posted June 08, 2020 10:10 AM            

I'm trying to make sense of the following midpoint composite and Davison chart

What do you think of them? Lots of planets in Scorpio (namely Sun, Venus, Mercury, Pluto), all conjunct each other?

All experiences and interpretations are welcomed!

MIDPOINT COMPOSITE

https://ibb.co/Sn4T57d

DAVISON CHART

posted June 09, 2020 01:28 PM            

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Originally posted by Randall:
Welcome! Remove the "s" after http for the charts to link. You have store the charts somewhere online (such as tinypic) for the IMG tags to work.

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posted June 09, 2020 01:41 PM            

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Originally posted by Bismarck2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Fpdl1sw9-8

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posted June 09, 2020 02:06 PM            

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Originally posted by serendipity20:
Thank you! I'll check Jewel's video out. Do the sextiles to Neptune and squares to Jupiter in both charts help mitigate the heavy Pluto theme?

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posted June 09, 2020 02:29 PM            

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Originally posted by Bismarck2:
No, if anything Neptune would make it worse, because it would add a layer of delusional and confusion to the volatile relationship.

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Aren't squares, oppositions and conjuctions to Neptune usually the ones that show a potential for delusion and confusion? I always thought sextiles were a positive flow of energy. But I guess with Neptune you never really know ...

Also, how do you interpret the sextile from Saturn to Pluto? There isn't a lot of information on those two in aspects with each other. Is it more of a generational aspect?

posted June 09, 2020 03:28 PM            

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Originally posted by serendipity20:
Aren't squares, oppositions and conjuctions to Neptune usually the ones that show a potential for delusion and confusion? I always thought sextiles were a positive flow of energy. But I guess with Neptune you never really know ...

Also, how do you interpret the sextile from Saturn to Pluto? There isn't a lot of information on those two in aspects with each other. Is it more of a generational aspect?

Thanks!

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Trines and sextiles aren't inherently positive, and conjunctions/squares/oppositions aren't inherently negative. With trines and sextiles the energy is more manageable, that's all.

According to Jewel, regardless of aspect, too much Neptune can create problems with deception, both self-deception and of eachother: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a93jjY_Lj3g

I'm no expert. I'm an amateur. So I definitely recommend getting a relationship reading from Jewel.

posted June 09, 2020 05:38 PM            

I think you're absolutely right about squares and oppositions not being inherently negative. It all depends on the people involved and how they react to a given energy. But in my opinion, these aspects might present a greater potential for delusion/illusion when linked to Neptune.

I also really liked what you said about trines and sextiles not being inherently positive. Easier to manage is a great way to put it.

As for Jewel's video on plutonic relationships... I had not seen that one before, but have come across a few of her other videos. While I think she does a wonderful job at explaining things in depth, I sometimes find her way too fatalistic in her approach to astrology.

Pluto does present underlying themes of obsession, jealousy, death and other more dark subjects. But Pluto is also about great transformation and rising from the ashes.

Anyway, thanks again for your help! I really appreciated it !

posted June 10, 2020 11:52 AM            

I do get a sense that the composite highlights a very fated relationship (with both the heavy Pluto/Scorpio energy and the IC/MC axis squared to the Nodes). But I'm a bit more skeptical about what the relationship entails for the couple when I look at the Davison chart.

I think the "love" stellium is usually a nice addition to any composite. The easier aspects to Neptune as you've mentioned can bring compassion and forgiveness to the relationship. Jupiter in aspects to the inner planets also shows happiness and expansion (although it can be overdone). All of these things in their best expression are rather positive.

But what about the two yods in the Davison chart? I'm very intrigued by them! They do highlight the theme of "fatedness" but they could possibly point to some serious instability in the relationship...

What do you think?

Mars sextile Jupiter with Neptune at the apex.
Neptune sextile Venus with Mars at the apex.

posted June 10, 2020 05:25 PM            

About the Composite and Davison chart, I personally wouldn't consider Saturn and Nodes square to the IC/MC axis as being an aspect showing instability, but more along the lines of being stifling or hindering the full potential of the relationship like you've mentioned.

I do agree with you on there being something that isn't quite fully expressed or perhaps out of reach. It's like two opposite worlds trying to work together for better or worse. On one hand, you have Pluto (very possessive, strong bonding) conjunct the stellium in the 4H, on the other, you have a very detached and fun loving moon in Sagittarius/Gemini placed in the 5th/11th house. Could it be that these two people have been brought together to learn how to find a middle ground between being possessive/co-dependent vs too independent/emotionally detached?

