posted August 11, 2007 02:44 AM            

At age 15, when I first ran away from home with a friend...could my friend and I simply gone into the welfare offices and say, "Hi, we're runaways. Can we get public housing, food stamps, and all that other good stuff?"

"Sure, fill out these forms."

"Um, we don't have these IDs that you want. We're kids. You could send off for our birth certificates if you want."

"No problem, we process illegals all the time, we can process you, too."

"Because we're also illegals!"

"Yep."

Would this have worked? I'd say it's insane, but now that I think about it, I think it just might've.

And if it worked, would the welfare agencies be guilty of aiding and abetting, or contributing to the delinquency of minors? If so, then why aren't they also charged with doing the same for other illegals? And if not, then why do abuse and homeless shelters face the risk of these criminal charges when they "look the other way" and not report minors that wind up in their shelters?

Also, as a runaway, I once needed medical attention really bad, to the point that I was worried that I might die if I didn't. But I was too scared to go to the hospital, for I feared that the hospital would report me to the police, the police would arrest me, and then I'd have been sent back home (yes, I'd rather have died).

But I understand that illegals can get free health care, more so than Americans--and not get deported. Is this true? And if so, could I have gone for medical help back when I was an injured runaway for the same kind of free medical care, and not get sent back home? If not, why not? Do American citizens care more about illegal aliens than desperate kids on the run, many fleeing sexual and other horrible abuse?

posted September 05, 2007 01:46 AM              

I am pleased to have this answer for you:
No.

You see, here in America we have this wonderful [*grins] little program called "CPS" Child Protective Services.

This program is funded by, yes [Your parents tax dollars] it provides that children in need are cared for.
Any childcare center, school, hospital, homeless shelter, etc. is required by law to report unattended children, children in unsafe or abusive situations, etc.

Now if you were a real bright teenager...
You would have called this program yourself!
You would have received, Food, Clothing, Shelter, and of course Medical and Dental care ALL FREE OF CHARGE! You most likely would have been placed with a very loving family who genuinely cared for your future. [By law this would have included a generous allowance]
[Contrary to popular belief Foster Care providers are not on average evil money hungry people, LOL!] You only hear about the few bad examples in the news. The average foster family spends much of their own money providing for the loving care of hurt children, many years of continued education are required for licensing, Very thorough backround checks are done on every household member, Continued investigation and guidelines are verified by all parties involved weekly.

You get where I'm going with this?

------------------
Sendin' love your way,
"your friend in spirit"

posted September 06, 2007 01:18 AM            

A friend of mine was disappeared by her dad, imprisoned in a literal teen gulag that brainwashed her. In case you never heard of places like this, then this will explain more about it:
http://www.teenliberty.org/An_American_GULAG.htm

Anyway, all we knew was that she vanished shortly after her dad read her diary and freaked because she'd written that she'd gotten interested in Wicca. Fearing the worst, a mentor of mine that worked a government job harassed the CPS office endlessly to investigate. Even doing so, it took the 6 WEEKS to do so. Normally it took 6 MONTHS. And in this case it meant a deputy went and asked without looking around at all (had he killed her, he could've gotten away). This matches how I've heard abusers have gotten away by saying the child they horribly abused had "runaway" or was otherwise not home.

And that was in California.

And there are way many more bad reports that "make the news." As a runaway, I met many who escaped from foster hades. And the news will often overlook bad reports more often than not. Sure there are good ones, too, but it's a crap shoot.

In my own experience, I had been locked up in my own teen gulag (I'm still traumatized over it to this day) as part of insurance fraud. Interesting enough, abuse against kids came out, but only to harden the jury against the place. What the government went after was the insurance fraud. There was some out of court settlement for a girl left pregnant and with a permanent STD by one of the staffers, but that was a civil suit, not brought about by the state.

When I got out, I found out that Mom and Dad were in the middle of a divorce. A bad one. Short and sweet, Dad damaged the brakes on the car after Mom won it and we were both nearly killed and he claims (years later) that he never even got a visit from a cop over it. Nor did the cops ever enforce the restraining order, even when he broke through a window in a drunken rage (I hid, but that was a very scary time for me, I thought he was going to kill her, and me if he found me).

