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Author Topic:   Anyone want to do Bhutto's chart?
berryberry
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posted December 28, 2007 06:22 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anyone thought of doing Bhutto's chart? I'm not an astrologer, or else I would do it myself. Her birthday was June 21, 1953 in Karachi, Pakistan.

For some reason, the news of her assassination resonates within me. Apparently, her father was executed, and her two brothers were also killed.

What a nightmare.

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blue moon
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posted December 28, 2007 09:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for blue moon     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

No birth time around anywhere, so this is a noon chart.

Some commentators have already had a look at her chart:
http://planetaryenergies.net/2007/12/28/benazir-bhutto-the-pluto-mars-effect/
http://astropost.blogspot.com/2007/11/birth-chart-benazir-bhutto.html

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lalalinda
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posted December 28, 2007 10:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lalalinda     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What's the number one transit we see here?
T.Pluto opposite N. Sun
T.Mars (Rx) conjunct N Sun

I was reading her biography, she was married on Dec.18th.
This puts T.Pluto conjunct the Sun in her marriage chart.

What does hard transits of Pluto show?
endings (death)

Rest in Peace Benazir

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Belage
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posted December 28, 2007 11:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Very interesting transits. First, RIP, Mrs. Bhutto. I hope analizing her chart will not be viewed as disrespectful as she is just now being buried.

Did anyone else noticed that the powerful Pluto/Jupiter conjunction in Sagg that happaned about 2 weeks ago was exactly opposite her natal sun?

Transiting Jupiter in Cap is currently approaching a opposition to her natal mars in Cancer. Indicating rash actions.

Transiting Saturn in Virgo was squaring her natal Jupiter in Gemini.

While transiting Neptune in Aquarius was trining her natal Saturn in Libra which can give her a sense of security and a desire for openeness, the same Neptune was opposing her PLuto in Leo, confusing her power base.

Transiting Uranus was trining her natal URanus, so she felt comfortable taking risks.

RIP.

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amisha121877
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posted December 28, 2007 12:53 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
this is the chart i'm thinking is her - what has hit me, so far since i'm still looking at this, is the transitting retrograde mars in cancer in her 6th house and the 29th gemini degree natal sun she has in her sixth house - her natal north node in uranus ruled aquarius in her 1st house and the transitting south node conjuncting her pluto in the 8th house and transitting mercury is conjunct her chiron in capricorn in the 1st house. there is so much to look at. what do you all think?

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alanabelle86
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posted December 28, 2007 01:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Poor Bhutto. I'm so angered by this, I found her fascinating and it's a shame she had to die, fighting for what's right, one can only hope good will come out of this. In the sense of those she's touched all over the world, coming together to stand against what she so strongly fought against and keeping her in our hearts everywhere.

What I first noticed was a transit of tremendous power.

Transiting Mars (violence, aggression) is fallen and retrograde, giving it twice the debility opposing a earth-shaking conjunction of Pluto( extremes, death), the Sun (life),and Jupiter (religion, exaggeration). This transit has been going on for a while (Jupiter-Pluto) but once you add the Sun to it, and now Mercury (administrators and plans), you can see the violence finally called to direct action and executed.

This power conjunction opposes her natal Sun/Mars conjunction...which at the very least denotes a life full of action and assertion, and marked by impulsive and rash, possibly, even violent contact.

The Sun, one of the main indicators of life (besides the Moon) is opposing her natal Sun. I read somewhere that generally in many "death" charts, when compared to the person's natal you'll see the Sun and/or Moon in hard aspect to the natal Sun...kind of a "lights out" affect, if you will.

Transiting Moon/Neptune (dissolution of safety) opposition exactly conjunct Pluto (death and extremes). Also noted that the Moon is the other life bringer and important when it comes to events, it's position, in opposition to Neptune strongly debilitates it. The Moon (public) being opposed by Neptune (secret enemies) while conjunct to Pluto (extreme violence, danger, and death)...Never a good situation to be in.

Saturn squaring her natal Jupiter, cutting her lifeline in a way. If Jupiter, generally, is where we can be luckiest and/or saved, this aspect was making those chances as little and futile as possible.

T. Jupiter is also in fall, Capricorn....and T. Venus is in detriment..Scorpio. Both benefic, "savior" planets are not working to the best of their abilities.

