posted February 08, 2010 01:19 PM         

Riane Eisler is an internationally known scholar, futurist, and activist, best known as author of the international bestseller The Chalice and The Blade: Our History, Our Future. She is the President of the Center for Partnership Studies, co-founder of the Spiritual Alliance to Stop Intimate Violence (SAIV), and The Alliance for a Caring Economy (ACE). For more videos, check out www.globalonenessproject.org

posted February 08, 2010 03:18 PM         

I love it!

She is saying what I've been saying,
though I've been speaking in terms of history.

We have enough, lol!

We had enough around 300 A.D., lol!

Enough art and wisdom,
enough to please and inspire,
more than enough to enjoy and
contemplate for centuries to come.

Witness the Renaissance.
The interest in classical works
inspired the production of new,
but still classical, works.

While we eschew the past,
and produce garbage.

We're obsessed
with accumulation
and productivity.

We tear down things
that were built to last
to build new things
that are not.

We don't read Seneca,
we read John Grisham.

We haven't taken the time
to understand Plotinus,
but we think we've gone
beyond him, lol.

This is what I've seen.

Every day we struggle for more,
when all we need is time in which
to take notice of our abundance.

posted February 08, 2010 04:21 PM         

but i cringe when i hear people say "we have enough" - of course we do! we always have! but would you really be content to sit back and enjoy the same old same old ad infinitum? most of the "excess" activity and accumulation is a direct result of people's endless curiosity, the desire to see HOW FAR you can go with your quest, etc.

posted February 08, 2010 05:43 PM         

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would you really be content to sit back and enjoy the same old same old ad infinitum? most of the "excess" activity and accumulation is a direct result of people's endless curiosity, the desire to see HOW FAR you can go with your quest, etc.

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Same old, same old? Have you read all of Shakespeare? Plutarch? Juvenal? Nicholas of Cusa? The list goes on and on. You don't have enough time to learn the names of all the great writers and artists, but you are already worried about running out of material?

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i tend to think those old sharing societies imploded through inertia...lack of pioneer spirit if you like...

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The reason you "tend" that way, kat, is because 5,000 years of history has been engineered to confirm you in that opinion. However, if you lift your head above the culture and overlook the course of history, you will make some curious discoveries. For one thing, our "pioneering spirit" is likely to result in the war to end all wars, if we are not careful. We could learn something from these cultures that managed to survive many times longer than we have, and to do it peacefully. To be conquered is a shame, but it is nothing to be ashamed of. Rather, the real shame is when a culture survives only by obliterating other cultures, and ultimately obliterates itself. And that's what we are doing. We have no choice now but to persih, or to reclaim the wisdom we burned in Alexandria. I agree only that we should learn from the lesson of the last 5,000 years, and recreate these societies with a greater appreciation for defense than they had known.

posted February 09, 2010 11:39 AM         

"The reason you "tend" that way, kat, is because 5,000 years of history has been engineered to confirm you in that opinion. However, if you lift your head above the culture and overlook the course of history'

the above quote from your goodself is a good illustration of why people argue with you. you have no respect or even inkling that others may not only be onto the same stuff but ahead of you.

you try to take credit for others "arriving" at a point you want them at without realizing they have been there already. in other words you are engaging in a mental form of the same desire to dominate you profess to abhor...

do you know that we are about to set out into the universe at large? my grandson's generation will see travel to mars as you do travel to germany...and the power sources to make it possible are being worked on as we speak.

no i have not read everything there is to read. is that your idea of a perfect life, to read all the masters? the ones who talk about the society we now live in, who knew it all hundreds of years ago? i warrant i have read more of them than you. but that is hardly my ambition.

posted February 09, 2010 03:02 PM         

I realize you're an older woman, and have been around for a while. I try to consider and respect the wealth of experience you may have. But I think you have too high an opinion of your years and the "respect" they entitle you to. When you make sharp remarks to me, I defend myself with arguments. When I make them to you, you throw up your hands. Perhaps it is the impudence of youth at loggerheads with the impudence of age? The one, full of radical enthusiasm, with an eye to the future, -- the other, conservatively resigning herself to what is, with an eye to the grave?

You think you've gone beyond where I am, as your words make clear. I have no problem with that. But you accuse me of arrogance for thinking I've gone beyond you. So be it. I continue to produce arguments and evidence for my views, while your only objections are repetitious cliches. Why don't you try responding directly to my arguments, if you can?

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you have no respect or even inkling that others may not only be onto the same stuff but ahead of you.

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I most certainly do. I've drawn your attention to a number of such personalities. Just because you havent impressed me, doesnt mean nobody has.

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you try to take credit for others "arriving" at a point you want them at without realizing they have been there already. in other words you are engaging in a mental form of the same desire to dominate you profess to abhor...

