posted January 29, 2011 02:46 AM            

Inescapably, reading a natal chart (tropical zodiac...and the OP seemed to be referring to that) involves generalizing personality traits. Even if it's done in a delicate, nuanced way, looking at the chart overall, gently using terms like "potential," it's still partly about saying: "Your Mars in Leo means you are likely to have these characteristics."

posted January 29, 2011 02:59 AM            

in my 2nd house, my ego,self expression,vitality is especially focused on matters of security,possessions

now considering the aspects to my Sun from the Mainstream Astrology (20th Century astrological system)

trine Moon - 2'10 orb (1'22 in Right Ascension)
quincunx Saturn - '13
ego/self expression/vitality (Sun) involve emotional nature/feelings/instincts (Moon) and structure/discipline/restrictions (Saturn)

Now that we are in the 21st Century and Pluto's fellow transneptunian dwarf planet/candidates have been discovered in the 21st century, my ego/self expression/vitality could be much better understood from the 21st century astrological perspective

Sun conjunct Ixion - '05 - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
Sun conjunct Quaoar - 2'58 (1'46 in Right Ascension)
Sun oppose Sedna - '44 in Right Ascension - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
Sun quincunx Varuna - '05 in Right Ascension
Sun contraparallel Orcus - '01 in Declinations - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
ego/self expession/vitality (Sun) involve karma/2nd chances (Ixion), creativity/inspiration (Quaoar), environmental awareness/caretaking for humanity/victimization (Sedna), cosmic order/justice/judgment (Varuna), oaths/promises (Orcus) as well as evolutionary intensification (transneptunian dwarf planet/candidate)

Sun conjunct Geocentric South Eris Node - '09 - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
Sun oppose Geocentric North Eris Node - '10 - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
Sun oppose/conjunct Heliocentric Eris Nodes - '10 - strong theme that shouldn't be ignored
ego/self expression/vitality (Sun) involve collective diversity/equality/discord (Eris Nodes) as well as collective evolutionary intensification (transneptunian dwarf planet nodes)

With my very strong personal connections to the Eris Nodes, I have the strong potential to be a public figure that involves collective diversity/equality/discord (Eris Nodes) and collective evolutionary intensification (transneptunian dwarf planet nodes)

Sun also is associated with important males in my life, and so all my Solar Aspects pertain to my experiences with my father and stepfather.
They could even pertain to my maternal grandfather and maternal uncles.

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted January 29, 2011 03:27 PM            

He got pulled over by a local policeman and harassed for having a string hanging from the rear view mirror. Including a ticket for the offense.

When he spoke to his father, he mentioned about the incident. His father made the statement, "well if you looked more normal they wouldn't bother you".

What do you think was his response...

"What if my skin was a different color Dad, would it matter about the mohawk?" It stopped him completely.

Prejudice and judgment come in all forms. I'm as guilty as the rest of humanity. But by recognizing it I can start to understand my own shortcomings. I think many folks would benefit from a little peaceful insight into their own personality make-up, instead of trying to pin a trait on a chart.

Astrology is a valid tool like anything else. It can be used and misused at will. Free will.

I'm a musician, I can read music and interpret it. Music notation is kinda like reading an astrological chart. There is a ton of information. What notes in what order, how hard or soft, how fast or slow, etc. If I was to take the literal notation and play exactly what is written (do exactly as I'm told), you'd have a wooden, unemotional string of notes. It's when you interpret that chart and express it in harmony and balance that beautiful music can be heard, felt and seen. Our inner make up is no different.

posted January 29, 2011 03:41 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Benedict Moon*:

Actually, I usually cancel plans because I'm busy and overwhelmed as well. Astrology would be much more positive to study if people were much more flexible with it instead of sticking to rigid stereotypes.

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posted January 29, 2011 03:53 PM            

I have to disagree with Lonake regarding learning Sun sign traits. Most people come to astrology via their Sun sign. If they didn't recognize the stereotype of the Sun sign within themselves, then they'd have no reason to look at astrology any further.

That said, I don't think people necessarily convey every stereotype about their Sun sign. The rest of the chart does influence things.

posted January 29, 2011 04:31 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by AcousticGod:
I agree with everything Lucia has said.