I was sent to live with Granny for a few months. There I actually got happy, but Mom dragged me back just so she could cash me in for the child support to fund her addictions. (She managed to find a way to use at least some of her welfare benefits for this, too.) At the time, I was forced to go down and talk to a "court advocate." Basically, the "advocate" told me I was going to live with my mom, but made an impressive effort to try tricking me into thinking it was my own decision.

Then I saw kids sexually exploited by the state when I was a runaway, violent cops, and a pimp that killed my best friend (accidentally when trying to get her addicted to hard drugs, but that's beside the point), the pimp could not be touched, supposedly because his place and biz were run by a rich lawyer who made sure the cops didn't ever raid the place, though they knew about it. I ran back home after a sexually abusive cop started stalking me.

Then the school tested me and I tested college level for everything save math (and I was "where I was supposed to be" for that), so I was placed in ABC (Adaptive Behavior Class). The counselor also believed I was a satanist. Then the Columbine massacre happened, and our school was one of many that was caught in the post-Columbine hysteria. Among the other outrageous stuff they (and other schools) were doing, they were going to have me locked up in that teen gulag again because of a story I helped to write. So again, I ran. The government forced me to live with Mom, never defended me or stood up for my interests, and then made me into a fugitive. There was no help there.

IOW, saying a bright teen could've called them and everything would be great is very, very naive to the extreme. Nor did I have any reason to believe that they would (btw, I'm glossing a lot over). See where I'm going with this?

posted September 06, 2007 01:26 AM            

quote:

---

Eileen Herring knows of one — her own father. Herring, a 40-year-old mother of two teenage daughters, testified in support of the new California law.

Her father began sexually abusing her when she was 12. When she was 14, Herring (her married name) mentioned the abuse to a friend, who helped her get in touch with Merced County's child protective services agency.

"I didn't even know what he was doing to me was against the law," Herring said.

Her father was arrested, convicted and given probation. "He said since he owned his child, he thought he could do whatever he wanted with me," she said.

Instead of a happy ending, Herring's nightmare intensified. Her father was ordered to undergo therapy. Herring, by then in a foster home where she felt safe, was forced to participate. "I was told that if I didn't go, I'd be put in juvenile hall for defying a court order."

After several weeks, the therapist "proclaimed us healed, and I was put back in my home," she said. "A couple of months later, he started sexually abusing me again."

No therapists, no police, no one from child protective services checked to find out if Herring's abuse had ended, and she felt it was useless to report her father again

---

Again, note that this is California, a state with a rep in being especially active in dealing with child abuse. Where was CPS then?

Take the girl above. Could she go to an abuse shelter? No, because any homeless or abuse shelter that lets her stay risks being charged with aiding and abetting and also corrupting minors. A few shelters practice a "don't ask, don't tell," but it's risky and get the entire shelter shut down as well as criminal charges to those who knew minors were receiving sanctuary there.

Can she report her abuser? Nope. She did that, and look where it got her. In some cases, not even that much is done. I read in a true crime book where the prosecutor boldly stated that the system knew of her being sexually abused and did nothing, and also said that OTHER WOMEN were treated the same, and thus the fact that the desperate girl had found a guy to kill her father for her had to be prosecuted to the max. Or the many "other women also ignored might take the law into their own hands." ie, your tax dollars at work to keep those girls down with the legs and mouth open wide.

Get this, the prosecutor also said, "Probation is not punishment." Well neither is ignoring the guy she had killed while he sexually abused her. And what about the many men like him who get probation because of the "incest exception law" in most states? Not punishment, he says?

So the ONLY option is to go underground. Where they can't go to the cops for help and the predators (from rapists to pimps to others) hunt and hurt these kids with impunity. And after a pimp grabs a kid, forces her to do drugs if she's not already addicted, and gets her fake ID, then the cops regularly bust her for prostitution on "vice nights" where the kids are then released to raise the money to pay the fine...you know how she'll raise it, too, just as the courts know. How do you like paying taxes to support pimps? (Not all cities do this, but I believe the vast majority of them do.)