Transiting Venus, the other benefic, is squaring the Moon/Pluto conjunction....noting that this too, is another "lifeline" that's out of order.

In her natal chart, Mercury is widely conjunct the South Node...possibly indicating that Mercury (or something Mercury related) may have had something to her death in a past life. She was assassinated when Mercury joined the Transiting power conjunction/opposition.

ALSO, Transiting Moon conjunct natal Pluto was opposite the Transiting North Node...showing that the time (Moon) to end this life (Moon/Pluto) has come or that she no longer is moving forward/continuing in this life (NN)

Also quite generally, Transiting Uranus was opposed to transiting Saturn, shaking up those stable support beams for everyone.

That's all I got so far, I'm not good at this, so correct me if I'm wrong or way off base.


RIP Bhutto

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Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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BornUnderDioscuri
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posted December 28, 2007 01:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BornUnderDioscuri     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does anyone feel like this is all a major effect of Pluto changing signs? Cuz in the past like 3 years so many major world leaders have died/been killed? Could that have anything to do with Pluto entering Capricorn, a sign of power and leadership? I mean think about it:

Saddam Hussein
Yasser Arafat
Ariel Sharon
Benazir Bhutto

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Dulce Luna
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posted December 28, 2007 01:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dulce Luna     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Eck, don't really know how much better she was as a leader/political candidate than Musharraf is but this is just awful. I predict that this whole thing might be like a 'Who shot JFK' type of thing with alot of likely suspects (everyone from Musharraf's government to Al Qaida) but only one who really had anything to gain from her demise. Ughhh, its just the instability in the world that p-sses me off sometimes.

Back on topic, I was even thinking of the Jupiter/pluto conjunction that most likely opposed her sun a couple of weeks ago and the fact that Pluto had either just began opposing her sun or had been doing so for the past year. And then there's Pluto's transition into Cappy.....alot of sh#t is changing.

May she R.I.P.

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alanabelle86
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posted December 28, 2007 01:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I thought of that yesterday. Jupiter in Capricorn (world leaders) conjunct Pluto (power, also death) at 29' Sagittarius (the largest possible, world, exaggerations)...


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Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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lalalinda
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posted December 28, 2007 01:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for lalalinda     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Amisha
good point on her (fated) 29th degree Sun

Now that I'm getting a better look,
notice that she was going through her Mars return with Mars Rx.
Back and forth, issue and re-issue.

Plus when T Mars conjuncts the N Sun tempers are high and there is always the possibility of face to face confrontation and a clash of force.
They tried to car bomb her when she returned and now this,
what degree was Mars then? (her return)

Another good point is the current Mars/Pluto opposition (aspecting her Natal Sun)
when triggered it is violent and deadly.

edit to add: didn't see yours Alanabelle
great delineation

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writesomething
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posted December 28, 2007 02:10 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
one of the most interesting threads in a looong time.

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Xodian
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posted December 28, 2007 06:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Xodian     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Eck, don't really know how much better she was as a leader/political candidate than Musharraf is but this is just awful

Offtopic:

Thank God someone is looking a bit beyond the sentimatalities that has suddenly befallen around her death. Offcourse I morn the death of a person but making her an icon?! Out of a person who embezzled God knows how much out of Pakistani Taxes? And fragulant defense deals? Not to mention aid money that was never repaid and thus recieved charges from Poland, France, Switzerland (and the list continues.)

Sorry guys... I would rather stick to facts.

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Belage
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posted December 28, 2007 08:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
More musings. Jupiter has moved into Capricorn. Capricorn is ruled by Saturn and symbolizes the father, while it's opposite, Cancer symbolizes the mother. Bhutto was a woman and a "mother" figure to her supporters. It's possible that with Jupiter in Cap, mother/females figures are in their detriment.

If you look at Bhutto's biography, she was removed from office in November 1996, and Jupiter was in Capricorn also at that time.

From a numerological standpoint, her date of birth 06 + 21 + 1953 adds up to a 9. Nine signifies completion, achievement, and in many cases endings.

This year, 2007, was a 9 year for her. (06 21 2007)

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writesomething
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posted December 28, 2007 10:44 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
give me a break, if society/people in general can mourn Reagan's death, or other corrupt leaders/etc I think theres room for someone like Bhutto. All leaders have flaws, even the ones I admire and respect.