I have to disagree with Lonake regarding learning Sun sign traits. Most people come to astrology via their Sun sign. If they didn't recognize the stereotype of the Sun sign within themselves, then they'd have no reason to look at astrology any further.

That said, I don't think people necessarily convey every stereotype about their Sun sign. The rest of the chart does influence things.

Also, the ASC traits; I don't believe they're learned as an effect of environment. I exhibited none of the typical Gemini chatiness as a result of my upbringing. In my fire dominated house, I'm sure that would have been welcomed. No, my Saturn opposite Mercury kept me understated, and rather aloof from my family. My Gemini side went along with the cold logic of Capricorn. The only Gemini trait I really exhibited was quick learning, which could happen under a myriad of charts.

---

are you often seen as one of a pair in public? do you look to learn something from others, more than the average person does maybe?

..i did happen to relate to much of my sun sign, but i have a stellium with every personal planet in 11th house taurus and a moon that's just into gemini.. my husband is a libra sun, but in 4th house with moon on his cancer asc, which squares his sun sign, so he didn't believe in astrology until after i started studying it and figured out why his didn't fit as well

posted January 29, 2011 05:17 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Glaucus:
No..I don't think the Sun Sign shows the person's central/core personality. That's just my view though.

Also..not everybody in this forum believes in the use of tropical zodiac.

There are even some people here that only use the Sidereal Zodiac.

I know an Australian Astrologer that hasn't used zodiac signs nor houses in over 10 years. His astrological system is heavily based on the geometry in Astrology and fixed stars.

I just think sunsign placement is only a small piece. I believe that the aspects to the Sun have to be taken into account. Of course, I believe the whole entire chart has to be taken into account.

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well this is what i always try to explain to people who start to battle about vedic/western zodiac!there are many ways to it!i personally love the geometric patterns the most.its like a geometric language having its own message.personally i also can relate to lucia,i tend to be better at guessing peoples sunsign than anything else.but i think the whole picture counts,the art in astrology is to *get the picture* right...and even though i am dumb with asteroids i think they do have an effect and also the vedic nakshatras make sense,but maybe it requires some years of study to get the real picture

astrology can be a tool for many things,soulcontracts,lifemission,personallitytraits...mainly all aspects of spirituality are involved.we are all observers of the inner and outer world,and i think we all categorize if with or without astrology.being in the *flow* without any judgment or idea is a enlightened state of being i think...i am not there yet

posted January 29, 2011 05:41 PM            

Why do you make that statement?
Where do you get your information?

I never said that I don't like Virgos.

If you're referring to my signature, that's referring to my not being a tropical Virgo Sun. It was mainly a retort to people that try to pin down my writing style here as Virgo when it's actually compensation for my Dyslexic/Dyspraxic/ADHD in regards to how I process information.

Technically though, my Sun is actually in the Virgo Constellation in the actual 13 constellation zodiac (not the same as sidereal)

but Virgo constellation has a different meaning from the tropical/sidereal meaning

Virgo traits are based on it being mutable Earth and Mercury being its ruler

My Ascendant is in tropical Virgo.

You state wrong when you make a point about me not liking Virgos. I like people of any sunsign because people can't be pinned down by sunsigns nor would I liked to be prejudiced against people regardless what they have in their astrological charts.

If you don't like Scorpios, that's your issue. I don't have that sunsign issue. Therefore, don't compare me to me in regards to not liking certain sunsigns.

Of course, I am not a typical Sun in Scorpio for my Sun is strongly modified by certain objects and points as I already listed in this thread.

I hope that I set the record straight.

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No..I am not a Virgo.

posted January 29, 2011 05:48 PM            

I hope that I set the record straight.

[/B][/QUOTE]

posted January 29, 2011 06:27 PM            

Here is the thread that I was talking about.
I got annoyed with my being pidgenholed with astrology http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/205166.html

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A different mind is NOT a deficient mind.

posted January 29, 2011 06:33 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by AcousticGod:
I agree with everything Lucia has said.

I have to disagree with Lonake regarding learning Sun sign traits. Most people come to astrology via their Sun sign. If they didn't recognize the stereotype of the Sun sign within themselves, then they'd have no reason to look at astrology any further.