I've also heard of how one "expose" (really a commercial disguised as "outraged reporters" exposing it) where cops knowingly licensed girls as young as 14 to lap dance completely nude. The cops stonewalled, the story was forgotten...except by the pervs who knew where to spend their tourist dollars the next time they went on vacation.

posted September 06, 2007 01:43 AM              

Because he was brave enough to make that call to CPS he now has a beautiful future to look forward to. He is enrolled in school for the first time in a year and 1/2. Has food [the best he's had since his momma died when he was age 9 yrs.] Clothing that was'nt handed down or completely grunged out, a bedroom to call his very own in a 5 bedroom 3 bath house sporting a nice cool inground pool, money in his pocket, friends who have more to offer than drugs and alcohol, a desperately needed dental appointment schedualed, and of course love and gratitude in his heart! He said to me "I'm scared" "I never lived in a mansion before" "I feel completely safe and loved" "It will take some getting used too"

Now remember the question at hand was in fact welfare

quote:

---

At age 15, when I first ran away from home with a friend...could my friend and I simply gone into the welfare offices and say, "Hi, we're runaways. Can we get public housing, food stamps, and all that other good stuff?"

---

And my answer remains the same "NO"
------------------
Sendin' love your way,
"your friend in spirit"

*Edited to add this after your edit of adding Eileen Herring story:
This story isnt even real, it's bogus...

quote:

---

"I didn't even know what he was doing to me was against the law,"

---

This girl at age 14 is unclear what good and bad touching is? Come on! My 3 year old daughter knows how to scream bloody murder when her sense of personal space has been violated.
Girls talk you know...
Teachers, educators across the globe teach children thier rights of safety at a very young age. The abuse didn't begin until age 12? Hello... This girl was obviously old enough to recognize.

If I'm completely wrong and this story somehow was true as she said then the reality would be that she is mentally challenged and perhaps in need of psychiatric care as well. Let us not forget that rebellious 12-14 year old girls lie an aweful lot to get attention.

posted September 06, 2007 03:22 AM              

Dervish, the comment I'm guessing that offended you was "Now if you were a real bright teen you would have..."

This was not meant to imply stupidity at all but rather resourcfulness...

Most teenagers are not even aware that programs exist that they personally can contact to help them meet thier basic needs like food, clothing shelter, safety, etc. Those whom have the resources available are often fearful to grasp them.

My other comment: "You get where I'm going with this..." was by no means meant to imply stupidity either, rather it is my way of saying "Can you understand where I'm coming from? (or) My veiw on this?

I sincerely apologise.

I suppose that as fast as we each were editing to add information it most likely added to the confusion.

This being said, let me assure you that I was genuinely excited by your topic. I did not post in order to debate nor really educate just going off my own personal experiences as are you I imagine.

I am pleased that you feel so strongly about your views as I actually agree with the majority of what you posted. It's wonderful that the two of us, along with so many others here are genuinely concered about our children, and the way our system works or rather does'nt.

Because of people like us, we can make a positive difference!

posted September 07, 2007 03:56 PM            

The first time I ran, I did so with my best friend. She was about to flunk for the year and feared what her dad would do. In the past, she had gone to a school counselor for help. Luckily, when she was registered, her dad wasn't doing and didn't have a phone so the number of the grandparents had been given. This is lucky because the counselor decided--after hearing how drunken and violent he was and also showing him how he'd literally ripped some of the hair out of her head and bruises from how he punched her into the wall--that what the family lacked was "communication" and decided to call the dad up and get the "communication" started.

Needless to say, she never went to help again after that. And who knows how things would be different had the counselor succeeded in calling the dad? Possibly with her dead.

She had good reason not to trust the help that is theoretically out there, and so did I. (My own family had its own problems, so I went with her, because we shared love for each other, unlike me with my mom or dad.) I met plenty of runaways that had been screwed by CPS, foster care, etc, too, which validated our feelings of mistrust.

As it is, I ended up getting some help, too, but from underground anarchists (people against ALL government, not that they're necessarily violent--I'd say the majority of anarchists are more wired to be pacifists actually) and the like that got me off the streets and hid me from the law. I'll always be grateful for that.

I've heard of kids on the street helped by the system. That guy in Los Angeles that started YES sounds particularly impressive. But it strikes me as the exception to the rule.

And Covenant House strikes me as doing more harm than good, though if you're older than 17 and/or pregnant (with no intention of getting an abortion), they can be good. As a 15-year-old runaway, I even got some sack lunches from their van, though I was careful to never let them know where our squats and such were, as they passed everything on to the cops.

