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Author Topic:   Victim consciousness - asteroid Prey and others?
PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 04:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It was suggested to begin a thread on how to help the victim in a relationship and so I looked up Asteroid Prey (6157) which is exact conjunct my 10H cusp, indicating that I am "prey" to others in a very visible way. Especially in terms of career or reputation.

This explains a lot - in my marriage I remember thinking "it was all me" when we has issues arise and then after one meeting with the therapist I was handed a very long checklist describing abusive controlling men. Almost every item was checked off. The therapist saw it in one session. That was when my life really began to change. With astrology I would have had this awareness sooner. I knew who he was when I met him but i still chose, unconsciously, to become a victim by allowing a situation to arise that kept me in that dynamic. I just didnt know it at the time how imbedded the victim consciousness was in me.

So no one is really at fault except the one who permits it, and that can all be changed with awareness and support when requested. It doesn't matter who the other person is, the perpetrator. The victim will always bring the villain in and the villain will always bring the victim until awareness arises. Then each can choose to change themselves. It is the alignment of each that creates the problem. The problem is not with the individual alone.

So as a start in helping the victim, look if you have asteroid Prey prominent in your chart. I've looked up several already and the ones who very much feel as though they are a victim have it prominent. Acknowledging this is major toward understanding yourself and avoiding situations that perpetuate this dynamic. It makes no difference whether the other person is a villain or not. If you need to experience victimization, anyone can play that role. It will not stop until you say so. I've made that choice and it will never happen again because of me, not because of them.

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Ami Anne
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posted April 10, 2014 04:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't think cusps matter that much. Am I wrong, PS?

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 04:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The next step would be to look up how asteroid Prey is activated by others and activated by events even if it is not prominent in your chart. Check synastry, past life synastry (Draconic) and other charts.

In Draconic charts, a conjunction or opposition will indicate unfinished business in this lifetime, so there will be potential for it to play out even though it indicates taking place in the past.

These are just thoughts on how to eliminate victim consciousness. Because without the victim the villain will disappear. How healing is that?

It works the other way, too. Help the villain, and there won't be a need for victims.

I know, this sounds idealistic, but if our current knowledge of astrology cannot be used to expose our unconscious in a healing way, what good is it really? Pure entertainment? Not for me, sorry. Any tiny bit of understanding, of bringing the unconscious to awareness, changes everything. You don't even have to work hard at changing anything, the conscious awareness changes everything. Then if you want to make progress ask for the tools you need and support for using those tools.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 04:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I don't think cusps matter that much. Am I wrong, PS?


I use equal house so the cusps are very important, mathematically, at least for me.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 05:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Actually, let me clarify. With equal house the 4H and 10H cusps become the angles in the chart. The angles, not the cusps would be important in the chart for me.

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Ami Anne
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posted April 10, 2014 05:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by PlutoSurvivor:
Actually, let me clarify. With equal house the 4H and 10H cusps become the angles in the chart. The angles, not the cusps would be important in the chart for me.


Ok--the angles. Yes, I agree lol xx

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So, preachiness aside, let's look at charts.

I'm not posting because i do not have permission.
I would say an asteroid is prominent if closely conjunct a planet.

Example 1:
male w/ natal Venus exact conjunct natal Prey.
Victim of love?. 12H, too, so hidden. Blames exwife with good reason - she posted an add in the paper to sell their own children (I know, very sick)

Ex wife Female w/ asteroid Prey conjunct husband's Mars. She was a victim of his control. His chart was filled with sexual and power/ control warning signs.

To the average person you would say he is a victim of her, but his chart shows how he is a victim of himself and she is really the victim of him. She has a very spiritual chart. The average person can not see the underlying unconscious overtones playing ou. Who Everyone blames her but does not look into the true essence of who he is.

