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Author Topic:   This Troubles Me (mobile tracking)
Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 12, 2021 01:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Obviously I know that mobile phones are essentially tracking devices, but to see it so brazenly admitted to on the BBC is quite astounding:

Covid: Are we following the government's stay-at-home message?

quote:
Health Secretary Matt Hancock has urged people to, "stay at home and reduce all social contact that is not absolutely necessary".

But are people acting on his advice and how does their behaviour compare with previous lockdowns?

What does the data show?
People are leaving their homes more than during the first days of the March lockdown, according to data from several sources.

Apple and Google collect "mobility data", which is pulled together by recording the location histories on people's mobile devices. They then take that data and compare how different it is to a national "baseline" established in early 2020, before the pandemic started.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/55626008

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 12, 2021 01:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not sure why my thread duplicated??

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 12, 2021 01:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hah, this is where Al foil actually does come in handy.

If you don't want to be tracked temporarily while out and about (but still want your phone on hand in case of emergency or the like), put your phone on airplane and battery saving mode or turn off to save the battery, then wrap it up fully in Al foil.

No EM signals in or out as long as its wrapped up in Al foil. If you need to find your way around, invest in some old fashion road maps and/or write down some directions. Good time to get back to the "old ways".

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 12, 2021 02:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh, the plutocrats don't care anymore. They are so mad, drunk, and rushed with power and control, because they are close to their end goals, they don't even care about hiding things anymore. They are brazen and in our faces about things now. The corporate media, being essentially an extension of them and their cronies (minus an occasional real and sincere piece of journalism here and there that slips through the cracks), is reflecting this more and more.

Did you read anything about the US's Democratic Primary and how in the Iowa Caucus, the DNC there used a data collecting App made by "Shadow Inc." and called the "Shadow app"? I mean seriously, you're going to call it that? These labels/names really are designed to invoke trust in the integrity and transparency of it all... What next, Joker or Lex Luther Inc, and the Joker or Lex Luther apps?

Oh, and two of the candidates previous to the Primaries, made sizable payments to the company, but don't worry folks, nothing to see here--that doesn't mean any possible "conflict of interest", even though the head (Tara McGowan) of a firm connected to Shadow Inc Tweeted out support to Pete "I copied everything Obama said and how he said it" Butthead (one of the people who made a sizable payment in the tune of some 43, 000).

They really think people are stupid and dumbed down enough that they don't care about good misdirection or hiding the corruption and conflict of interest anymore.

It's funny too because the "Fact Checking" sites (some of which have their own interesting ties to plutocrat types like Gates), state these facts, but imply there is nothing to see here, even though it can obviously imply at least conflict of interest if not outright corruption. Apparently conflict of interest doesn't mean anymore what it used to. Except when its convenient. For example, previously HIGHLY and long time respected Epidemiologist John Ioannidis who has been very vocally critical about the way governments and bureaucratic health organizations have dealt with the pandemic, did a research study where a Jet Blue big wig donated money to, and when that was found out, he got BLASTED in the media for conflict of interest, despite that it was very possible he didn't even know the specific details. He's a research scientist, not a bureaucrat, accountant, lawyer, etc. Nor was he the only scientist involved in the study.

Funny enough, DNC recently argued in court that because they are actually a private corporation, and not actually a public related branch of government (many Americans don't even know this fact), they could do anything they like with the process of counting votes etc. Which, I guess is technically true, though not ethical in the least bit since they give us, the public, the impression that our vote counts and matters. But no, it's really who the DNC wants, they want.

It's funny to me when people literally stop the process of investigation and thinking critically about things once they get to the Fact Checkers, with complete and blind trust in these, and accept everything they both say and/or imply with no questions.

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Randall
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posted January 12, 2021 05:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So, the tin foil hats are based on real science?

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Belage
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posted January 12, 2021 06:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, basically anything we are doing online on a shared platform or cloud or server can be tracked.

When we log online or when we use our phone, we give up a lot of privacy. As users, we are just implicitly "trusting" that Big Brother who is watching us will not use data collected on us to get us fired, censored, deplatformed, harassed, arrested, unless we were actively engaged in the commission of something grossly illegal or criminal.

