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Author Topic:   2nd marriage...
Lana29865
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posted April 11, 2007 01:25 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi all!

Right now I'm finding it a bit hard to grasp that the 7th house would represent the 1st marriage partner and the 9th house the 2nd marriage partner etc. Any ideas and experiences anyone?

It's going to be his 2nd and my 1st. He has Aquarius rising and I have Leo rising, making a very nice strong aspect between us (the 7th house cusp needs), but should I look at his 9th house cusp instead...??

A bit confused...

Lana

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alanabelle86
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Posts: 40
From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Registered: May 2009

posted April 11, 2007 02:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You'd look at your 7th cuz he's your first partner

And look at his 9th because you're his 2nd partner.

The 7th house and its ruler will generally describe all the partners too. So if you want, you could look at his 7th too. But you'd be represented in his 9th.

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Lana29865
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posted April 12, 2007 04:41 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks :-)

It does make sense to me to think that the 7th house is a GENERAL representation of partners (not just the first marriage partner).
Besides, he is not my first long term partner, just the first one I'm thinking of signing the legal papers with ;-)

However, not only do we have our Ascendants opposing each other (which fullfills perfectly our 7th house needs), but his Sun is on my Descendant, his Moon on my Ascendant and my Sun is in his 7th house. It sounds logical to me to see myself in his 7th house...

As for his 9th house, he has Scorpio on the cusp (his 9th house ruler Pluto in Virgo in the 7th house - my Virgo Sun and Virgo Pluto fall there in our synastry), and his Mars and Neptune are in Scorpio in the 9th house.
How would that represent me? I am Virgo Sun and Virgo Pluto, and my Mars and Neptune are in Scorpio (in my 4th house). In synastry, his Mars conjuncts my Neptune.
Is that enough to find me in his 9th house...? I'm at a loss, as I'm not Scorpio Sun.

It's kind of confusing in this day and age when relationships can be so varied in form. For example, a short marriage could very well be less significant than a long and deep commitment without signing the papers... How would that show up in the chart...?

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Stargazer
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Posts: 46
From: just left of center
Registered: May 2009

posted April 12, 2007 12:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stargazer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Lana

Fellow Virgo here with Pluto in Virgo and Mars and Neptune in Scorpio..

The 9th house is Sag's house... I think of it as a total learning experience... through thought, communication and journeys.
Maybe it is common to find relationships formed by people who are in a sense more
"traveled" than when they are "younger" and possibly in their first contractual relationship...
I think it is nice to have the 9th house highlighted in a relationship formed as we are older...But don't disregard the 7th, 4th and 11th... these are houses that best suit "live together" relationships...Home building, lasting friendships and of course marital partnerships... not all relationships end in a contract...
I had a very profound relationship with a guy whose stuff fell in my 9th house...
He was larger than life and I found him very easy to be with... He taught me alot... and we of course had a fabulous time together especially while on an adventure.. We made almost everything an adventure....
Too much Uranus (him)... he would never be one to settle down with just one... and for me, being too jealous found myself faced with no positions of interest open to me in his life... and we ended it...

Here are our synastry house placements:
I am (A)....

A's Sun in S's 1 house
S's Sun in A's 9 house
A's Moon in S's 9 house
S's Moon in A's 11 house
A's Mercury in S's 1 house
S's Mercury in A's 9 house
A's Venus in S's 1 house
S's Venus in A's 9 house
A's Mars in S's 4 house
S's Mars in A's 10 house
A's Jupiter in S's 12 house
S's Jupiter in A's 1 house
A's Saturn in S's 9 house
S's Saturn in A's 12 house
A's Uranus in S's 2 house
S's Uranus in A's 7 house
A's Neptune in S's 4 house
S's Neptune in A's 9 house
A's Pluto in S's 2 house
S's Pluto in A's 7 house

btw...my 2nd marriage houses looked like this:

A's Sun in C's 11 house
C's Sun in A's 7 house
A's Moon in C's 7 house
C's Moon in A's 2 house
A's Mercury in C's 11 house
C's Mercury in A's 6 house
A's Venus in C's 11 house
C's Venus in A's 7 house
A's Mars in C's 2 house
C's Mars in A's 4 house
A's Jupiter in C's 10 house
C's Jupiter in A's 2 house
A's Saturn in C's 6 house
C's Saturn in A's 1 house
A's Uranus in C's 12 house
C's Uranus in A's 7 house
A's Neptune in C's 2 house
C's Neptune in A's 9 house
A's Pluto in C's 11 house
C's Pluto in A's 7 house

Mars conjunct Neptune is tricky in synastry... Who is the Mars?
I'll be back in a few with a link on this...

edit to add:
Duh! You said he was the Mars..
here is a great link to this aspect and others Neptunian...
Lauren gives a great "story" about Mars/Neptune http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/010168.html

Best of luck to you!!