My point is that no one is to blame. Having awareness of these placements brings understanding to the situation. And that alone can be healing. You don't even have to know what it means. Just knowing starts the healing process.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 05:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Her's another one.
Person A has asteroid Prey exact conjunct person B's Uranus.
Person A could be a potential victim of B'.s erratic behavior. Person B is an alcoholic and practices indiscriminate sex excessively.
Person A is very aware through intuition,, even without astrology and chooses not to engage, but through astrological awareness was able to bring up a discussion finding out the truth.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 05:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I just think it is interesting how a simple asteroid can bring so much awareness. Any asteroid can do this.

I guess I will leave the rest of the thread to comments.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 05:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wait, one more. In Synastry Asteroid Prey square asteroid Prey, tight. That couple's relationship ended abruptly with a bang, each feeling like the victim.

I really think to look at a relationship comparison responsibly asteroid Prey should be included.

Sorry I haven't done an exhaustive study, so I'm willing to learn here how this plays out with your research and discussion. Also, any suggestions for how to bring this type of information to the victim would be appreciated. This is very delicate, suggesting to the victim how they can be helped, solely by taking responsibility for themselves.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 10, 2014 06:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, enough. I'm going to go walk the dog now

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Astro keen
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posted April 10, 2014 07:39 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is a great thread. Thank you PS. The examples you've given are very helpful.

OK! In my natal, PREY sextiles NN. Does that mean I must experience what it is to be a victim in this life and that will help me fulfil my purpose?

In the synastry with my ex-husband, an abusive relationship, we had:

His PREY sesquisquare my DEJANIRA (1) and NEPTUNE (0)
My PREY sextile his DEJANIRA (2), and conjunct his NEPTUNE (1)

This is interesting - two DWs. Which of the two victim asteroids Dejanira and Prey would you say dominates when aspecting each other? Since his PREY causes disharmonious aspects, it seems that PREY in this context is one causing more harm. Or, it's a co-creation as you suggested earlier.

NESSUS, on the other hand, did not form any aspects with Dejanira. His NESSUS was square my ASC and VALENTINE.

Also, there were other aspects with PREY, but mostly soft ones.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 11, 2014 08:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AK, I don't know about your individual aspects. I'm just looking into this asteroid Prey. I'm looking at conjunctions and major aspects to Prey planets now.

I think with this asteroid, if you don't stand up for yourself you will be eaten alive, so to speak.
I'm already seeing in a natal chart, harsh aspects to Prey show where one needs to stand up for themselves.

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Astro keen
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posted April 11, 2014 10:42 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That's OK PS. Was just adding my bit to the synastry examples you had provided above.

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iQ
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posted April 12, 2014 05:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for iQ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Excellent analysis!

With Asteroid Prey, there is unconscious permission to allow victimization.

With Dejanira, the victimization is accidental, from breach of trust.

With SADO, there is deliberate attraction of abuse.

All such Asteroids are strengthened when the Natal Moon is afflicted or in the 6th House.

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Astro keen
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posted April 12, 2014 05:42 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 12, 2014 03:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by iQ:
Excellent analysis!

With Asteroid Prey, there is unconscious permission to allow victimization.

With Dejanira, the victimization is accidental, from breach of trust.

With SADO, there is deliberate attraction of abuse.

All such Asteroids are strengthened when the Natal Moon is afflicted or in the 6th House.



Thank you, IQ. I love how you can summarize in an instant how these three compare.
You are great at expressing your findings in such a concise way.

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Gabby
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posted April 12, 2014 03:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My prey is square my Venus, makes a t- square when you add my Vertex..
Venus libra@19.03
Vertex aries@21.23
Prey cap@20.50
Medusa cancer@19(just to add to the lovely'ness of this aspect)

I fell in love and got very hurt by a man who's Eros was exact on my prey and his Psyche fell in my Vertex..I look back now and realize I didn't ask any questions, i wanted so much for it to work out that I blindly trusted him when everything screamed for me not to!

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Gabby
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posted April 12, 2014 03:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gabby     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by PlutoSurvivor:
AK, I don't know about your individual aspects. I'm just looking into this asteroid Prey. I'm looking at conjunctions and major aspects to Prey planets now.

