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Author
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Topic: What's up with all of the cheating??
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Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 889
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 07:02 PM
 
Yeah, the problem is truly that more people aren't willing to consciously, conscientiously choose whether to open their relationships.There are TWO ethical choices--1) agree to a committed, monogamous relationship, and keep that commitment and 2) decide you want an open relationship, and discuss this with your partner to make it consensual. To me, both are just fine. It't the LYING that bothers me, that and the almost willful thoughtlessness. I personally find it easy not to cheat when I have a partner. What's harder is to not help someone else cheat...I was reading StarrofVenus's thread here recently and thinking how, if I were willing to sleep with a man who had a girlfriend, I would be way less lonely right now...like she is...she gets to make out with some hot guy and stay up all night talking to him...but I'm NOT WILLING TO DO THAT. Even if some guy is unethical enough to want to cheat on his partner--even if he would leave her for me afterwards--NO, as a Leo I'll just never participate in that, ever, even if I find the guy really attractive. I don't really buy Belgz's argument that cheating is some natural part of life. I mean, rape and murder are a natural part of life, too, in the sense that some a--holes do those things. It doesn't make them acceptible. If you want to occasionally have sex with someone else in your relationship, and you see it as not meaning anything, then why not open your relationship and discuss the fact that you need to do this with your partner? IP: Logged |
Benedict Moon*
Knowflake Posts: 225
From: formerly Dulce Luna
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 07:05 PM
This is exactly why at times I don't give a sh#t about the concept of Romance.IP: Logged |
Diana
Knowflake Posts: 386
From:
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 07:07 PM
I think the eclipse could be bringing a lot of it to light. Eclipses bring to light that which is hidden. Long term? I think a lot of people explained it well. Chiron, neptune, and Jupiter together are pretty intoxicating. It really depends a lot on their charts, though. IP: Logged |
Choc
Knowflake Posts: 60
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 07:32 PM
There's no such thing as an open relationship.
It's just a "civil-sounding" excuse for f___ing around.
Relationships are about commitment. You don't want to/can't commit = you're not in one then.
People are just not willing to compromise anymore.
We want everything, freedom, money, sexual gratification etc and we want them all now.
IP: Logged |
Cheshire Kat
Knowflake Posts: 259
From: Wonderland
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 07:39 PM
One more quick thing before I go today. Also believe cheating stems from people just not being comfortable enough with themselves. In today's society there is the whole "one partner bores me" but there is also that fear of "I don't want to be alone for the rest of my life", that when anyone comes along that type of person attaches to that relationship and they never give themselves enough time to find themselves or explore their needs..this use to be.I used to have a fear of being alone by myself or people would view me or say things like "why am I single?" all disappointed like it use to bother me enough to just accept any relationship that came away regardless of how awful and stiffled I felt in the relationship plus I am still so young and young people seem to have this emphasis on dating like it's that big of a deal..that parents/teachers don't really see.. I realise now that being single and exploring my options and exspanding my personal love/spiritaulity is better then being in a relationship that just presents itself out of a fear of lonliness. IP: Logged |
Cheshire Kat
Knowflake Posts: 259
From: Wonderland
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 08:05 PM
"There's no such thing as an open relationship.
It's just a "civil-sounding" excuse for f___ing around.
Relationships are about commitment. You don't want to/can't commit = you're not in one then."..That exactly what I thought open relationships were , just people afraid of commitment and screwing around but now I am more acceptable of it the more I see people around me shifting towards that and they don't just have sex with these people and it's over, they go on dates with them and make connections. These people that I personally know, my best friend and my gay uncle would commit in heartbeat to that special one, their just not ready they still want to explore their options in life..and like people..options are ever changing but I am 100% sure they would commit whenever the time is right for them and there is nothing wrong with that. The biggest issue is not fufulling your needs in life ,it's about honesty and respect. To be honest and respect yourself and others.
IP: Logged |
VirgOh
Knowflake Posts: 130
From: New Jersey, USA
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 08:50 PM
This is so weird  I just caught my Leo friend's husband at work "A Scorpio" cheating on her after 10 years of marriage and the moron is doing it with another colleague. I was so furious so I told her, I think she kicked him out, this is the 3rd time she caught him doing it this year. IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 889
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 09:21 PM
quote:
There's no such thing as an open relationship.
It's just a "civil-sounding" excuse for f___ing around.
Relationships are about commitment. You don't want to/can't commit = you're not in one then.
