posted February 26, 2013 05:26 PM            

I am just wondering if a particular person in my life may be a narcissist.

However this person has done a few things that seem non-narcissistic. My question here is - is it possible for this person to behave in the following ways (I'll type them up in a sec)... and STILL be a narcissist?

- He has admitted to being wrong in a conversation with me. The conversation was about a socially & legally contentious issue.. not a personal issue.
The conversation was public and many other mutual friends were witnessing it.
I replied disagreeing to something he said... and his answer was: "You are right. I hadn't thought of that previously.. That is a better way to look at it" - that was the gist.

- He has complimented another guy in my presence, telling him: "You are a braver man than I am"... It was said in a joking context but he did say those words.
Maybe I am wrong about this - I mean I am not a trained psychologist.. but wouldn't it be fairly unlikely for a narcissist to express himself in this way?

- He has often self-criticized for not being "reasonable" enough. He thinks he does not think clearly and he's too emotional at times. However I am not sure whether this is BS to attract women.. or whether he actually *feels* this way.

- At a point in my life when I was very upset about something - he was there for me and seemed empathetic. We did not have an audience to clap for him being "nice" or something...
I have read that narcissists can "fake" empathy, if they have good reasons...
However, it did not seem to me like he had anything to gain in this situation by "faking" empathy.

- During this conversation ^^ he has also said the words: "Please don't feel bad. I have often thought/felt along the same lines as you".. so that was relating to my situation and saying he has also felt the same way in the past.

- He has complimented me and others. But again - I've heard that sometimes narcissists can intentionally compliment people if they see those people as narcissistic-supply.. So I wasn't sure if this was even relevant?

hmmm ok - I guess that's about it..
So could anyone tell me if - in your opinion - this person can still be a narcissist - despite the behaviour I just described?

Thanks so much!!!

posted February 26, 2013 07:00 PM            

Narcissistic Vampires

have huge egos and tiny consciences. It's not they're actively trying to hurt people; they just never consider other people at all, unless they want something.

LEGENDS IN THEIR OWN MINDS with talent like theirs, who needs performance?
LOOK FOR: Self-proclaimed genius, with membership in MENSA listed as greatest life achievement.
DRAW YOU IN WITH: Talent and potential.
DRAIN YOU BY: Blaming everybody else for their inability to realize that potential.
THE ONE YOU SEE EVERY DAY: Your brother-in-law, the genius who can't hold down a job.
DEFENSIVE STRATEGY: Getting them to do the parts they don't like first, and paying attention to performance rather than talk.

SUPERSTARS do what it takes to climb the ladder of success – whatever it takes, especially taking advantage other people.
LOOK FOR: Success, achieved at all costs.
DRAW YOU IN WITH: Talent, charisma, and acting as if you were as cool as they think they are.
DRAIN YOU BY: Perpetually seeing their needs as more important than anybody else's, and not giving a rip once they've gotten what they want.
THE ONE YOU'RE MOST LIKELY TO SEE EVERY DAY: Politicians, prima-donnas, and hard-driving competitors who throw tantrums when they lose,
DEFENSIVE STRATEGY: Keep a ledger book in your mind. Make sure Superstars pay up front for anything they want from you. Never accept promises or extend credit.

posted February 26, 2013 07:01 PM            

The Success-Oriented, Pragmatic Type:
Adaptable, Excelling, Driven, and Image-Conscious
En Español: Tipo de Personalidad Tres, El Triunfador
In het Nederlands: Persoonlijkheidstype Drie, de Presteerder
For more about the meaning of the arrows, see below.

Type Three in Brief
Threes are self-assured, attractive, and charming. Ambitious, competent, and energetic, they can also be status-conscious and highly driven for advancement. They are diplomatic and poised, but can also be overly concerned with their image and what others think of them. They typically have problems with workaholism and competitiveness. At their Best: self-accepting, authentic, everything they seem to be—role models who inspire others.

Basic Fear: Of being worthless
Basic Desire: To feel valuable and worthwhile
Enneagram Three with a Two-Wing: "The Charmer"
Enneagram Three with a Four-Wing: "The Professional"
Key Motivations: Want to be affirmed, to distinguish themselves from others, to have attention, to be admired, and to impress others.

The Meaning of the Arrows (in brief)
When moving in their Direction of Disintegration (stress), driven Threes suddenly become disengaged and apathetic at Nine. However, when moving in their Direction of Integration (growth), vain, deceitful Threes become more cooperative and committed to others, like healthy Sixes. For more information, click here.

