posted October 09, 2014 10:42 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Sabina79:
Okay, Lotis White, LeeLoo, Mir et al,

Since no one had anything to add (further) on KarkaQueen's parents, let's move on to Kurt Russell and Goldie Hawn.

They first met in 1968 but did not start dating until 1983. Their first date was on Valentine's Day (2-14-83).

Together: 31 years.

Personal quotes:
KURT: "“We have a lot of good days. I figure it this way. If it’s 3 percent really bad, and 7 percent not too good, but 90 percent fabulous, I think I’ll take that."
GOLDIE: “I would honestly say that ours has been 2 percent really bad, 2 percent so-so, and 96 percent fabulous.”

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posted October 09, 2014 10:43 PM            

I actually see some nice 5th, 7th, and 8th house, ties between these two. There are some symbolic/affinity matches and some good house ruler synastry. First I’ll look at things from Goldie’s side and then I do Kurt’s side in my next post.

From Goldie’s side she has her late Gemini Moon conjunct her Dsc, with the entire sign of Cancer in the 7th house. Kurt matches this with his Moon, Asc, and Uranus all in Cancer falling into Goldie’s 7th house.

Goldie has her Mars in Leo near the end of her 7th house, and Kurt matches this with his Mercury, Mars, and Venus all in Aries.

Goldie also has Saturn in the 7th house, and while Kurt is not very Saturn-like overall (except that he has a Sun/Saturn opposition about 3 degrees wide, perhaps giving him some common sense), She is able to ‘feel’ his Saturn because it tightly sextiles her Sun by 1 degree, and squares her Moon by 3 degrees. He is able to ‘give’ her Saturn.

A similar thing is happening with Goldie’s Gemini Dsc in relation to Kurt’s chart. Kurt is not very Gemini-ish but he does strongly aspect Goldie’s chart with his Mercury… So he is able to ‘give’ her Mercury energy even though his chart is generally not overly Mercurial. His Aries Mercury exactly trines Goldie’s Leo Mars in her 7th house. So he is able to use his mental energy to contribute to Goldie’s 7th house Mars issues/needs.

THE SECONDARY 7TH HOUSE

Because Gemini is on the cusp of Goldie’s 7th house, her secondary 7th house is her 3rd house of communication. In Goldie’s chart her 3rd house starts in mid-Pisces and ends in late Aries (I think it’s obvious where I’m gong with this). Kurt puts his Pisces Sun, Jupiter, and North Node, as well as his Aries Mercury and Mars, all in Goldie’s 3rd house. He really resonates with her secondary 7th house.

Also, Goldie had Leo on her 8th house cusp, ruled by her Scorpio Sun. Kurt has nothing in her 8th house but her 8th house ruler is sextile his Saturn. This might not sound so great unless we also look at Kurt’s chart, and see that Saturn rules both his 7th, and 8th houses. So Goldie’s 8th house ruler is actually connecting with Kurt’s dual 7th and 8th house ruler. That’s pretty nice.

Adding to there chemistry, Goldie’s 8th house Pluto trines Kurt’s Mars in Aries.

Now for the 5th house, Goldie has Taurus on the 5th house cusp ruled by Venus in Scorpio. The only connection that Kurt has to this is that his Mars in Aries quincunxes her Venus in Scorpio by 1 degree. Actually, I do wonder if the fact that Scorpio and Aries are both Mars ruled signs adds a strength to this aspect that would not otherwise be there (it might be similar with a Taurus/Libra quincunx). Like this adds an extra Poow!! to the quincunx. Regardless the quincunx is still an aspect (it’s about unspoken undercurrents, a weird incongruent feeling, and people surprising each other with unexpected behavior). My guess is Goldie’s subtle Venus in Scorpio knows he to keep Kurt’s direct Mars in Aries on his toes. This aspect would still add to the attraction, especially since it’s a Venus/Mars aspect (Many people ignore quincunxes altogether and I think this is a mistake).