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Xodian
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posted December 28, 2007 11:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Xodian     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Offtopic again:

Thus I categorize a leader upon the benifit of their legacy vs. the damage they caused.

Ronal Regan was about as competent of an economist as the current administration; Shifting resources into projects that have no significant return in terms of benifits at all. Though I agree with the idea of lowering taxes; Placing large amounts of revenues on defense bugets resulted in a record rise in debt for the United States.

HOWEVER; During his regin, the GDP of the United States rose significantly after the rescession of 1982 and inflation decreased. It had to come at a heavy price though.

Now Lets put Benazir into the spotlight:

Compared to Musharaf whose economic revamps included privitization of key govenment services (under heavy corruption may I add) and a huge jump in the Karachi stock index (not to mention better services for the people,) Benazir actually embezzeld money out of an already weakining Pakistani Economy during her time as Prime Minister. Most of the money she embezzled went to her PRIVATE bank accounts in Switzerland. And ontop of that the aid money that was being provided by other countries such as France and Poland didn't saw its way being used for the purpose it was intended to be used for (infrastructure imporvement, etc.) They were so ****** off that they actually charged her for fraud!

Oh and did I fail to mention the Muhajirs that werre wrongly accused during her turn in power and were executed? (however this info. has yet to have solid backing and therefore I am not gonna shift it up as fact just yet.)

People were so fed up with her term in power that they removed her from office... TWICE I might add and yet you see no change in women's rights during her time in power or any move to change the corrupted govenment owned businesses (including the state bank) in anyway.

Face of Democracy? I think not.

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Dulce Luna
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posted December 28, 2007 11:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dulce Luna     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I thought all those charges against her were never proved? Anyways, despite the fact that I'm not really a supporter of hers and whatever flaws she had, I still respect her courage in coming back to Pakistan in the face of extremists who wanted her dead and a corrupt government that probably had the same ideas. Ronald Reagan openly backed an Aparthied (sp?) gov't and continued a foreign policy of giving them the weapons that had allowed them to wreak havoc in Southern Africa from decades. Bhutto is probably the lesser of two evils IMO.


quote:
Bhutto was a woman and a "mother" figure to her supporters. It's possible that with Jupiter in Cap, mother/females figures are in their detriment.

That's probably what's been bugging me so much about this death (I am a cancer). And I must say that eerily, my younger brother is going through a similar situation. No, my mother hasn't died but he was supposed to go live with her next month but my father has halted that and now wants to take her to court. He probably won't be with her in the Carolinas until June or July now. Good lookin' out on the Jupiter in Cap stuff.

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alanabelle86
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posted December 28, 2007 11:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Okay, mine was a personal statement. An opinion, everyone's obviously not going to feel the way I feel. Personally, I don't think she was an "icon" but she definitely touched me. Which is why her death ****** me off. Actually, on a larger scale than just her. I get really sick of the "person tries to do some good and gets assassinated" chapters filling the history books these days.

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Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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alanabelle86
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posted December 28, 2007 11:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Can we stick to the topic and not turn this into a political thread? After all, there is a specific forum for that....

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Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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lalalinda
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posted December 29, 2007 04:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lalalinda     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
back on track

After playing with her chart for awhile
I came up with a rectification chart that fits.
(but has room for improvement)

http://www.astro.com/cgi/chart.cgi?cid=wwwfilePQEZNp-u1198914608&lang=e&gm=a1&nhor=2&nho2=1&btyp=245&mth=gw&sday=27&smon=12&syr=2007&hsy=-1&zod=&orbp=&rs=2&add=20&add=22&pfday=-YP+ 1&ast=

I'll tell you why I like this chart

Starting at the top
MC is 22 Aquarius 03
Transiting Neptune is conjunct the MC
(at 20 Aqua)
Transiting Neptune on the top of the chart can show a martyr

This is supported by
her 12th house cusp at 0 Taurus.
Ruler of the 12th (Taurus/Venus) is in the 12th
Venus is strong in it's own sign and in it's house of exaltation
(double dignity)
Venus here is self-sacrificing.

Going to the bottom of the chart
Natal Pluto is conjunct the nadir.
The nadir shows conditions at the end of your life.
Pluto rules assassination.
By Progression her progressed Sun is at 21Leo23
it's off only 40 minutes (not even a degree)from being exact.

