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Author Topic:   Which aspects are most important
Stellia
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Posts: 329
From: Yorks, UK
Registered: Jan 2017

posted August 29, 2017 09:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stellia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've been thinking about if it would be possible to 'rank' different aspects for impact/significance in interpersonal charts - specifically in terms of ranking the importance of some of the lesser used aspect patterns.

I'll start it off, and will go back and edit as more ideas and submissions come in. Is this worth a try? I'll include orbs where possible, too...

Or - question, does this all depend on what you're using the chart for and how tight the orbs are?


Conjunction (0) 0-5 degrees
Parallel 0-1.2 degrees
Opposition (180) 0-5 degrees
Contra-parallel 0-1.2 degrees
Square (90) 0-5 degrees
Conjunction (0) 6-8 degrees - 10 for luminary
Opposition (180) 6-8 degrees - 10 for luminary
Trine (120) 0-3 degrees
Semisquare (45) 0-1 degrees
Sextile (60) 0-4 degrees
Quincunx/Inconjunct (150) 0-3 degrees
Square (90) 4-6 degrees
Sesquisquare (135) 0-1 degrees
Quintile (72) 0-2 degrees
Biquintile (144) 0-2 degrees
Septile (51.4) 0-1 degrees

*edited on feedback from Kannon about orbs for square and sextile*

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Ami Anne
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From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
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posted August 29, 2017 09:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
First--the closeness of orbs

Second--are there aspects that BALANCE the hard aspects.

For example, if people have Mars oppose Pluto, which can be an aspect for violence, but they, also, have Moon trine Moon, which is a true soul connection, this would help to mitigate the Mars/Pluto. It takes me over 5 days to do a full synastry and then I can know what is what as far as how it all shakes out, my friend.

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Stellia
Knowflake

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From: Yorks, UK
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posted August 29, 2017 11:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stellia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That's a good point, balance is critical.

I think one thing I'm trying to get a handle on is how strong a parallel aspect is compared to, say, a conjunction.

People describe parallels and contraparallels as like a 'weak' conjunction - would you see a parallel between moon and moon as more or less important than, say, a trine. What about a wide trine?

Also, at one point do some of the lesser-used harmonics become valid compared to the big aspects?

Or, do they all matter equally as long as the orb is close enough?

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Ami Anne
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posted August 29, 2017 11:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't use parallels. To me, they make things utterly confusing but I could be wrong.

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comdoc
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posted August 31, 2017 10:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for comdoc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The rank of interpersonal synastry aspects in terms of power is the same as in natal charts. Power of an aspect depends on how much TimeSpace experience is encompassed.

Conjunction is most powerful of all aspects, it represents the entire Cycle. Opposition next: half the Cycle. Trine next a third of the Cycle. Square next a fourth of the Cycle. Quintile next a fifth of the Cycle. Sextile next a sixth of the Cycle. EXCEPT: Quintile is not harmonic with the others like twelfth division aspects are--so not as powerful in external world.

quote:
Originally posted by Stellia:
I've been thinking about if it would be possible to 'rank' different aspects for impact/significance in interpersonal charts - specifically in terms of ranking the importance of some of the lesser used aspect patterns.

I'll start it off, and will go back and edit as more ideas and submissions come in. Is this worth a try? I'll include orbs where possible, too...

Or - question, does this all depend on what you're using the chart for and how tight the orbs are?


Conjunction (0) 0-5 degrees
Parallel 0-1.2 degrees
Opposition (180) 0-5 degrees
Contra-parallel 0-1.2 degrees
Square (90) 0-3 degrees
Conjunction (0) 6-8 degrees - 10 for luminary
Opposition (180) 6-8 degrees - 10 for luminary
Trine (120) 0-3 degrees
Semisquare (45) 0-1 degrees
Sextile (60) 0-1 degrees
Quincunx/Inconjunct (150) 0-3 degrees
Square (90) 4-6 degrees
Sesquisquare (135) 0-1 degrees
Quintile (72) 0-2 degrees
Biquintile (144) 0-2 degrees
Septile (51.4) 0-1 degrees


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Stellia
Knowflake

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From: Yorks, UK
Registered: Jan 2017

posted August 31, 2017 10:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stellia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by comdoc:

Conjunction is most powerful of all aspects, it represents the entire Cycle. Opposition next: half the Cycle. Trine next a third of the Cycle. Square next a fourth of the Cycle. Quintile next a fifth of the Cycle. Sextile next a sixth of the Cycle. EXCEPT: Quintile is not harmonic with the others like twelfth division aspects are--so not as powerful in external world.


Thank you ComDoc - a really useful insight as always, never heard it described in that way before. I think it's difficult as the eighth harmonic is emphasised so much in interpersonal astrology that it's easy to ignore placements such as the trine.

As a general point, is it fair to say that the larger the aspect degree, the more powerful it is then? Or does it only apply to the 12th harmonics.

Any thoughts on where parallel/contraparallels compare on the scale of significance?

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waxlobster
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From: Birmingham
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posted August 31, 2017 10:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for waxlobster     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mars opposite Pluto is heavy! I wouldn’t like to see this in a long term relationship unless both parties were very evolved, peaceful and meditative. Sure in the short-term it’s great for passion but long-term I’m not sure chaos is easily avoidable. Moon trine Moon wouldn’t mitigate, it would add a level of emotional understanding but they operate in different areas of the psyche.

I also don’t use parallels, septiles or sesquisquares and semi-squares I use sparingly. You shouldn’t need to, the synastry should be strong enough in all areas that the indefinable does not require consideration. If the obvious isn’t there, then neither is a bond.

