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Author Topic:   Alcoholism
placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 15, 2020 07:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hey guys,

So, alcoholism runs in my family. My grandfather was an alcoholic and my sister just admitted to having a problem. I was was wondering if there is any indication of this in her natal chart. I will try and post it in a comment. So yeah, to clarify, I’m wondering what planets, houses, and aspects may indicate alcoholism in general and, specifically, if any apply to my sister.

Thank you for reading,

Placidus flamingo

Ps I have bacchus conjunct Venus in the 12th... I already try to be cautious given the family history, but how troublesome does this sound?

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 15, 2020 08:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
https://app.photobucket.com/u/placidus_flamingo/p/65367113-c92b-4d72-9ef4-cb8fa7b2bb80

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Graham
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From:
Registered: Apr 2019

posted December 17, 2020 01:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by placidus_flamingo:
https://app.photobucket.com/u/placidus_flamingo/p/65367113-c92b-4d72-9ef4-cb8fa7b2bb80

I was unable to bring up the chart from this link. ... Perhaps because I do not have a photobucket account, so could not sign in to the site.

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 01:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
[IMG] https://app.photobucket.com/u/placidus_flamingo/p/65367113-c92b-4d72-9ef4-cb8fa7b2bb80
[/IMG]

Is that any better?

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 01:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
[IMG]https://app.photobucket.com/u/placidus_flamingo/p/65367113-c92b-4d72-9ef4-cb8fa7b2bb80[/IMG]

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 01:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
[IMG]https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/i/placidus_flamingo/1BAEEF64_2D6F_40EF_A76B_97FE5E0FB8A2.png?width=450&height=278&fit=bounds&crop=fill[/IMG]

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 01:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is ridiculous. I followed the instructions of how to upload. Why is this so hard? Why can't I just upload an image?

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 01:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If someone can tell me how to upload an image I'll try again. I thought that my problem was trying to upload on my cell phone, but I just got on my computer and still can't get it to work.

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Amoranthaniela
Knowflake

Posts: 47
From: europe
Registered: Dec 2020

posted December 17, 2020 09:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Amoranthaniela     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Use Imgur instead of photobucket.
It's more stable.

As for alcoholism in general, it's a Neptunian thing and also Pisces-Virgo axis related. Other things can play parts but those are the main culprits.

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted December 17, 2020 10:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
* Always remove the 's' from http.
That includes any urls/links you leave at LL. The 's' is needed if you're a website that deals with 'money-exchange'. This is not a sophisticated site, and there is no exchange. Remove the 's' and your link is 'clickable' from the post.

* Don't leave a 'space' after *img* or before */img*.

Photobucket sucks here. Hard to read past the grey-shadow 'brand' they stick over a portion of the charts. Can't make hardcopy of it to study.

We had a member lose more than a decade's worth of hard work because she wasn't able to 'afford' the over $500(?) ransom they suddenly charged her to access her work. She didn't get the time she needed to remove and save it. She lost EVERYTHING because of Photobucket. {Lexxigramer }
Evil Capitalists!!

Using a different image host site, works.

(There are some hosting sites that block our ability to make hardcopy or e-copy for later-studying and writing notes. I haven't determined which one it is yet. I don't respond to those charts.. I'd need TWO computer screens to do work.)

Graham has his own software, and a way to capture chartdata from 'just' a chart wheel. He's a good person that helps folks here.

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 12:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the advice

[IMG]http://imgur.com/gallery/dBqOlld[/IMG]

I still can’t get it to work though can anyone open this link?

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted December 17, 2020 12:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by placidus_flamingo:

[IMG[URL=http://imgur.com/gallery/
dBqOlld


Says Zoink!!

Trying something else.
Okay, this works.

- http://imgur.com/gallery/dBqOlld

ADD
This is your Sister's Chart, not your own.
Chart is drawn with the 'Equal' House system

Try again
(Note, it COULD appear-itself later on in the day. I've seen that happen with the tiny-window appearing instead of full chart.)


At least, the url is clickable, if the *img* doesn't produce a chart.

____________
I see that the Advertisements for LL Banner above has the tiny-window rather than full add.

Just wait. Chart might appear later on.