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MoonDreamer81
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posted April 12, 2007 04:54 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yaaayy....I have Eros in my man's 9th house(Pisces) and we've both been engaged before(not to each other...LOL),but it fell through....

------------------
S:Taurus
ASC:Gemini
M:Scorpio

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Lana29865
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posted April 13, 2007 04:21 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Stargazer, thank you so much for your very nice and encouraging post :-))

Right now I'm busy with work, but I will reply in more detail soon (in the next few days) :-)

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pearlized
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posted April 13, 2007 11:11 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was told that 7th house represents marriages represented by church or state so no long term dating would not apply to that house.

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Stargazer
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Posts: 46
From: just left of center
Registered: May 2009

posted April 13, 2007 11:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stargazer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Pearl

I was with my 2nd husband 10 years (lived with him for 7) before we got married...
I guess I couldn't ever complain that I didn't know what I was getting into.
It was ironic that I got pregnant with our first child on my honeymoon!!

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AcousticGod
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From: Pleasanton, CA
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posted April 14, 2007 12:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hmmm...that's interesting about the 9th representing the second wife. I see a lot of Sags marry twice.

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Lana29865
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posted April 14, 2007 03:34 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Stargazer, it's so nice to talk to a fellow Virgo who shares the same Mars&Neptune&Pluto sign :-) I also noticed in some thread that you have a 3rd house Moon - me too! ;-) (Venus/Moon conjunction in Libra).

That link you posted gives an excellent insight into Neptune... Yes, we have an exact Neptune (me) and Mars (him) connection. Me being the woman and him the man, do you have any idea how that would manifest in this conjunction...? I would think gender has something to do with how the effect comes out, or am I totally wrong...? Would I be the one less reliable...?* Would I be the one with more illusions about him or would my Neptune confuse him and his sexuality (Mars)? I feel I know some of the answers but this conjunction is still somewhat of a puzzle to me.
(We also have Sun&Neptune conjunction in our composite 7th house).

The first relationship synastry you posted, would you count that astrologically as "a marriage"? This is what my original post was about: I don't really know if I should see my partner as my 1st partner (and hence look for clues about him in my 7th house) or should I consider my previous serious attachments as such...? If I do, it gives a totally different astrological view of him (and the same goes for me in his chart).
That's why I feel that at least for me it is best to stick to the GENERAL description of a partner... (If not, I wouldn't really know whether to count him as my 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th partner...).

Still about the Mars/Neptune aspect: As your Mars fell into his 4th house, how was that for you...? His is in mine... (He also has the M/N conjunction in his own chart, mine are mutually unaspected).

I do feel the 9th house in our relationship, though... He is a strong Aquarius (Sun, ASC & Mercury), his Uranus&Jupiter in Libra are in conjunction on the 7th/8th house cusp (btw, in conjunction with my Moon/Venus). There is no Sagittarius in him, but with his 9th house Mars and Neptune, he really has some very strong Sagittarius traits, such as traveling (hitch hiking style) all around the world and being an "eternal bachelor"...
I feel for you when you said the Uranus effect was too much for you in your relationship, because I feel that all the time in our relationship. Now I'm able to deal with it, but 15 years ago he was too much for me (this is our 2nd time around ;-)). Ours is by no means a traditional pairing.
(It's interesting that both your guys had their Uranus in your 7th house... My man's Uranus/Jupiter/Pluto are in my 3rd house).

*He is totally open, I am very secretive, even when there is nothing to hide...

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sVirgo
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From: Colorado
Registered: May 2009

posted April 14, 2007 08:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sVirgo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is interesting. I am Virgo
Today I checked and found that in my 7th house, it's Cancer sign. My ex-husband sign was Cancer. And now my 9th house is Virgo. Does that mean, I would be my own companion.

The strange thing I found that my ex-husband has Virgo sign in his 9th house. But in his 7th house, he has mercury(Leo), venus(Leo), his sun sign(Cancer).

