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Author Topic:   @graham huber lifeclock and age point
vansio
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posted September 27, 2020 11:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting... following step-by-step Age Points and my personal history... AP will conjunct my natal Pluto a few days before my next birthday (28th year). However, in Koch, Pluto is in what becomes an intercepted 5th House. 😯 I’d like to know more about this pending conjunction if you can help, Graham.

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Graham
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posted September 28, 2020 02:03 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

quote:
I’d like to know more about the pending conjunction of my Age Point to natal Pluto.

In your Huber Style chart - natal Pluto is intercepted in a house which is some 40 degrees wide, and has its low-energy-point just 2 degrees behind that planet. ... So, I'd expect the conjunction to create a (subjective) feeling about the inability of your Pluto qualities to be seen/heard/noticed by others - albeit not in a (psychologically) "crippling" way, since the aspect is wide and separating.

When the Age Point hits natal Pluto you will be impelled to address this Pluto issue ... possibly due to being prompted by an external event, but perhaps only by a subjective "urge from within" to do so.

For you, this is a significant Age Point progression because - in Huber - planets are weakest (by sign) when located at 0-3 degrees or 27-30 degrees ... and (in your non-Huber progressions) Pluto avoided going there in this lifetime, by turning retrograde at age 8. ... So, the issue of nature/signs vs nurture/houses may need to be considered by you at that time.

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vansio
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posted September 28, 2020 02:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted September 28, 2020 05:25 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

Give me a day or so to reflect upon the most helpful way to respond to (or walk through) this, vansio.

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vansio
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posted September 28, 2020 05:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ok 🤍

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Graham
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posted September 29, 2020 12:18 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I still have not figured out the "best" way to attempt to walk you through this, vansio. ... So let's try using the British stiff-upper-lip approach (of "keep calm, and keep moving").

The astrofocus.co.uk image posted below shows the five layers that all Huber charts consist of ... centre circle : aspect circle : planets circle : signs circle : houses circle.

The Lifeclock hand (not shown) is pinned at the centre circle, extends across all the other 4 layers and has its pointer in the houses circle. ... This point is the Age Point, which moves around the houses circle in a clockwise direction, and at a rate of 6 years per house. (So, the larger the house the faster it moves - and the less time it spends in aspect to planets/NN within the house.)

And the first thing we need to note is that the Age Point is influenced by the intensity curve of each house, as it moves through it ... high-energy-point at the cusp : balanced-energy point 2years 3months 15 days (856 days) later : low-energy-point 3 years 8months 15days (1354 days) after passing the cusp. ... And your natal Scorpio Pluto is at the low-energy-point of the 5th house, which is 39degs 56mins in size.

In practice though, the Age Point movement/progression towards each house cusp begins at the low-energy-point of the previous house. ... So, the conjunction of the progressed Age Point with your natal Pluto is signalling a change of focus from 5th house interests to 6th house interests. ... So, sure enough, you now observe/state that "I have nothing left to lose except my health" - the greatest gift that natal Pluto has bestowed upon you (via psychologically-inclined Scorpio, and the 5th house of self-expression/creativity).

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Graham
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posted September 29, 2020 03:55 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
So ... now that we know what the Age Point conjunction to Pluto is highlighting ... we look at the 3 natal charts (radical, houses, nodes) to ascertain the issue(s) involved.

For example ... what do you think the Dynamical Evaluation table means by "cut down" cardinal, air and water?

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vansio
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posted September 29, 2020 04:13 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted September 29, 2020 10:42 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Originally posted by vans :-

quote:
the Huber drawing is groovy ~ if I were your granddaughter (lol bc youre Astro-grandpa G.) I’d build you a tiered serving tray exactly designed as such. Wouldn’t that be fabulous?

I've never noticed that ... but afternoon tea Huber Style would be a nice way to talk someone through the roles of the 5 chart layers.

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Graham
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posted September 29, 2020 11:19 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vansio:
question / rhetoric : “cut down [by environment]” of Libra and Cancer? ... what does ‘unwanted‘ imply ... a form of external denial, or the contrary? how does incompatibility apply? ... why do Houses precede Signs in Elements/Behavior crossevaluted by Motivation? ... over-encompassed by precedence?