To come back on the Saturn square the MC/IC axis and Moon opposite Uranus aspects, I noticed that both of them are at 9 degrees. Would you consider them to be very impactful despite their wide orbs?

posted June 10, 2020 06:12 PM            

I agree with the latter case, even though both Saturn and Nodes square to the axis looks like a big karmic challenge, there is a strong fated bond on one side, and a big question mark for long term... it seems to me that this aspect usually points to a very significant union but separation is at stake.

yes you're right, the saturn square is wide, but the NN is quite exact... as for Moon/Uranus, Composite Saturn/Moon midpoint is conjunct Uranus, and quincunx to Jupiter, so even though Uranus adds emotional sparkles, the general picture considering the Davidson opposition, looks emotionally instable, possibly with big ups and downs, and the quincunx to Jupiter might become divisive and a break up dealer, or there's risk of initial sparkles that might wane with time under the weight of those issues I was mentioning...

"Could it be that these two people have been brought together to learn how to find a middle ground between being possessive/co-dependent vs too independent/emotionally detached? "

With Chiron/Jupiter midpoint conjunct South Node in 12th house there's indication that a karma about letting go is possible. This is square to Pluto, but Pluto doesn't look extremely controlling, it give a lot of intensity and powerful feelings to the relationship, but with the square to Jupiter/SN in 12th house looks more like asking for a letting go of an earthly material possession or of selfish attitudes. North Node in Aquarius might certainly have to do with learning independence and self-reliance. The Davidson Mars quincunx aspects to Neptune and Venus might also suggest a toxic trait, maybe some issue of addiction, or they might have a flitring attitude outside the relationship, or even cheating each other, or simply a strong cultural divisive trait between them, but mainly they might show a "bipolar" on-off attitude between extreme passion and then detaching from each other as suggested also by the Composite Uranus aspects I mentioned.

posted June 11, 2020 09:22 AM            

As for Pluto, I have to admit I was very surprised when you said he didn't strike you as being controlling. It's a very refreshing approach... I never consider aspects to be just black or white. For example, I have Pluto in the 4H natally and have never been abused or drawn to abusive/controlling relationships. Quite the contrary. I think some aspects/house placements are often interpreted in very limited or negative ways, which makes us (myself included), a little paranoid when they show up in our charts or in the charts of people close to us.

Thanks again for all the wonderful insight!

posted June 12, 2020 01:26 AM            

Well I agree with you, one aspect on its own, like having Pluto in the 4th house, might not mean anything cept for suggesting a plutonian energy in that house, for instance a deeply transformative impact within the familiar environment to one's personal growth, but it depends especially on other aspects to that Planet... if you have, for instance, Moon square to Pluto in 4th house, then all sort of intense experiences are potentially there, such as an over controlling mother, or just a very intese emotional dimension in the person coming from his family environment and so on... I would consider a red flag in abusive experiences a Saturn or Mars or Chiron square to Pluto and also Chiron or Nessus involved with those.

the cultural divisive aspect can be suggested by Neptune versus Venus/Mars, since this is a quincunx and not a square, it's softer aspect that can be worked out and not exactly significant in terms of addiction or cheating issues (but those may be a possibility)...

posted June 12, 2020 08:57 AM            

Is this your composite? I'm curious how you're experiencing the Pluto stellium. I've Sun/Venus/Mercury square Pluto with my guy and the intimacy is unparalleled compared to my past relationships. It's instant, intense, possessive, compulsive urge to know everything about the other person. But because ours is the square, a lot of negative behaviours emerged. By this I don't mean we abuse each other. Far from it. We sincerely love each other and very protective... but we can get unreasonable. The fundamental reason is because of our own insecurities and the fear of losing the other person. There's an inherent mistrust, fearing that the other party may sabotage us or play us out even when no such thing is happening. I believe your conjunction can swing both ways and I wish we had this instead of the square. ☹️ For people who say Pluto is abusive, it is not true for every couple.

posted June 12, 2020 05:22 PM            

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Originally posted by Stoika7:
You are so welcome ❤️

Well I agree with you, one aspect on its own, like having Pluto in the 4th house, might not mean anything cept for suggesting a plutonian energy in that house, for instance a deeply transformative impact within the familiar environment to one's personal growth, but it depends especially on other aspects to that Planet... if you have, for instance, Moon square to Pluto in 4th house, then all sort of intense experiences are potentially there, such as an over controlling mother, or just a very intese emotional dimension in the person coming from his family environment and so on... I would consider a red flag in abusive experiences a Saturn or Mars or Chiron square to Pluto and also Chiron or Nessus involved with those.

the cultural divisive aspect can be suggested by Neptune versus Venus/Mars, since this is a quincunx and not a square, it's softer aspect that can be worked out and not exactly significant in terms of addiction or cheating issues (but those may be a possibility)...

I believe that these Neptune quincunx in the davidson are more significant for cultural and religion differences, cause Netpune is usually a spiritual and cultural aspect, while the Moon is mainly about the emotional sphere... in the big picture of the Davidosn Moon/Uranus opposition, is possible that the Composite Moon in Sagittarius may suggest that they potentially can emotionally learn to overcome those differences, I would mainly say though that the Uranus opposition to the Moon might make things "colder" and sometimes insensitive and emotionally detached.

