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Author Topic:   @ Orange - on ruler of DESC and ASC in solar Return
Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 11:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Orange,

you wrote that usually when a relationship starts, you find the ruler of the horizon in Solar Return in conjunction, is that right?


What if there is a different aspect?


I am just asking cause I noticed in this year`s Solar Return

SR Venus, rDESC, sextile SR Pluto, rASC (0°52)
with SR Pluto being conjunct SR Mercury (2°16), with Mercury ruling my natal DESC.


While I donīt think I am going to get into a relationship in the next 4 months, I was just wondering how you would interprete such an aspect?


It was also rousing my curiosity in terms of the evolvement in FOLLOWING Solar Returns.


so 2017:
SR Saturn, traditional ruler of ASC, conjunct SR Sun, ruler of DESC, widely (6°16) with Saturn being conjunct MC from one side, and Juno being conjunct MC from the other side (MC 17 Sag, Saturn 19 Sag, Juno 14 Sag).

And of course Sun is also conjunct my natal Mercury, DESC-ruler, as it always is, but this coming year, Sun will rule Solar Return DESC.

2018
will have the horizon in Cancer-Capricorn, and while the 10 degree conjunction of SR Moon and SR Saturn are probably too wide, curiously there is this stellium of


SR Mercury 15 Sag
SR Moon 19 Sag
SR Venus 20 Sag
SR Sun 25 Sag
SR Saturn 29 Sag

Moon and Saturn ruling the SR horizon, Mercury ruling my natal DESC

I donīt remember to ever have had a Venus-conjunct Moon and Sun in a Solar Return before. Honestly this line up fascinates me.


In 2002 I had a widish Sun-Venus-conjunction (6-7 degrees) but no connection to Moon

in 2010 I also had a widish Sun-Venus-conjunction (6 degrees) but also no connection to Moon


But curiously those were the ONLY years (since 2000) I had even a Sun-Venus-conjunction, and the one in 2018 year is even a tad close, and of course closest to Moon.

BTW next year I have a close opposition of Moon and Venus, which actually has a subtle aspect to Sun (Sun semisquare Venus: 0°22 and Sun widely sesisquare Moon: 1°41) - not sure how important that would be though.

And 2019

Ruler of the horizon, Mercury and Jupiter like in my natal, conjunct by 3°49, and falling onto my natal Mars-ASC.
and also widely conjunct SR IC.

No Sun-Moon-VEnus directly, however

Sun in 4th house in applying trine to Moon 1°58 in 8th house (and applying trine to Uranus 2°50)

plus

Sun semisquare Venus in Scorpio (0°15)
And Mercury, SR ASC-ruler and natal DESC-ruler, falling roughly onto the Sun/Venus-mp (1°37)

Just thought it was interesting how Sun-Venus and the aspects between horizon rulers seems to come into play for some years now.

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Orange
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posted August 20, 2016 12:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Orange     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hey there Ceri,

Ive seen it time and again that relationships starts when the rulers of the 1st and 7th houses come into a contact, but it's usually the hard aspect - conjunction of the two being the strongest and smoothest with no issues. It shows in different charts like in Solar Returns OR in Pogressed charts as well as SA charts, AND in the progressed Composite charts too. I am not sure a sextille might produce a strong result but it's possible of course as it shows the two Lords being in total harmony.

The year I started my love relationship, Moon conjuncted Venus in the 1st house and squared Saturn and Mars. All these 4 planets were the rulers of the 4 angles - Moon ruled the 1st, Saturn the 7th, Venus and Mars ruled the IC/MC. So there was an exact ( 0.02 degree) square between the 1st and the 7th house rulers.

In the Valmu's SR (from the other thread), Mercury conjunct Jupiter with Venus in the mix, and Mercury and Jupiter rule all 4 angles.

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Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 04:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Orange,


"Ive seen it time and again that relationships starts when the rulers of the 1st and 7th houses come into a contact, but it's usually the hard aspect"
did you see other aspects happen too?


I noticed my SEXTILE will become a SQUARE next year, well on top of the conjunction.


I am going to have Aquarius-Leo on the horizon with Pisces-Virgo-intercepted (ha, the same interception as in my natal chart, just in my natal it is the 3rd house, and well that intercepted Jupiter is VERY active in my natal intercepted or not )

MC-IC Sagittarius-Gemini, with my NATAL horizong being ruled by Mercury-Jupiter as well.