“Huber's conclusion that sign placements show the chart-owner's instinctive/natural way of behaving and the house placements reveal the extent to which the people with whom he/she interacts will attempt to change that natural behaviour. ... So, this table attempts to quantify the potential stress that the chart-owner will experience from his/her "nature vs nurture" conflict in the current lifetime.”

If the calculated house number is within a healthy range, what’s the issue—how might it be negated?

answer / evaluation : ideological Instinct-initiative of strength by sensitivity/care and relation/harmony, considering the signs themselves. extraordinary for lack of better word, enough to cause stress, though the extent isolated, a neglect or needlessness for it—in cardinal terms, discouraged. imagination, will, cooperation is not minimized or fixed, rather internalized and dynamic.

correct me if I’m wrong in figuring how to interpret the objective data ... I don’t usually prescribe a typecast identity neither associate with any one sign - though seeing libra and cancer undercut makes sense, to love and feel. much affectionate and emotional than meets the average eye / circumstance

my closest, dearest friend is a Libra Sun Cancer Moon Scorpio Rising so abundance isn’t forsaken

ps the Huber drawing is groovy ~ if I were your granddaughter (lol bc youre Astro-grandpa G.) I’d build you a tiered serving tray exactly designed as such. Wouldn’t that be fabulous?


Did you remember to use only Koch Houses for Huber charts? And can you see why mutable and Fire are not listed as "build-up"? (I think they should be, since both fall outside the healthy-pressure range extremes of +5 and +25.)

The differences with a minus score (cardinal, air, water) indicate qualities that you have more of than is required by those with whom you interact. ... The differences with an outside-the-healthy-pressure-range plus score (fixed and fire) are qualities that others want more of than you are (by nature) able to comfortably give.

Both the positive and negative (outside-the-range) difference scores create stress that is (potentially) unhealthy ... so, some kind of coping strategy (or a reduction of the outside pressures) is required in order to be/remain psychologically healthy.

However, the stress created by the positive scores is different to that created by the negative scores ... because being required to deliver more than you are naturally equipped to creates a different kind of stress than does being naturally equipped to deliver more than you are required to.

So ... what are your current coping strategies for handling the excess stress created by your positive and negative difference scores? ... And can you see why natal Pluto is placed where it can wave a red flag as your Age Point is about to progress through the mutable-fire sign of Sagittarius?

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vansio
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posted September 29, 2020 11:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted September 29, 2020 11:53 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Have you compared the pattern changes in the aspect circles of the radix and houses chart?

What do you think is happening there with Pluto-Venus? ... And the shrinking of the Aries-Libra signs?

Note added on 30th September 2020 ... I see Pluto (in the houses chart) is making a RECORDER configuration with Venus-Sun-Uranus+Mars ... and Jupiter is adding to that, by making a STIMULATION triangle with Venus-Pluto.

This is a big change from Pluto's contacts in the Radix, where it makes only a small learning triangle with Moon-Sun+Saturn

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Graham
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posted October 02, 2020 04:04 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Deleted by Graham.

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vansio
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posted October 02, 2020 05:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted October 02, 2020 11:07 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vansio:
Hi graham, an update, I’m busy (with immigration business) at the moment and want to continue this thread with full attention when I have more ample time to work abstractly alongside you in the Huber learning curve. it’s technicality is new to me and will require I study each question you provide

please don’t mistake my scattered availability for disinterest in your future help. the contrary, I pause this inquiry for reasons of divided attention to potential sloppiness (on my end) in contribution; respect for your time


because this is AP point is four months away, keeping it in mind and will dutifully return when coherent


Ok, vansio. ... Bump this thread when you are ready, as I check the Personal Readings board board regularly.

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vansio
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posted November 01, 2020 10:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
“ Have you compared the pattern changes in the aspect circles of the radix and houses chart?”

oh that’s an interesting squeeze... I hadn’t looked at the huber “house” chart until now, only the huber “style”, previously.

the Venus-pluto aspect doesn’t show up on the table, green line implies out-of-orb quincunx or?

