posted May 06, 2004 12:47 AM         

of course one can follow this theme back even further a few thousand years til archeological evidence becomes slim
a learned man, teaches that all is one, becomes deifed by his followers , who become or are usurped by the establishment that wishes to perpetuate a paternalistic, warlike, "royal bloodline" that seeks to monopolize not only material wealth, but psychological domination over the "masses"

this is why i always suspect that the "devils" of one religion MIGHT be the Great Teachers of another religion
my mother was told as a child that Buddists worshipped a statue of a fat man as God. that they actually WORSHIPPED the STATUE
while the truth of that was probably being realized more closely in her own church by some....
i was raised in a catholic school so we went to church during school, plus sundays, plus extra instructional classes.....
nowhere would anyone have suggested that Jesus practiced astrology, sacred geometry, incantation/meditation , or "initiation" in any "mystery cult", in fact these things are nigh unto "heretical Satanism" to some fundamentalists...

yet for several hundred years before Jesus there was an ongoing movement which Syncretized many "mystery religions" and took the best things from each, teaching astronomy/astrology, numerology/sacred geometry/gematria/mathematics, meditation/physiology/herbology/medicine.
even the larger part of the jewish faith absorbed these paths into their lives and PERHAPS they were all better for it compared to the dark ages that preceded the 6th and 7th centuries b.c.e.
are you saying that jesus DIDNT teach the path of the "perfected...renaissance man/woman"? that he didnt teach a karmic type reincarnation with a consequence upon judgement of an immortal soul which could escape the cycles of life,death,and rebirth by a union with GOD.... he DIDNT teach the astrological systems so similiar in use today which were part and parcel of mithraism, like the metaphor of the soul with light and the historical/mythological/astrological "ritual" used to teach by analogy/allegory? along with initiation "rituals"like baptism, where one is conciously giving ones soul for the spirit of the Creator, or in purification and abolution "rituals" like fasting and sexual abstinence "periods"
these were all common themes to mithraism,serapism,gnostic,druidic, and eastern religions, along with a balanced equality of men and women, and a reverance for the beauty of nature..

it always seemed to me that the "catholic church" in the middle ages, did everything possible to purge "heretical pagan" practices like these, killing millions for practicing their ancient traditions you say they were actually promoting? why expuragate so many passages (and destroy entire gospels,scrolls and manuscripts) that corroberated that it was a widely held belief that Jesus WAS Matreya, the Messiah returned, the REINCARNATION of Mithra....why?? to fool us into worshipping communely on sunday instead of saturday?? will we be consigned to hell for THAT??

as ive said before...i believe that the fraud by the catholic church was in driving a wedge between science and theosophy and therefore taking away the holistic meaning for astronomy (which is astrology and the understanding of the phrase "as above, so below")
for mathematics ( which is numerology and sacred geometry...first causes)
for physiology and medicine( which is health,both physical and mental)
those kinds of things plus promoting the patriarchal,male dominated aristocratic fuedal society that stills wields the power and wealth consolidated over a period of hundreds of generations....

posted October 27, 2004 06:41 PM         

Thank you so much miss_apples for your confidence, every Seeker could use an open heart and mind. Looks like you're off to a good start.

There IS a purpose for organized religion, and there are VERY important reasons to subscribe to an established Tradition.

You are not reading the words of a teacher, and so it would be improper to presume to explain to you what the purpose for religion is and what the reasons for joining a Tradition are.

If you need those answers, you'll find one who is qualified to give them on the Universal Codes forum....here:
Follow Me, I am Your Guru

Thanks again for your words of encouragement. Please be well along your path and thank you for the lessons.

Love,

daf

posted October 28, 2004 10:41 PM         

when this whole thing started i could almost feel you shuddering at any mention of pre-christian or egyptian or pagan spirituality....
it was as if you were certain that spirituality couldnt have existed before jesus christ....

now youre refering people to a Ba'al (hebrew for master) who has the title of a priest of mithra (magi) and who does *ugh*.... math (division)
ummm so what happened? youre not going to explain?
has the magi ever heard of the 11:11 phenomena, or is that not relevant anymore?(it doesnt seem to me as if any1 should need to ask...isnt he supposed to be the leader?)

of course i had some tuff technical questions to ask him , cuz when he came in he said....

"I know all the hidden divine codes of the sacred numbers and the sacred codes: astrology, astral travel, channeling, alchemy."

but then he says....

Attar says, "The lazy and vain birds claim, 'That is all there is' or 'I know it all.'" This was the height of lack of adab which destroyed the vehicle of love and the journey was never made

that and some other statements that he has had to completely redefine for every1 makes me think his particular skill is at giving the OPPOSITE impression than he intends to convey.....not good when he specializes in delivering crypto-poetic oracles in response to vague questions....

i think people would take your master more seriously like you do if we know you consider him "qualified" for some reason, is it simply that he is refered to you by meilli?

posted October 29, 2004 12:30 AM         

quote:

---

I just wrote what I saw and felt without a correct understanding of what was being experienced. That was irresponsible and something that will be avoided from now on.

---

It's called life daf. We learn. We grow. I don't think there is a need to delete everything you've thought, said, or experienced. In my view, that is ignoring who you are which is the opposite of growth. They're your decisions though.

posted October 29, 2004 12:31 AM         

A very wise person once told me that sometimes the best answer is silence.

Not being a particularly wise person myself, I'm responding to your post.

If you will answer one question, I will gladly answer yours:

What answer could I give that would make you happy?

Be well Py, you're still in my heart and I miss being in the game with you very much.

Love,

posted October 29, 2004 12:51 AM         

It is the height of irresponsibility to profess to know that which you experience but do not understand. Back when I did not know what I was doing by posting the information I did, I was acting from a place of confusion. (In many ways, I still am. It is a difficult journey.)

Once I became aware of my error, THEN there was an obligation to undo or atone for what had been done in ignorance.

There is no Truth to be seen in confusion. Yes, Truth is there behind the confusion, always, but what is seen of it are bits and pieces, distorted shadows of the Reality.

Because there is a Real Truth behind these confused messages, they can become very powerful seeds that sow even greater confusion.

I couldn't in good conscience leave those seeds lying around. Not because there aren't other seeds of confusion lying around for people to run into, and not because the material I removed was particularly powerful or attractive, but because those posts were the confusion that I left lying around.

It was necessary, Dean. Thanks again for caring.

Peace to you my friend,

posted October 30, 2004 12:44 AM         

Then - this pops out at me in Petron's post:

quote:

---

now youre refering people to a Ba'al (hebrew for master) who has the title of a priest of mithra (magi) and who does *ugh*.... math (division)

---