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 08:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
[IMG]http://imgur.com/a/7g35ggE.jpg[\IMG]

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 08:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted December 17, 2020 08:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mirage29:
* Always remove the 's' from http.
That includes any urls/links you leave at LL. The 's' is needed if you're a website that deals with 'money-exchange'. This is not a sophisticated site, and there is no exchange. Remove the 's' and your link is 'clickable' from the post.

* Don't leave a 'space' after *img* or before */img*.

Photobucket sucks here. Hard to read past the grey-shadow 'brand' they stick over a portion of the charts. Can't make hardcopy of it to study.

We had a member lose more than a decade's worth of hard work because she wasn't able to 'afford' the over $500(?) ransom they suddenly charged her to access her work. She didn't get the time she needed to remove and save it. She lost EVERYTHING because of Photobucket. {Lexxigramer }
Evil Capitalists!!

Using a different image host site, works.

(There are some hosting sites that block our ability to make hardcopy or e-copy for later-studying and writing notes. I haven't determined which one it is yet. I don't respond to those charts.. I'd need TWO computer screens to do work.)

Graham has his own software, and a way to capture chartdata from 'just' a chart wheel. He's a good person that helps folks here.


OMG photobucket sounds awful! And it's ironic, bc i only made the account so i could post here. I just tried two more times with imgur. I'm gonna wait a few and check. Thanks for the responses and I'm sorry for my frustration-- it's been a rough couple of days.

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted December 17, 2020 09:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No problem Placidus_flamingo!

People can always 'click the link' and see the chart you posted at IMGUR.

When you see the LL Banner Ads appear at top of page, then your *IMG* code should work?
(fingers-crossed)

People will be responding.
We have some good astrologers here.

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Randall
Webmaster

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From: Your Friendly Neighborhood Juris Doctorate.
Registered: Apr 2009

posted December 24, 2020 05:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bump!

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Randall
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posted January 02, 2021 05:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bump!

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted January 21, 2021 10:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
sister's chart--- let's see if it will let me post now

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted January 21, 2021 04:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Placidus_flamingo..
Happy Birthday!!!
{Sun is 1+ Aquarius}

_______
for ref: adding link to your natal chart
- http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum11/HTML/026300.html
_______

I don't think those asteroids are connected enough for them to be used for the purpose of determining alcoholism.

There's a book I have {ref below}.
They mention having had more clients with LIBRA Ascendants, (or a strong Libran energies) coming into their office for help around problems dealing with addictions-- drugs, drinking, and nicotine.

What I think I see with her is an incredibly intelligent person, with a lot of personal magnetism. She probably finds herself in positions of 'helping others'. She has a lot of sensing-ability . Could be a 'work'-aholic-- and perfectionist. An Idealist.

A lot of 'mercury' .. Gemini, Virgo.
Aries Moon ON the Descendant.

Not going into super-details here--
but what I'd see is a person that can get into a lot of 'nervous' tense energies.
She's brilliant!?

She can get irritable.

Can be an encouraging and supportive partner.. and would be especially devoted in the creative development OF her partner.
Capacity to work with others and have creative accomplishments.

Look at the aspect grid.
Sun through Mars --
all the red SQUARES, plus!
semi-squares and sesquiquadrates 135deg?
Tension tension tension in the background for her all the time. Part of the 'tone' she's had throughout her life.

Mars square Uranus-Neptune
{Moon squares are weaker}
Jupiter Virgo sesqui Neptune

There's a lot of 'tension' with her ..
The 'tension' could be a reason for drinking, but I don't know about alcoholism.
Some people can drink {e.g. wine or a beer every day coming home from work} and NOT be alcoholics.
Others can be that with just one.

Would be a Medical condition to react with alcohol in a way that drives alcoholism?
Pluto, Neptune strong transits or progressions might tell you more?
Neptune to Moon transits/prog too??? {guess}

She has Neptune square Moon.. but that's a weaker aspect as it is a separating square.

Years ago, I watched daily astrology vids by Jeff Jawer {RIP} and Rick Levine. I remember them describing the tension underlying semi-squares, sesquisquares, and quincunxes.

