posted October 15, 2008 07:25 PM              

ONERULEDBYMARS: Thank you too for posting this info.

I confess, I can relate to most of the points said to indicate an "old soul". My NN is in Pisces (following the theory I once read about, but can't find the link to anymore: It says that the later your NN-sign in the Zodiac, the "older" your soul.) I have a decent handful of retrograde-planets in my natal chart (including Neptune-rx cj. my ASC in 1st house and Chrion-rx in 4th) - and I am just quotinng what is 100% true for me:

ONERULEDBYMARS's points (Steve Gunn-quotes):

quote:

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Had a difficult romantic life often with much pain and disappointment (...) · Things just seem to happen to you and around you, often becoming very dramatic through the seemingly extreme reactions of others (...) Somehow know you’re different (...) Have some psychic intuition and ‘just knowing’ things (...) Find that you have deeper emotions and passions than most people (...) People have extreme reactions to you – some just adore you and some seem to really dislike you yet you behave the same to everyone (...) Have an inner creative passion (...) Suffer lots of jealousy from others (..) Often perceived wrongly

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Even more precise is the source that BUENA36 has given:

quote:

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Old souls have largley given up on the world. It doesnt seem worth the touble to spend a lot of energy on things that do not last.(...)They (...)live a more relaxed lifestyle. Their motivation is of spiritual purity. (...)Old souls are usually very competent, but there is a tiredness about them which prevents them from making a lot of effort. Others, however, see this as laziness. (...)They often become teachers to pass the knowlege and wisdom on (...)When they do make themselves noticed, they are often perceived as "far out" or weird" (...)

Old souls usually have problems with self esteem because their perceptions and values are not shared with the rest of society.(...)Old souls are often loners. They are a rare breed, comprising about eleven percent of the population. They have very little attachment to coworkers, neighbors, encounters of casual nature, even their sense of connection with blood relatives is not very strong. They dont like heavy entanglements with other people. When they do get involved, its because of a strong spiritual bond. It is difficult for old souls to develop relationships with people they have not had numerous past lives with. Many times old souls seek companionships through astrology or psychic endeavors.(...)

In dating situations, they don't need to go anywhere (to a movie) or do anything (play a game) as a means of developing social intimacy. If the basis of psychological intimacy is not quickly apparent to the old soul, he will not put himself through much trouble to develop it. (...)Sex is not highly prized by the Old soul. He is usually competent therein (...)Old souls are often hedonistic and sensual, however, and can have a bawdy sense of humor. Old souls are often androgynous (having balanced masculine and feminine characteristics) (...)What the Old soul seeks in romantic relationships is a "soul mate" — someone to whom he relates on a soul level. This might be someone else with whom he has spent many lifetimes, or another soul in his own Entity. The drive for this is so strong that it could be described as a compulsion. (...) In order to even out your past life choices, as an Old Soul you are often in the body of the sex you least prefer. But having had both male and female bodies so many times before, you do begin to blend the different energies (...)

Old souls are individualistic, believing people should do whatever they want as long as it doesnt hurt anyone else. Their motto is "You do what you want, I'll do what I want." They rarely campaign for anything, they don't want to change the world, they just want to to let it be. They have a "Live and let live" attitude. (...)They do not have a strong sense of attachment to the world, they want to purify themselves of materialistic attachments (...)Old souls are detached and aloof, even uninvolved.(...)Old souls inherently perceive the broader perspective. They see that the world rolls on, day after day, year after year, millennium after millennium, with the same basic stories being told time after time with minor variations. Old souls know the big lesson of the whole Maturation cycle, and that is nonjudgmental acceptance of anything and everything.(...)Profound issues are their concern, not the trivial. They want to get right to the heart of the matter and skip all the superficialities.
(...)

Old souls tend to be tolerant and inclusive, and at least try to be open to other ways of looking at things. However, they may become upset by people whose points of view are rigid and exclusive. So if they are trying to respect different points of view, they may not respect people whose points of view do not respect other points of view. Old souls are still learning tolerance. They can be a little arrogant about the fact that they would never be so openly intolerant. (...)Old souls "go with the flow" (...)The good thing is that they are graceful and gracious when it comes to dealing with other people. The disadvantage is that they may lack the initiative to do what could be done. They often come up with great and innovative ideas because of their advanced and efficient perceptions, but they lack the energy to bring them to completion.
(...)Because of their advanced perceptions, Old souls are inherently ethical in behavior, feeling, and thought. (...)as if they are grown-up even when they are children.(...)They rarely perceive actions as being truly evil. Rather, they regard things that cause suffering as foolish and primitive. (...)