To me, relationships are about exploring the unique connections we have with others--whether they are spiritual, intellectual, sexual, romantic, play-based, or some combination. No two people are alike, and each connection between two people is completely unique. Relationships are not a place, they are a set of practices and connections. We don't expect platonic friends to have only one friend!! Or parents to love only one of their children! The truth is that we have deep erotic attractions and connections to many people in a lifetime, just as we have emotional or intellectual or creative ones. We have a choice to decide to be sexually monogamous with one partner (as the Libra and I did for 15 years), or to open our relationships. I think open relationships are very valid, as long as they are honest, loving compassionate, and consensual...but then I also a life that is about exploring all kinds of pleasures. In any relationship, both partners need to work as a team to make sure that their lives are as thrilling, creatively inspiring, profound, and joyous as possible. Having a life of many sexual/emotional intimacies is not necessarily mutually exclusive with the satisfaction of a deep and long-term connection with one or more people. Honesty is one of my #1 values, as are compassion and open-heartness. Convention, conformity, settling for something other than the deepest happiness,and doing things thoughtless are lifestyle choices I disrespect. Imagine if we felt that love was infinite and abundant, instead of something in short supply to get grabby about. Monogamous one-on-one relationships are the best choice for many people--but if someone does want to enjoy safe sex with multiple partners AND have the satisfaction of a deep, longer-term relatoinship too, why is that wrong, as long as both people agree to explore in that way? IP: Logged |
GypseeWind
Knowflake Posts: 838
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 09:38 PM
I don't really want to get into morals and ethics, but I did want to respond to the question, which was did anyone notice all the cheating going on lately, and my answer is, yes I did notice all the cheating going on lately, especially since people do not seem to go to great pains to hide it!
My friend cheated on his girlfriend over a month ago, and he was dumb enough to park his car in the girls driveway, which she lives on the main road that we all use for travel!
Then he says all sorry, sorry stuff, bad mistake, and he is still doing it, and he leaves his phone open on the table with text messages from the other girl on it, knowing dang well it will be read.
My rant is just, don't make a person suffer your drama, if you want out, have the guts to say so, and don't let the door hit you in the butt on your way out.IP: Logged |
aerialcircus
Knowflake Posts: 180
From: Western Massachusetts, US
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 09:44 PM
I think cheating, like most problems with relationships, stems from an unwillingness or a fear of being totally honest. I've come to believe that relationships can survive literally anything as long as everyone is completely honest and respectful to each other every step of the way. All of the longest, happiest marriages I've seen had this quality of respectful but total honesty. Don't want to be with your girl/boyfriend anymore? Tell them. Don't just hop on the next person who let's you as an "escape." Will they be mad/hurt? Probably, but not as mad/hurt/deeply psychically damaged as they'll be when they find out you lied, disrespected the love they've given you, made them look like a fool and endangered their safety. Lover not giving you what you need sexually? Time to be honest. Lover still won't do it? Time to leave. Lover not giving you that "feeling" anymore and you feel like you need to get it elsewhere? Time to be honest and leave. There are a LOT of people in the world. Most of the people you date will be jerks/boring/chaotic/not The One. Don't cling to a sinking ship! I actually walked in on my then boyfriend going at it with a "good" friend of mine once. It was the singlemost disgusting moment of my life. Did I explode and beat everyone to a bloody pulp? Nope (not that it didn't cross my mind). Were my bags packed and on a plane the very next morning? Bet your a**. The truth of the matter, to me anyway, was that he didn't BELONG to me. It was within his rights as an individual to be a careless, thoughtless, lying pig. I couldn't expect him to be anything more or less than what he chose to be. The only thing I could control was whether or not I stayed or tried to work it out or forgave- and I couldn't, so I didn't. He clearly (UNDERSTATEMENT) wasn't right for me, so what was the use of sticking around to have it out and make the hurt worse? I just left, and haven't spoken to him since. IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 889
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 14, 2009 10:25 PM
Eeewgh, sorry to hear that people have had to endure being cheated on.Re: the recent cheating epidemic, and all the boob/penis/I-feel-an-unusual-urge-to-have-casual-sex threads...I wonder if this intense eclipse series is making people feel itchy for transformation? So people are messing up their relationships, and are also really horny? IP: Logged |
comica23
Knowflake Posts: 343
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 12:12 AM
I do agree that we can feel attracted to more than one person, whether we are more into monogamy or open relationships. And that both monogamy and open relationships can work, yet the difference resides in what makes us happy.But now even if monogamous people can feel attracted to other people besides their partners, it doesn't mean that they would go sleep around - not if they truly value their partners the most. Coz monogamous people values that deepest, unique bond we can develop with another person. And this bond - when you have built so many unique memories together, can you really substitute this person? This is what makes monogamous people into monogamy.