I heard some people talking about going back to the days of CB radios, but even that does not guarantee privacy at all. Messages can be intercepted.

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 13, 2021 03:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Belage:
Well, basically anything we are doing online on a shared platform or cloud or server can be tracked.

When we log online or when we use our phone, we give up a lot of privacy. As users, we are just implicitly "trusting" that Big Brother who is watching us will not use data collected on us to get us fired, censored, deplatformed, harassed, arrested, unless we were actively engaged in the commission of something grossly illegal or criminal.

I heard some people talking about going back to the days of CB radios, but even that does not guarantee privacy at all. Messages can be intercepted.


True. I still remember my grampa's landline being tapped due to the BSE scandal. But tracking my movements bothers me more than listening to my conversations or watching my internet searches for some reason. It's just bloody creepy.

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Face a situation fearlessly, and there is no situation to face
~ Florence Scovel Shinn ~

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 13, 2021 03:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Galactic, often it's the conflict of interest that draws people to a particular career! I echo Randall, but serious question, does tin foil actually block signals on electricals?

I am still in disbelief at the audacity of the BBC. I mean I am assuming that the only data they are referring to is data that people have chosen to share, but I don't think that was explicitly stated, so perhaps not. Therefore how do the data protection rules not apply to Apple and Google?

There are 3 types of location history that I can think of: Facebook check-ins, Google search, and location on phone. If all these are off, and they are still getting location data, then surely they are breaking data protection laws?

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Face a situation fearlessly, and there is no situation to face
~ Florence Scovel Shinn ~

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 13, 2021 02:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes, if the phone is wrapped fully in the Al foil, it will neither receive nor transmit any EM signals. This principle is what a Faraday cage is based on. The only thing that this cannot block is straight up pure magnetism, but magnetic fields proportionally decrease with distance and such weak fields already have a very limited distance range.

Also, if you want to save any electronics during the coming Solar storms/CME's when they will come with strong EM pulses and/or induce electrical charges that destroy electronics, one way is to wrap the electronic in alternating layers of metal foil and an electrical insulator (like zip lock plastic bags).

So do one layer of foil wrap, put it in a plastic zip lock bag, wrap again in metal foil, put another bag, metal layer, bag. How many layers you would need will ultimately depend on how powerful the EM pulsing and/or electrical induction.

I plan on at least trying to save my non blu tooth, non wi fi, MP3 player and a couple ways to recharge same. Music is almost a food and necessity for this self.

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shura
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posted January 14, 2021 08:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shura     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Why troubled? If you didn't do anything wrong, you've nothing to hid.

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DualGemV2
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posted January 15, 2021 02:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DualGemV2     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just turn off GPS Enabled, if an app on your device requests you to turn it on, i.e. google maps on your mobile device don't enable and leave it off.

Its the exact same issue with javascript extensions..don't enable unless you know what its used for.

The more complicated way to track you goes back to how mobile devices were previously called "cell phones".

Essentially each tower that broadcasts the signal from your phone is its own "cell region"...

So when you make a call they whould detect what tower is sending the signal, what cell region your in and an aprox. distance to the tower...it won't give a pin point position.

If law enforcement or anyone is actualy serious about tracking you down using this method..they will fly planes mimicing cell towers...but thats a very extreme case.

I doubt your Pablo Escobar or a drug lord, thats a lot of resources and costs to deploy just for the ordinary citizen.

You just gave me an great idea for a project to try...something like a VPN for mobile devices using Arduino or Raspbery pi.

A VPN will only mask your internet traffic it won't protect incoming and outgoing phone calls.

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 15, 2021 03:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My understanding is that most phones are pretty easy to hack, hence the right people with the right knowledge can turn these things on unbeknownst to your knowledge or permission.

And yes, also cell tower pinging.

Only sure way is to take the battery out (which a lot of phones today don't make easy) or wrap it in foil or the like.

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DualGemV2
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posted January 15, 2021 03:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DualGemV2     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
My understanding is that most phones are pretty easy to hack, hence the right people with the right knowledge can turn these things on unbeknownst to your knowledge or permission.

And yes, also cell tower pinging.