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Graham
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posted November 02, 2020 04:00 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vansio:
“ Have you compared the pattern changes in the aspect circles of the radix and houses chart?”

oh that’s an interesting squeeze... I hadn’t looked at the huber “house” chart until now, only the huber “style”, previously.

the Venus-pluto aspect doesn’t show up on the table, green line implies out-of-orb quincunx or?


In the radix, Venus is involved only in the (incomplete) Tsquare with Mars and Jupiter. ... In the house chart, Venus loses that connection/aspect to Mars (but retains the opposition to Jupiter) - and now connects to Sun + Uranus/Neptune + Pluto.

So ... if the house chart = "nurturing" from the environment (to change your natural/instinctive/habitual/past-lives/karma-driven behaviour) ... what do you think those changes might be?

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vansio
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posted November 02, 2020 04:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted November 02, 2020 04:26 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vansio:
“ Have you compared the pattern changes in the aspect circles of the radix and houses chart?”

oh that’s an interesting squeeze... I hadn’t looked at the huber “house” chart until now, only the huber “style”, previously.

the Venus-pluto aspect doesn’t show up on the table, green line implies out-of-orb quincunx or?


Note that, in the House chart, Venus is now part of a configuration made up of a Stage figure and a Developing Talent Triangle. ... The stage consists of Sun-Venus-Jupiter-Pluto, and the triangle of Sun-Uranus/Neptune-Pluto.

Moreover, that configuration is driven/fuelled by the Venus-Jupiter-Uranus/Neptune Tsquare (aka Effort Triangle).

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vansio
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posted November 02, 2020 04:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
"So, for example, Stage, an opposition with a nested semi-sextile, trine and semi-sextile, also has two inconjuncts, formed by the semi-sextiles.
Continuing with Stage as an example, here is its complete delineation:

The Stage contains two green quincunxes crisscrossing inside like struts. This quadrilateral has fixed motivation but with four green aspects there is considerable flexibility within. Green aspects form two sides and there are green aspects inside. This is where the bulk of thinking, searching, doubting, questioning, sensitivity and awareness will take place. With theatrical connotations, the Stage is a base from which the individual can perform, and is the platform from which they can learn, understand and connect with others, using the green aspects to pick up all manner of messages and clues about human interaction and behavior, with the blue aspect storing this information. In Aspect Pattern Astrology the Hubers say that people with this pattern "try to take away differences and to create a unified picture."

The Stage is a relatively rare figure which can act like a bridge that connects opposing sides and viewpoints. It spans the chart and has the ability to resolve the opposition which it contains."
http://www.astroamerica.com/huber.html

The Hubers, in Aspect Pattern Astrology, say "The apex of the triangle is always a kind of goal direction". Recorder is described by the Hubers in "Aspect Pattern Astrology" as functioning which "stores, among other things, feelings, situations and destinies, and can replay them in such a way that one imagines they are there."

<<And can you see why natal Pluto is placed where it can wave a red flag as your Age Point is about to progress through the mutable-fire sign of Sagittarius?>>

erm not following. i am treading to understanding

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Graham
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posted November 02, 2020 12:50 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by vansio:
"So, for example, Stage, an opposition with a nested semi-sextile, trine and semi-sextile, also has two inconjuncts, formed by the semi-sextiles.
Continuing with Stage as an example, here is its complete delineation:

The Stage contains two green quincunxes crisscrossing inside like struts. This quadrilateral has fixed motivation but with four green aspects there is considerable flexibility within. Green aspects form two sides and there are green aspects inside. This is where the bulk of thinking, searching, doubting, questioning, sensitivity and awareness will take place. With theatrical connotations, the Stage is a base from which the individual can perform, and is the platform from which they can learn, understand and connect with others, using the green aspects to pick up all manner of messages and clues about human interaction and behavior, with the blue aspect storing this information. In Aspect Pattern Astrology the Hubers say that people with this pattern "try to take away differences and to create a unified picture."

The Stage is a relatively rare figure which can act like a bridge that connects opposing sides and viewpoints. It spans the chart and has the ability to resolve the opposition which it contains."
http://www.astroamerica.com/huber.html

The Hubers, in Aspect Pattern Astrology, say "The apex of the triangle is always a kind of goal direction". Recorder is described by the Hubers in "Aspect Pattern Astrology" as functioning which "stores, among other things, feelings, situations and destinies, and can replay them in such a way that one imagines they are there."