For more 5th house strength we could look at Goldie’s secondary 5th house. With Taurus on the 5th house, her 2nd house is the secondary 5th. Aquarius is on the 2nd house cusp, ruled by in Gemini and Saturn in Cancer…. Kurt matches this with his 1st house Uranus (his self expression), and again his Cancer planets. He’s got a bit of a ‘rebel’ in him which she may quite like.

The asteroid Juno is often important in attractions that result in long-term committed relationships. Goldie’s Libra Juno is opposite Kurt’s Aries Mars

INTERPLANETARY ATTRACTION SYNASTRY

If we put aside the house related attraction synastry for a moment, it’s also worth noting that this couple has quite a few interplanetary aspects that are traditionally considered to indicate attraction just by themselves. These two also have a nice mixes of dynamic challenging aspects, and smooth harmonious aspects.

For instance, Goldie and Kurt share a nice Sun/Sun trine in Scorpio and Pisces by 2 degrees, however his Sun/Saturn opposition also squares her Gemini Moon. It’s not all bad for her Moon though, because his Venus in Aries comes along and sextiles her Moon by 1 degree. There’s compensation for the challenging aspects, and enough dynamic energy here to keep things interesting.

And about their attraction aspects.

His Sun is square her Moon… (Sun/Moon aspects are actually very strong indicators of attraction between the sexes. I think a lot of people forget about this because they get so caught of in the idea of other aspects like Venus/Mars, or Venus/Pluto, and whatnot. Sun/Moon aspects have both an element of physical attraction, and a deep primal psychological pull towards someone. The hard aspects can be very compelling, and heartbreaking if there are no soft aspects to compensate for them, because it feels like someone tugging very aggressively at your core. Sun/Moon aspects in general tend to generate powerful feelings between people).

His Venus sextile her Moon… (this is a nice cozy, loving aspect)

Her Pluto trine his Mars.. (this is a steamy one)

Her Venus quincunx his Mars (Because the quincunx occurs between signs ruled and co-ruled by the same planet, Aries-Scorpio, I strongly suspect the aspect is more powerful then with a regular quincunx).

The Asc of both are conjunct each other's Dsc (They have an Asc/Dsc conjunction. It's out-of-sign but the energy link is bound to be there. Each has an 'aura' about them that connects to the Dsc of the other, promoting attraction).

posted October 09, 2014 10:47 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by astra7:
Heaps of good aspects in Synastry.
- Their ASC/DSC swapped and Goldie's NN on Kurt's ASC
- Many Saturn glue, Kurt's Saturn sq Goldie's moon, Saturn sextile Saturn, Kurt's Saturn sextile Goldies Sun
- Venus sextile moon
- Sun trine Sun/Mercury (good communication)
- Venus trine Mercury & Asc
- Saturn trine Jupiter & NN
- Mars trine Sun

Composite
- Saturn in the 5th house and it took them a while to start dating.
- Moon in the 4th, nice

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posted October 09, 2014 10:48 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Sabina79:
Goldie's natal chart:

Goldie has a predominantly (almost entirely) southern hemispheric chart (with nearly all her planets in Quadrants III (social identity) and IV (social expression).

To quote cafeastrology.com:
"People with the majority of planets found in the Southern hemisphere tend to be more objective, sociable, and concerned with "outside" events, whether they affect them on a personal level or not."

While other chart factors may motivate Goldie to enter into- or remain in- relationships, direct "planets in houses" is not one of them (rulerships, secondary houses, etc. notwithstanding).

The rulers of her ASC (Jupiter; which conjuncts her MC) and DSC (Mercury; 12 house)) help to form a cradle configuration (along with Uranus in the 6th house and Pluto in its own 8th house).

While it's not essential that a partner connect with one's natal configurations, I do believe longevity is rare without it, especially when angle rulers are involved. Thus we might expect Kurt to tap into this energy "field", preferably with a "romance" planet.

Down to detail, we see that Goldie's Moon in Gemini (social but not emotional by nature) closely conjuncts her DSC, emphasizing a link between serious relationships and emotional satisfaction.

Her Moon also conjuncts her 7th-house N. node (for the node fans out there!), perhaps indicating that serious relationships are her personal catalyst for growth.