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Not a fan of Pluto square Mars in Composite either . Saturn in hard aspect to Pluto is a toss up for me, depends on other factors. As for asteroids like Nessus, I seldomly take them into consideration. I prefer sticking to the planet action and might check asteroids for confirmation of a pattern.

posted June 12, 2020 05:34 PM            

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Originally posted by Lunesoleil2020:
What I think, a Moon and Uranus opposition in a composite requires partners a lot of freedom from one to the other

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posted June 12, 2020 06:22 PM            

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
@serendipity20

Is this your composite? I'm curious how you're experiencing the Pluto stellium. I've Sun/Venus/Mercury square Pluto with my guy and the intimacy is unparalleled compared to my past relationships. It's instant, intense, possessive, compulsive urge to know everything about the other person. But because ours is the square, a lot of negative behaviours emerged. By this I don't mean we abuse each other. Far from it. We sincerely love each other and very protective... but we can get unreasonable. The fundamental reason is because of our own insecurities and the fear of losing the other person. There's an inherent mistrust, fearing that the other party may sabotage us or play us out even when no such thing is happening. I believe your conjunction can swing both ways and I wish we had this instead of the square. ☹️ For people who say Pluto is abusive, it is not true for every couple.

I like your cJupiter conjunct ASC square the love stellium. You probably come across as a couple that can do anything because Jupiter is full of optimism. The negative side of this is there may be a lot of overindulgence and laziness, not encouraging each other to grow. The midheaven shows a couple's drive and potential for success. Here Saturn/Nodes are squaring it. As Saturn blocks/hinders/delays, I see this as either potential roadblocks for the rs journey or you may intentionally/unintentionally hinder each other. But Saturn doesn't deny, you just need to be conscious of what's happening. Nodes square emphasised that adjustments need to be made.

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Thank you for your response Hikaru!!

To answer your question, no it isn't my Composite. But I actually have a Pluto stellium with my dad . And have had it once with a guy, but the relationship didn't go anywhere. In synastry he had his Mars in my 4H. I think someone putting their Mars in my 4H, is a no go for me. They always end up being very insensitive. Weird, because someone's Pluto in my 4th doesn't bother me. I guess I'm somewhat used to the plutonic energy in that house...

Anyway, from my observations I do think the Pluto conjunction to the composite stellium might be easier than the square. But I wouldn't be able to tell you for certain as I've never really experienced it in a romantic relationship.

I agree with you on the Jupiter square being a mixed blessing if both people aren't careful. Overindulgence and laziness could definitely be a result. Do you think Saturn in soft aspect to the stellium could help keep things grounded? There's also a wide orb Saturn trine/biquintile to Mars... I'm not sure how that one would manifest itself in the long run.

Saturn squaring the MC is certainly not an easy aspect. The orb is wide, but both you and Stoika seem to put emphasis on it, so I think I'll probably take it into consideration. As for the Nodes squaring the MC/IC axis, I don't see that one as a "negative". I take it as work needing to be done in that department.

Let me know what you think...

posted June 13, 2020 06:48 AM            

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
^ I read that aspects to MC (and DSC) are important so I always pay attention to it. You're right that the Saturn square is at a wide orb but it's there nonetheless. Whenever an aspect comes into place, it's telling me to look at it so I will take it into consideration. Theoretically what happens with wide orb is the aspect will not be felt so intensely. But I can't say that for sure. The couple will be in a better position to confirm this. What could also happen is wide orb aspect takes a longer time to become obvious. This is of course just my personal opinion.

I think Mars trine Saturn is a nice one to have. It shows the couple's tenacity...in their case the focus is on 10H matters. Do they perhaps work together or have jointed ventures? I don't think Nodes square is necessarily bad. It simply shows adjustments needed in order for the couple to progress on a common path...maybe attitude/perception need to change?

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The couple doesn't actually work together, but we all work in the same field. Just not in the same location/places. From my view point, they could end up working together in the future. So the Mars trine Saturn aspect linked to the 10H would make sense.

To explain things a bit more clearly, both of them are friends of mine and have only recently came in contact with each other through their friendship with me. When I first introduced them, the attraction was EXTREMELY strong and obvious on both sides. Which they both confirmed to me afterwards. They aren't *yet* in a relationship with each other, but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if things progressed quickly in the near future. I thought I'd check their composite and get feedback on the potential of the relationship.

I personally think they could make it work long term, but do have some concerns when I see the tight Saturn opposition to Chiron in the Composite, as well as the two yods in the Davison. I wasn't sure what to make of all the plutonic energy, as things could go both ways with Pluto in conjunction to the stellium.

If I may ask, how long have you and your guy been together? I could definitely see how the stellium squared to Pluto would be challenging, but do you have other aspects in the composite that help smooth things out/make it more manageable?