on their plate and the calendar was way down the list of important things to keep track of.

Predicting the end of the world, the end of civilization, the end of whatever through the ages has become a lucrative past time. Just look at the current crop of snake oil sales persons selling books, seminars, speaking tours, DVDs and memberships and you get the general idea.

Just look at the 1980s and Howard Ruff promoting the idea of a currency collapse of the US dollar, runaway inflation and collapse of the United States. He sold a lot of books...I bought one...and did a lot of seminars...and made a lot of money.

If he was right, he was off 30 years, time-wise and it took a demoscat Congress and a functional economic imbecile in the White House to pull it off.

IP: Logged

katatonic
Knowflake

Posts: 6508
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 26, 2009 11:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for katatonic     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well the mayan calendar may have ended in 2012 but there are other artifacts of theirs which discuss later dates. no they never expected it to be the end of the world. however they DO expect a BIG change which may SEEM like the end of the world to some.

of course there is always someone who thinks the sky is falling. otherwise chicken little would not be such a universally known story!

IP: Logged

jwhop
Knowflake

Posts: 3580
From: Madeira Beach, FL USA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted October 26, 2009 12:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jwhop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Don't forget Ducky Lucky, Goosey Lucy and Henny Penny!

IP: Logged

All times are Eastern Standard Time

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Open Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  
Hop to:

Contact Us | Linda-Goodman.com

Copyright © 2011

Powered by Infopop www.infopop.com © 2000
Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a