SEMI-SQUARE 35deg : stress-and-alert state
felt 'just before' an action begins.
e.g. runners at the start-line, poised and waiting to 'hear' the shot to GO.
The drawn-aspect in grid resembles a runner's block they place their feet on, ready to push-off when the shot is heard.


SESQUIQUADRATE 135deg : stress-and-alert state,
'while' action is going on.
e.g. while driving, you see a street light start to change, about to turn RED. That anxiety felt.

Powerful person.

What field does she work in?
What's her position?

Does it have to do with Social issues?

I had seen the chart and worked on it the week before Christmas. I kept thinking of her and how she did over Christmas?

Has stress and confrontation transits! yep
Her MARS was under siege with that LONG retrograde cycle we had last year 2020.

I see you have an Astrodienst account.
You could help her by looking at her chart.
Go to Free Horoscopes.
Go to Short Reports
Find Short Report Forecasts.

Read the influences in her life.
Let her know.
{Tell her about www.astro.com
and she can read and follow it for herself.}

Cool Person!!
Love my Gemmies.

ref Julia and Derek Parker c1991
Parkers Astrology.
Dorling Kindersley Inc. UK NY

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted January 21, 2021 05:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well she was in rehab, so not doing well, but getting help, which is what matters.

Thank you so much for your detailed response. I will check out that book. I hadn't noticed her rising, but she acts very much like a libra ascendant (or at least how I imagine them to act)--- puts a lot of effort into her looks, very attractive, concerned about how she's perceived.

She's getting her psy d-- which is a phd in psychology with an emphasis on clinical work. so I'd say yes, definitely related to social issues. she is brilliant--- this field is made for her, once she gets her demons under control. She is definitely a people person, very charming. But also irritable and prone to nerves. Tension is a good word for it--- she had severe separation anxiety as a kid.

She doesn't believe in astrology at all, but thanks for the tip re: Short Reports. I'm gonna read hers and then give her some "general advice."

Honestly, I can't help thinking that it should have been me. I'm the one who worked in this industry while she was helping others with rehab. I'm the one with bacchus exactly conjunct my venus in the 12th (link to chart below). I'm the one who has issues with moderation in general. Anyway, thank you for your insights, I'll save the self flagellation for my therapist.
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum11/HTML/026300.html

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted January 23, 2021 03:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi. Thanks for your response.

(Oh my.) I didn't realize her problem was of that severity.

Alcoholism is in your 'family'? ..
(so sorry..)

I have had experiences with people who had that personally, or, in their family--- Is a really "self-destructive" disease that affects MANY other lives than *just them*.

I LIVED with a sadistic mean drunk for 7 years of my early life (late teens, early 20s). I was in college (at first to become a Social Worker, then eventually an MSW). I changed my mind after being exposed to Experimental (Research) Psychology, from a course I took in "History and Systems of Psychology {text: Edwin G. Boring}."
She happened to work in the psychology field.
I rented a room.
With the 'instincts' {and training} she had, she knew how to 'tear me apart' emotionally.. She would be sooo cruel. Leave me in a heap, on the floor. She would 'accuse' me of the most awful UNTRUE things,,, While I would be in the state of a broken human being, her face would break out with a sly smirk
.. She was "pleased".
She had accomplished her HARM, and in her gut it "pleased" her to see me demolished in front of her eyes.
I was trying my best to get-through college.
Drank EVERY day, until passed-out.
She would become suicidal, owned a rifle
. ..
One evening, a coworker-friend offered me a ride home. {I worked part-time, student full-time}.
My friend came in the townhouse she owned.
She was passed-out on the sofa.
..
We went into the tiny eating area off the kitchen, had a snack while listening to the new 'Moody Blues' album he had purchased. {Knights in White Satin}
She woke up. Went upstairs. Got her rifle. Came down to where we were, and threatened to shoot ME.
He was VERY concerned and did NOT want to leave me there with her-- but I shooed him away very quickly saying I could 'handle this' just LEAVE immediately.
. .
In the mean time, some of the friends I had in a weekly A Search For God Edgar Cayce study/meditation group I had attended faithfully for several years, 'figured out' something was 'wrong' with my situation {without me having spoken a single word to them about it}. They knew my roommate from the past, from a job-place she worked.
. .
(Right now I could cry.. oh my.)
One of those ladies in the EC group, .. just 'knew' -- and she was going to act on it.
{She was my very own fantastic authentic older Jewish friend.} ..
She "arranged" a VERY very CLEVER way for me to 'escape' that situation.
Don't know what I would have done-- my life was in peril.
She very subtly {while being friendly to 'her'}, arranged for an out'of'state trip to a conference with me-- and had already arranged it to be 'a move' for me. She knew people, and had hooked me up with a job already.