Old souls are casual and easygoing about everything. Nothing is a big deal to them. Almost never are they outrageous or outlandish.(...)Rarely are they overly concerned with what other people think.(...)Old souls pursue education with the same casual attitude as they do everything else in life. Grades are of very little value to them.(...)Old souls tend to cut out the material pursuits that occupy so much of the time and energy of younger souls, and concentrate what little energy they have on spiritual integrity. By this is meant the need to understand the truth, and the reason for things. Old souls rarely participate in organized religion. They are often drawn rather to metaphysics, mysticism, philosophy, and the occult in their quest for understanding.(...)

A fancy house or car, or impressive clothes and jewelry aren't often too high on an Old Soul's real priority list. Neither is a nine-to-five job. Plain laziness on the physical plane sometimes creates difficulty paying the bills, but the material game just isn't what it used to be. This is especially true after the soul has had many materially succesful lifetimes. They have already completed the lessons to be gained from having riches. (...)

Old souls are late bloomers, they usually do not grow into their full soul perceptivity until about age 35 or so. (...)They are definitely out of the mainstream of society and care little for its formal institutions.(...)No matter how much they might need it for building character, they will only tolerate just a certain amount of stress in any given situation. Then they will get depressed and just chuck it all and move on. (...)It's appropriate for an Old Soul to not meet societal norms, to look and act mildly eccentric and to be teaching others, even when his own personal or material life isn't together. (...)

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Sorry for quoting so much! But all of this applies so very much to me! It feels more accurate than my own natal chart interpretations!;-) Thanks again for this link, BUENA 36.

Yours, Alvarella a stone-aged-old Soul!!!;-)

posted October 15, 2008 10:07 PM            

The terms ‘old soul’ and ‘young soul’ aren’t just descriptions of personality types but do give us a meaningful clue to why we find ourselves in this life cycle…

The journey of the soul through many lives is one of growth and learning; from the earliest manifestation of that soul in human form – where it’s focused on material things, power, ego and the “now”, eventually through to the higher levels of compassion, truth, destiny, caring and fairness in later lives as old souls.

The soul is required to visit human form many times in order to learn these lessons. It is through interaction with others on the three dimensional plane that the soul accrues karma, the results of its actions on others and paying the price of those actions ( first rule of karma “what goes around comes around” – or what I often refer to as the ‘karmic boomerang’) that develops, hones, and tunes the spirit into the higher levels, eventually becoming attuned to the highest level of as ‘old soul’ in later lives.

Part of that developing process is to become infinitely more empathic, attuned to the universe and destiny, and for our intuition to develop more towards psychic powers. At this stage we sense that destiny plays a greater part in our lives that we could previously have imagined as we ‘peek behind the scenes’ of the universal mechanisms through our developing intuition.

This itself is also a challenge as we watch those less enlightened who are still contained in the “I know best” mode, mess up their lives going wandering down the wrong path. Typical of this is the soulmate; where we are tasked to watch them wander off knowing somehow that the tests they will face will ultimately bring them back around, older, wiser and more spiritually aware.

It’s important to understand that each time our soul revisits the earthly plane, that we play ‘catch-up’, developing through our earthly actions and learning experiences quickly to regain that level of spiritual awareness we attained when leaving the previous life. In other words, in entering this life we are initially unconscious of the fact that we are required to have a very testing life to ‘fast track’ us to the spiritual level we are meant to be at in this one.

So; the older the soul, the harder and more testing the early events in order to make us reach inside and spiritually open; to regain previously achieved levels of spirituality and to further develop.. "

So yes Katatonic the soul is eternal.
The soul age I think applies more along the lines of how many times the soul has incarnated here on earth, and how successfully they were able to percieve what is right and wrong and make the right choice. Balancing out there Karma and along the way reaping the rewards of there refinement.

posted October 16, 2008 02:44 AM              

Thank you very much for nice comment.
Now I am curious am I old or young soul? My NN is in Gemini (I would like to be Gemini sign).

