posted December 01, 2015 12:02 PM            

but Quetzlcoatl has number 1915

He was the twinbrother of Tetzlacipota (1980)

According to Mark Andrew HOlmes

"It was named for the Mesoamerican god of light and wisdom, son of the primal hermaphroditic creator deity Tonacatehcuhtli and twin brother of Tezcatlipoca, god of matter and darkness, with whom Quetzalcoatl did the actual work of creating the world.

...

Quetzalcoatl and Tezcatlipoca are two sides of the same coin: Quetzalcoatl is light and Tezcatlipoca darkness; Quetzalcoatl is spirit and Tezcatlipoca matter; Quetzalcoatl gives and Tezcatlipoca takes. Neither can exist without the other.

...

Astrologically, Quetzalcoatl mainly signifies teaching and heroism, but can also signify civilizing influence, redemption, the fallen or imperfect hero(Bill Clinton is a good example of this), communication, the media, journalism, education, the pundit, and that in human nature which gives without taking rather than that which takes without giving(which is signified by Tezcatlipoca)."
http://markandrewholmes.com/quetzaco.html

and

"Tezcatlipoca was a powerful warrior, magician and diviner who saw prophetic visions in his mirror of obsidian, from which his name was derived.

...

In astrology, Tezcatlipoca stands for darkness, scheming, giving without taking; criminal, evil, predatory or antisocial behavior; the occult, materialism, opportunism; the anti-hero, the sorcerer or other individual who considers himself or herself above the written and unwritten laws that govern human conduct."

http://markandrewholmes.com/tezcatpo.html

But of course there might be different interpretations of these.

posted December 01, 2015 12:03 PM            

Mr Sag feels like a friend to me so I'm glad we have that opposition I forgot to say my 10 Pisces Pholus opposes Tezcatlipoca.

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(and no we are NOT going to talk about how that opposes our KARMA-conjunction, interconnecting with those vibrating 15-17 degrees in our comparision. lol)

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No we are not talking about that whatsoever. I'm not repeating it, we're not saying anything. Though your use of the word vibrating is a little hard to ignore..... ....but *poof*....nope, not thinking of that either.

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Seems he`s more 'targeting' my Juno(and what is attached to my Juno-complex), while Mr Sag is more targeting my Ceres-Jupiter (and what is attached to it )

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Far be it from me to read into anything. =)

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Why on the wrong side?

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Just because the Jesus narrative does have a "wrong side" and someone has to play it. Those who oppose Jesus would have the karma. I mean...doesn't karma usually connote bad karma, not good karma? But I like what you said, it's not black and white.

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The way he performs this role, really affects me deeply. Still does, everytime I hear or see him perform 'Gethsemane.' Hard to describe. It feels.... transdimensional almost.

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I saw it and know what you mean, at least I had a glimpse of that. Well and that is the kind of thing Elvis could do, somehow seeming to ascend to another dimension while physically still here. Must be vibrational.

I should check his asteroids....

posted December 01, 2015 12:04 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:

"In the natal chart Tezcatlipoca depicts our ability to see what lies hidden beneath the surface our ability to look honestly within our own souls and that of others. This asteroid gives us an ability to intuitively feel what lies behind the actions of others. As God of the night he confers the ability to see through the darkness and follow the path before us."

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posted December 01, 2015 12:14 PM            

"I'm not repeating it, we're not saying anything. "
I am glad we are not saying anything.

"Though your use of the word vibrating is a little hard to ignore."
Yeah, curious how THAT came out. But since it is there, it stays. It fits too.

Seriously, I have always wondered how Mr Sag could have NOTHING on these 17 degrees in his chart, which, in my own chart, were looking at me so weirdly, like saying: "Look here. Pay attention. We mean something. You gotta figure it out"

I still believe Mr Sag must have something there I have not found yet.

HOwever while looking and looking and not finding anything, I pulled up Lancelot`s chart and was HIT OVER THE HEAD with all those thingies he has on 17 degrees, oftentimes EXACTLY or almost exactly on this degree.
Natrually I find out with my progressed Moon on 15, nearly 16 Leo. LOL

And I am not even talking about really weird esoteric asteroids here.

"Far be it from me to read into anything. "
NOt far from me. lol

"Those who oppose Jesus would have the karma."
Or those who suffered with him.

" I mean...doesn't karma usually connote bad karma, not good karma?"
Nope, Karma just means "deed". and in terms of past and present lives, facing the results/ consequences of something that went on before, no matter whose fault it was. Usually it does mean however that something has to be modified, redirected, readdressed, repeated, improved, whatever, yes.