So next year I am going to have
Sun conjunct Saturn,

but ALSO Mercury in 11th square Jupiter in 7th (4°44), and in fact making a wide T-square.


Jupiter in 19 Libra in 7th
opposite
Uranus in 20 Aries in 1st
square
Mercury in 14 Cap in 11th
Pluto in 16 Cap in 11th

Well not a clue what that means, only that it seems like relating to others seems to become more and more important, even if it might be a bumpy road.


"OR in Pogressed charts as well as SA charts, "
Well next year I am going to have pSaturn conjunct pDESC exact, with Saturn ruling the pASC.


"I am not sure a sextille might produce a strong result but it's possible of course as it shows the two Lords being in total harmony."
No I don`t think so either, that it shows strong results, but what I was thinking is that maybe it signifies a certain openness to the idea of relationship, or even just towards friendships?

Well my Mercury is conjunct Pluto, and will continue so for a few years to come, so I guess there is some sort of profound transformation or even just intensification of my thoughtpattern; however it is also true that Mercury rules my DESC, so I guess this thoughtpattern might have to do with my own attitude towards relationship or how I relate to others. What do you think?
Sort of a preparation ground?


"The year I started my love relationship, Moon conjuncted Venus in the 1st house and squared Saturn and Mars."
Which most astrologers would not have associated with the start of a relationship, I guess, especially the square to Saturn. Though the others were of course indicative of great emotional involvement and passion.
But it seems that Saturn can be very much of a relationshipplanet when ruling one of hte angles, even though of course he will probably still bring Saturnian experiences into one`s life, just instead of blocking relationships might actually intensify them so the issues can be worked on in the context of a relationship.


"All these 4 planets were the rulers of the 4 angles - Moon ruled the 1st, Saturn the 7th, Venus and Mars ruled the IC/MC. So there was an exact ( 0.02 degree) square between the 1st and the 7th house rulers."
Wow that is VERY exact!


"In the Valmu's SR (from the other thread), Mercury conjunct Jupiter with Venus in the mix, and Mercury and Jupiter rule all 4 angles."

All Solar Return angles I think?


Well, if I scan my next Solar Returns for that.

2017
Ruler of ASC: Uranus, Saturn
Ruler of (i) 1st: Neptune, Jupiter
Ruler of DESC: Sun
Ruler of (i) 7th: Mercury
ruler of MC: Jupiter
ruler of IC: Mercury

Uranus trine Saturn: 0°57
Uranus opposite Jupiter: 1°16
URanus trine Sun: 5°19
Saturn sextile Jupiter 0°14
Saturn conjunct Sun: 6°16
Uranus square Mercury: 5°50
Jupiter sextile Sun: 6°35
Jupiter square mercury: 4°44

Well some of the aspects are a bit wide for my taste anyway
Though not uninteresting.

2018
ruler of ASC: Moon
ruler of DESC: Saturn
ruler of IC: Mercury
ruler of MC: Neptune-Jupiter

Moon applying to Saturn, but too far for being considered conjunct: 10°02
- it will touch Saturn 10 months into the Solar return though, so that would be in october 2018-

Moon conjunct Mercury 4°08
Mercury square Neptune 3°54


Well probably not such a strong case, but I still find the line up of Mercury-Moon-Venus-Sun-Saturn very interesting. lol

2019
ASC Virgo: Mercury
DESC Pisces: Neptune-Jupiter
IC Sag: Jupiter
MC: Mercury

now that is easy.

Mercury conjunct Jupiter: 3°49 (applying too)


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Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 04:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmm, when my Mom met my Dad she had SR ASC in Libra with Venus right on the ASC. however it was not aspecting Mars (though Mars was on the IC; so both were foreground).
What is interesting to me though is that this SR Venus was conjunct her NATAL Saturn, which rules her natal DESC and was the ruler of her Solar Return IC.

Seems this works as cross connection from Return to natal as well?
Did you notice that, too?


My Dad was having Leo-Aquarius on the horizon in that year, and there was an exact Sun-Venus-conjunction in Aquarius, 6 degrees off the DESC, which was square SAturn by 3 degrees and trine Uranus by 3 degrees as well.

