posted January 07, 2010 03:33 PM         

Now on to my favorite Leo Mooner (she also has a Leo Ascendant, Mars, and Neptune):

Let's peek into the heart of Leo narcissism:

Riches can all be lost, but that happiness in your own heart can only be veiled, and it will still bring you happiness again, as long as you live. As long as you can look fearlessly up into the heavens, as long as you know that you are pure within, and that you will still find happiness.

Parents can only give good advice or put them on the right paths, but the final forming of a person's character lies in their own hands.

I have often been downcast, but never in despair; I regard our hiding as a dangerous adventure, romantic and interesting at the same time. In my diary I treat all the privations as amusing. I have made up my mind now to lead a different life from other girls and, later on, different from ordinary housewives. My start has been so very full of interest, and that is the sole reason why I have to laugh at the humorous side of the most dangerous moments.

I've found that there is always some beauty left-in nature, sunshine, freedom, in yourself; these can all help you. Look at these things, then you find yourself again, and God, and then you regain your balance. And whoever is happy will make others happy too. He who has courage and faith will never perish in misery!

It's really a wonder that I haven't dropped all my ideals, because they seem so absurd and impossible to carry out. Yet I keep them, because in spite of everything I still believe that people are really good at heart. I simply can't build up my hopes on a foundation consisting of confusion, misery, and death. I see the world gradually being turned into a wilderness, I hear the ever approaching thunder, which will destroy us too, I can feel the sufferings of millions and yet if I look up into the heavens, I think that it will all come right, that this cruelty too will end, and that peace and tranquility will return again.

[F]inally I twist my heart round again, so that the bad is on the outside and the good is on the inside, and keep on trying to find a way of becoming what I would so like to be, and what I could be, if... there weren't any other people living in the world.

This is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.

Who would ever think that so much went on in the soul of a young girl?

Would anyone, either Jew or non-Jew, understand this about me, that I am simply a young girl badly in need of some rollicking fun?

This one made me laugh:

Quickly into dressing gown, soap in one hand, pottie, hairpins, pants, curlers, and cotton wool in the other, I hurry out of the bathroom; but usually I'm called back once for the various hairs which decorate the washbasin in graceful curves, but which are not approved of by the next person.

posted April 03, 2010 10:42 AM         

quote:

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Hi,Ami, what's your mother's astro?
What you said resonated with me. I am still recovering from my M.

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I will come back with my mother's information.
I would love if you could help me figure it out.
I can see a few bad things -lol- like sun combust mercury in Aqua in the 12th house.
That is just the start.
x o x
Ami

posted April 03, 2010 02:48 PM         

Not all Leonine type I've known are as sick and disturbed as my brother. This is a friend, who has a strong Leo moon on his DC. He has this never-ending need for attention and expressions of love and admiration from other people, but he's actually an unbelievably generous and loving person in return. Utterly devoted to his younger brother, a completely loyal friend, despite all his struggles with his difficult family background. He has an enormous heart, and he's gives so much of himself, it's no surprise he has a great need to get something back too:

And this is the chart of an old high school friend. We were best friends for much of high school, but we started growing apart when she started thinking a bit too highly of herself during our senior year. After high school, she insisted on going to a private university, despite her parents not having the money and having to go into massive debt to send her. She became insufferably patronizing toward me, because I choose to go to a state uni in the same city. She felt she needed to be around more impressive and important people than me, despite my having been a good friend of her for over 4 years by then. She ended up getting kicked out with a below 1.0 GPA after her first year. She spent her freshmen year at uni schmoozing and hanging out with people who she wanted to notice her, and she was a very lazy student: she had gotten spoiled in high school with teachers who would "fix" her failing grades for her and was literally surprised when she didn't get that same special treatment at this private uni. All in all, a stereotypical (bad) Leo. I haven't seen her in ages, but I suspect she hasn't learned any lessons:

posted April 04, 2010 04:23 AM         

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Well, My M is an N and a practicing therapist. How do you them apples???
I am just now trying to recover from her-- from my mouth to God's ear.

The main thing that makes it so hard with an N parent is that they don't see you. It is all about how they feel. You are there to make them feel good. You are not a person in your own right. If you don't make them feel good, they pull out all the ammunition and go nuclear on you---URRGGH.

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Ami Ann, same with my mother. She's not a therapist, but she's definitely completely narcissistic. She is very beautiful, even at 62, and wanted to be an actress and everyone else to is blame in her life for everything that went wrong -- but espcially for her unrealized show biz ambitions. She will take any opportunity to lament her wasted talent and how she was thwarted by everyone and never made it. Being around her is like walking on egg shells, but she's also devastatingly charming and intelligent and shrewd. She's delightful when she wants to be and an absolute nightmare when she is upset for whatever reason. But I've never known anyone more complex and difficult in my entire life than my own mother. She's also hypercritical, BUT GOD FORBID if you EVER dare criticise her for anything, big or small, justified or not. You'll incite a hiroshima or fury upon yourself.

She's a Virgo with Leo rising, and weirdly, she has the exact same stellium of planets in the first house as my complicated Pisces ex-husband -- Sun/Venus/Mercury -- tightly conjunct.

Onto other things, my most recent ex who I was with for 1.5 years, he was also a Pisces with an Aqua moon and Venus in Leo, Scorpio Rising and I am so shocked at all these little games you guys are describing, because he totally played those too, constantly!