That said, I don't think people necessarily convey every stereotype about their Sun sign. The rest of the chart does influence things.

Also, the ASC traits; I don't believe they're learned as an effect of environment. I exhibited none of the typical Gemini chatiness as a result of my upbringing. In my fire dominated house, I'm sure that would have been welcomed. No, my Saturn opposite Mercury kept me understated, and rather aloof from my family. My Gemini side went along with the cold logic of Capricorn. The only Gemini trait I really exhibited was quick learning, which could happen under a myriad of charts.

---

posted January 30, 2011 12:28 PM            

quote:

---

can be a multitude of reasons for any sign... cancers can be very home-centered, needing peace in the serenity of their own home, their emotions (and sympathetic natures) can overwhelm them sometimes.. could just be that a night out with lots of noise is like nails on chalkboard for them

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Exactly. All the signs are multi-faceted and three dimensional...they don't just operate in one mode (eg. pettiness for cancer in that earlier example). Its just kind of ridiculous (and very 'low' watersign, for irony's sake) to assume when there's a change in anything, we're obviously mad at someone. Sometimes we get 'overwhelmed' too... by the emotional stimuli of the outside world, and therefore we need a BREAK too. LOL.

posted January 30, 2011 01:53 PM            

Seriously, though--the problem is partly in my clumsiness articulating how I find that this works. Like last night, I was talking to someone at a party and astrology came up and I said, "Well, you must be an Aquarius," and after she confirmed that she was, I just sort of felt like I could understand the motivations for her behavior better, and predict her behavior better. In the past, this has played out over and over again in my life and been confirmed as accurate--only dealing with friends, never in my own love life because my Cancer Moon-Saturn in the 7th blocks me I think--but, as another example, my friend was having problems with her Aries boyfriend and I told her what he was likely to do. He did what I had predicted. And I accurately guessed what was going on with him and WHY he was acting a certain way, which she ended up being very grateful that she'd known before her told her, she felt it helped her prepare herself.

It's hard to articulate this stuff, but if it didn't work to help accurately predict people's behaviors and the motivations behind them 90+% of the time, I wouldn't still be drawn to it.

posted January 30, 2011 03:11 PM            

But yeah, I do think it's a fair rule of thumb to assume Cancer Sun behavior toward someone is personal, and motivated by their feelings about that particular person. Accurate 95+% of the time. Also, 100% of the Cancers I know, I've seen engage in passive-aggressive behavior--at some point, I've sensed they were feeling something and wanted me to ask them twice about it, and in the end it's borne out that that's an accurate feeling. Most of the Geminis I am close to, that kind of thing has never happened.

posted January 30, 2011 03:12 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Benedict Moon*:
I didn't twist anything you said, that's just how I interpret anything that involves passive-aggressive behavior. Anyways, you're completely missing my point which would be that not everything we do is motivated about how we feel about a PARTICULAR person. Sometimes it has to do with the general day, mood, life circumstances, or the freaking dog. Yes, I guess I can agree there might be an emotional component there, but its not always personal. People thinking like that only proves my point on why astrology can be so negative as a learning experience.

---

I agree.

I love your practical, common sense logical view on things.

VirgoMask is like that too,and that's something that I love about her.

------------------
A different mind is NOT a deficient mind.

posted January 30, 2011 03:56 PM            

quote:

---

But yeah, I do think it's a fair rule of thumb to assume Cancer Sun behavior toward someone is personal, and motivated by their feelings about that particular person. Accurate 95+% of the time. Also, 100% of the Cancers I know, I've seen engage in passive-aggressive behavior--at some point, I've sensed they were feeling something and wanted me to ask them twice about it, and in the end it's borne out that that's an accurate feeling. Most of the Geminis I am close to, that kind of thing has never happened.

---

I don't think that's fair to assume at all from my POV, because that's only true about a much less percentage of the time for me and the majority of the cancers I know. And I have a whole stellium in Cancer so if you tell me again that I'm 'atypical', I'll seriously LOL.

Again, I'm not disagree about the emotional component, just the personal one.

And thank you, Glaucus. Virgo placements really do rule!

posted January 30, 2011 04:20 PM            

But maybe you were referring to someone else who said you seemed like an atypical Cancer?