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First of all, I've never claimed to be entirely free of the influences of the dominator culture I grew up in and contend with still. Have you discovered my flawed humanity again, kat? BRAVO!! A cookie for you. I dare you to notice your own hypocrisy as well. And, while you're at it, consider that I am promoting mushrooms as a cure for the dominator system -- and that I myself rarely have access to them. So, if I exhibit dominator traits, that's ultimately supportive of my argument, lol. Let me take mushrooms at least once a week for several months and you will see a very different "side" of me. That's my excuse, lol. What's yours?

Secondly, I wasn't even necessarily taking credit, etc. If you haven't noticed, I'm a cheeky bugger. I was probably teasing you. But, also, making a point, as I tend to do. Maybe you could indicate the instance you are referring to, so I could properly examine it with you? I think I have brought several things to your attention which you were not previously aware of -- and you have done the same for me. Taking credit for that is reasonable, and no crime of domination. But, again, I dont know what you are referring to.

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do you know that we are about to set out into the universe at large? my grandson's generation will see travel to mars as you do travel to germany...and the power sources to make it possible are being worked on as we speak.

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What is this nonsequitor supposed to signify, kat? I mean, besides another ambitious conquest on behalf of dominator values? Let's see, we've got billions of dollars to invest, and power sources that trump anything we've known so far... Should we bring water to people who have no access to water? Should we invest in arable land, and try to provide for the hungry of our world? No, of course not. We should over-extend ourselves yet again, in order to visit other worlds. Grey and red rocks in space. Yup. Look what we did! *Thumping on our chests*

You must be kidding.
Oh, yeah, you're way beyond me.
LMMFAO

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is that your idea of a perfect life, to read all the masters?

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Perfect life? I don't know about perfect, but if the alternative is producing tons and tons of crap, raping the environment, and exploiting nearly every man, woman, and child in the world in order to do it... Yeah, reading the masters is my idea of a good life.

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the ones who talk about the society we now live in, who knew it all hundreds of years ago?

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The ones who hail each other as brothers and sisters from across the centuries? The ones who speak of eternal things, and bring insight into the society we now live in -- the society we will have to understand and remember, once it is past, so as not to revert back to it? Yes. The masters.

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i warrant i have read more of them than you. but that is hardly my ambition.

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What you read for school, and only because you "had" to, doesnt count, lol. And it's not how much you read, but how well you read. How deeply. With how much appreciation and understanding. Evidently, not much, or you would surely have ambition in that direction.

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change your self, change the world. not by continually chewing on what's wrong with it but by being something new. toodaloo!

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With you teaching by example, kat, how can I go wrong? Seriously, though, I am something new. I'm the only one on these boards saying what I'm saying. You know damn well I'm one of the most three-dimensional people you've ever encountered in a two-dimensional landscape. Look around this site and you can see for yourself that most of the people here are repeating the same cliches we've all heard a million times. If they are investigating something of interest to them, you can find half a dozen others here investigating the same thing. How many are directing people to information that can revolutionize their view of human history and of what is inately human or mere conditioning? How many are recovering things which have been ignored, thrown away, and stigmatized, and restoring those things to their rightful place as sacred allies and tools?

posted February 09, 2010 03:09 PM         

the fact that i am older than you and therefore started this before you does not leave me "resigned" to anything. but in better position to work with what is, after all the first step starts where you are, no?

posted February 09, 2010 03:25 PM         

So nice to see you again.
I thought you'd gone for good this time.

Well, okay, not really.

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the trouble is you don't want a discussion. you want a soap box. have at it.

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I want to share my vision, yes. If you have something that can contribute to it, or if you can learn something from it, be my guest. But if all you want to do is place stumbling blocks in my way and tell me to walk a different path -- get lost. You said "have at it", well, let me have at it. Adios!

And dont tell me I dont want a discussion. I dare you to name a single knowflake who routinely responds point-by-point to your objections -- assuming they're even original enough to disagree with you in the first place. Where can you find anyone willing to read you carefully enough and sincerely enough to formulate rational responses to your words? Well, you might not find my responses so rational, but they are, at least, real responses, directed at the real substance of your posts.

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the fact that i am older than you and therefore started this before you does not leave me "resigned" to anything. but in better position to work with what is, after all the first step starts where you are, no?

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Most people are very big on what is, kat. It makes them feel "like a man", like they are facing reality. The reality, though, is that they lack the vision to see possibilities. They see only what is. Not what may be. It's the oldest and most common story in the book, lady.

And for all you know, I'm much, much, much older than you. In the way that counts. But disputing that stuff is child's play. So we move on.

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and as for an eye to the grave, well i ain't dying, as chuck said to keith 20 0dd years ago...and he wasn't.

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"He not busy being born is busy dying." ~ Dylan

posted February 09, 2010 04:18 PM         

" place stumbling blocks in my way and tell me to walk a different path " never! but get you to think about how this might actually translate into the real world? how could i be so negative and jaded?

trouble is the thing youre aiming for does not (hopefully) suffer from "leading lights" and once again you will be craving the recognition you think society has robbed you of.