posted February 14, 2004 03:50 AM         

Lots of foods out there contain animal ingredients, eg. cheese (rennet, a calf's stomach extract), yoghurt, jelly,confectionery (gelatine, boiled animal skin/bone tissues), beers, wines (blood or isinglass for fining)and more. Vegetarian or vegan cheese/yoghurt and alcoholic drinks can be found at your local health food shops.

Fruitarianism is a good concept, though. Fruit was once the only food that was meant to be consumed by human beings. As Linda pointed out, fruit cleanses your body. When you're very ill and have lost most of your appetite but you still have to eat in order to live, fruit (fresh, unrefrigerated) is the only thing you can eat. Or fruit juice.

Nevertheless, you cannot suddenly become a fruitarian. Indeed, as Linda said, our systems have been gravely poisoned and it will take us a long time to let our bodies gradually get used to fruit and fruit alone. Start with being vegetarian, then being vegan, eat simple foods. Get in contact with your local vegetarian or vegan groups. They can help you with all the information you need regarding nutrition and more. Even veggie pet food.

Vegetarianism is not restriction. It's relief and freedom.

posted February 14, 2004 06:17 AM         

when attempting to leap to the next level of good nutrition, it can be difficult to find the right path.

every way one turns seems to offer a different and better solution.....i've been on that merry-go-round often. macrobiotic, raw food, vegan, fruitarian.....some praise fermented foods, some condemn them.....it can be confusing!

and your body making such rapid changes, especially if you just jump in...it affects your whole being -- mental, physical and spiritual. as your body purges itself physically, so does your mind and spirit and you will find yourself in strange new states of being as a result of diet.

i agree with your approach completely....after trying all of the above for a good number of years. i'm starting the path again slowly myself. i always thought that i should make the transition to fruitarian as soon as possible, but now i know that isn't right for me.....i need to work slowly into veganism (having already been so many times) and onto raw foods after that and eventually fruitarian when my mind and body are ready.

this is so true, as you begin the path on vegetarianism, you undoubtedly will see and feel changes, like a purge and rebirth, in your whole framework and outlook....not just your physical body. they are all connected. too much too fast is quite the rollercoaster ride!

going veg has had the most profound effect on my life and it's ongoing.

Vegetarianism is not restriction. It's relief and freedom.

i love how you stated that! it's a most definite truth and pearl of wisdom.

thanks for posting this topic.

posted February 14, 2004 01:28 PM         

I must say I agree with Randall. After a few generations the young won't need to go thru this process. We just need to get it out of collective system, so to speak.

I'll go one step further by saying that eventually the animals will follow our lead. I think they followed us into flesh- eating and they will follow us out of it. Deep down Lions want to be vegetarians too!

"Vegetarianism is not restriction. It is relief and freedom." Love it!

posted June 14, 2004 01:36 PM         

Just because fish eat fish it doesn't mean it is justifiable. Just like the fact that predators eat other animals (including humans) does not justify the action of taking other life forms that are made from flesh and blood out of no necessity whatsoever. Besides, as I've pointed out many times, the sea is heavily polluted now and as fish do eat other fish, and when you eat fish, you're near the top of the food chain and you consume a huge amount of poison. Despite the so-called benefits of fish oil, fish is no longer beneficial in this respect. In fact, I just don't think we human beings ever need to consume aquatic animals.

Why does fish eat fish then? Why is 'whether it's eating or being eaten' the 'ecological law' of the ocean? Well, I'd say there are so many things that are not supposed to be happening on this planet and as well as in the sea. Causing pain is wrong and fish do feel pain. Bleeding is suffering and fish do bleed. Suffering is unnecessary and fish do suffer because of the absurdity of the so-called 'law of universe'. Breathing is what life forms do and fish do breathe. Life forms are supposed to live together in peace and fish are life forms. People rarely doubt what's right or wrong because they are not aware that lots of things ought not to happen.

posted June 14, 2004 01:40 PM         

No offence. Forgive my Uranus amnesia- I totally forgot that you already replied to me in 'Forsaken fish', oops! I've just checked and I found out about it

posted June 15, 2004 09:06 AM         

To this day, I can't stand the smell of bread baking anymore, because I associate it with being ill, plus I do not like sweets as I did before, and spinach, garlic, onions, lettuce, and tomatoes make my mouth water. While listening to my body I found what I really like to eat.

And avocadoes and rice:> Carribbean food is wonderful isn't it?

But I think everyone has to have their own realization, and everyone has their own perfect food. For some it's lamb, for others it's buttered corn. Maybe genetically we all need different things? I love saumon and others hate it, there must be a reason for this push and pull:>

Cancer survivors can't stand the smell of meat sometimes, there must be a reason but I think it has less to do with evolution than simple nutrition. Our bodies tell us what we need. It's up to us to get in touch and listen. hopefully not while in the hospital.

It was Richard Pryor (Scorpio Moon) who said that the happiest time in his life was when he was in the hospital laying on his back, doing nothing. It was the first time he could really listen to himself, with nothing else to do but be himself. How sad that he had to be at that point, where he set himself on fire to do that. But in reality his body was crying out.

I wish everyone could go someplace to listen to their body without fear or anxiety.

posted June 15, 2004 10:26 AM         

I agree that everybody responds to different foods differently and we all have the foods that best suit us. I love potatoes, tomatoes, mushrooms and all fruits.