This alcoholic woman roommate was an Aries Sun (April 6).
{Transiting Chiron is on her Sun right now.}

ALCOHOLISM
Placidus, did you know that you can have an 'alcoholic personality' WITHOUT drinking a drop? Yep. They go on 'dry drunks'.

My first husband's father had been a severe alcoholic-- in and out of hospitals/rehabs. Got cirrhosis of liver.
Ex-Husband turned out to have a kind of 'gambling' problem, and, a criminal background I hadn't been aware of-- never thought to do a background check on someone I loved, automatically trusted and was going to marry.

The Aries woman.. was experiencing the 'shakes' every morning she woke up. Had delirium tremens. Took Valium to control her shakes. Her lips were caked with brown scabby crusts from drinking. She'd pick at those scabs. It would amaze me that she could get herself together and go to a very responsible job, , , and get away with it?

When I looked into how to help her?, I found out about the "Games" that alcoholics play, and the {unconscious} "Games" that the people in their lives cooperate and play into. Read some books. I had worked FOR someone who recommended them. It was shocking and revealing. I had gotten SUCKED IN to it.

Later in life, had a coworker-- one of the men on my dispatch team-- who would show up every morning with alcohol on his breath. He said he NEEDED the drink to stop his shaking and to be 'normal'. .. Worked that way for him, but, customers complained from how badly he reeked of alcohol.
.. Our boss sent him to rehab, then had to let him go.
I remember the amount of 'emotional currency' these TOOK from others' lives.

I was sitting by a lake a decade ago. Just contemplating things. Some guy came to sit by me. Struck up a conversation. "Complained" he couldn't drive his car because the Police took-away his license for Drunk Driving.
. .
When he 'said' that to me, it felt like HE was trying to get me to 'feel sorry for him'!
I turned to him. I said-- Do you realize you could have KILLED SOMEBODY???? D.U.I. YOU want ME to feel sorry for YOU?.. The Police did YOU a FAVOR.

I've been to AA Meetings. They also have groups for partners and family OF alcoholics.
AA Meetings I observed seemed more like "bragging" sessions and competitions, than any sort of mutual therapy.
No remorse.
That is the WRONG USE of those valuable tools.

__
So Placius_flamingo.

Don't you for ONE second 'think' that SHE is more important than YOU are!!

From what it 'felt' like, from what you wrote--
sounds like she's got the "attention" of the whole family?? Everything circled around HER? ..

Even her going for the PsyD.
Actually, that experience being an "in-patient" in psych-ward for alcohol, drugs, will ADD to her Education and Counseling Skills.
This will work out FOR her.
Like you say... she needs to MASTER herself.
Gain control of her demons.

She's got a loaded 8th.
You have loaded 12th.

I've barely begun studies of Vedic astrology.
One of the things that captured me, was their interpretation of presence of 12th House planets.
You say other members of your family have alcoholism?

The vedics say that the 12th belongs to the karma of your ancestors, AND the family.

With those planets, it may be possible that you have an ability to STOP the energy of what's been happening.

If you want to--
Read the contents of this Vedic astrology thread.
- http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum38/HTML/000306.html
Listen to the vids.

Consider it 'energetically' (if it resonates with you, otherwise, it's okay to-not} as a way to view your 12th H energies?
Whether it applies to you in YOUR Vedic Chart,
CERTAINLY, I would imagine this being a 'help' to you, as you must 'deal' with this as a "family disease."

You talked about Bacchus and Dionysus being important in YOUR chart? .. Those two asteroids pertain to 'more' than wine, etc. They pertain to a drunken state? .. Can also be applied spiritually BTW.