Examples: Bill Clinton, Oprah Winfrey, Jane Pauley, Michael Landon, Tony Robbins, Tom Cruise, Barbra Streisand, Sharon Stone, Madonna, Shirley MacLaine, Sting, Paul McCartney, Dick Clark, Whitney Houston, Ted Danson, Michael Jordan, Shania Twain, Sylvester Stallone, Arnold Schwarznegger, Billy Dee Williams, Kathy Lee Gifford, Truman Capote, O.J. Simpson, and Barack Obama.

Type Three Overview
We have named personality type Three The Achiever because when they are healthy, Threes really can and do achieve great things in the world. They are the "stars" of human nature, and people often look up to them because of their graciousness and personal accomplishments. Healthy Threes know how good it feels to develop themselves and contribute their abilities to the world, and also enjoy motivating others to greater personal achievements than others thought they were capable of. They are usually well regarded and popular among their peers, the type of person who is frequently voted “class president" or “home coming queen” because people feel they want to be associated with this kind of person who acts as a stand-in for them. Healthy Threes embody the best in a culture, and others are able to see their hopes and dreams mirrored in them.

Threes are often successful and well liked because, of all the types, they most believe in themselves and in developing their talents and capacities. Threes act as living “role models” and paragons because of their extraordinary embodiment of socially valued qualities. Healthy Threes know that they are worth the effort it takes to be “the best that they can be.” Their success at doing so inspires others to invest in their own self-development.

Threes want to make sure their lives are a success, however that is defined by their family, their culture and their social sphere. In some families, success means having a lot of money, a grand house, a new, expensive car, and other status symbols. Others value ideas, and success to them means distinguishing oneself in academic or scientific worlds. Success in other circles might mean becoming famous as an actor, or model, or writer, or as a public figure of some kind, perhaps as a politician. A religious family might encourage a child to become a minister, priest, or rabbi since these professions have status in their community and in the eyes of the family. No matter how success is defined, Threes will try to become somebody noteworthy in their family and their community. They will not be a “nobody.”

To this end, Threes learn to perform in ways that will garner them praise and positive attention. As children, they learned to recognize the activities that were valued by their parents or peers, and put their energies into excelling in those activities. Threes also learned how to cultivate and develop whatever about them is attractive or potentially impressive.

Eve is a successful business-woman:

“My mother trained me to perform. I was about three when I performed my first solo in front of the church congregation. I got a lot of positive strokes for that and went on to perform in front of audiences throughout high school, either through music or debate. To this day, something mystical happens to me when I get in front of an audience. I ‘turn it on.’ I am called on frequently as a public speaker and some of my professional colleagues say that they hate following me on the program because I am such a hard act to follow!”

Everyone needs attention, encouragement, and the affirmation of their value in order to thrive, and Threes are the type which most exemplifies this universal human need. Threes want success not so much for the things that success will buy (like Sevens), or for the power and feeling of independence that it will bring (like Eights). They want success because they are afraid of disappearing into a chasm of emptiness and worthlessness: without the increased attention and feeling of accomplishment which success usually brings, Threes fear that they are nobody and have no value.

The problem is that, in the headlong rush to achieve whatever they believe will make them more valuable, Threes can become so alienated from themselves that they no longer know what they truly want, or what their real feelings or interests are. In this state, they are easy prey to self–deception, deceit, and falseness of all kinds. Thus, the deeper problem is that their search for a way to be value increasingly takes them further away from their own Essential Self with its core of real value. From their earliest years, as Threes become dependent on receiving attention from others and in pursuing the values that others reward, they gradually lose touch with themselves. Step by step, their own inner core, their “heart’s desire,” is left behind until they no longer recognize it.

Thus, while they are the primary type in the Feeling Center, Threes, interestingly, are not known as “feeling” people; rather, they are people of action and achievement. It is as if they “put their feelings in a box” so that they can get ahead with what they want to achieve. Threes have come to believe that emotions get in the way of their performance, so they substitute thinking and practical action for feelings.

Jarvis is a well-educated and accomplished business professional; he sees that this pattern developed in him at an early age.

“I had no conscious awareness of this at the time, but when I was a child, I wasn’t allowed to have my feelings at all. They counted for nothing in the framework of my stepfather’s concept of what it took to be successful. I developed the habit of denying my feelings and instead focused on performing and getting good marks in school.”