Her Moon inconjuncts her Sun in Scorpio (11th), so there may be some struggle between her ego needs and emotional needs. However, the rulers of both (Pluto and Mercury) are in trine, so this no doubt eases some of the discomfort.

Of note, her LAP is her Scorpio Venus in the 10th which only squares her Mars and Pluto (both in Leo). This house placement of Venus gives it a slight Saturnine tone, suggesting desire for a partner who has Saturnine qualities or who is younger/older. The 10th house of career means she might meet a partner through work.

Her 7th house Mars (especially in a fire sign- Leo) would suggest a desire not just for a "fiery partner" but for a more volatile relationship. Passivity is not for her. In regards to projection (a 7th house issue), she likely attracts temperamental individuals.

Her 7th house Saturn reiterates the above interest in a Saturnine-themed relationship. See above. Too, if she projects Saturn, she may feel "stifled" by men interested in a more traditional relationship, preferring the long-term but technically unbound union (which she does). To quote Goldie:

"I don’t like the idea of somebody closing a door and saying, ‘You can’t walk out the door.’ I don’t like that feeling. Now, if somebody keeps the door open, I could be a bird in that cage forever and never fly out."

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posted October 10, 2014 02:26 PM            

EDIT: sorry, no square, a biseptile. But what really weighs here IMO, the connection with her intercepted 7th
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posted October 10, 2014 03:41 PM            

Mars opp Neptune - enormous pull for a Pisces, he has it by sign, she makes an aspect for him
Mars trine Pluto, Mars quincunx Venus/Lilith - 5th to 11th
5th ruler Venus trine DSC ruler sq Saturn , he has a 10th house stellium, powerful Sun/Merc Saturn opp, sextile her DSC ruler

all these ruler contacts are extremely important in mutual attraction

they have an amazing synastry, with a huge number of aspects, DWs, pattern completion and many traditional aspects.

His Sun/Mercury, Saturn (his DSC ruler) and all the other personal are multiaspected by her planets.

Her Sun/Merc Moon Uranus in his interception, IC/MC related
her planets in his 5th
her Mars Saturn Pluto in his 2nd, very good for physical attraction and long-term physical compatibility among other things
her planets in his 12th

Venus/Eros DW, just as a detail

bit there are a million reason for mutual long-term attraction and a marital relationship in this synastry, IMO

posted October 10, 2014 05:43 PM            

Progressed Sun-Moon in 4th Harmonic -

In 1983 she had pSun in Capricorn, pMoon in Scorpio. He had pSun in Aries, pMoon in Virgo.

Notice that her pMoon was conjunct her nSun in Scorpio & his pMoon was opposite his nSun in Pisces. YES!! it acts/works the same as if both Sun & Moon were progressed.

posted October 10, 2014 07:41 PM            

To quote cafeastrology.com:
"People with the majority of planets found in the Southern hemisphere tend to be more objective, sociable, and concerned with "outside" events, whether they affect them on a personal level or not."

While other chart factors may motivate Goldie to enter into- or remain in- relationships, direct "planets in houses" is not one of them (rulerships, secondary houses, etc. notwithstanding).

The rulers of her ASC (Jupiter; which conjuncts her MC) and DSC (Mercury; 12 house)) help to form a cradle configuration (along with Uranus in the 6th house and Pluto in its own 8th house).

While it's not essential that a partner connect with one's natal configurations, I do believe longevity is rare without it, especially when angle rulers are involved. Thus we might expect Kurt to tap into this energy "field", preferably with a "romance" planet.

Down to detail, we see that Goldie's Moon in Gemini (social but not emotional by nature) closely conjuncts her DSC, emphasizing a link between serious relationships and emotional satisfaction.

Her Moon also conjuncts her 7th-house N. node (for the node fans out there!), perhaps indicating that serious relationships are her personal catalyst for growth.

Her Moon inconjuncts her Sun in Scorpio (11th), so there may be some struggle between her ego needs and emotional needs. However, the rulers of both (Pluto and Mercury) are in trine, so this no doubt eases some of the discomfort.