Up to the 8th house 1 Capricorn
Transiting Pluto/Jupiter is conjunct the 8th house cusp.
(Rulers of the 4th and Ascendant)
End of life and the self

With this chart we have Chiron (the Great Teacher)
in the 8th house (others resources)

for discussion purposes
I didn't like it that Saturn was not angular (but it is exalted in Libra)
If anyone wants to try and get it angular, that would be cool.

Out

edited to add:
Saturn actually rules Martyrs but Neptune shows self sacrifice.

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stillatlarge
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posted December 29, 2007 11:48 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for stillatlarge     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
From: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page2362.html?theme=light

Astrological Analysis: Bhutto Killed in Pakistan
by Brandi Jasmine

Back in November, I spoke of my concern for Benazir Bhutto:
Last month I spoke of a woman in leadership coming to prominence, and of course the story of Benazir Bhutto fits nicely with the aspects I was watching then. Her potential is great, but I am afraid for her safety with the aspects I see right now. I would urge her to be more cautious than she has been in the past. The same for other women leaders who have polarizing or controversial pasts, who want to transform the world quickly or in radical ways. This is not the best time to push past people's prejudice. They will want to fight to hold on to the "old ways", and some of that push-back could be violent. I feel some of this energy could peak mid-month.

(ASTROLOGICAL CHART)

November came and went safely for Ms. Bhutto, but today, her good luck came crashing to an unfortunate end, and she was assassinated in the middle of a political rally. Looking at the astrological chart (above) for the time of death, the Ascendant is Cancer, ruled by the Moon (a prominent woman). The Moon in Leo (arrogant leadership, feeling invulnerable) is opposed North Node, T-Squared Venus (a strong woman crossed by unfortunate events). The 12th House Mars (secret plots, war, violence) is opposed by Pluto and Jupiter (religious extremism, the potential for great violence).

The AstroCartography chart for the death time is frightening. It places Jupiter, Mars and Pluto lines in Iran, with the Death-God Pluto directly over Tehran. Worse, the Uranus MidHeaven line (unexpected, shocking events in high profile people or leadership position) also crosses Tehran. There are two possible interpretations. It is possible this assassination was sponsored in Iran, or that Iran will be blamed for it, and there may be retaliatory assassinations in Iran as a result.

Uranus, Pluto, Mars and Jupiter are a dangerous, explosive mixture in this kind of configuration. This assassination could have repercussions that will echo around the world. It bodes ill for peace in 2008, the effects could stain the entire region under a cloud of violent bloodshed. There is a particularly high degree of danger as Pakistan is a nuclear-powered country, and the expanding chaos may put their stockpiles in jeopardy. I am loathe to predict a nuclear exchange, and I pray it is avoidable, but I would not be surprised if there were some kind of nuclear disaster in Pakistan or Iran in the next 18 months.

Mercury also plays a role in this chart, with the Mercury Rising line passing close to Atlanta (CNN headquarters), Washington DC and New York City. The same Pluto, Mars and Jupiter lines cross through the heartland of America. Clearly this news will have a huge impact in the United States as well, possibly leading to a wider spread of the war in Iraq, and a greater burden for "Middle America". The controversy may affect the US elections. I would be greatly surprised if the war in Iraq, and the broader war on terror do not spread dramatically as a result.

--Brandi Jasmine, editor in chief, Astrology.ca

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Scorpio3x
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posted December 29, 2007 03:11 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm codfused. how can someone have a death chart when we are all going to die. wouldnt we all have one?

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alanabelle86
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posted December 29, 2007 04:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alanabelle86     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
We do, Scorpio3x. It just hasn't been created yet. For obvious reasons...


We're still alive.

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Sagittarius AC, Sun in Scorpio, Moon in Leo

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Scorpio3x
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posted December 29, 2007 06:56 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
so you mean the chart is created at the moment of death? I thought our charts were created at the moment of our births.

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writesomething
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posted December 29, 2007 07:24 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
alana- just wanted to add, I forgot to tell how I really enjoyed what you wrote.

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Geocosmic Valentine
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posted December 29, 2007 08:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Geocosmic Valentine     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The correct birth data for Benazir Bhutto is:

Jun 21, 1953 7:32 PM Karachi, Pakistan

After all of this I thought it was necessary.

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