posted November 30, 2013 08:57 PM            

There does appear to be, however, an interesting karmic relationship that can be derived.

It's got me thinking about how the roles can either change - or APPEAR to change. Where Dejanira can be the one ultimately detrimental to Nessus, and Nessus, reacting to something set forth by Dejanira.

I say this based upon the following synastric configuration:

NESSUS square SUN/PLUTO opposite ALICE/AMOR conjunct DEJANIRA.

and

MADHATTER/VENUS square NESSUS quincunx LEWISCARROLL/DESTINN

specifically.

For me, it applies.

But what I WANT to know is how Nessus and Dejanira might be interpreted where Nessus is not abusing, and Dejanira, not victimised.

My guess is, karmic pattern. But, again, I think the interpretation goes against the grain - the typical - and even contrary.

Also, the NESSUS-DEJANIRA conjunction is in his 8H.

posted December 03, 2013 05:09 AM            

When Dejanira is not being victimized, she is worrying about the infidelities of her husband Hercules, and fearing that he will abandon her. Worry and Low Self Esteem are thus keywords for Dejanira.

posted December 03, 2013 01:47 PM            

I completely failed to mention at the initial posting the following (which now feels like a terrible oversight):

NESSUS-DEJANIRA-CERES-MERCURY opposite ALICE-AMOR square MOON-NYMPHE-EROS-BML opposite SUN-BML-PLUTO.

That's the essence of the pattern; the Cardinal Cross.

posted December 03, 2013 01:59 PM            

I just noticed that there's an odd synchro here. My HERACLES and his DEJANIRA with POLYHYMNIA.

My POLYHYMNIA is on my DSC. His is in his 8H, but parallel his 7C and 8C.

posted December 03, 2013 05:52 PM            

I'm not being abusive. I'm a recovered victim of abuse, (okay, recovering; it's a long road) and also a healer by nature. Now, as IQ has stated, I'm shifting consciousness and redirecting things - and to someone afraid of changing the status quo - it can feel VERY intrusive. He's said as much - but does not see it as abusive. Merely uncomfortable, disconcerting, and requiring adjustment and patience.

I THINK this is from our past, however. Our most recent karmic pattern, if you will. It's curious to me, because, if I'm correct, his coming in with DEJA on my NESSUS is a weird insight into how he felt. Like the victim.

posted December 04, 2013 02:47 PM            

Especially since, with my husband, it's very clear: his SUN-NESSUS right on my PSYCHE? Ouch. He's had to learn from me what he never thought true: he's an emotional, psychological abuser. But, again, he's learning. All's not lost. Perhaps the trine to my SUN-PLUTO helps there?

Conversely, seeing the NESSUS-DEJA link up with the man who has instead have to come to MY 'rescue' many a time in this mix, was curious. Especially considering our own most likely karmic history. I could see how HE would label himself the victim - despite being the one to ultimately deal in violence. A paradox, to be sure.

I think NESSUS-DEJA being so tightly configured into this Cardinal Cross expresses that. And NOW that I know how an evolved NESSUS operates - I totally get it. And OOB. Yeah, I'm pretty forceful in my counselling others in abandoning negative psychological practises. Guilty.

I got the nickname 'Tyler Durden in a dress' when I first started, for my no-holds-barred, BS-unacceptable take on approaching my client's denial. Honestly, sometimes, the best thing for someone entrenched in denial is to be given the cold, hard facts.

You're cheating on your wife because she won't perform in bed and you think I'm the answer to all your hopes and dreams? Well, didja know I have sexual issues up the wazoo which prevents me from having the level of libido my husband desires? Oh, you thought that because I'm such a badass that I've got it all figured out - that my persona is the reality. Well, that's a shocker. So, when do you - and your wife - want to begin counselling?

Hey. It works. Cheating assholes need to initially be called out on it - not patiently heard in a nonjudgemental fashion. THAT comes AFTER they've begun to drop the denial, holier-than-thou, nothing's-wrong-with-me act. Then I'm as patient and nurturing as a trusted caregiver.

posted December 04, 2013 08:11 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Astro keen:
Indeed therapists (and writers) have the skills and sense to disentangle psychological complexities. A guy's Nessus squared my Moon - certainly a case of emotional abuse, which I almost failed to recognise but for a clever someone who's advice made all the difference. His Dejanira conjunct my Moon, which again makes sense - the need to abuse or manipulate occurred because of inadequate self-esteem.

However, in a blatantly abusive marriage, it was my Nessus that was square his Dejanira. Whilst his Nessus was square my Asc. In light of what iQ said, this begins to make sense.

---

This makes MUCH more sense to me, putting NESSUS and DEJANIRA together in context. When there's a strong linkage on one side, it only stands to reason it'll be a DW.

Curiously, his NESSUS is also square my ASC-VENUS. I would certainly agree that he's also shifting my consciousness! We're both working to help each other with changing and growing where necessary.

In your circumstance, I can see how the MOON-DEJANIRA works now. I have that as well. I had to leave because of it. While I always knew it was rooted in his own fear of victimisation, abandonment, and the host of other issues from his childhood, he certainly had no right to take it out on me. So, I left. Things are better now. Nowhere near the level we once had; while it breaks my heart on some level, I know this is what had to happen for now. He's growing, too.

Unrelated, but a man whose SUN is exactly conjunct my DEJANIRA strangely appeared right when I needed him most - to help me pick up pieces from other relationships. We were together for about a year in our late teens, having met in another city both being from other states. (I actually ended up moving to his state a decade later, heh. But we've yet to reconnect! Terribly ironic.)

posted February 11, 2015 11:30 PM            

I wonder if it shows up in cases of the synastry between lovers were one of the two is married or both.