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Stargazer
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Posts: 46
From: just left of center
Registered: May 2009

posted April 16, 2007 08:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stargazer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Lana
Sorry for the delay in getting back to this thread....

I've prolly confused you.. I had also read about 9th house and second marriages.. don't know where... but the first synastry house layout i posted was with someone I had a relationship with after my second marriage (second one). i did not marry him.
I feel that it would be common to find a strong 9th house in a second marriage or beyond because it would normally represent a maturity feel to the relationship...
i hope that makes sense? Not all relationships end in marriage... regardless of which marriage we are in, I would look to the 7th, 4th and 11th for contracts, home and a general friendly feel... In fact a 11th house composite is one of my fav's..

As far as Mars/Neptune, I was the Mars. I have the conjunction natal. I will quote some more Liz Greene for you and explain how this played out in our relationship..
Again, this is with synastry guy #1.
He is a Scorpio...I used to be captivated by the Cancers (guy #2).. Now its Scorpios and its always been water... I have Cancer on the DC and Scorpio on the MC.. Again, i feel like I have moved on so to speak..Don't know if there is an Astrological explanation for this? It just is what it is.

An awareness of this aspect is greatly needed....
"Mars will happily play the knight, and Neptune the damsel in distress; regardless of gender, this the archetypal dynamic between the aspect. Neptune inspires Mars to greater vision and Mars provides Neptune with a shield against misfortune. But because we so often find Neptune frightening and dangerous to the ego's need for control, the Neptune person may refuse to acknowledge his or her dependency, or may experience deep unconscious envy of Mars' toughness and sexual power. Secret fear, envy and dependency may Provoke Neptune to undermine Mars' initiative and self-confidence, in highly manipulative ways which frustrate the Mars person and fan anger and even violence.
Mars can not fight underwater and, when baited prefers the efficacy of a simple punch or shouting match. Equally often, Neptune may become addicted to being led; and Mars may eventually become weary of always having to wear suits of armour while Neptune relaxes in yet another warm bath.

The sexual charisma of Mars, as perceived by Neptune, may seem untrustworthy and dangerous, because the protector might, at any point, go off and protect or conquer someone else. In an effort to bind the Mars person, Neptune may try to obtain protection through failure, illness or victimisation, or may unconsciously undermine Mars' potency through subtle forms of rejection and evasiveness which keeps Mars feeling uncertain and confused. Neptune can thwart Mars's need for clear-cut action, asking Mars to make all the descions, and then sabotaging the results.
Neptune is adept at producing a classic "Not tonight, but maybe tommorow" script; Mars is refused, but never directly, and the eager knight is kept hoping and waiting, increasingly furious and frustrated"

This most certainly played out in our relationship. He was used to being the one with all the power.. Yet, he secretly liked the fact that my magnetism was as great as his... Down the road, he began to resent it. He would not put forth much effort in anything.. expect me to do it and then when i did.. He would sabotage it and make me feel bad about myself...
For instance, I made plans for us and he decided at the last moment that he wanted us to stay at his house. I locked the door to the bedroom and he unlocked it.. leaving it ajar.. Sure enough, his dogs bolted in the room.. and lets just say the moment was ruined... He would then say "Its bad Karma
It's too hard for us to be together.."
I replied "No, its just sabotage on your part because you are scared of surrender in any form" Weeks would go by after this type of thing before we would speak again...

Just make sure that even though you tend to be secretive.. you are honest about how you feel and SAY IT! Don't assume he knows...
It can turn around and bite hard..
IMO, His Mars falling in my 4th would have been better. I was a threat to his whole way of life and it scared him.. He undermined our whole relationship and in fact, probably got more joy out of destroying it than the joy he got making it come to fruition...
The Uranus aspect made it all seem like a fairytale... at first... But the prince was a toad... and the price was too, high.
"Eternal Bachelor", indeed! Very Saggy...
Some grow out of it.. him, not so much!

I hope this helps... It can be a wonderful aspect.. If both are aware of whats going on!
Are you engaged?

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Lana29865
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posted April 17, 2007 05:53 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you so much, Stargazer, for giving of your time and knowledge to me :-)

You didn't confuse me, I was already confused before that, lol. A while ago I read a book about synastry; if I remember correctly, the title was 'The Best Way to Learn about Relationships' (stupid title, btw, imo). It was written by two Aquarius ladies (I don't remeber their names either), but it was the first time I ever read about the 9th house having to do with the 2nd 'marriage'. It has puzzled me since then, but I do understand it much better now :-)

Thanks for that Mars-Neptune passage. It REALLY feels exactly like that! Surprising precision!
I suppose this aspect works better when the woman is the Neptune... (?)It has a more traditional feel to it, and maybe it's a little easier for a man to accept his own Mars role than a woman's strong Mars (??). This depends on the guy, of course...