Yet people often forget that the deepest, strongest bonds often requires a lot of time and effort to be achieved - people idealize love too much in these days -, and that's the problem. You see, it's so easy to talk to our friends about our problems and then idealize how we feel more connected with them than with our current partners.. why? Coz we aren't dating these friends!! IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 889
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 12:26 AM
Comica23, I agree. Also, I think when you're in a monogamous relationship--at least when I was for many years--it IS possible to divert your sexual energy away from people outside the relationship. Emotionally, too, it is possible to set boundaries with other people right off the bat so that it is clear you are unavailable to everyone but your partner.Similarly, it's possible as a single person to decide NOT to get physically or emotionally intimate with people who are in other relationships, and I think it's REALLY crappy to sleep with...or for that matter, even make advances toward...someone else's partner, unless you know for sure they have an open relationship. Even if their relationship is unstable and they are a cheating a**...it's still rotten. IP: Logged |
geemeeni
Knowflake Posts: 65
From:
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 12:27 AM
I agree with all of you. It comes down to being an honest and respectful person to yourself and others. That's the best we can do for one another. Then there is no room for wrongdoing or shame or pretending. Feelings may get hurt, but at least it's based on truth and not deceit. Pain from honesty is much easier to handle than pain from betrayal. Lucia23, I admire your perspective on relationships- there is much reasoning behind your words. Aerialcircus, you are a strong woman to have processed your experience the way you did. I wish we all could remind ourselves in that painful moment that cheating really has nothing to do with anyone else but the cheater and his/her personal choices and the baggage they've accumulated. It doesn't matter if you are the most beautiful/handsome-fun-wonderful-sweetest person in the world. If you are with a cheater, they will most likely cheat. It's nothing that can be prevented by you, and is no reflection of you. The best thing to do is walk away and look forward to your the next step in your life. The astrological theories brought up here are good ones. Venus retrograde... Pluto squaring Libra... Chiron, Neptune and Jupiter together... July's eclipse energy... it's probably a combination of it all. After all, isn't that the way astrology works? Thousands of effects at once, most that we aren't even aware of, creating endless possibilities for every moment in time. The long-term transits have set the stage, and the eclipses act as the final triggers. IP: Logged |
PeaceAngel
Moderator Posts: 1481
From: peace.angel@live.com.au
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 12:49 AM
The notion of being with one person isn't for everyone. And in a society where it's virtually expected, it can't be easy.Maybe the concept of marriage is just simply outdated - or, in truth, it's for very few. The idea of a lifetime commitment when people are constantly changing may just be too hard to uphold. It's a societal expectation, maybe not a practical one. That doesn't excuse cheating. But remove the ideal of "the one" and you have the freedom to be with the right person at the right time, for as long as it lasts. IP: Logged |
belgz
Knowflake Posts: 214
From: Sydney, Australia
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 03:03 AM
cheating is wrong, im not saying it isnt. But if i cheat i dnt feel guilty or like i cheated. I feel like i just hung out with a friend. I prob do it once a year mayb twice with the same ex??
I wantd to be honest and thats how i am though i would never leak this info to my friends haha.
Every human being will be vulnerable at one point in there life. We all feel attraction to many people. And i did think about why i did it and its not because im insecure its just because i dont really see it as wrong. And i know i sound like i have no morals but i spent 8 yrs of my 25yrs with one guy and the rest with another. And i think why not keep my options open? When they commit to me i will commit to them but until then i will search for mr right. My bf never was going to commit because of religious issues so he can get *beep* ! He dumped me and played so many games over the years i was sick over it. When we broke up he still assumed we wernt over and it was just a bad arguement. Also because i cheated myself and knew it wasnt so bad i accept it with others. But if your always with 1 particular other then thats worst. Because then your living like a double life. I wouldnt do that..------------------
•' •.♥♫♫´°°♫ • Life is Beautiful •.♥.•♫°°´♫♫ ♥ • •Sun• Cancer
•Moon• Gemini
•Mars• Cancer
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•Venus• Leo •••Virgo Rising••• IP: Logged |
swirl-kitt
Knowflake Posts: 46
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 03:45 AM
If a person decides to sleep with someone other than their long-term partner they should let them know because then their partner has the right to sleep with other people too, or break up if that's what they want.It's all about honesty. IP: Logged |
bopbop
Knowflake Posts: 99
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 04:14 AM