posted October 16, 2008 02:59 AM              

----If you are an old soul, does that mean you have incarnated here many times or does it mean your first incarnation was a long time ago? If you are an old soul and have been here many times, does that mean you are a slow learner? I don't feel like an old soul at all! I've had people tell me I am, but I feel very inexperienced. I don't think I wanted to incarnate here this time around. It really feels more like I was talked into coming here. I'm not real comfortable with the physicality of this life. For example, the whole food thing is such a big bother! I don't like going to the store and buying the food. Then I have to carry it from the car into the house and put it all away. Cooking is something that I really don't like to do and then I have to cleanup afterwards. And it doesn't end there! My body uses what it can (often complaining and getting gas) and then I have to go to the bathroom and get rid of the waste. What a big bother!------

raeanne, wherever you are, I am the same like you. About cooking I have the same opinion: why so much work with simple cooking? You can go to the restaurant and buy simple (not very expensive) food and eat it. That is reason I like salad more than any other food. I drink also milk (don't need to cook it)

posted October 17, 2008 02:07 AM            

But if that's the case, that shows that a Pisces SN strives towards a Virgo NN. If Pisces is more evolved than Virgo by virtue of being later in the zodiac, then why would Pisces need to develop by regressing? I really don't think a sign is more evolved than any other. They just have different functions.

To determine who's an old soul and who's a young one, I'm in favor of bypassing people's charts and talking to them instead.

Because isn't wisdom what we're all talking about when we're saying "old soul"? I don't think that's based on the number of incarnations. That would be like assuming old people are more wise than young people since they've been around for more years. Plenty of old people are idiots. Maybe some souls have been here a lot but keep getting held back a grade, have to keep repeating Mars square Pluto, for example.

posted October 17, 2008 02:41 PM            

quote:

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I got about half-way through.. its interesting.. and i definitely fit the criterea... but I'd like to know what authority you base this on, besides your own wish to be an old soul. I think we tend to interpret things in a way that is sympathetic to our own perspective and experience (see: Nietzsche and "Perspectivism").. we all find a way to glorify those qualities we find most prevalent in ourselves.. and we all diligently refine our point of view, whether we know it or not, to create a personal philosophy, so that we end up in our own little echo chamber, with an answer for everything, -- but the world we construct, though it may be fascinating and beautiful, often has little relation to the real world... I'm interested in knowing if there is a real authority which you base your philosophy upon.

Personally, I am inclined to believe that the truly old souls are the ones who have gotten down to business, so to speak, and are very busy practicing Transcendental Meditation, or Taoist Sex Magick, or Kriya Yoga, or Kung Fu, or Chi Gong, maybe somewhere in Japan, Nepal, or the Himalayas, or on Mount Athos in Greece. Maybe some of them are very busy doing nothing, sitting in a cave somewhere, allowing their bodies to be devoured by insects, and learning the true nature of impermanence, like Ramana Maharshi. I personally dont think they frequent the internet much, and I would bet that the melancholy apathy of pot-smoking, video-gaming suburbanites has little in common with the true detachment experienced by yogis and saints. But who knows? Life is strange.

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posted October 17, 2008 09:25 PM            

This is just something I've personally noticed, that might be relevant. People with a transpersonal sun sign (Sagittarius, Capricorn, Aquarius, Pisces) or alternatively lots of transpersonal planets - are more likely to venture on the dark side or at least pay attention to it.

The "older" the sign, the more likely they are to *not* be all love and light. Piscean men specifically make a point in their lives to do things that are not very morally acceptable - for what seems to me, to be like research (to understand that side of things, the 'bad' parts of being human)

They don't see the world in rules and they have little interest in morality - concepts such as right/wrong, black/white, good and evil.. Piscean men feel free to try out anything and usually go pretty deep down in places where most people wouldn't even think about venturing.

There are many things we are taught to be inherently "wrong", things that shouldn't be done. A 'young' soul, would be more likely to have a very simple idea of good/evil, such as "caring/nice people are good", "rapists are evil".

A Pisces man (and I know lots) will often take a number of socially/morally unacceptable actions in his life time. This is usually due to a desire to understand EVERY facet of human nature, of animal nature and of his own and other people's spiritual and psychological nature.

posted October 18, 2008 03:33 AM              

"Plenty of old people are idiots."

posted October 18, 2008 03:45 AM            

quote:

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What that means? Some proverb or what?

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Yes it is.

You might know it as:

"Age and idiosyncrasy go together like a horse and carriage"

Or

"The water of brain is always under the bridge of age"

Or

"when you chase two rabbits, you only catch the older one"

Sound more familiar?

posted October 18, 2008 03:53 AM              

Thank you for that. I collect all proverbs they mean something.

posted October 18, 2008 04:02 AM            

I was joking. They don't actually mean anything. It wasn't a proverb. Jane said: 'old people can be idiots' and Love was quoting her. I made those up.

sorry to confuse you - I said *kidding* at the end.