Anyway, the entire point of this thread is that back when I was an illegal, I didn't see how I could get welfare. Nor could I expect not to get sent back home if I went to get medical care and the like (and I'd, or my family, would be charged for that help). So how can illegal aliens expect these benefits that I couldn't back when I was a runaway (and thus illegal in my own way)? How can they be so bold as to march, declaring themselves to be illegals (ie, criminals), in protesting when the laws are actually executed?

This is not a moral question. This is simply one of confusion. I know that illegals get welfare, and I believe they get free medical care, too. They don't do this by pretending to be legal, they admit to being criminals. So why aren't they arrested instead?

posted September 07, 2007 04:55 PM              

It's sad really when there are so many children in our own back yard "so to speak" that genuinely need help and are unable to receive it.

Even those commercials on starving children in africa kind of **** me off now. I know many people who send money all over the world trying to make peace with themselves.
[holding that picture in thier hand, feeling pride] When right in the very towns and cities where they live they are blind to the poverty, abuse, undereducated, lack of medical care, etc.

When will people open thier eyes?

Your story particularly pulls at my heartstrings. I'm certain your inner strength was built by this experience.
But, at what cost? Should'nt someone have noticed, cared, or stepped in to provide you the very things you so desperately needed as a young teenager.
Where are peoples values and morals?
What can we personally do to change this?
What actions can we take?

------------------
Sendin' love your way,
"your friend in spirit"

posted September 08, 2007 01:17 AM            

I like the idea of shelters (homeless and abuse) not requiring parental permission for a kid to stay at. These shelters could keep kids off the streets (all the kids have to do is follow the rules of the shelter they stay at) and function as sanctuaries. Right now, that's typically not allowed, and that means desperate kids have nowhere to go but all the way underground, where the predators hunt them. The laws criminalizing youth don't protect them, they make them vulnerable.

There are all kinds of things individuals can do. I know there are underground railroads that do a lot. There are even those that specialize (like for gay youth on the run, for sexually abused girls, for mothers with children on the run from a violent ex and can't trust the system, etc), as well as those who help anyone they can.

You can also do what this guys does, and goes around as a "video vigilante" recording johns, underaged girls, violent pimps and the like. In broad daylight, young girls are beaten while cars go by, some right by an elementary school, and people did nothing. But once it became known that some nut was down there recording it and putting it on the net, it made quite the difference, and now some in the community are trying to clean it up so that it can't be rubbed in their faces anymore (among other things). You can see his vids (and get to his main website)here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/videovigilanteokc

Note, at least in larger cities, boys are also part of the sex trade, though it's much rarer for pimps to actually snag boys for some reason (I don't understand why boys are mostly left alone by pimps myself).

Though there are other tricks, like one guy liked taking pix of runaway kids and "selling" us on-line. We'd have people come up to us who said they paid whoever and therefore thought we (boy or girl) had to have sex with him. Even as a teen, I could not understand either their naivety (paid for us on-line to some jerk who took pix of us without us even knowing about it and thinks he actually owns us) or the gall in thinking they could just order us into their car.

There are the usual predators. And sometimes the system can be a willful enemy to oppose you because these kids provide money directly and indirectly, and perverts can be members of the system, too (cops, lawyers, judges, etc). Though it can be useful to remember that just because 1 or 2 cops are bad doesn't mean that they'll be supported by the other cops--though OTOH, it's possible that the cops in that area WILL stick together, no matter what, too.

posted September 09, 2007 01:02 AM              

quote:

---

I like the idea of shelters (homeless and abuse) not requiring parental permission for a kid to stay at. These shelters could keep kids off the streets (all the kids have to do is follow the rules of the shelter they stay at) and function as sanctuaries. Right now, that's typically not allowed, and that means desperate kids have nowhere to go but all the way underground, where the predators hunt them. The laws criminalizing youth don't protect them, they make them vulnerable.

---

Re: Video Vigilante
Excellent link Dervish! Here's the main website for any who are interested this guy really has the right idea...Click Here
I especially enjoyed the "Delivery Driver with Hooker Busted by Video Vigilante" This guy actually had to teach the officer the state law, LOL!
Though I support this guys actions 100% and know what he's doing is making a huge difference in his area, I can't help but worry about how dangerous this can be.

The National Runaway Switchboard sounds promising... If you choose to go this route.