" Well and that is the kind of thing Elvis could do, somehow seeming to ascend to another dimension while physically still here."

" Must be a vibrational thing
"

"I should check his asteroids...."
Yes, he has some interesting ones. like DNA conjunct NEptune and CUPIDO. lol

"It's nice to talk to you in real time, "Yes, I agree.

posted December 01, 2015 12:15 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
I prefer this line of interpretation. Where is it from, Hypatia?

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Seems Tezcatlipoca was a Scorpio/Pluto figure.

What with the darkness, x-ray vision, occult interests.

My Quetz widely opposes Tez (abbreviations very handy in this case )

Tez 11.51 Virgo
Quetz 14.45 Pisces

posted December 01, 2015 12:21 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Seems Tezcatlipoca was a Scorpio/Pluto figure.

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posted December 01, 2015 12:30 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
Tez 11.51 Virgo
Quetz 14.45 Pisces

So, less than 3 degrees, in a t-square with my 12.44 Sag Neptune.

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Neptune on their midpoint.

and yes handy abbreviations.

Interestingly my Tez/Quetz-mp is at around 16 Capricorn, opposing my Saturn, so another of these karmic thingies.

well I guess we should get back to the Magdalene-discussion though.

Did I mention my Magdalene conjuncts Mr Sag`s KARMA on 3 Libra?

posted December 01, 2015 12:38 PM            

Hmmm....

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Seriously, I have always wondered how Mr Sag could have NOTHING on these 17 degrees in his chart, which, in my own chart, were looking at me so weirdly, like saying: "Look here. Pay attention. We mean something. You gotta figure it out

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That is interesting. I mean...vacancies can be fascinating...like the third decan is almost a dead zone in my chart, save for Chiron and a few asteroids. Second decan is a dead zone in my husband's chart. So we complement each other...you know, almost like geometric pattern completion, only with degrees. Maybe that was part of your allure with him, that you bring all these "missing numbers" to his table, like exotic treasure. (Yes I love getting carried away with metaphors...astrology is so good for that!)

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However while looking and looking and not finding anything, I pulled up Lancelot`s chart and was HIT OVER THE HEAD with all those thingies he has on 17 degrees, oftentimes EXACTLY or almost exactly on this degree.
Natrually I find out with my progressed Moon on 15, nearly 16 Leo. LOL

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Right. How could it be any other way? LOL

And who better to tell it to than me, with my sympathetic 16 Aries Jupiter and 16 Gemini Mars lending their ears? Plus a hearty wave from my 17 Libra Karma.

"Yes, he has some interesting ones. like DNA conjunct NEptune and CUPIDO. lol"

posted December 01, 2015 12:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Did I mention my Magdalene conjuncts Mr Sag`s KARMA on 3 Libra?

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LOL, it never ends. Well he kept you pure but he might regret that...

posted December 01, 2015 01:18 PM            

Anyway what I mean is this in my chart:

Moon 17°06 Aquarius
Quetzl 16°17 Aquarius

Juno 16°58 Pisces

my name 16°59 Taurus

Karma 16°01 Gemini
Aeternitas 16°03 Gemini

Saturn 16°57 Cancer

Lancelot 16°47 Scorpio

Erato 15°10 Sag
Tetz 15°11 Sag

even if we scratch all (minor) asteroids, the Moon-Saturn-Juno still remains.

" Maybe that was part of your allure with him, that you bring all these "missing numbers" to his table,"
In terms of empty spots falling onto the same degrees as other objects in his chart, yes definitely. In terms of just any number, no, that would be too arbitrary. I mean if we believe that it would be valid with pretty much anyone, as the chance to meet someone who has something on unrelated degrees is much higher than meeting someone who actually has something there.

"With DNA like that, maybe he is the love child of his mother and the alien who abducted her? That would explain some things..."
LOL
Love your imagery!

Well, what does it tell about me then that I have DNA in Libra conjunct SAPPHO, MUSA and KASSANDRA?

Loved the song. hehe.

posted December 01, 2015 01:21 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Faith:
LOL, it never ends. Well he kept you pure but he might regret that...

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that is actually what I always liked about Magdalene, that she was NOT pure in the traditional church-sense (chaste), but that her purity was of a spiritual nature but not excluding the humanity of being a woman of flesh and blood.
It`s my deepest conviction that BOTH have to be brought into balance to experience a sense of completion, at least as long as we are in our bodies.

posted December 01, 2015 01:35 PM            

So if we have a bundle of things in our chart that do not connect to another's chart, that is not a case of filling in their blanks, that's just like remaining off their radar?