Only sure way is to take the battery out (which a lot of phones today don't make easy) or wrap it in foil or the like.


To a certain extent your correct.

Lots of the encryption algorithms for mobile devices..strickly from the signal broadcasting side of things..not the application side of things date back to the 70s.

Even a modest brute force machine (try every combination) could brake it.

The classic man-in the middle attack which is no longer applicable to websites using https and TLS..still hold true with mobile devices...by mimimicing the cell tower broadcasting the signal call.

FYI: lindaland is still using http and not using TLS so if you were on the same local network..say starbucks you could pull off the man-in-middle attack.

But like everything else its about chassing the prize. To any white hacker or pro penetration tester who is the bigger prize?

The everyday citizen or lets peep into the politcal candidates phones?

Unless you have something really to gain out of the everyday individual other then to keep them on lockdown what else whould you gain?

For protection i'd perfer using a virtualization software, can't hack something that doesn't actually exist.

Something along the lines of mobile virtualization will keep you protected.

Which is also were the future of security is...everything is moving towards virtualization.

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 15, 2021 03:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting info. You seem a lot more knowledgeable about these things than myself.

To briefly speak to LL's for a moment in that regard, I wonder, is that why I sometimes see random Asian language characters here and there? I don't remember exactly which it was, but I looked it up one time, and it was either Chinese or Japanese.

At one point, I thought it was just me, as I realized that my keyboard had been switched to international english, and then I switched it back. But, once in awhile, I still see them in different peoples' posts.

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DualGemV2
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posted January 15, 2021 04:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DualGemV2     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
Interesting info. You seem a lot more knowledgeable about these things than myself...

I whouldn't count myself as an expert, my background is in tech thought.

I try to take the quote from Einstein: "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough"

Anyone who can't explain something and say it in the most clear, concise, correct way and under 5 minutes always draws red flags for me.

Perhaps this is the most fiting thing to say on the global unity forum.

You have to very carefull, lots of people may appear to be experts and say certain things and be fouled.

Some people make up facts...but if you take a step back think about it..you'll realize it just doesn't make sense or there's holes in it.

Especially with whats going on in the US right now..people can't make that distinction or use made up facts to jusifty there ideas and actions.

quote:
Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
Interesting info. You seem a lot more knowledgeable about these things than myself.

To briefly speak to LL's for a moment in that regard, I wonder, is that why I sometimes see random Asian language characters here and there? I don't remember exactly which it was, but I looked it up one time, and it was either Chinese or Japanese.

At one point, I thought it was just me, as I realized that my keyboard had been switched to international english, and then I switched it back. But, once in awhile, I still see them in different peoples' posts.


My best answer whould be browser settings?
Can be alot of diffrent things..but yes there is no protection from rogue javscript because the point of https and TLS is to verify the source IP, destination IP and have a verifying certification that starts the encryption process using any type of encryption algorith.i.e RSA, SHA256 or a combination.

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DualGemV2
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posted January 15, 2021 04:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DualGemV2     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
Yes, if the phone is wrapped fully in the Al foil, it will neither receive nor transmit any EM signals. This principle is what a Faraday cage is based on. The only thing that this cannot block is straight up pure magnetism, but magnetic fields proportionally decrease with distance and such weak fields already have a very limited distance range.

Also, if you want to save any electronics during the coming Solar storms/CME's when they will come with strong EM pulses and/or induce electrical charges that destroy electronics, one way is to wrap the electronic in alternating layers of metal foil and an electrical insulator (like zip lock plastic bags).

So do one layer of foil wrap, put it in a plastic zip lock bag, wrap again in metal foil, put another bag, metal layer, bag. How many layers you would need will ultimately depend on how powerful the EM pulsing and/or electrical induction.

I plan on at least trying to save my non blu tooth, non wi fi, MP3 player and a couple ways to recharge same. Music is almost a food and necessity for this self.


100% Correct.

Radio signals travel from the source to the destination via two methods a cable or brodcast throught the air.

If there's an obstruction in both it won't flow as easily.

Any material can interfere with the signal being broacasted..

That's why when it rains you might encounter degradation of your wifi signal and sometimes even have difficulty making phone calls.

