Author
|
Topic: Is Health Care a Human Right?
|
juniperb Moderator Posts: 10491 From: Blue Star Kachina Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 27, 2017 06:53 PM
This is not a political statement but rather an irksome question.I saw protesters of the new TrumpCare bill and many had signs that said "healthcare is a human right" How so? I do not think it is. Heatth care is a responsibility not a right. We are responsible to provide the care needed for ourselves and dependents. Not a given right provided by the states or feds. I am not splitting hairs over Medicaid either. It used to be called ADC ie Aid for Dependent Children and adults were exempt. Now it is the expected method of healthcare for children and adults. When I was a child and needed my tonsils out, my dad took a second shift to pay it off. No state aid. Isn`t this how it should be? Where did Americans get the idea health care is a human right? I`m truely perplexed by this. Stepping off soapbox  ------------------ Partial truth~the seeds of wisdom~can be found in many places...The seeds of wisdom are contained in all scriptures ever written… especially in art, music, and poetry and, above all, in Nature.
Linda Goodman IP: Logged |
teasel Knowflake Posts: 10320 From: Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 27, 2017 07:12 PM
I grew up in England, where I would have had my tonsils out thanks to the NHS, if I'd gone through with the operation. Whenever I needed to see a doctor, I saw one, and received the medicine that I needed. Doctors even came out to your home, if necessary. We had affordable housing, thanks to the council, too. I used to get sick at least four times a year, incredibly high fevers. I wouldn't be here without the NHS. IP: Logged |
teasel Knowflake Posts: 10320 From: Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 27, 2017 07:18 PM
Deleted.I would rather die by my own hands, than die in the streets of a country that would take healthcare away from its citizens (again). I'm too depressed, and if anything happens to my dad, I'm done. IP: Logged |
Randall Webmaster Posts: 82445 From: From a galaxy, far, far away... Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 27, 2017 07:26 PM
I agree. Health care is a responsibility, not a right. Medicaid was created for poor women, children, and the disabled. We have now expanded it beyond its sustainability.IP: Logged |
Catalina Knowflake Posts: 4452 From: shamballa Registered: Aug 2013
|
posted June 27, 2017 08:24 PM
Who thinks Medicaid is a "right"? We pay for it in our taxes... everyone who earns any money. "Free" healthcare just means you don't pay cash on the line or go without. Its nothing to sou with a Right but everything tto do with living in a healthier society. Your father would have to work a lot of shifts to pay for a tonsillectomy today thanks to the stranglehold insurance companies have on the med industry. I paid $1100 for a doctor to talk at me from across room and prescribe ibuprofen for a hip injury it didn't touch a couple years ago. Dont be fooled that people on Medicaid are just the "lazy" unemployed.. most of them work and pay in to the pot. This is the fallacy of "something for nothing". If people with more are contributing more they should also be entitled to the service.. but even if they choose not to use it I promise you a country without healthcare safety nets is a country with a lot of people suffering and seriously only the very richest are not affected. In England, for instance, a millionaire can get NHS care and also know that he wont be infected by people carryingTB around on the street (for an example). Its a tough one tho, because unless it's done right the bureaucrats will ruin it. And unless its done the poor will be much less able to contribute to society at large. Personally I think: make real food affordable and most people could take care of themselves.. but the cracker hacks and pill pushers would go out of business... We need to rethink what Healthcare means and relegate medicine to its proper place IP: Logged |
Node Knowflake Posts: 2778 From: 2,015 mi East of Truth or Consequences NM Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 08:51 AM
Lets talk healthcare vs wellcare.Many people can not afford wellcare. My opinion of how americans allocate their disposable income is another thread. [think starbucks, new phones every 6 months, 3,000 sq ft homes for couples) Wellcare can help prevent issues spiraling out of control. Healthcare means different things to different people. Healthcare = insurance to me. I do think medical "attention/treatment" is a human right. I also feel that since we are the richest [?] country in the world treatment should not bankrupt people. Medical care ie hospital shouldn't be for profit. Old people should not have to go to Mexico or Canada for medicine. Profit, Profit, Profit.
IP: Logged |
Randall Webmaster Posts: 82445 From: From a galaxy, far, far away... Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 03:42 PM
This is a capitalist country. Why should doctors go to school for over a decade and not be allowed to make a profit?IP: Logged |
Catalina Knowflake Posts: 4452 From: shamballa Registered: Aug 2013
|
posted June 29, 2017 04:50 PM
No one has suggested they shouldn't. IP: Logged |
Node Knowflake Posts: 2778 From: 2,015 mi East of Truth or Consequences NM Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 06:05 PM
^ No indeed IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 06:31 PM
What is the purpose of living within the rules of a society, if not to get some "benefits" ? especially a rich, I mean RICH society ? IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 06:38 PM
I highly recommend anyone who hasn't seen it, to watch SICKO from Michael Moore.Don't be afraid to agree with someone you don't like, the subject is not him, but healthcare. Please, watch it to understand how other rich countries see the matter of healthcare. Please IP: Logged |
jwhop Knowflake Posts: 9999 From: Madeira Beach, FL USA Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 29, 2017 11:37 PM
Yes, El Sicko extolls the virtues of the Cuban Communist health care system.Cuba has a health care system which couldn't even treat their Maximum Leader, Fidel. In fact, they almost killed Fidel and had to call in European doctors after they botched Fidel's treatment. You're welcome to El Sicko. IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 30, 2017 03:39 AM
Have you watched it ?IP: Logged |
Node Knowflake Posts: 2778 From: 2,015 mi East of Truth or Consequences NM Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 30, 2017 05:31 AM
And~ Capitalism, A love story
IP: Logged |
jwhop Knowflake Posts: 9999 From: Madeira Beach, FL USA Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 30, 2017 09:43 AM
Listen up, El Sicko is an old, old, old story covered very thoroughly here.It's a stew of old tripe and smelly fish heads that only dim wits would find appetizing. IP: Logged |
Catalina Knowflake Posts: 4452 From: shamballa Registered: Aug 2013
|
posted June 30, 2017 12:44 PM
Farrah Fawcett went to Germany for the same disease when American doctors failed to heal her. And Fidel had an Egyptian, not European, surgeon if I remember right.Apparently Istaels best doctors made the wrong call when Sharon had his stroke.. which ultimately killed him. But Cuban doctors are required to be infalliible..or they're judged uaeless.. You're entitled to your opinion.. as is pire 😉 IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 30, 2017 05:30 PM
quote: Originally posted by jwhop: Listen up, El Sicko is an old, old, old story covered very thoroughly here.It's a stew of old tripe and smelly fish heads that only dim wits would find appetizing.
