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Author Topic:   Rye or Clover for Nitrogen ?
PlutoSurvivor
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posted November 17, 2014 01:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is it better to plant rye or clover to add nitrogen to your soil over winter?
they say rye can only be tilled with a machine
what's your experience, can you till rye by hand in the spring or do you need a rototiller?

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Randall
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posted November 18, 2014 11:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wish I could help.

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted November 19, 2014 09:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
me too

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted November 19, 2014 09:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
...wish you could help, that is

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Randall
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posted November 20, 2014 09:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sorry.

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Randall
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posted November 21, 2014 01:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Someone must know.

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TensionEmpire
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posted November 26, 2014 07:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TensionEmpire     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I did never plant rye or simmilar.
So I have not much experience
Of course you can plant rye without a machine, how did they do it when there where no machines? xD
I think rye is not leguminous.
Clover I know is, leguminous plants fix nitrogen in the soil with the simbiosis with that bacteria. But I believe you alredy knew that.

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Randall
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posted December 03, 2014 03:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
*bump*

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Randall
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posted December 17, 2014 10:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Did you figure it out?

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted December 19, 2014 01:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, I went to the farm store where they sell the seed and they suggested winter rye for cover, but the roots make it hard to till by the time spring arrives. Clover is better for early spring cover and tills easily. I forgot to ask if is too late to plant so I will try a little bit and see what happens.

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mirage29
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posted January 10, 2015 01:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I spent some time researching your topic when you first posted this. I recall somewhat that there is a hybrid seed you can use... Sorry, I should have posted it. I lost my work.

But they have that subject 'covered' if you need this kind of product! ...without the 'wasted work', like 'leek'y diapers!

omg, I'm still enjoying that good chuckle in my belly from the pun you made in another post, PlutoSurvivor!!

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted January 10, 2015 10:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, I'm glad someone didn't think it was too corny

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mirage29
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posted January 11, 2015 12:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^ corny !

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deepseablues
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posted January 12, 2015 10:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for deepseablues     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I read clover, and alfalfa

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted January 13, 2015 12:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ha!, get it

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted April 30, 2015 10:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It just dawned on me that the pet grass sold in pet stores for indoor cats is actually oat grass and rye grass. Probably wheat grass and clover, too b

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Randall
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posted May 01, 2015 03:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

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mirage29
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posted May 06, 2015 01:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

(music) Crimson and Clover (Tommy James & The Shondells, lyrics) [5:35] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4-NDc2jRmQ

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Randall
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posted May 07, 2015 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Joan Jett did a version, too.

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mirage29
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posted May 07, 2015 08:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^ You're right! It was the first one I thought of~~ but I couldn't find any Joan Jett that had a good video-match to this thread.

I really luuuuvvvv that deep grungy base-walk and beat she uses. When I enjoyed roller-skating long ago, this was one of my favorite tunes to skate to!

Stroke!!

(music) I Love Rock n Roll (Joan Jett & The Blackhearts) [2:59] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NH0ZwqBsKU

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HRH-FishAreFish
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posted May 08, 2015 06:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HRH-FishAreFish     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting dilemma, PlutoSurvivor. Maybe you could try planting Goobers instead...

quote:

NITROGEN FIXATION EFFICIENCY AND NITROGEN FERTILIZATION

Some legumes are better at fixing nitrogen than others. Common beans are poor fixers (less than 50 lbs per acre) and fix less than their nitrogen needs. Maximum economic yield for beans in New Mexico requires an additional 30-50 lbs of fertilizer nitrogen per acre. However, if beans are not nodulated, yields often remain low, regardless of the amount of nitrogen applied. Nodules apparently help the plant use fertilizer nitrogen efficiently.

Other grain legumes such as peanuts, cowpeas, soybeans, and faba beans are good nitrogen fixers, and will fix all of their nitrogen needs other than that absorbed from the soil. These legumes may fix up to 250 lbs of nitrogen per acre and are not usually fertilized. In fact, they usually don't respond to nitrogen fertilizer as long as they are capable of fixing nitrogen. Nitrogen fertilizer is applied at planting to these legumes when grown on sandy or low organic matter soils to supply nitrogen to the plant before nitrogen fixation starts. If nitrogen is applied, the rate is low, 10-15 lbs per acre. When large amounts of nitrogen are applied, the plant literally slows or shuts down the nitrogen fixation process. It is easier and less energy consuming for the plant to absorb nitrogen from the soil than to fix it from the air.

Perennial and forage legumes such as alfalfa, sweetclover, true clovers, and vetches may fix 250-500 lbs of nitrogen per acre. Like the grain legumes previously discussed, they are not normally fertilized with nitrogen. They occasionally respond to nitrogen fertilizer at planting or immediately after a cutting when the photosynthate supply is too low for adequate nitrogen fixation.

NITROGEN RETURN TO THE SOIL AND OTHER CROPS

The amount of nitrogen returned to the soil during or after a legume crop can be misleading. Almost all of the nitrogen fixed goes directly into the plant. Little leaks into the soil for a neighboring non-legume plant. However, nitrogen eventually returns to the soil for a neighboring plant when vegetation (roots, leaves, fruits) of the legume die and decompose.

When the grain from a grain legume crop is harvested, little nitrogen is returned for the following crop. Most of the nitrogen fixed during the season is removed from the field. The stalks, leaves, and roots of grain legumes such as soybeans and beans contain about the same concentration of nitrogen as found in non-legume crop residue. In fact, the residue from a corn crop contains more nitrogen than the residue from a bean crop, simply because the corn crop has more residue.

A perennial or forage legume crop only adds significant nitrogen for the following crop if the entire biomass (stems, leaves, roots) is incorporated into the soil. If a forage is cut and removed from the field, most of the nitrogen fixed by the forage is removed. Roots and crowns add little soil nitrogen, compared to the above ground biomass.

http://www.csun.edu/~hcbio027/biotechnology/lec10/lindemann.html


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HRH-FishAreFish
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posted May 08, 2015 06:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HRH-FishAreFish     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The only thing I could think of that would be more fun than goobers would be...

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HRH-FishAreFish
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posted May 08, 2015 07:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HRH-FishAreFish     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If anyone could pull it off, it would surely be a Pluto survivor!..and maybe I have an hyperactive imagination, but I could easily conjure up a vision of you out at night working in your field illuminated by the glow of your super cool lightning machine...

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted May 09, 2015 08:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mirage29:

(music) Crimson and Clover (Tommy James & The Shondells, lyrics) [5:35] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4-NDc2jRmQ



Great song, thanks for the revival

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PlutoSurvivor
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posted May 09, 2015 09:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoSurvivor     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
@ HRH
You have a crazy sense of humor... I love it!

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