If you would feel moved to it-- review that Vedic discussion on Dodecatemoria/ Dvadashamsha. Apply it WITH the thoughts of what those asteroids stand for.

YOU could be able to "break the cycle"...
simply by being 'who you are'. Knowing you have VALUE. Spiritually 'you' can give the needed medicinal answers TO your family-line. Do it 'through the soul'. .. YOU are the one with the 12th House placements... those are "of" the Neptunian Realms. You agreed this lifetime TO this responsibility. The 12th Houser is born here to Serve. Same as 6th House. That axis accepted a special mission in life.

Chiron in your 6th House .. with Kaali.

Chiron IN the 6th, according to Barbara Hand Clow, Chiron Rainbow Bridge author, is the mark of a Healer, Placidus. YOU have that imprinted into your chart.. to HAVE that ability to Heal. .. Kaali's energies are like what the Seasons do. In the Fall, the leaves change, and drop to the earth, to rot, and become NEW ground. .. Kaali was ALSO a Fierce PROTECTOR of her Partner-- She is about Sacred Outrage. She laid down in front of Shiva, as an act of Protection.

6th / 12th axis!

Maybe you feel overlooked?
The 'drama' encircles your sister, and her work and affairs?

Quiet 'Humility' .. is a STRENGTH.

Release.
LET your sister do and be who and what she will.

That doesn't make YOU a "lesser" person..
You will be Wiser.. watching and learning.

So. In your work and field,
What are you doing with it now?
What are your plans?

MUCH LOVE to you!!
Happy Birthday.

____________________________________

- http://www.amazon.com/Games-Alcoholics-Claude-Steiner-Ph-D/dp/0345323831

Games Alchoholics Play, Eric Berne
- http://www.ericberne.com/games-people-play/alcoholic/

____________________________________

And thank you for this thread.
I learned some important things.

BTW.. There's a person with 8th House Gem Sun and a 6th House Aries Moon .. who is IN the counseling field. Has been for 43 years. She does therapy USING the astrology chart.

Jung used astrology charts.
Said it could cut 6 months off the therapy bill. LOL
Get TO the point!, right?

The story of Patch Adams was put into a movie, starring Robin Williams as Patch.

- http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Adams,_Patch

FROM Patch Adams, 1998
* "Group Therapy"
[2:11] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk9mR3zjrkk

* "I Want to Help People"
[1:30] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKl8s0EO5T4

quote .. google search
* Patch Adams/Film synopsis
After struggling with depression in a mental hospital,
Hunter "Patch" Adams (Robin Williams)
decides he wants to become a doctor.
He enrolls at Virginia Medical University but is disillusioned by the school's clinical perspective on patient care.
With the aid of a wealthy friend, Adams opens his own medical clinic for those without insurance.
He forms a deep bond with fellow medical student Carin Fisher (Monica Potter) before a tragedy causes Adams to re-evaluate his approach.

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GalacticCoreExplosion
unregistered
posted January 23, 2021 04:59 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Very odd, two of my posts completely disappeared.

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mirage29
Knowflake

Posts: 14337
From: us
Registered: May 2012

posted January 23, 2021 05:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I only saw one of them, GalacticCE. Was long. Scanned through it.

Noticed it takes a LONG time in buffering-zone {whirly-twirl circles and circles, or 'blank' LL page} right after submitting post edit.

MS-Edge has sent Dell computers MORE upgrades to the software . I had my first opened-tabs this morning suddenly crash. When I started over again, the 'changes' appeared-- and they thought I'd love it?? {New feature that puts 'tabs' to sleep if you haven't looked within a certain amount of time.-- Immediately I shut it off in the Settings.}

They keep tweaking their update-changes TOO much.

And Mercury Retrograde in Aquarius is coming on January 30th {saturday} until Direct around Sat/Sund Feb20/21st.

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placidus_flamingo
Knowflake

Posts: 67
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2020

posted January 23, 2021 05:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for placidus_flamingo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosion:
Very odd, two of my posts completely disappeared.

Oh no! I hope they turn up. I didn't get a chance to read them and I would love to hear what you think. Either way, thanks for taking the time to post.

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