Oh, so once upon a time you criticized its author, therefore : 1- we can not bring the subject up 2- you are going to call me names for liking it While you clearly haven't watched a film that you criticize ? IP: Logged |
jwhop Knowflake Posts: 9999 From: Madeira Beach, FL USA Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted June 30, 2017 09:08 PM
Just telling you that you're way behind the curve on this particular story. El Sicko's nonsense and utter stupidity have been covered here...thoroughly.IP: Logged |
Catalina Knowflake Posts: 4452 From: shamballa Registered: Aug 2013
|
posted June 30, 2017 11:21 PM
The Oracle has spoken. We all know what you think,Madeira .. therefore discussion over?IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted July 01, 2017 03:08 AM
Have you watched it jwhop ???Yes Or No ? IP: Logged |
jwhop Knowflake Posts: 9999 From: Madeira Beach, FL USA Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted July 01, 2017 09:10 AM
Just reading excerpts from El Sicko's fantasy land Schmuckumentary was torture enough.Question is; why are you trying to resurrect the corpse that was buried long ago. Next, you'll be trying to resurrect the corpse of Karl Marx's Communist Manifesto and/or Hitler The Socialist's drivel, Mein Kampf. IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted July 01, 2017 11:46 AM
Hitler's mein kampf and karl marx manifesto aside, although you haven't seen the documentary SICKO by michael moore you pretend to know what it is about ? quote: Originally posted by jwhop: Yes, El Sicko extolls the virtues of the Cuban Communist health care system.Cuba has a health care system which couldn't even treat their Maximum Leader, Fidel. In fact, they almost killed Fidel and had to call in European doctors after they botched Fidel's treatment. You're welcome to El Sicko.
This doc isn't about the cuban heatlcare system, but actually about the failures of the US system in comparison to what other countries achieved, including cuba, but including France or the UK, which are far from communist countries, both being alternatively the 4th and 5th strongest economy with merely 60 to 65 millions citizens each. I think your arrogance is so big you can not admit something you believe in, love, cannot be perfect already. And your failure to see the truth, as is shown in this documentary, and even listen to other point of views different than yours, like those of michael moore for instance, is another proof if one was needed, that you react emotionnally but are never able to rationalize even afterwards. Knee jerk reactions, insults... jwhop IP: Logged |
juniperb Moderator Posts: 10491 From: Blue Star Kachina Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted July 01, 2017 12:44 PM
quote: Many people can not afford wellcare. My opinion of how americans allocate their disposable income is another thread. [think starbucks, new phones every 6 months, 3,000 sq ft homes for couples)
I appreciate the distinction between healthcare and wellcare! I agree 100% about Americans believing a lifestyle of luxery is more important that health/wellcare. Leave the iphones aside and pay for your medical needs. @cat. I also appreciate your post on the outrageous cost of Drs and medical needs. Drugs are so overpriced even insurance companys pay little of the cost. During the course of Obamacare, my inhaler went from $10 co pay to $60 a month now. ------------------ Partial truth~the seeds of wisdom~can be found in many places...The seeds of wisdom are contained in all scriptures ever written… especially in art, music, and poetry and, above all, in Nature.
Linda Goodman IP: Logged |
Catalina Knowflake Posts: 4452 From: shamballa Registered: Aug 2013
|
posted July 01, 2017 02:23 PM
Obamacare was written as a sop to Republicans.. it is basically pro insurance and pharm companies and less "leftist" than Romneycare.. but that didn't stop the Repubs from stonewalling it and calling it Marxist. Had it been done better it would have worked better across the board but frankly insurance companies have been sacrificing quality and innovation on the altar of profit for decades now. Thete are quite a few doctors groups implementing "club care" where practice is paid for with a monthly stipend of about $50/capita for amazing benefits. Is this Marxist? It seems to work whatever you call it tho it doesn't cover everything it brings costs way down. IP: Logged |
pire Knowflake Posts: 2595 From: France Registered: Apr 2009
|
posted July 02, 2017 10:48 AM
Why the U.S. pays more for health care than the rest of the world - pbs newshour http://youtu.be/gXBPKE28UF0 27 avr. 2017 Why are American health care costs by far the highest in the world? Journalist and former practicing physician Elisabeth Rosenthal chronicles how we got here in her new book, "An American Sickness." Economics correspondent Paul Solman talks with Rosenthal about the forces driving high prices and what could be done to bring costs down. IP: Logged |