I think with this asteroid, if you don't stand up for yourself you will be eaten alive, so to speak.
I'm already seeing in a natal chart, harsh aspects to Prey show where one needs to stand up for themselves.


iQ, what transits do you think would wake someone up to the fact that they were attracting and allowing abusers into their lives....and chose to change it?

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IndigoDirae
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posted August 13, 2014 02:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for IndigoDirae     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gabby:
... I fell in love and got very hurt by a man who's Eros was exact on my prey ...

Ahhhh. See, I'm thinking we may need a second look -- and more work done -- regarding how PREY operates.

Virginia Johnson's EROS was exactly conjunct William Masters' PREY. But when you look back upon everything, it's anybody's guess who was most victimised by whom -- or who took the most advantage. (And without Thomas Meier's book, we'd have no insight into it whatsoever.)

She felt completely destroyed when, after many years, he divorced her and married the childhood sweetheart whom he didn't have the courage to ask in his youth. She died Mary Masters, having returned to her first given name (Mary) and choosing to keep his surname for the rest of her life. Really, really tragic.

If you asked Masters, would he say he was victimised by her sexuality? They both went into it with both eyes wide open, if you ask me.

Perhaps even more telling is his NYMPHE on her PREY. Maybe THAT's where he felt the true 'victimisation' lie; once he discovered the true innerworkings of his own sexuality, it was a genie which couldn't be stuffed back down into the bottle. EROS implies a depth of passion and an erotic longing. NYMPHE is sexual freedom -- often with a rather bohemian and rebellious connotation.

In either case, this asteroid is really fascinating and warrants deeper study.

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Ami Anne
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posted August 13, 2014 06:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by iQ:
Excellent analysis!

With Asteroid Prey, there is unconscious permission to allow victimization.

With Dejanira, the victimization is accidental, from breach of trust.

With SADO, there is deliberate attraction of abuse.

All such Asteroids are strengthened when the Natal Moon is afflicted or in the 6th House.



More pearls of wisdom from the master. Thank you IQ

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Voix_de_la_Mer
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posted August 13, 2014 06:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Voix_de_la_Mer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Prey is conj. my ASc exact.

Oh dear.

In saying that, I have only truly been "preyed upon" once in my life.
As soon as I harnessed my personal power, I have been pretty much immune to being preyed UPON.
And developed the capacity to prey on others, essentially, through connection to my own power.

I do not abuse this though.

When you have been a victim, it is like suicide to become a victimiser.

Perhaps the upside of this position of Prey, is the intimate knowledge of what it feels like, and therefore, the ability to protect others at risk.

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athenegoddess
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posted August 13, 2014 12:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for athenegoddess     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Transit Neptune is square my Prey exact.

This is square someone's Lucifer I know and i feel like he is spiritually doing something to me and acting like he isn't.


What does it mean when my Dejanira is conjunct his Mars/Saturn?

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Ami Anne
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posted August 13, 2014 02:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow V

Prey conj the ASC.

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bioephemera
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posted August 22, 2014 11:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for bioephemera     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"With SADO, there is deliberate attraction of abuse".
Out of the tree asteroids Prey,Dejanira and Sado,the last one is the most prominent in my chart.
For example someone with Sun conj Sado (2 deg. in my case)in Taurus (usually this sign has control over their temper,but once it gets unleashed...) 11th house can be violent and cruel towards their friends or a particular group of people.And I was.
Probably Sado made me cruel and ruthless towards my closest people,so they can feel what I feel.This was a cry for help.Being a victim of abuse can petrify your emotions,can make you feel guilty and worthless for being in such position.
A victim tries to regain their power by taking someone else`s.When you are a part of abusive behavioral pattern you start to incorporate it in your actions.Yes,deliberately,many people follow the reason:"X caused me pain,so I`ll do the same".The prey wants to hunt.
When Sado makes aspects with the Asc,again in my case,abuse turns inward.It can manifest through self destruction as a coping mechanism.I lost confidence and as an extreme
I practiced self mutilation.

BUT!We always have a choice.I made myself aware of these issues,and worked really hard to fix things.
I realise I turned this into confession,more than just an opinion,but its always useful to see how aspetcs manifest in reality.

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