<<And can you see why natal Pluto is placed where it can wave a red flag as your Age Point is about to progress through the mutable-fire sign of Sagittarius?>>

erm not following. i am treading to understanding


1) Can you see why natal Pluto is placed where it can wave a red flag as your Age Point is about to progress through the mutable-fire sign of Sagittarius?

In addition to what needs to be "cut down" ... the Astrodiest Dynamical Evaluation Table should (but does not) show what you need to "build up".

The houses/environment perceive your Sagittarius qualities as needing to be built up - because mutable = +4 and Fire = +30. ... So, Pluto is flagging up that (as the Age Point passes through Sagittarius) you will experience events/pressures that are intended to "transform" you.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

2) "The Stage contains two green quincunxes crisscrossing inside like struts. This quadrilateral has fixed motivation but with four green aspects there is considerable flexibility within. Green aspects form two sides and there are green aspects inside. This is where the bulk of thinking, searching, doubting, questioning, sensitivity and awareness will take place. With theatrical connotations, the Stage is a base from which the individual can perform, and is the platform from which they can learn, understand and connect with others, using the green aspects to pick up all manner of messages and clues about human interaction and behavior, with the blue aspect storing this information. In Aspect Pattern Astrology the Hubers say that people with this pattern "try to take away differences and to create a unified picture."

The Stage is a relatively rare figure which can act like a bridge that connects opposing sides and viewpoints. It spans the chart and has the ability to resolve the opposition which it contains."

And the Hubers also state that "there are two conflicting questions cropping up again and again, that call for renewed searching. For every problem, the more sophisticated the powers of discrimination or distinction, the more solutions the person finds. This enables all problems to be solved with time".

So ... those with this configuration are adept at problem solving. ... And, in your case, this ability is enhanced by the addition of the triangle-of-developing-talents.

However, what we need to consider/focus upon is "why is this configuration in the houses chart but not in the radix?" ... And the answer is "because (nurturing)/the environment is creating events/pressures that will develop this ability (which you were not born with)".
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

3) "The apex of the triangle is always a kind of goal direction". ...The Recorder"stores, among other things, feelings, situations and destinies, and can replay them in such a way that one imagines they are there."

The recorder in your houses chart consists of Venus-Sun-Uranus+Neptune-Pluto ... (rather than Uranus+Mars, as I stated previously).

Again though, what is relevant here is that it is an ability which comes through nurturing (rather than nature).

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Graham
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posted November 03, 2020 01:16 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bump

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vansio
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posted November 24, 2020 02:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Graham
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posted November 24, 2020 11:18 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

For now ... focus only upon the fact that the conjunction of the Age Point with Pluto (on 15th Feb 2021) is highlighting the upcoming passage of the Age Point through the sign of Sagittarius (from 20th October 2021 to 6th Dec 2027).

In the Dynamical Evaluation Table ... the difference scores show +30 for Fire and +4 for Mutable ... So +34 for Mutable-Fire (i.e.. Sagittarius and the 9th house).

A +score difference tell us that events (nurture/shaping-by-our-environment) will demand more of you than you are (by nature) able to comfortably provide. ... So, when the Age Point passes through the sign of Sagittarius, this will be a very stressful time for you - as will the period from Age 48 to 54, when the Age Point passes through your 9th house.

Thus ... the 15th February 2021 conjunction of the Age Point with Pluto is saying let's NOW get ready to rumble - intensely, and for some 74 months.


[To illustrate ... I have a +17 Cardinal and +10 Earth score, so +27 Cardinal-Earth. ... My Age Point passed through Capricorn from 25th November 1966 to 2nd June 1972. ... I started my first job on 7th August 1967 and was formally accepted as a member of my profession in May 1973. ... However, when starting work as a very physically active 19 year old, the prospect of a career as an accountant absolutely horrified me - and I spent the first two years trying to find a job that would not tie me to a desk/office every day.]

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vansio
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posted November 25, 2020 12:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for vansio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ah ok.

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