Also I seem to notice that the constellations are actually stronger at the onset of a relationship than when the wedding takes place, at least for my parents it seems so.

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Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 04:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
BTW you do use the unprecessed REturns, right?

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Orange
Knowflake

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From: Georgia
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posted August 20, 2016 05:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Orange     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
yes, unprecessed SR is what I was looking at

so your dad also had the Saturn square Venus and Sun in his SR, and that was a square between his 1st and 7th house in the SR.
for your mom it involved the SR 1st and natal 7th. I guess that counts, too even thou I have only looked at the SR so far.

In progressed charts, both natal and Composite, it is usually the rulers of the 1st and 7th in the progressed and natal mixed up.

It's not necessarily that when a relationship starts - the SR angle rulers will be always in contact, but if they are indeed in contact - then a relationship will start for sure, I think.


Your year of love will be 2019 it seems. Those rulers in an applying conjunction in the SR are going to work their charms fir sure. . What progressions do you have at that time, or transits? Does it show any additional info? To pinpoint the month when it will start - check each month Tertiary progression for 2019 starting the SR month.

also, what is your year number in numerology for 2019? The phase you will be in will also show what is to come.

Also, check your Venus Return for 2019. This will show new love as well.
In my case - all these predictive charts collected together showed new love.

Also, one of the angles in the SR for 2019 or the SR Vertex might show his Sun Sign and his Sun degree.
In my case - the MC in the SR chart was the sign and degree ( 2 degree off) of his Sun sign ( his Sun is at 16'48 Aries, the MC in my SR chart was at 14'52 Aries).

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Orange
Knowflake

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posted August 20, 2016 05:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Orange     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just checked another SR of mine when another relationship had started back in the past, and the rulers of 1st and 7th in the SR chart ( mercury and Jupiter) were in an applying trine BUT on top of that, the ruler of the SR 7th house Jupiter was exactly 0.00 degree conjunct my natal Venus.

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Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 05:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That is great information!

Yes, I think too, the 2019 is the most promising year, though I think the following 2 years might lead up to something, feels like a built up somehow.

Well next year I find interesting progressionwise as I have pSaturn on pDESC (curiously peaking when I am in London next year).

And also I have an applying pMars conjunct nVenus which will be exact in november 2017.

will have to check the other things still though

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Orange
Knowflake

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From: Georgia
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posted August 20, 2016 05:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Orange     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
oh yes...these two aspects you mentioned , for 2017, are def carring relationship potential, especially the Mars-Venus

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Ceridwen
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posted August 20, 2016 05:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ceridwen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
BTW interesting about the natal Sun conjuncting Solar Return angles.

However I donīt think it always needs to be the Sun, however it will be some very personal planet.


For my parents for example my Dad`s MOon was EXACT conjunct my Mom`s SR Vertex (Opposing her Sun)

his Mars was conjuner her SR Venus, ruler of the ASC.

----------------------------------

my Dad`s angles nor Vertex were conjunct my Mom`s natal planets, for him it was probably more


her n Sun conjunct his SR Jupiter (r5) and opposing his SR Saturn (r7)
and squaring his Sr Sun-Venus-conjunction


Seems the ruler of the angles have their say too


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mir
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posted August 20, 2016 06:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mir     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
BTW interesting about the natal Sun conjuncting Solar Return angles.

Yea that's what we had last year when it all started, a DW funnily enough and look at the exactness;

My solar return ASC - 0'36 Taurus
His natal Sun - 0'59 Taurus

His solar return ASC - 2'15 Leo
My natal Sun - 7'25 Leo (natal venus 0 Leo)

my SR asc-ruler Venus (at 0'10 Virgo) conj my SR Jupiter by 2,5 and square my natal Neptune by 0'10 (pisces is my natal DESC)

his SR desc-ruler Uranus conj his natal asc-ruler Mercury by 2,5

^ clearly mixed-up case ;D

His SR Venus conjunct his natal Mars by 1 deg.
My SR Venus conjunct my natal Asc by 3,5 deg.

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Orange
Knowflake

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From: Georgia
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posted August 20, 2016 07:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Orange     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^^^

yeah, those are great examples as well

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