Thick concrete can also interfere..but in terms of effectiveness rating its pretty low.

Outside of a lab, farday cages or metal shielding built into the walls is a common occurance at hospitals to prevent interference with sensitive medical equipment espically MRI's.

@GalacticCoreExplosion
Off topic you whouldn't happen to have a degree in physics???

Most people outside of physics don't know that..kudos if you do...it's one of the harder "hard science" degrees to earn...in terms of science degrees go, way out of my reach.

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 15, 2021 07:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by shura:
Why troubled? If you didn't do anything wrong, you've nothing to hid.

I don't have anything to hide. That doesn't mean it's acceptable to stalk me.

------------------
Face a situation fearlessly, and there is no situation to face
~ Florence Scovel Shinn ~

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 15, 2021 07:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DualGemV2:
Just turn off GPS Enabled, if an app on your device requests you to turn it on, i.e. google maps on your mobile device don't enable and leave it off.

Its the exact same issue with javascript extensions..don't enable unless you know what its used for.

The more complicated way to track you goes back to how mobile devices were previously called "cell phones".

Essentially each tower that broadcasts the signal from your phone is its own "cell region"...

So when you make a call they whould detect what tower is sending the signal, what cell region your in and an aprox. distance to the tower...it won't give a pin point position.

If law enforcement or anyone is actualy serious about tracking you down using this method..they will fly planes mimicing cell towers...but thats a very extreme case.

I doubt your Pablo Escobar or a drug lord, thats a lot of resources and costs to deploy just for the ordinary citizen.

You just gave me an great idea for a project to try...something like a VPN for mobile devices using Arduino or Raspbery pi.

A VPN will only mask your internet traffic it won't protect incoming and outgoing phone calls.

My Planets
=========================================
☉‘ ♊, ☽ ♈, ASC ♑, ☿ ♊, ¡÷ ♉, ¡ö ♋ , ♃ ♒, ♄ ♏, ♅ ♐, ♆ ♑


Thank you for this info, my GPS is always off unless I am taking a route to somewhere that I haven't been before, which of course, is nowhere right now due to lockdown.

Like I said before, I'm not concerned because I am doing anything I shouldn't be, I am concerned that they are tracking people to produce reports seemingly without permission.

It's not ethical to stalk people to produce research reports without their permission. That flies in the face of the most fundamental ethical principle of research - informed consent. Plus it also violates the right to know how your information is being used.

It's wrong on so many levels and an insult to ethical researchers.

------------------
Face a situation fearlessly, and there is no situation to face
~ Florence Scovel Shinn ~

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DualGemV2
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posted January 15, 2021 07:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DualGemV2     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your best bet is to find a provider with Mobile Virtualization.

I could only find one provider and its in Israel. http://www.cellrox.com

The Isrealies tend to be among the leaders in cybersecurity.

Virtualization is a new development, Mobile Virtualization is even newer.

I apologize if your familiar with the concept of virtualization and if this is comming off as redundant information.

But basically the idea behind virtualization is it mimics an actualy device on your device..think of it as a computer on your computer that makes requests on your behalf.

To the outside world they will only see the "fictious" computer you mimicked if it gets hacked there was nothing there in the first place and collecting data is also hard.

quote:
Originally posted by Voix_de_la_Mer:
Thank you for this info, my GPS is always off unless I am taking a route to somewhere that I haven't been before, which of course, is nowhere right now due to lockdown.

Like I said before, I'm not concerned because I am doing anything I shouldn't be, I am concerned that they are tracking people to produce reports seemingly without permission.

It's not ethical to stalk people to produce research reports without their permission. That flies in the face of the most fundamental ethical principle of research - informed consent. Plus it also violates the right to know how your information is being used.

It's wrong on so many levels and an insult to ethical researchers.


Your correct, whenever I watch youetube there is an algorithm thats already collecting what I watch and providing me with suggestions based on what I watch.

On the flip side it can also be used for good..

If you make online transactions, the credit card companies have a statistic based on your common purchases..

Anything deamed outside of your common pattern of purchases will be deemed your credit card as stolen.