Almost like a water void won't look for a water heavy person necessarily, just to supply them with water...because as far as they know, they don't even need or understand water?

I think I get it.

I don't really understand Magdalena at all, not sure why she gets such a bad rap- if Jesus liked her, why shouldn't everyone else? She must have been special, to be his choice.

I guess I've had enough of the Catholic repression mentality to last me several lifetimes.

No offense intended to other Catholics.

posted December 02, 2015 12:43 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Not wanting to derail......

but Quetzlcoatl has number 1915

He was the twinbrother of Tetzlacipota (1980)

According to Mark Andrew HOlmes

"It was named for the Mesoamerican god of light and wisdom, son of the primal hermaphroditic creator deity Tonacatehcuhtli and twin brother of Tezcatlipoca, god of matter and darkness, with whom Quetzalcoatl did the actual work of creating the world.

...

Quetzalcoatl and Tezcatlipoca are two sides of the same coin: Quetzalcoatl is light and Tezcatlipoca darkness; Quetzalcoatl is spirit and Tezcatlipoca matter; Quetzalcoatl gives and Tezcatlipoca takes. Neither can exist without the other.

...

Astrologically, Quetzalcoatl mainly signifies teaching and heroism, but can also signify civilizing influence, redemption, the fallen or imperfect hero(Bill Clinton is a good example of this), communication, the media, journalism, education, the pundit, and that in human nature which gives without taking rather than that which takes without giving(which is signified by Tezcatlipoca)."
http://markandrewholmes.com/quetzaco.html

and

"Tezcatlipoca was a powerful warrior, magician and diviner who saw prophetic visions in his mirror of obsidian, from which his name was derived.

...

In astrology, Tezcatlipoca stands for darkness, scheming, giving without taking; criminal, evil, predatory or antisocial behavior; the occult, materialism, opportunism; the anti-hero, the sorcerer or other individual who considers himself or herself above the written and unwritten laws that govern human conduct."

http://markandrewholmes.com/tezcatpo.html

But of course there might be different interpretations of these.

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I did read his interpretation for it but Mother Teresa has DC-Pluto-Tezcatlipoca-Valentine stellium and she is not evil or selfish.

DC in Gemini @24d16
Valentine in Gemini @26d29
Pluto in Gemini @27d45
Tezcatlipoca in Gemini @29d23

The discovery chart for Tezcatlipoca has:

SUN conjunct AMOR under 3d
Jupiter conjunct Valentine under 2d
Eros conjunct Osiris under 2d
Moon conjunct Pluto

I could see why Mother Teresa has it conjunct Pluto...

Glenn from Walking dead has it conjunct his Jupiter under 1d, his character is very giving, always giving others the benefit of the doubt no matter how badly they have messed up, risking his life for those who others would not and almost died in recent episodes bc of it.

Stefen Molyneux has it conjunct Jupiter under 1d too an he sees beneath the surface of things and cares about humanity and has made it his career to wake people up...

Its possible both descriptions are incorrect as looking at the discovery chart I would think this asteroid has to do more with extreme devotion, unconditional love and sacrifice.

I would point out that Neptune is not afflicted at all in the Tezcatlipoca discovery chart, on the contrary, and perhaps that is why the astrologer I referenced said it was a good asteroid for intuition and seeing beneath the surface:

Neptune sextile Moon
Neptune trine mercury
Neptune Biquintile Venus
Neptune Biquintile Jupiter
Neptune semisextile Saturn
Neptune sextile Pluto
Neptune sextile Chiron

^ Yes those neptune aspects in the discovery chart do fit this interpretation:

"In the natal chart Tezcatlipoca depicts our ability to see what lies hidden beneath the surface our ability to look honestly within our own souls and that of others. This asteroid gives us an ability to intuitively feel what lies behind the actions of others. As God of the night he confers the ability to see through the darkness and follow the path before us."

I bet she checked the discovery chart first and then tied it to the mythology, that is how it should be done in my opinion.

However MARS is AFFLICTED! so perhaps that is were the selfishness interpretation kicks in but mars conjuncts the Southnode exact 0d02 in the discovery so perhaps the goal is to overcome that selfish nature and balance it out. In spite of the mars been afflicted, neptune is blessed which makes me feel NOW that both interpretations fit the discovery chart!

1915 Quetzalcóatl on the other hand does have an afflicted Neptune with its tightest aspect been: