posted April 14, 2009 02:22 PM              

the same happen in france, when everybody talks about a subject when actually no one outside the country gives a damn.

posted April 14, 2009 05:33 PM            

TINK is right again. The US flag should never be tipped to a dignitary of any nation and no President should ever bow before foreign leaders, even Monarchs. That's rooted in American custom, tradition and law.

If the President of the United States and the Office of President is not of equal stature to any foreign leader or office then, we've elected the wrong person President..which it's now obvious we did.

posted April 14, 2009 09:37 PM            

So was it ok for Bush to give massage to that German female chancellor while performing American duties?

And why is it ok for American tennis players to bow before English royalty in the courts of wimbledon?

posted April 15, 2009 03:28 AM              

quote:

---

If the President of the United States and the Office of President is not of equal stature to any foreign leader or office then, we've elected the wrong person President..which it's now obvious we did.

---

no, what is obvious is that this little incident is used by u to justify your discomfort to have a black president.

posted April 15, 2009 03:47 AM            

Secondly, while I'll take your word that the French people may not want to engage in war/conflict, you might want to send a memo to the French government. Or have we missed the situation in Somalia created in part by the French ... the same government who is now interested in taking a miltary stand in Somalia perhaps even joining forces with, of all people, the Chinese?

Where do the French get the right to keep blacks in Africa downtrodden over the centuries and then kill them when their own economic interests are threatened? Ho ho, it's a cheap argument but then it's not really my argument, after all. No, no, I actually think piracy does need to be stopped ....

As for the cheap shot regarding Jwhop not liking Obama "because he's black" ... that's a ludicruous though unsurprising argument. Hey, how about this? Obama is bi-racial; half white. Perhaps people who don't like him don't like the EVIL WHITE MAN half of his genetic make up. You know, how all minorities who disliked Bush did so only because he was white? That's a real good argument right there.

******

posted April 15, 2009 08:54 AM              

I think the people in government, being french, english, US or saudi do whatever they like, with no regards to the population. that is why i find it painful to defend one nation against another because it serves only the interest of a few, who probably dont care at all about their own country and its people.

and personnally, i dont defend saudi, even though it might sound like this. how could i defend a regime that condemn love between people of the same sex being gay myself. in fact, i really appreciate US ideal of freedom. your country shines a light of progress which need to be defended, from attacks on the outside as well as from inside...

it's hard to be a leader, but im glad the US are the leading nation of the modern world, except when they loose their mind because of some internal manipulation.

ps: when i say this, obviously ive got no mandate to represent the french people in general but i can ASSURE u that my views represent the vast majority of french people; long life to the freedom defended by the US!

amen

posted April 16, 2009 02:08 AM            

And you bring up a point that has boggled my mind for years. These religious extremists are so far right they make our evangelists look like liberals. I know they're not real Muslims but that doesn't change how they feel or what they believe. Saddam had more than a decade to change his ways. And countries with religious extremists in charge still exist; countries who cannot be considered "for the people" because so few of them are allowed a say in what goes on.

And beyond that, do we all understand that they HATE LIBERALS?

Seriously, think about it. They hate women, they hate gays, they hate people who don't practice their religion ... on and on the list goes. Why, WHY would any liberal defend their right to "their business" in "their country" when that business is oppressing and torturing and killing people just like you?

They hate people like me and even more conservative than me because most of us DEFEND your rights; even those of us who disagree with them ideologically have often defended your right to do what you want; for us all to do what we want. And, until now, most liberals have done the same for us.

For my part, I don't think that only Americans deserve freedom. Or Europeans. Or the rich, civilized nations. I don't see any reason why a little girl in Iraq couldn't go to school or why a gay man almost anywhere in the Mid East would be killed with full support from the government. Nevermind the horrible living conditions their own governments subject them to regardless of how much (oil?!) money the government actually has. Do we not remember Saddam's palaces?

I don't agree with hopping in and bombing at the drop of the hat. But we didn't do that. That so many Americans weren't paying attention to what was going on over there for over a decade is their own fault. However, I don't like the way we went in there, partly because it has divided us so perversely. And still, STILL, I'm glad to see the restoration and rebuilding going on there now. Little girls in Iraq are going to school now when just a year ago they were outright denied and could be killed for learning.

posted April 16, 2009 12:11 PM            

and where did praecipua side with the saudis? she mentioned that to receive respect you give respect, she wasn't standing up for any regime.

posted April 16, 2009 01:35 PM            

____________________

Eleanore, I think that point is lost among the apologists /uber politically correct people here. Some are more concerned about placating the enemy (meaning anyone that wishes us all dead) and looking good in the eyes of the global community, than what the extremists want to do to us.

Sadly enough, we have seen exactly what the extremists do to anyone that does not fall into their way of thinking. Remember Berg that was beheaded? Remember Soldiers that have been taken captive by Al Q or the Taliban? We have seen this happen time and again, but we still have people apologizing for them.

I would like to see those same people GO TO Iraq or Afghanistan and promote their "peace and love" agenda and we will see what happens. I have a feeling once there, once they are in trouble, that is when they will cry for help- which will most likely come from our Military.

posted April 16, 2009 02:51 PM            

where in our constitution does it say we are bound to make the whole world free no matter how much it costs us?

i didn't even see the pictures where obama is supposed to have bowed and i couldn't care less. it is a side issue dredged up to discredit the president of the united states, all the while blaming him for discrediting the country. in the armed forces maybe one salute is rigidly meant to mean one thing, and another another. maybe (i wouldn't know) the wrong salute is even punishable. we're not in the military here.

edit: if it's not okay to ridicule bush, it's not okay to ridicule obama. i never ridiculed bush and i'm not going to do it to our current president.

and one more last time, even if he did he is only the last in a long line of presidents whose etiquette has been criticized.

posted April 16, 2009 05:02 PM            

------------------
~
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world is immortal"~

posted April 17, 2009 12:00 AM            

quote:

---

actually no one is apologizing for anyone here pidaua. you seem to suffer from the disease of "anyone who sees a different side is siding with the enemy".

---

I also don't think Pidaua was referring to this thread alone. She didn't single anyone here out or refer specifically to this thread. Perhaps you suffer from self-identifying with negative comments that don't actually relate to you? Seriously, though, she was replying to me and I'm sure that she knows that I know exactly what she's talking about because we've both been around here for years.

There have always been many liberals (and more specifically some leftists) on this site and over the years those same arguments have been made (although worded more PC) by some.

I don't think you've done same, katatonic. So please, at least for my part, don't think that because I refer to some comments made by some people that you perhaps identify with that I specifically mean you. I'm not a coward (and imo neither is Pidaua) and if I had a personal issue with you or your comments, I would clearly address you and specifically what you wrote. I haven't got the time to seive through all the past threads right now but if you want to see the comments I'm talking about, grab something hot to drink and scroll on back.

posted April 17, 2009 08:08 AM            

Juni,

posted April 17, 2009 11:41 AM              

feeling generous today.

posted April 18, 2009 10:19 AM            

Such masterful imagery juni

posted August 16, 2009 04:25 AM            

everything now a days are over dramatized. obama should have not bowed at all. nice simple hello and a handshake or nod would have been fine.