Of note, her LAP is her Scorpio Venus in the 10th which only squares her Mars and Pluto (both in Leo). This house placement of Venus gives it a slight Saturnine tone, suggesting desire for a partner who has Saturnine qualities or who is younger/older. The 10th house of career means she might meet a partner through work.

Her 7th house Mars (especially in a fire sign- Leo) would suggest a desire not just for a "fiery partner" but for a more volatile relationship. Passivity is not for her. In regards to projection (a 7th house issue), she likely attracts temperamental individuals.

Her 7th house Saturn reiterates the above interest in a Saturnine-themed relationship. See above. Too, if she projects Saturn, she may feel "stifled" by men interested in a more traditional relationship, preferring the long-term but technically unbound union (which she does). To quote Goldie:

posted October 11, 2014 01:05 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Nine:
She's born just after a FULL MOON, he's born just after a FIRST QUARTER. In my 4th harmonic theory, this is a "natural match". That's why they're attracted.

Progressed Sun-Moon in 4th Harmonic -

In 1983 she had pSun in Capricorn, pMoon in Scorpio. He had pSun in Aries, pMoon in Virgo.

Notice that her pMoon was conjunct her [b]nSun in Scorpio & his pMoon was opposite his nSun in Pisces. YES!! it acts/works the same as if both Sun & Moon were progressed.

If you were using this as a cycle, you would reference the pMoon back to the nSun. So, the next flash point would be when the pMoon next aspects the nSun. pSun to pMoon would then be part of a separate cycle, this because it wasn't involved when she started with Kurt. Nonetheless, it can be said that they started with Sun & Moon in the 4th harmonic. [/B]

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It's unbelievable how this ^ probably really works. Well, it can't be a coincidence that we met/started under about the same moon cycle as *their ^* natal one. pMoon/pSun mine just before the FIRST QUARTER and pMoon/pSun him just before the NEW MOON (same amount of degrees 16-18).. a natural progressed moon cycle match can prob. survive anything!

ps; in 2032 when there's a prog. composite new moon conj, we have this;

my pMoon 12'50 Aqua
my pSun 6'47 Libra

his pMoon 8'02 Libra
his pSun 14'05 Aqua

posted October 11, 2014 01:24 AM            

For starters, Kurt's 7th house ruler Saturn is sextile her Sun, and square her Moon. This is doubly important because Saturn also rules Kurt's 8th house.

Symbolically Goldie doesn't seem to fit the Capricorn/Virgo(7th house ruler) of his 7th house, so we can look at his secondary 7th house...

Kurt's secondary 7th house is his 10th house because he has a Capricorn Dsc. On his 10th house cusp he has Pisces, ruled by Neptune in Libra. His Jupiter, Sun and Mercury all fall into the 7th house. The planets in his secondary 7th house create quite a few symbolism matches with Goldie's chart.

She has Sagittarius rising, and Mercury in Sag (matching Jupiter in Kurt's secondary 7th house).

She has Mars and Pluto (which both co-rule her Scorpio Sun/Venus) in Leo (matching Sun in Kurt's secondary 7th house).

She has Moon in Gemini (matching Mercury in Kurt's secondary 7th house).

Also, Kurt's Neptune ruling his secondary 7th house (the 10th house) is exactly conjunct her Jupiter (which rules her Sagittarius Asc/Mercury).

Actually, since both have Pisces on the secondary 7th house cusp the Jupiter/Neptune conjunction is very telling... Jupiter and Neptune both co-ruler Pisces.

Kurt's Neptune is sextile Pluto by 1 degree in his chart. Since Neptune rules his secondary 7th house, this adds a Plutonic flavor to his relationship taste.

Another possibility... Kurt's Asc is showing at only 00 degrees Cancer. That means with only a minute of two difference in his recorded birth time he could have 29 degrees of Gemini rising, putting 29 Sagittarius on his Dsc... Goldie's Asc is 27 Sagittarius.

I think it's highly possible that his Asc is actually very late Gemini. If Sag is on the Dsc Jupiter in Pisces would rule his 7th house. Kurt's Jupiter sits in both the Scorpio decan and duad of Pisces. Something to consider.