Oh but I should add, I will consider up to 10 degrees for a conjunction, especially where other planets aspect in between that orb. I don’t have limits to my orbs, rather additional considerations as to whether the wider ones are likely to be felt.

It’s strange in this list that it’s given a 5 degree orb for conjunctions and up to a 6 degrees for a square?? I will consider up to 6-7 degrees for a square, but when doing a reading I wouldn’t assume


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waxlobster
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posted August 31, 2017 10:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for waxlobster     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh and in terms of rank. Always the conjunctions are most important!

Then I see that squares and oppositions are felt a lot.

Angles are so important though, as is mirroring and when you get into that you need to be quite complex. It's about balance overall too.

A stellium person and a stellium person may have nothing in common. Whereas a stellium person and a splay person may have very similar aspects. You want enough in common for a deep understanding and enough depth to add something to each others' lives that's very special.

I love to see outer planets to personal planets. I don't like to see *any* planet in either chart unaspected ptolmeically! If one party has a peregrine planet, you want that to be integrated by the other chart, they will need that in a partner.

You also want to see trines made into grand trines by the other and, believe it or not T-squares turned into grand crosses. Sure the latter is often karmic but it's very very common in synastry nonetheless...

I could talk forever actually haha

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Stellia
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From: Yorks, UK
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posted August 31, 2017 12:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stellia     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks WaxLobster

I put the reduced orbs in as a classic synastry measure, but reduced further to distinguish between a tight conjunction and a looser conjunction.

Really interested to hear about the way you use orbs. I know for example there are times when I can feel a 6deg trine between Moon and Ascendant (probably because of the luminary element?), but others would frown upon using a similar orb for even a conjunction in synastry.

I separated them out to imply a difference in 'strength' of feeling between a tight conjunction and a looser one.

My question is does a loose conjunction still hold over a tighter 'weak' aspect such as a semi-square or quintile etc.

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Kannon McAfee
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From: Portland, OR - USA
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posted August 31, 2017 10:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kannon McAfee     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ami is right about aspects that show as tightest, but I think it is also about the planets/pts. Sun, Moon, Venus, Asc, Jupiter, MC, Nodes are pretty important in establishing the energy of friendship and intimacy. Some may want/need some Mars and/or Pluto splashed in there.

In other words, if there is a synastry aspect with Moon and Jupiter or Moon and Venus, it becomes important by way of the benefic nature of the planets involved.

Your aspect list is pretty close to how I'd rank them in terms of potential for establishing bonds and rapport, but you can use an orb of about 5° for squares, depending on what planets are involved; sextiles 4°.

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Randall
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From: From a galaxy, far, far away...
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posted September 10, 2017 07:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you, Kannon!

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Randall
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posted September 17, 2017 05:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bump!

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Mohini108
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From: San Antonio, Texas, USA
Registered: Dec 2015

posted September 17, 2017 08:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mohini108     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kannon McAfee:
Ami is right about aspects that show as tightest, but I think it is also about the planets/pts. Sun, Moon, Venus, Asc, Jupiter, MC, Nodes are pretty important in establishing the energy of friendship and intimacy. Some may want/need some Mars and/or Pluto splashed in there.


I have a question about the Mars/Pluto aspect. I have a Mars/Pluto double whammy with a girl I'm seeing. Mars Opposute Pluto at 3°, and Mars SQUARE Pluto at 2°. But at the same time we have some great positive aspects like Venus Conjunct Jupiter at 0°, a Moon Conjunct North Node double whammy, both under 3°, Venus Conjunct Mars at 1°, Venus trine Uranus and Venus trine Neptune both at 1°....to name a few.

Now, it seems universally accepted Mars/Pluto hard aspects are notorious for violent potential, a lot of drama, and tension. Would some of those positive aspects I listed ease the Mars/Pluto double whammy?? Or will there always be some of the violent potential there?

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waxlobster
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From: Birmingham
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posted September 18, 2017 06:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for waxlobster     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Stellia:

My question is does a loose conjunction still hold over a tighter 'weak' aspect such as a semi-square or quintile etc.


Yes!! Almost always! Conjunctions are generally much more powerful! Another interesting way to consider aspects is via transits. So obviously where it comes to the outer planetary transits only quite tight aspects are going to be major impactful at the same time. However, with a Moon transit you will feel them within the day even if they have a wider orb. So with an exact conjunction (or even square and opposition!) the planets involved are intrinsically linked at all times. When Pluto hits one, Pluto hits the other and you just know that will be a majorly pivotal experience, even more so than a transit to a solo planet.

So then, when you consider that the wider orb doesn't really work for outer planetary transits, but it does for the Moon and maybe even Mercury and Venus, you can gauge a different type of connection between the linked planets.

Finally if you have a conjunction of with say an 8 degree orb, which you may well feel, then if you have a trine or square to the midpoint, this conjunction is most definitely activated. For example I have Sun at 14 Aquarius, conjunct Jupiter at 22 Aquarius, squared by Mars at 17 Taurus. The Mars square to both of these planets is most certainly present and assists the connection between the Sun and Jupiter. Although, I'm glad of the orbs as I'm only *sometimes* over the top and crazily energetic. Somebody with this configured with much closer orbs would probably have boundless energy and find it difficult to calm themselves.

Oh and a note also. Quintiles are amazing, they are very valid in synastry and I'm watching them more overall. The feel like 'the answer to the questions' there is an appeasing, sympathetic and open-minded vibe to them. As if it assists resolution in relationship and cohesive resonance within the natal. :-)

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blog: http://waxlobster.blogspot.co.uk/

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