For meat-eaters, let's start with

Eliminating fast food/junk food, then
Eliminate processed food, then
Eliminate red meat, then
Eliminate poultry, then
Eliminate fish, then (if you wish to continue)
Eliminate eggs, then
Eliminate dairy products, then (if you wish to continue)
Eliminate bee products, then
Avoid fake meat and other processed vegetarian/vegan foods (although they can satisfy many people's needs)

Then again, it's up to you.

posted June 15, 2004 01:05 PM         

I believe fish are the perfect meat for us all to eat. They have everything that we need, and I agree with Randall and the "eat or be eaten" theroy.

Fish feel no pain. Catching them, gutting them... none of it is painful as it would be for humans or other animals of nature.

posted June 15, 2004 04:26 PM         

Some people believe you have to be a complete vegetarian to walk the spiritual path. I know that Linda did. I do not. I have learned that it is a case of energy force. One that is beneficial to your own system. You are not made "Spiritual" just because you choose not to eat meat. Not at all. You maybe more empathic towards animals and that is a good thing, though that on it's own would not make you more loving towards your fellow humans, or loving in other ways as a matter of fact.

posted June 15, 2004 05:34 PM         

What about mercury, POPs and PCB? Don't you think they damage your life force?

Even without these toxic chemicals, can you further explain why you believe consuming fish gives you energy force and keeps you on the spiritual path?

posted June 15, 2004 11:54 PM         

They (fish) can be stressed physiologically when out of the water, and stress can quickly become lethal.

So fish do get stressed.
www.firstscience.com/SITE/editor/024_ramblings_05092003.asp

This web page actually points out that fish do feel pain.

posted June 15, 2004 11:54 PM         

Heavy Metal intoxication especially of Mercury and PCB's are not just in our oceans, lakes and rivers. Not only those who eat meat will be contaminated. Facts say, according to the World Health Organization research, the prime sources for Mercury exposure are:

Soil
Drinking water
Fungicides
Pesticides
Fabric softners --- yes it is a shock!
Wood Preservatives
Paints
Plastics
Dental Fillings .... the list goes on.

PCB's:

Drinking Water
Food all kinds
Copy paper
Colour Pigments
Heat transfer Systems
And millions of every day items.

These chemicals are quite resistant to degradation and therefore persist in our bodies [ stored in fat cells ] or in the enviroment.

You may never consume fish in your life. I don't care if you lead the "BEST" organic life style, it is impossible for you in this day and age to completely avoid them.

The answer to your question is obviously yes, of course they impede your life force to some extent. So does living, and many other things. I did not say it kept me on the spiritual path now did I? I said you were not made more spiritual by simply refusing to eat meat. Not at all!

I have not eaten meat since I was ten. School was horrible especially at meal times. I'd be made to sit in the dining hall for hours. Whilst everybody else was in class, I'd be staring at cold, congealed hunks of flesh on my plate. I started to think of what I thought were creative ways to get rid of it before the teacher came back. I used to chop it up in tiny bits and hide it behind the school radiators. I stuffed my pockets, shoes and even knickers full of it when I had to. Anything but eat it!!

I started to eat Salmon about 8 years ago. I eat only wild about four or five times a year. Sometimes not even that. It does NOT give me any MORE energy, nor did I say it did. It actually affects the energy I have. Totally different. Everything in life has energy force even a carrot.

The journey of self discovery is not a straight line rise from one level to another. So that if you don't eat meat, you'll somehow automatically move up a notch. That is really misguided nonsense.

Anytime you make transitions in your inner life, you will be making transitions in your outer. The lesson is quite simple: While we are climbing the rock face we must recognize it as such. Don't lets get suckered into the idea that a particular direction you take is also great for everyone else. People ask me what I eat and what I take daily because they like the results I get. I tell them gladly, I'm happy to share. I do not make them feel bad for their choices, nor do I tell them, my way is the best way for them. These animal activists who blow up buildings and assault people with their aggressive behaviour are not very spiritual either are they? We are all going to get there one day. Lets all be patient with one another.

posted June 16, 2004 06:32 AM         

P.S. I strongly disagree with the deed of those animal rights extremists who encourage people to bomb McDonalds and who actually did blow up McDonalds. They only get the opposite effects. Once again, well-said, Gia.

posted June 16, 2004 12:30 PM         

I can hardly say you share those same values as you have reacted to me in other posts.

You do shove your ideals down other peoples throats believing that YOUR was is the ONLY way to live healthily.

Never once have you given me the impression that you belive as Gia wisely stated, "Don't lets get suckered into the idea that a particular direction you take is also great for everyone else."

posted June 17, 2004 06:47 AM         

Thanks for the input. I didn't know white sugar contains such material. I'll double check that.

LibraSparkle,

I heartedly agree with what Gia said. She provided me a new angle. Let's just accept the fact that we are not to reach an agreement and that we are not to comprehend each other's position.

posted June 17, 2004 01:01 PM         

For checking whether any product contains animal ingredients, the booklet 'Animal Free Shoppers' is available at www.vegansociety.com/shop

posted June 17, 2004 03:59 PM         

Please see my latest posts in the 'Vegetarianism vs. omnivorism' forum, you may find out I am not that predictable after all (as you called).