Even if Kurt does have a Gemini rising though, Saturn would still rule his 8th house, and so that nice sextile to Goldie's Sun from his Saturn still has meaning in his attraction pattern.

Also, Goldie connects very well to Kurt's 5th house. He has Libra on the 5th with some on Scorpio falling into that house. Goldie put's her Jupiter in Libra (which rules her Asc/Mercury) and Scorpio Venus in Kurt's 5th house.

Venus in Aries rules Kurt's 5th house and makes a 1 degree sextile to Goldie's Gemini Moon.

It might also be worth noting that Kurt has Juno in Sagittarius, and Goldie (again) has this sign rising.

posted October 11, 2014 06:44 AM            

quote:

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It's unbelievable how this ^ probably really works. Well, it can't be a coincidence that we met/started under about the same moon cycle as *their ^* natal one. pMoon/pSun mine just before the FIRST QUARTER and pMoon/pSun him just before the NEW MOON (same amount of degrees 16-18).. a natural progressed moon cycle match can prob. survive anything!

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I know. Due to the uncertainty of birth times Westran said he didn't include Moon aspects in his book. That's where we come in to fill that void.

Another book I have asserts the Carl Jung found that Sun-Moon, and Asc-Moon showed up three times more likely than chance in marriages. Clearly Sun-Moon plays a major role in relationships.

posted October 11, 2014 08:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Nine:
I know. Due to the uncertainty of birth times Westran said he didn't include Moon aspects in his book. That's where we come in to fill that void.

Another book I have asserts the Carl Jung found that Sun-Moon, and Asc-Moon showed up three times more likely than chance in marriages. Clearly Sun-Moon plays a major role in relationships.

Goldie & Kurt (talking of Sun-Moon) have a tight square, and a devilish 11 degree trine.

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There has been a tendency to undervalue the Sun-Moon-angles or/ and the angles to luminaries over the last years, in favour for... other things, which I think was very misleading. Of course nothing can be seen in isolation, but the Sun-Moon-cycle is the one that we are affected by most visibly (alone the lunar cycle we do observe at night), how could we think this would not have a strong effect in astrology, if the astrological premise is: "as up above, so below"?

posted October 11, 2014 09:15 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:

There has been a tendency to undervalue the Sun-Moon-angles or/ and the angles to luminaries over the last years, in favour for... other things, which I think was very misleading. Of course nothing can be seen in isolation, but the Sun-Moon-cycle is the one that we are affected by most visibly (alone the lunar cycle we do observe at night), how could we think this would not have a strong effect in astrology, if the astrological premise is: "as up above, so below"?

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Truth! Truth!

This is why I always look at moon phase (Sun-Moon) for attraction when I look at a synastry.

I'm Virgo & Saturn & #4 prominent, so I need order, sequence, and simplicity in my astrology.

I think part of the move away from Sun-Moon is the human quest for the new, different, and exotic. Perhaps Sun-Moon is viewed as old and boring.

posted October 11, 2014 09:47 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Nine:

I think part of the move away from Sun-Moon is the human quest for the new, different, and exotic. Perhaps Sun-Moon is viewed as old and boring.

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I think so, too. And the quest for the new has its merits, however, now and then I personally feel this need and hunger to get back to the basics, the grounding.

Sun-Moon-cycles have proved very interesting and telling,t hough they seem to not overlap always precisely, but with a a little timelapse (a little, not spanning several years of course). at least in the progressed synastries I have been looking at, which funny enough I think all have either a Sun-Moon-aspect (4th harmonic) (plus Sun-Sun often) and/ or luminaries conjunct an angle, just the basic natal synastry.
I couldn`t find that they have the same natal moonphase though, it seemed more important that there was some Sun-Moon-alignment in the progressions, either natally or synastrically, sometimes both.

For example my Mum has a waning crescent Moon, my Dad is a New Moon-baby. Hardly anything in common ther.

My Mum`s Sun opposes his Moon and squares his Sun natally, which is a nice start, and should be backed up by progressed cycles.