Like perhaps Deja conjunct Nessus could represent a pair of lovers who choose to see each other even though is frown upon by society..(open relationship or not; even though open relationships are naturally less frown upon than straight up secret affairs)..

I could see how if both parties have a nessus that is nicely aspected in their chart that a nessus conjunct dejanira would not translate to abuse but it may indicate past life abuse when there are clear past life markers.

Like two people with composite Sun conjunct Southnode exact and composite venus conjunct northnode exact.

But who also have her Dejanira in the 8th conjunct his Nessus in the 7th in synastry with Sirius right on that conjunction with his dejanira conjuncting her mars exact and lets point out that his nessus conjuncts his juno in the 7th.

Interestingly his Deja conjuncts her mars exact but her Draco Deja conjuncts his natal venus exact.

OR

it could be just kinky sex with a bit of domination and submission in the works since both of their nessus are tamed in their own natal chart.

OR

All of the above............

I hope it doesn't always translate to abuse.

posted February 11, 2015 11:37 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
This is one I don't often see. Especially in the sense of there being [b]no abuser involved.

There does appear to be, however, an interesting karmic relationship that can be derived.

It's got me thinking about how the roles can either change - or APPEAR to change. Where Dejanira can be the one ultimately detrimental to Nessus, and Nessus, reacting to something set forth by Dejanira.

I say this based upon the following synastric configuration:

NESSUS square SUN/PLUTO opposite ALICE/AMOR conjunct DEJANIRA.

and

MADHATTER/VENUS square NESSUS quincunx LEWISCARROLL/DESTINN

specifically.

For me, it applies.

But what I WANT to know is how Nessus and Dejanira might be interpreted where Nessus is not abusing, and Dejanira, not victimised.

My guess is, karmic pattern. But, again, I think the interpretation goes against the grain - the typical - and even contrary.

Also, the NESSUS-DEJANIRA conjunction is in his 8H.

Thoughts?[/B]

---

posted February 11, 2015 11:46 PM            

I was deeply hurt in the relationship due to his HUGE lie(s) but he never physically or intentionally hurt me...well the lies were intentional.

Being hurt so deeply forced me to change and grow. But after all that happened, I could never trust him again, I'd always see him as a liar.
His support and friendship where huge in inspiring me to
write and from that I believe I have raised my energy because I've worked through so much fear that was holding me back.

posted February 11, 2015 11:57 PM            

Nessus the Centaur abducted Dejanira, Hercules rescued her and fatally wounded Nessus. Nessus told Dejanira with his dying breath that if his heart’s blood was mixed with Olive Oil and applied to Hercule’s tunic he would never be unfaithful again. Dejanira believing him applied the blood which burnt Hercules so badly he threw himself on the funeral pyre, Dejanira in grief followed him.

In other versions of the myth Hercules violates Dejanira and promises to come back and marry her. The Centaur Eurytion asks to marry Dejanira and Hercules comes back on the scene to slay him and claim Dejanira as his wife.

Both versions of the story deal with passions of the heart, violence and sexual infidelity and misconduct. Dejanira is a warrior princess expert in warfare and chariot driving, similar to Queen Boudicca. Queen Boudicca of the Iceni tribe watched her daughters being raped as she was flogged by Roman soldiers. Boudicca then led the Iceni and other tribes in revolt, burning Roman Colchester, London and St. Alban’s to the ground. The Roman Armies finally defeated Boudicca at the Battle of Watling Street where she committed suicide rather than be captured by the Roman Army.

Nessus is an indicator of Bad Blood, there was certainly bad blood between Boudicca and the Romans. With his dying breath Nessus plots Hercule’s death, this is the stuff of vendettas. This Bad Blood comes straight from the heart and is capable of poisoning us, Nessus is our urge for revenge, our inability to let go of the past and move on. Nessus in the natal chart shows where issues of Bad Blood have affected us family vendettas, inability to move on and forgive ourselves as well as others is shown by Nessus.

Dejanira, shows where we have been wounded by the slings and arrows of misfortune, this asteroid shows abuse of power in all its forms whether that is Boudicca witnessing the rape of her daughters or the daughters witnessing the physical abuse of their mother Dejanira is no pushover she is a warrior that fights back refusing to passively let the slings and arrows wound without a counter attack.

^

Perhaps Deja is the key to helping Nessus heal, learn to let go and forgive...

Perhaps Deja needs to learn to get in touch with her own primal sexual urges and confront her husband demanding an equal relationship instead of spending her time worrying about whether her husband is cheating..

posted February 14, 2015 10:17 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gabby:
I was in a relationship with
gemini Nessus/Dejanira/Juno/Vertex/Mars/Saturn were bunched up together (0-4 degree) in our comp 7th house
In synastry his gemini Nessus was exact square my virgo Dejanira (12th house conjunct Moon)

I was deeply hurt in the relationship due to his HUGE lie(s) but he never physically or intentionally hurt me...well the lies were intentional.

Being hurt so deeply forced me to change and grow. But after all that happened, I could never trust him again, I'd always see him as a liar.
His support and friendship where huge in inspiring me to
write and from that I believe I have raised my energy because I've worked through so much fear that was holding me back.

The relationship was a catalyst for me.

---

Yeah I feel what you are saying..I think nessus can very much be about deception, lies, and the lies seem to sting more when nessus is activated; think catfishing!...

but it also has this effect were the energy gets you in touch with something you are ignoring that you are dissatisfied with and pushes you to change giving you that courage to take that step which may feel risky, scary and impulsive but it ends up been for the best.... (this sounds like pholus actually right????).