Belgz, if you're cheating you're cheating. It doesn't matter if you feel guilty or not, it's what it does to your partner that you should be thinking about.And no, we don't all feel attraction to many people when in a committed relationship. Personally, when I am with someone I see only them. It is a conscious decision (i.e. commitment). If someone is attractive to me on a superficial level on some rare occurrence, I wouldn't "explore" that attraction. Fortunately I have that fortitude of mind to shut someone out when it could hurt another relationship, and I don't think I'm the only one that can do this. I've known people that actually haven't had temptations in many years of marriage as well. Of course, they were very good marriages where both partners were equal and honest, and totally devoted to each other on many levels, not just sexually. I wouldn't "accept" cheating, unless you're agreeing its an open relationship with your partner. Otherwise you're just further disrespecting yourself. Please consider seeing this issue differently, because the way you describe your experience doesn't sound like a healthy attitude at all. IP: Logged |
PeaceAngel
Moderator Posts: 1481
From: peace.angel@live.com.au
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 04:42 AM
I think that we do find people we are attracted to and compatible with and that could be equally good partners as to those we are already in relationship with. It's just that we're taken so we put on some brakes and that energy is never given the opportunity for expansion or expression. You just don't know unless you drop that guard. That's the difference - that whole possiblity - the "what if" factor.It's a touchy subject because it threatens people's sense of security in their relationships. Everyone meets people they find attractive - it happens all the time - whether attached or not - it's a constant. If you think your partner is not checking out that hot looking guy or gal in the corner, no matter how much they love and value you and your relationship, you're fooling yourself. IP: Logged |
bopbop
Knowflake Posts: 99
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 04:59 AM
Well, when I say I haven't I'm not fooling. I just rarely check people out in general I guess. Actually, it was very torturous when I did break up with my bf, because I never once made eyes at anyone or saw anyone else as being attractive that way (we were together for 2 years, but I am young haha). So when we broke up, it was like my libido crashed. It took a while to remember that other people were sexy, too. But maybe I'm just weird, or haven't been far enough past the "honeymoon" phase of a relationship.IP: Logged |
aerialcircus
Knowflake Posts: 180
From: Western Massachusetts, US
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 08:35 AM
quote:
Aerialcircus, you are a strong woman to have processed your experience the way you did. I wish we all could remind ourselves in that painful moment that cheating really has nothing to do with anyone else but the cheater and his/her personal choices and the baggage they've accumulated.
Thank you, geemeeni! I'm proud of how I handled it, considering the history I have of lashing out harshly toward people who claim to love me and then blatantly disrespect me (Moon square Pluto here!). I was surprised, but I guess I was so disgusted that every part of me that wanted to care just turned itself off. I didn't walk away unscathed, it was pretty traumatic. I left him behind without any problems but residual anger over what/how it happened still haunt me. The situation overall was really complicated (long story) but I'm actually going to start Deep Memory Therapy to get over a few residuals from it. I'm really excited about it- healing comes from within! quote:
I think it's REALLY crappy to sleep with...or for that matter, even make advances toward...someone else's partner, unless you know for sure they have an open relationship. Even if their relationship is unstable and they are a cheating a**...it's still rotten.
Agreed Lucia- if you "steal" someone from someone else, all that tells you is that s/he is open to being "stolen." If monogamy is what you're looking for, don't start it off buy interrupting someone else's monogamy. If s/he really wanted to be with you, s/he would break it off on their own in a respectful, less dramatic way. Karma, karma, karma. quote:
And no, we don't all feel attraction to many people when in a committed relationship. Personally, when I am with someone I see only them..... So when we broke up, it was like my libido crashed. It took a while to remember that other people were sexy, too.
I do the same things, bopbop! Maybe it's all our similaries! I don't even look at other people when I'm involved with someone special (not typical Aries behavior, I suppose), and never feel tempted. It takes me a while to recover from a deep attraction. I've gone through two hardcore periods of self-imposed celibacy, both after really significant relationship ended. Almost like a period of sexual mourning? IP: Logged |
Glaucus
Knowflake Posts: 788
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 11:20 AM
I wanted to point out that Saturn has been squaring the heliocentric Venus Nodes in 16'46 Gemini/Sagittarius, and so that can indicate the possibility of relationships on the collective level going South..so to speakThere can be unhappiness,restrictions,limitations in regarding relationships,love matters on a collective level
heliocentric Venus Nodes have to do with relationships,love matters on the collective level.