Threes report that when they realize to what extent they have adapted their lives to the expectations of others, the question arises, “Well, then, what do I want?” They often simply did not know; it was not a question that had ever come up before. Thus, the fundamental dilemma of Threes is that they have not been allowed to be who they really are and to manifest their own authentic qualities. At a young age, they got the message that they were not allowed to have feelings and be themselves: they must, in effect, be someone else to be accepted. To some degree, all of the personality types have been sent the same message, but because of their particular background and makeup, Threes not only heard it, they began to live by it. The attention they received by performing in a certain way was their oxygen, and they needed it to breathe. Unfortunately, it came at a high price.

Marie, a skilled therapist describes the contradiction—and the pressure—of this orientation.

posted February 26, 2013 07:38 PM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted February 26, 2013 08:46 PM            

quote:

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why don't you just break it off?

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Oh this is completely broken off romantically and has been for months from my perspective -- although he does not want to leave me alone on this level.
I am so put off that If he turned into Brad Bitt over night and won a billion dollars, I still wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole.
He has also been deleted and blocked on every form of social media I own.

However - depending on how good a job he manages to get in the line of work that we are both involved in - it may be that he will never be completely out of my life...
So, for networking reasons, it's not entirely savvy of me to have NO interaction with him whatsoever.

Socially people would expect me to at least say "Hi- How are you?" when I see him.
If I do not keep up ANY pleasantry I will look like the "bad guy" - and I am not that stupid.

Quite apart from my complete lack of interest in him emotionally, sexually and on every personal level - I am curious - whether or not he is a narcissist.
This way at least I will know whether for not I can count on him professionally in the future.

Because if he is a narcissist - then i will only be able to count on him in situations that benefit him.
Whereas if he is not a narcissist it would make things easier and he might be a 'good' connection - for purely professional reasons.

peregrine -

quote:

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i don't think they are very strong signs to say that he isn't. but i dunno what are.

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posted February 26, 2013 09:12 PM            

Maybe some time the two of you could get together over coffee or wine and have a cleansing kind of talk about your worry? Wouldn't it save 'torment' to 'know' where you stand with this? Find out what his default answer would be? Get some peace of mind-- whether it go one way, or the other.

posted February 26, 2013 09:34 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Odette:
He is not an overachiever. He has achieved as much as anyone would expect really... considering his life/family.

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the other type is the underachiever.

posted February 26, 2013 09:57 PM            

if he is smart though then most of his comments seem like analysis. a compliment is analysis that one is aesthetically pleasing or competent. u can still be a narcissist while saying those things. u can be wrong especially if it is not your field of expertise.

posted February 26, 2013 10:38 PM            

...

posted February 26, 2013 10:56 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by somethingexcellent:
-Envious of others, to the point of being a driving force behind actions

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^this is the only one i don't check. exploitative is subjective lol! grandiosity too. there is a resume for that but in my mind i can do anything i set my mind too. tho secretly i also know this ain't true lol!

posted February 26, 2013 11:54 PM            

-Highly arrogant and/or domineering

No.

-Sense of entitlement

Undecided...

-Grandiosity towards own talents, achievements, or qualities

No.

-Preoccupation with success and power

Yes.

- Belief of being unique

No.

-Requiring admiration

Yes.

-Exploitative

Yes.

-Lack of empathy

Not seemingly.

-Envious of others, to the point of being a driving force behind actions.

Definitely Yes!

There's only 4 I can say *yes* to... but I'm undecided on one of them... so he might still pass that test lol

peregrine -

quote:

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besides what is the problem?

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posted March 05, 2013 09:26 PM            

"I replied disagreeing to something he said... and his answer was: "You are right. I hadn't thought of that previously.. That is a better way to look at it" - that was the gist."

I have a friend who is a self-admitted NPD sufferer and he is just like this. He can seem incredibly arrogant but then I believe he pretends to be critical of himself and also, I feel like he can make comments like this occasionally but you can completely tell it is /hollow/ and not genuinely true by the distant look to his face and eyes, and how removed he always is.

He could be faking the more empathic or sympathetic statements to get you to trust him, others to trust him, and to get what he wants. Also sounds like possible anti-social features? Not sure. They come off as more emotional and angry to me for some reason, also extremely manipulative too.

posted March 06, 2013 01:57 AM            

quote:

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if you look at his body language and eye contact/face in general it often will speak differently and go against the empathy or kindness he'd try to convey

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