Here's a bit more information for those who may be interested:
The National Runaway Switchboard (NRS) is a 24/7, national hotline in the United States, for runaway youth, parents and families of runaway youth, youth in crisis, and anyone else who might benefit from their services. They are confidential, anonymous, non-judgmental, non-directive, and free. Although many phone numbers forward to them, their primary hotline number is 1-800-RUNAWAY.

Originally established in Chicago, Illinois in 1971, they received federal funding to become a national hotline in 1974. They currently receive over 100,000 calls a year.

-----
Years ago I used to work/vollunteer at the Teenage Crisis Hotline as well as the Rape Crisis Center... Both of these I would also recommend as altenative ways to support your community. Let me forewarn however that each of these programs is emotionally challenging to say the least!
If you have high-blood pressure not the right place for you. Very high stress environments, with very little reward.
Both are challenging in thier own ways and certainly beneficial.

Hmm... anymore ideas?

Edited to add these interesting facts/links:

Here are some interesting stats for you:

(First Quarter, 2006) INS/FBI Statistical Report on Undocumented Immigration

62% of all "undocumented immigrants" in the United States are working for cash and not paying taxes, predominantly illegal aliens, working without a green card;

95% of warrants for murder in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens;

83% of warrants for murder in Phoenix are for illegal aliens;

86% of warrants for murder in Albuquerque are for illegal aliens;

75% of people on the most wanted list in Los Angeles, Phoenix, and Albuquerque are illegal aliens;

More than 380,000 "anchor babies" were born in the United States in 2005, they, were to parents who are illegal aliens; making those 380,000 babies automatically U.S. citizens. 97.2% of all costs incurred from those births were paid by the American taxpayer;

More than 66% of all births in California are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal whose births were paid for by taxpayers;

24.9% of all inmates in California detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally;

40.1% of all inmates in Arizona detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally;

48.2% of all inmates in New Mexico detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally;

29%(630,000) convicted illegal alien felons fill our state and federal prisons at a cost of $1.6 billion annually;

More than 300,000 illegal aliens in Los Angeles County are living in garages;

More than 53% of all investigated burglaries reported in California, New Mexico, Nevada, Arizona and Texas are perpetrated by illegal aliens;

More than half of all gang members in Los Angeles are illegal aliens from south of the border;

More than 43% of all Food Stamps issued are to illegal aliens;

More than 41% of all unemployment checks issued in the United States are to illegal aliens;

58% of all Welfare payments in the United States are issued to illegal aliens;

Nearly 60% of all occupants of HUD properties in the United States are illegal aliens;

14 out of 31 TV stations in L.A. are Spanish-only;

16 out of 28 TV stations in Phoenix are Spanish-only;

15 out of 24 TV stations in Albuquerque are Spanish-only;

21 radio stations in L.A. are Spanish-only;

17 radio stations in Phoenix are Spanish-only;

17 radio stations in Albuquerque are Spanish-only;

More than 34% of Arizona students in grades 1-12 are illegal aliens;

More than 24% of Arizona students in grades 1-12 are non-English-speaking;

More than 39% of California students in grades 1-12 are illegal aliens;

More than 42% of California students in grades 1-12 are non-English-speaking;

In Los AngelesCounty, 5.1 million people speak English. 3.9 million speak Spanish;

More than 71% of all apprehended cars stolen in 2005 in Texas, New Mexico,
Arizona, Nevada and California were stolen by illegal aliens or transport "coyotes";

47% of cited/stopped drivers in California have no license, no insurance and no registration for the vehicle. Of that 47%, 92% are illegal aliens;

63% of cited/stopped drivers in Arizona have no license, no insurance and no registration for the vehicle. Of that 63%, 97% are illegal aliens;

66% of cited/stopped drivers in New Mexico have no license, no insurance and
no registration for the vehicle. Of that 66%, 98% are illegal aliens;

Less than 2% of illegal aliens in the United States are picking crops, but 41% are on welfare;

Over 70% of the United States annual population growth (and over 90% of California, Florida, and New York) results from immigration;

The cost of immigration to the American taxpayer in 1997 was a NET (after subtracting taxes immigrants pay)$70 BILLION a year,[Professor Donald Huddle, Rice University];

The estimated profit to U.S. corporations and businesses employing illegal aliens in 2005 was more than $2.36 TRILLION dollars;

The lifetime fiscal impact (taxes paid minus services used) for the average adult Mexican illegal alien is $55,000.00 cost to the American taxpayer in a 5-year span.