Raymond
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“It is absolutely the perfect name,” Dr. Brown said, given the continuing discord among astronomers and the public over whether Pluto should have retained its planetary status. In mythology, Eris ignited discord that led to the Trojan War. “She causes strife by causing arguments among men, by making them think their opinions are right and everyone else’s is wrong,” Dr. Brown said. “It really is just perfect.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/15/science/space/15xena.html?_r=1 IP: Logged |
geemeeni
Knowflake Posts: 65
From:
Registered: May 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 12:42 PM
Aerialcircus and bopbop, another devoted person here! I'm the same way in a relationship. Not sure why I lose my lust for other men when involved, but it just happens naturally. It doesn't mean that I can't look at people and say they are attractive, but as far as actually FEELING attracted to someone, no. Aerialcircus, I have also done the celibacy after a relationship a few times. Once even went over two years. My friends couldn't believe it, but I felt I needed to recover from the relationship and then do a little soul-searching before connecting with someone else sexually. I wish the best for you in your deep memory therapy- that's pretty exciting! Processing stuff on a soul level can uncover power and strength from within that you may not have even felt before. You said you have a Pluto-Moon square, I have a conjunction, maybe there's a pattern. Bopbop- how about you?Glaucus, thanks for the insight! I've never looked at Venus nodes before. How long do heliocentric Venus nodes stay in that position? It struck me, because the degree you mentioned is very close to my Neptune and Ascendant/Descendant. I don't mean to take this topic to another direction, but I can't help but ask...
My Ascendant/Descendant is Gem/Sag 16.05 and Neptune is Sag 16.45 Could that possibly be a reason why I am personally affected and disturbed by all of the cheating/ general love issues going on around me? Forgive me if that is a naive question, I really don't know anything about heliocentric astrology. IP: Logged |
Glaucus
Knowflake Posts: 788
From: Sacramento,California
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 01:23 PM
"Glaucus, thanks for the insight! I've never looked at Venus nodes before. How long do heliocentric Venus nodes stay in that position? It struck me, because the degree you mentioned is very close to my Neptune and Ascendant/Descendant. I don't mean to take this topic to another direction, but I can't help but ask...
My Ascendant/Descendant is Gem/Sag 16.05 and Neptune is Sag 16.45"Heliocentric Nodes of objects (not only planets, but also asteroids,centaurs,transneptunians/kuiper belt objects) move 1 degree per century. They are slow moving like fixed stars. That's why they have to do with the collective. The heliocentric Venus Nodes are very prominent in your chart,and so you're definitely connected to collective love/relationship matters.
If you want to, you could actually do significant things involving those things like write a bestselling book about love and relationships. That's just one example.
There could also be an artistic talent.
You could be a great diplomat.
Peace and harmony would seem to be very important to you. "Could that possibly be a reason why I am personally affected and disturbed by all of the cheating/ general love issues going on around me? Forgive me if that is a naive question, I really don't know anything about heliocentric astrology." oh most definitely!
here is information on heliocentric nodes
http://www.astrologycosmobiology.com.au/planetary_nodes.html
http://mysite.verizon.net/bonniehill/pages.aux/astrology/tobey/tobey.14.html
Raymond
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“It is absolutely the perfect name,” Dr. Brown said, given the continuing discord among astronomers and the public over whether Pluto should have retained its planetary status.
In mythology, Eris ignited discord that led to the Trojan War. “She causes strife by causing arguments among men, by making them think their opinions are right and everyone else’s is wrong,” Dr. Brown said. “It really is just perfect.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/15/science/space/15xena.html?_r=1 IP: Logged |
Lucia23
Knowflake Posts: 889
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted July 15, 2009 01:29 PM
quote:
I don't even look at other people when I'm involved with someone special (not typical Aries behavior, I suppose)
Actually, all the Arieses I know personally (and I know a lot) are this way--very single-minded once they have decided to commit to somebody. I would say it's kind of typical of Rams. I see what some of you are saying about how not everyone feels attraction outside of their relationships...my point is, in a monogamous relationship, even if you WOULD or MIGHT feel a deep attraction/connection to someone else if you opened yourself to that, it's perfectly possible to set a boundary where you don't go there. Also, it's not just about sex--if you are in a committed, monogamous relationship, don't go out alone and have 15 beers with your gorgeous colleague. When someone hits on you, let them know clearly and right away that you're not available. As a single woman who does not want to contribute to cheating, I am really grateful when I am talking to a gorgeous, funny man at a party and says, "Yeah, my girlfriend and I are going there on vacation" or otherwise drops the G-word into a conversation, so I know he's not free. When I was in a monogamous relationship, I did this too when I would meet interested men. One thing that really bugs me, other than the lying, is the idea that it's hard not to cheat. It is highly possible not to cheat, and for many of us, it's EASY not to...for those who find it a massive challenge, why NOT try an open relationship? Why lie and potentially shame/disappoint someone, or multiple people, you care about? IP: Logged | |
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