Since both are based on anomaly detection or finding a common pattern..to throw both off when it comes to collecting data you make it difficult to find a common pattern by doing things that don't have any relation to each other.

But going back to the credit card example, I don't like the idea of the credit card companies building a profile on me based on how I spend, items I consume then give it off to certain people.

I share the same concerns as you, I also wanted to do 23 and me or DNA ancestry..but your essentially giving out your biology data.

My Planets
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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 16, 2021 03:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
@ DGV2, I do not have a physics degree, nor any academic training in that area. Was obsessed with science from age 8 to 12 (and then wanted to be a research scientist), until I started to have nonphysical/intuitive type experiences, then became obsessed with spirituality. But I kept a peripheral interest in science, and especially practical applications of same.

For example, a little while back I was working on prototypes of hybrid battery-super capacitor that would have been mostly biodegradable and the metals used were cheap and plentiful (primarily copper and magnesium as these are fairly opposite on the Paulings scale and it's that opposite charge differential which seems to be one of the keys of energy storage. Turns out though, that magnesium while theoretically a good material for energy storage and transfer, has some issues in the actual application).

The primary matrix though, was/would have been graphitized nanocellulose crystals. That was one of the primary secret sauces. This idea was partially inspired by a researcher who had found that graphitized hemp competed well with lower to mid grade quality graphene in energy transfer. My idea was to isolate the stuff in the hemp that was doing this, and it seemed to me, it was the crystalline cellulose that was doing so. So if you isolate and have mostly or only the crystalline cellulose, you should seen an improvement over even what they saw in the lab.

But I don't have enough time, energy, nor money to complete this project. Ideally it would be done with a team, and with some help from people who are more knowledgeable in the physics and maths of all this stuff. Me, I'm more of an intuitive, holism, and systems perceiver all in all. But measuring and testing is not my forte. Need more strongly analytical, very Mercurial types for that.

In any case, there is a collapse coming, so spending too much time on such projects is ultimately a bit of a waste of time. My spouse has had dreams of us visiting post collapse, former "China" and being involved with them in a new form of energy generation that is clean and efficient. One that in the dream, at least one ET group had some interest in.

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted January 17, 2021 06:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DualGemV2:
Your best bet is to find a provider with Mobile Virtualization.

I could only find one provider and its in Israel. http://www.cellrox.com

The Isrealies tend to be among the leaders in cybersecurity.

Virtualization is a new development, Mobile Virtualization is even newer.

I apologize if your familiar with the concept of virtualization and if this is comming off as redundant information.

But basically the idea behind virtualization is it mimics an actualy device on your device..think of it as a computer on your computer that makes requests on your behalf.

To the outside world they will only see the "fictious" computer you mimicked if it gets hacked there was nothing there in the first place and collecting data is also hard.

Your correct, whenever I watch youetube there is an algorithm thats already collecting what I watch and providing me with suggestions based on what I watch.

On the flip side it can also be used for good..

If you make online transactions, the credit card companies have a statistic based on your common purchases..

Anything deamed outside of your common pattern of purchases will be deemed your credit card as stolen.

Since both are based on anomaly detection or finding a common pattern..to throw both off when it comes to collecting data you make it difficult to find a common pattern by doing things that don't have any relation to each other.

But going back to the credit card example, I don't like the idea of the credit card companies building a profile on me based on how I spend, items I consume then give it off to certain people.

I share the same concerns as you, I also wanted to do 23 and me or DNA ancestry..but your essentially giving out your biology data.

My Planets
=========================================
☉‘ ♊, ☽ ♈, ASC ♑, ☿ ♊, ¡÷ ♉, ¡ö ♋ , ♃ ♒, ♄ ♏, ♅ ♐, ♆ ♑


Thank you for your advice Dualgem, I will look into mobile virtualisation.

I suppose trust is the problem, which is why research ethics exist - to uphold public trust in research and to avoid causing harm. But research has been corrupted too. That's the downside of freedom - it's an open door for corruption. And you're left with the task of discerning who to trust and who not to trust, as censorship and more red tape just spoils it for those who behave ethically. Minefield.

------------------
Face a situation fearlessly, and there is no situation to face
~ Florence Scovel Shinn ~

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