When they met, his p Moon was applying to a conjunction with his p Sun (7 degrees applying, which would have become exact about half a year later):

my Mom actualy did not fit the theory, but her p Moon was squaring her n Moon - and I wonder if that might - occasionally or in this case- act as complemen to the Sun-Moon-relation of the other person.

(her p Moon was also applying to a trine to her n Sun with about 7 degrees, but of course a trine is not a 4th harmonic aspect).

Still must have been good enough for them, as they are still married, 40 years later.

Here this was a case of reinforced progressed synastry as well.
Remember how I mentiond her natal Sun opposping his natal Moon?
In progression they had his p Moon applying to a square with her p Sun.

and her p Moon trine his p Sun.

posted October 11, 2014 10:02 AM            

quote:

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Sun-Moon-cycles have proved very interesting and telling,t hough they seem to not overlap always precisely, but with a a little timelapse (a little, not spanning several years of course). at least in the progressed synastries I have been looking at, which funny enough I think all have either a Sun-Moon-aspect (4th harmonic) (plus Sun-Sun often) and/ or luminaries conjunct an angle, just the basic natal synastry.
I couldn`t find that they have the same natal moonphase though, it seemed more important that there was some Sun-Moon-alignment in the progressions, either natally or synastrically, sometimes both.

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Not quite. New Moon & First Quarter are natural associates. Last Quarter & Full Moon are also natural associates. In love they switch up; New Moon with Full Moon, Last Quarter with First Quarter. New Moon with Last Quarter, First Quarter with Full Moon. Roughly opposing phases attract.

posted October 11, 2014 10:23 AM            

my parents (40 years)
----------------------
first quarter vs. waning crescent

my brother and his gf (9 years)
---------------------------------
last quarter vs. fullmoon

(they fit of course)

my friends (15 years)
----------------------
waxing crescent vs. waning gibbuous

another friend and her partner (10 years)
-----------------------------------------
waning gibbuous vs. waxing gibbuous

Or are you using the 4 main phases only? new moon, full moon and quarter Moons?
If so how do you count these? From what point on would you call a moon phase a quarter moon instead of a new Moon one?
I mean it is clear that 00 degrees are a new Moon and 90 degrees a quarter Moon, but what with 70 or 50 or 35 degrees? What would you call this?

posted October 11, 2014 10:24 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Nine:
So one had pSun-pMoon in 4th harmonic.

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posted October 11, 2014 02:09 PM            

quote:

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yes, do you think that is enough? One person having the 4th harmonic aspect?

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Yes.

quote:

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Or are you using the 4 main phases only? new moon, full moon and quarter Moons?
If so how do you count these? From what point on would you call a moon phase a quarter moon instead of a new Moon one?
I mean it is clear that 00 degrees are a new Moon and 90 degrees a quarter Moon, but what with 70 or 50 or 35 degrees? What would you call this?

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Yes, I only use the the 4 main phases. I'm not to technical with it, but I fit everyone into the phase they were born closes to.

posted October 11, 2014 02:38 PM            

then how do you consider these two couples, what phases?

1. her waning crescent
2. him waning gibbous

1. her full moon
2. him third quarter

the second question: if two people can come together when one has a Sun/Moon 4th - the other another Sun/Moon aspect (sextile, trines) (my parents, and both my previous relationships), why two people both having trines/sextiles couldn't?

Thanks

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posted October 11, 2014 03:00 PM            

I mean, we met during and are still going through a 4th harmonic pSun/pMoon. The space we need, is equal. No pushing from one side to the other for more interaction. It simple FITS. And we NEED that.

Lee, I just looked at yours and I suspect you also fit the pSun/pMoon 4th harmonic angle during meeting. Am I right?

EDIT@

quote:

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why two people both having trines/sextiles couldn't?

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posted October 11, 2014 03:15 PM            

quote:

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I'm Virgo & Saturn & #4 prominent, so I need order, sequence, and simplicity in my astrology.

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I have the same I swear haha. See there ^ LOST! With my Virgo Merc exact on my Virgo ASC .. ow and to not forget Saturn exactly square it. AND NN 6th.