The *actual* sayings are:

1. Love and marriage go together like a horse and carriage.

2. It's water under the bridge (it means: it's in the past, it's over and done with)

posted October 18, 2008 04:56 AM            

Oh, probably not.

Thanks, CF. I like knowing your thoughts on subjects too. And in my mind, I picture you like Orlando Bloom. I don't know when it started, and I'm aware that you're a lovely young lady, but in my head you will probably remain as Orlando. Hope you don't mind.

Interesting post about the transpersonal signs being less "nice" in a formalistic way. I do think of the human experience as a way for the universe to know itself. So a transpersonal sign is more inclined to see themselves as a tool for that.

But I don't think the universe is amoral. The more connected someone feels with the whole, the more they'd realize that the harm they do to one they do to all. So although experiencing all the facets of human existence is part of growth, I think that experience would culminate in a soul choosing a loving attitude. I think at the end, we'd all be kind souls.

posted October 18, 2008 08:35 PM            

I'll start picturing you as Leonardo DiCaprio

quote:

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I don't think the universe is amoral. The more connected someone feels with the whole, the more they'd realize that the harm they do to one they do to all. So although experiencing all the facets of human existence is part of growth, I think that experience would culminate in a soul choosing a loving attitude. I think at the end, we'd all be kind souls.

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posted October 19, 2008 01:36 AM              

it's funny cuz my experiences of pisces men are like yours, coral frequency; pushing well past the limits in an apparent effort to transcend. i think you are right that there is a lack of judgement or moral code to this type of behaviour. it sort of seems like a stuckness *within* the piscean experience, and that there is a lack of objective perspective for the most part. they feel deeply and experience others' feelings as their own, but that doesn't necessarily indicate altruism. in fact it seems to push them to transcend these types of experiences even more, in ways that may harm others (or themselves).. i haven't known very many pisces women well enough to notice whether this is true of them. i attract a lot of pisces men into my life, though.

on the other hand, my experiences with pisces SNs (i am one too) is that we have this inherent sense of compassion and unshakable faith in the goodness and rightness of the universe. the order that mysteriously structures the seeming chaos. i am guessing it is because we've BEEN THERE and tested those piscean waters, pushed past all those limits, transcended mundaneness, and somehow were 'rewarded' (for lack of a better word) with a knowing that ultimately, everything is on track. i've known a LOT of pisces SNs and we're all very forgiving, spiritually oriented people. there is a vulnerability and spiritual pain that i think comes with compassion, but overall the pisces SNs i've known have been the most spiritually serene people i've ever known, which is a lot different than my experience of piscean sun men.

"Lately I've been wondering if our trines are the lessons we've already mastered, and our squares are what we have to learn this lifetime. If we get it right before we bite it, then in the next life our square is a trine and we get new squares to learn."

wow, jane, i've wondered this too. and that maybe the trines are the lessons we've learned but now can teach and bring into the world.

posted October 19, 2008 01:24 PM            

quote:

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"I once read that the more retrograde planets you have in your chart, the older your soul is"

"young soul has many planets in the sign of Cancer and Leo"

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I know astrology has multifaceted inner tensions, and you must take the chart as a whole, but I'm curious about my best friend's chart: she has five retrograde planets, but her True Node is in Aries (square her Moon to the exact degree) and she has three planets in Cancer and Leo.

posted October 19, 2008 04:17 PM            

Because I'm not an old soul, even though I wish I was, if the Nodes are an indicator, I suppose Cancer NN is an indicator because that's mine. I don't mean to offend those with Cancer NN. I've also got quite powerful Cancer influences. I have very strong Scorpio influences also.

posted October 20, 2008 12:10 AM            

quote:

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Or am I Orlando dressed as a priest?

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It's like you can read my mind. If you ever want to whisper some hot fire and brimstone, I'm all ears.

Leonardo? Good choice. I do have my Moon in DiCaprio, after all. I hope you and I get a chance to work together someday.

I've noticed that too, about the transpersonal signs and those with "personalized" transpersonal planets being less bounded and more open to experiencing all sides of themselves. I think those signs and planets help people mature past dualistic terms like right and wrong, light and dark. That expansion is a function of transpersonal signs/planets.