When I first met him, I thought he was so amazing I could have fallen for him so hard. But he just played so many games with me, trying to manipulate reactions and emotional outbursts out of me. It was exhausting. I put my guard up real quick and decided very consciously to hold back and observe.

He did all the typical things of telling me how all his exes were models and gorgeous and whatever and constantly felt the need to point out all the women that wanted him... thing progressed to him once telling me he broke his leg in a tournament via text message and I left him a hysterical, emotional message on his voicemail (a broken leg at that time would have ruined all his plans and things he'd be working on for MONTHS)... well, right after I left the voicemail, i got a text message saying "just joking! i didn't break my leg!"... GRRRRR... he did apologize once he heard the voicemail though. He did a lot of other ridiculous things too. Venus in Leo. I never connected it to that before. To be fair, he also had Scorpio on his ASC.

I finally decided i didn't want anything serious, but all through 2009 and to this day, I pretty much knew I could demand a serious commitment and I would get it in a heartbeat... of course, with some requisite prevarication and pretense -- he'd have to pretend it was all my idea and i was pressuring him and he was reluctant, but i have absolutely zero doubts in my mind that I'd get it. But he really screwed himself in that regard and I could tell he knew he has pushed too far for too long and regretted it, because he knew I didn't want to be with him anymore.

I'm upset at myself for having allowed the shenanigans to continue for a year a half. He got a lot more of me than he deserved, that is for sure. But I learned a lot, and I'm sure that is why he entered my life. He is a great friend, fiercly loyal and was always there for me and is still my friend, and for that I am thankful and glad to know him, really.

posted April 04, 2010 09:57 AM         

I agree with evander, that it's more about virgo, not leo (would really like to hear your astrological theory...)

As for relationships with narcissists, the pattern forms in childhood. My ex husband is a narcissist, and they are extremely good at eating away any kind of self-confidence that his "victims" have (usually, it's low to begin with). It's only after we've ended it that I realized that he was a full blown narc (it's a really serious personality disorder, unlike healthy narcissism that should exist in all of us), and that the only reason I survived was that I have histrionic PD myself. Still working on that...

I understand that NPD is not treatable, again, I am talking about the disease. No one can "save" the narcissist.

posted April 04, 2010 11:03 AM         

I admired Anne Frank ever since I first read her diary.
So thank you for putting this up.

posted April 04, 2010 12:29 PM         

NPD and antisocial personality disorder are especially challenging because the individual has blocked out, or otherwise not developed either a sense of remorse or the ability to put others before their own needs. They both fall an the extreme end of the personality disorder spectrum. That does not necessarily mean they cannot be treated. A personality disorder is first learned; therefore, at least as far as psychology is concerned, it can be unlearned, provided there are no other cognitive deficiencies to prevent that. But getting the narcissist or antisocial person to acknowledge they need to change is extremely difficult because of the nature of these disorders.

posted April 04, 2010 02:22 PM         

This thread is fascinating. Thank you for introducing the topic. I am learning so much from each person's experience.

I think I have a mild version of NPD and I see it in my extended family as well. I don't have any planets in Leo at all BUT Jupiter squares my Sun and my Sun rules my 4th House. And like I said, my family operates very much like a royal family to the point where, as children, we were told to think of ourselves as Prince's and Princess and to treat each other that way.

I haven't studied this Leo phenomena for quite a while and it's rearing it's head in a strong way on this family holiday where I have chosen not to celebrate with my very large extended family.

posted April 05, 2010 12:58 AM         

But I believe we all have a bit of that in us anyway. Who wouldn't love royal treatment?

When I was growing up my mum used to tell me I was the most beautiful girl on the planet and as I grew up I was only interested in partners who would compliment me same as my mum did. If you didn't love me and think I was as great as what my mother described, I would either pretend you never existed or in some way try to prove how great (venus leo) I was or talk (gemini moon) about myself LOL

I love to compliment people, I love making others feel beautiful too because it makes us smile and confident. I love to tell people how great they look too. But if they are up themselves and self centred I love pointing out their flaws. (Virgo rising)

I don't think I've ever felt jealous in my life. Im usually not interested in things I can't get or guys that arn't interested in me so I've never had that problem. I do on the other hand get extremely upset (secretly) if my cat is affectionate to other people. Im sure shes aware of that and does it deliberately though looking me in the eye and I have no shame in getting up and picking her up to put her straight on my lap and then spend hours laying still as she gets comfortable on me and has her 12 hour snooze.

I am very preoccupied with fantasies and a grand love that probably doesn't exist. (Venus trine Neptune)
I feel like Im in a different world when I paint, sing, play the piano and feel love and I stare and day dream alot. Me and my ex were watching a movie in bed last night and the whole movie I was staring at him with my back turned to the movie not really a *stare of love* but just day dreaming and watching him, observing his facial features and facial expressions.

I do have unrealistic expectations as well. Im a perfectionist. I don't like to repeat myself and expect things to be done right the first time. I do lack empathy mos of the time if people close to me cant be as great as I imagine in my head.

posted April 05, 2010 06:10 AM         

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I feel like Im in a different world when I paint, sing, play the piano and feel love and I stare and day dream alot. Me and my ex were watching a movie in bed last night and the whole movie I was staring at him with my back turned to the movie not really a *stare of love* but just day dreaming and watching him, observing his facial features and facial expressions.

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