I am not engaged to my man, we somehow seem to have passed that stage. We have started to think and talk about marriage as it would make our lives easier and more simpler economically and materially (he has proposed to me). We own property together and would also welcome a baby (if that still happens at my age). So, basically, we have already taken the biggest steps, and the only thing that remains is the signing of the papers... I know, why don't you just do it... My answer is: I still need to think a little... There are some cultural differencies to be dealt with.

Maybe also here my Neptune plays a role - his Mars would just go ahead and do it, but I still want to fantasize...

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Stargazer
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Posts: 46
From: just left of center
Registered: May 2009

posted April 17, 2007 10:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stargazer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Lana

Hi! I was also so very surprised at the accuracy of her "take" on Neptune...
I would recommend you read it...

The Neptune/Sun Conjunction in the Composite is also very powerful. I had it with Mr. Scorpio as well but just in Synastry. There is alot of info on that at the link i posted, but here is what it says about the Composite.

"Most powerful is a composite in which the Sun makes a strong aspect to Neptune, for the essential goals and meaning of the relationship are coloured by Neptune's longing for fusion and flight from the pain of the mortal world. Such relationships are often based on a shared spiritual or artistic commitment/ If this kind of container can be provided, darker Neptunian elements may not prove to be too great a problem. Where no such container exists, the relationship may require some form of abnegation which, with or without the consent of the individuals, denies the possibility of its being sustained in the world of form. Sometimes the relationship comes into being through shared guilt, or an obligation such as an unplanned pregnancy. It is not surprising that, when a bond is rooted in mutual unconsciousness, it may prove dissapointing. Often the dissappointment is sexual- one or both parties cannot or will not allow physical consummation- or sexual fulfillment is curtailed by the prior and unbreakable commitment of one of the individuals to somebody else.
This does not mean that composite charts with Sun-Neptune contacts always reflect dissapointment and disillusionment. They may reflect a compassionate and inspiring bond which opens the hearts of both people. But Neptune offers its most creative face if a channel can be found for its dreams- a joint commitment through which the longing for redemption can be shared without either person projecting too much on ther other. Whether this is a spirtual path, an artistic project, or a humanitarian effort, such a focal point is essential to get the best from such an aspect in the composite chart."

I found that info very profound.

I agree that it probably is more comfortable if the woman is Neptune. It would be the "traditional" role in a Mars/Neptune conjunction.. We actually had it both ways (Double whammy) But me as Neptune the conjunction was much wider...
I can only say that again Neptunian themes in relationships can cast the illusion that you "know" what is going on or how one another feels without actually saying it...
This is the deception. Had i said to him, "Why did you unlock the door when you know the dogs are running amuck? and started a conversation about it, I may have realised then that he did not really want to be with me at all that night. He wanted to be somewhere else. He didn't say that. He changed the plans in hopes that i would be angry enough to not want to see him... after all, It was I who went to the trouble of making the plans... When this did not occur, he felt like the only way to get out of it was to sabatoge the night by other means... and then make me look like the bad guy. to justify it to himself. Had we both been honest... we would of saved ourselves a lot of grief.. Me especially, Being very Neptunian myself, The rosey glasses are snug at times... I have to constantly remind myself that I need to take them off.. I also, being a Virgo, need to make that "I'll be nice as long as you don't cross this line" boundry a whole heck of alot farther from my heart....

Relationships that start off in a weird sort of way and remain non-traditional are very Uranian..
Thinking is great... but try not to over-think it... TRUST your gut (Virgo)... It will tell you the truth!!!
Best wishes... and let us know how it goes.....

------------------
"Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment"

Rita Mae Brown

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Lana29865
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posted April 18, 2007 07:03 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dear Stargazer, a TRULY GREAT passage about composite Sun-Neptune conjunction.

Would you believe it, but 2 years ago we founded a cultural/humanitarian association together... It must be the outlet of our composite Sun-Neptune... Suits amazingly well the description, I would think...

Thank you so much for the good luck wishes - I will let you know how things proceed (if they will, lol).

Have a wonderful day,

Lana

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