posted February 05, 2012 06:00 AM            

My, my, you have been quite the active poster recently.

Re: Magi Society philosophy and tone…

It is my opinion that the Magi Society was never intended to be a one-size-fits-all type of astrological organization. It is a specific niche organization in the astrological landscape that is especially attractive to left brain type, linier logical thinkers [verses right brain type intuitive thinkers]. The Magi Society is a distinctive mix of Asian cultural mores combined with Judeo-Christian philosophy combined with calculated scientific analysis combined with financial analyst’s sensibilities. They have no problem calling it like they see it. They abhor astrological sacred cows that do not prove to be valid under rigorous scientific research analysis and could care less as to how they astrological establishment perceives their findings. They do not do conferences; they do not do newsletters or journals, all they really do is astrological research, astrological education, and they create software to assist those who want to practice their methodology. While some in the astrological community perceive the Magi Society negatively, there are others who see them as a beacon of light, shifting the astrological paradigm. And from experience, I know that if as an astrologer that you embrace whichever methodology you have chosen to use to the extent that it has become a part of your identity, well then the Magi Society is going to push your buttons in a big way.

All that being said, if you try their methods and it works for you, then I strongly suggest you pay the $80 dollars and become a member. Having access to the Magi Society member’s only websites is well worth the membership investment.

As for the natalization day and the transits to the natal, I’m very visual and generally won’t comment much on chart data without seeing the actual charts. If you feel comfortable posting the relevant data, that will allow me to pull up my own charts, then I’d be happy to take a gander.

As to some of your questions….
Re: Also, would that mean that a planetary eclipse be one of the strongest enhancing aspects then?

Yes, you would award a planetary eclipse the power of three to four times that of a single pure linkage.

Re: I notice that sometimes the heliocentric charts are being used, and I wonder how important are they compared to the geocentric and what is their qualitative difference in an interpretation?

In Magi Astrology the heliocentric dimension, both longitude and latitudes, is used concurrently with the geocentric dimension. Both are vitally important. The qualitative difference is minimal. In general, if you are practicing Magi Astrology, you would use the heliocentric dimension at every juncture and with every type of chart.

Re: I have in my geocentric chart: Sun conjunct Mercury, but also ALMOST Sun parallel Mercury; the orb is 1°16, so almost 1.3 in decimal, and if I am rightly informed, then only an orb of 1.2 is applied, right? I was wondering if the fact that there is already an aspect in the longitudes allows for expanding the natal orb? (I think I have seen it done in synastry, but is it okay in natals, too?)

Yes, with a planetary eclipse, which is also technically a bi-level aspect, you can expand the orbs.

Re: Also, Sun parallel Venus and Mercury parallel Venus (both are well in orb). This means that if I can allow an orb of 1.3 for Sun parallel Mercury, there is a planetary configuration of Sun, Mercury and Venus in the declinations. Is this a Magi Pyramid? Or is it not considered one because, I think, I read only selected planets are used for the Magi Pyramid, and Mercury is not one of those?

In geocentric declinations when you have three or more planets in alignment you may expand the orb for one aspect up to 1.6 degrees. It is not a Magi Pyramid.

Re: So the Sun-Mercury aspect actually is:
- a bi-level aspect, possibly a planetary eclipse?
- a trans-dimensional aspect?

The Sun-Mercury is an eclipse and all eclipses are inherently bi-level, and it is also trans-dimensional as the Earth carries the Sun [and Moon]symbolism in the heliocentric realm.

Re: Does this mean it (Mercury) is has special emphasis in my chart? (Knowing myself, it would indeed make sense)

Obviously from the aspects you listed Mercury has significant influence on the self and your identity (Sun/Earth) but most things in charts are relative and without examining the entire chart it is difficult to speculate on the amount of significance.

Re: That triple parallel probably would indicate something like being a person (Sun) who loves (Venus) to communicate (Mercury), right? Or even give some verbal skills?

That would be a valid interpretation. The Venus in and of itself would not specifically point to exclusively verbal communication. It would more so point to the style of communication, such as Venus often shows up as especially gracious and polite.

Re: But how are the activation aspects being interpreted in a natal? Like that T-square of Earth-Mercury-Jupiter in helio?

The Magi Society has stated that no natal aspect is provably bad or negative. Therefore in natal chart interpretation, activation aspects are not automatically interpreted with a negative slant. A Magi Astrology interpretation of that alignment would be a wise person who is a gifted communicator, possess copious amounts of common sense, and is especially adept at diving deeply into subject matter.

Re: (3) Juno in personal aspect and its counter-medicine? in geo I have following planetary synchronization, involving Juno:
Moon-Saturn-(Chiron)-Juno
Moon bidirectional quinkunx Saturn (0.1)
Moon bidirectional sextile Chiron (2.9)
Moon semisextile Juno (0.1)
Saturn widely square Chiron double retrograde (3.1)
Saturn bidirectional Juno (0.0)
Chiron widely semisextile Juno (3.1) ° probably Chiron is not really a part of that synchronization due to the wide orbs?

If you would like to share the chart data, I will take a look.

Re: also how important are planetary synchronizations which contain semisextile and sextile instead of enhancements or even activation-angles?

Again, importance in a chart is relative. Without seeing the entire chart it’s very difficult to ascertain what the order of importance is. Can alignments such as that be important? Sure. Are they always important? Not necessarily.

Re: The orb of Pluto/Juno again is above the usual orb - does it still count?

Yes, if it is in an alignment of three or more planets.

Re: And if so, to what degree?

Anytime you expand the orb, the alignment is weakened somewhat. The smaller the expansion, the less the weakening.

Re: Also, if Juno symbolism includes infidelity and Uranus also is indicative of change, wouldn´t that be signs of a person, prone to cheating or a "wanderer"?

Yes.

Re: But I am not like that. Maybe I am a tad indecisive, but fidelity is something that is important to me. I was wondering if this configuration in helio might act as a "balance" then? Neptune latitude Vesta 0.3
Jupiter contralatitude Neptune 0.3
Jupiter contralatitude Vesta 0.0

Yes.

Re 4) I was wondering if this was a planetary synchronization?
Jupiter conjunct Ceres
Jupiter/Ceres square Neptune
Jupiter quinkunx Pluto
Jupiter semisextile Pallas
Neptune sextile Pluto
Neptune sextile Pallas
Pluto trine Pallas very closely (orb: 0.1)

If all the aspects are within orb,or within orb with one exception, then yes.

Re: (5) interlocking planetary geometry
-------------------------------------
how is it interpreted if there are interlocking planetary geometry or even just a single planet aspecting one other planet, which is involved in planetary geometry otherwise?

On one of the Magi Society’s members only websites there is a lesson on planetary geometry interpretation that answers this question. As it is a member’s only lesson, and the Magi Society uses these advanced lessons to encourage membership and to enhance the value of being a member, it would not be ethical for me to share their thoughts on the subject in this public forum.

Re: I noticed that Sandy mentioned focal or focus aspects on her website, when she was analyzing natal charts, and I wondered what makes a planet a focal planet?

Focus Aspect = The aspect closest to exact by distance orb.

Focal Planet = The most frequent occurring planet within the top few listings in the Magi Quad sequence.

Focal Planets were identified easier with the original MagiSoft software that is no longer sold or supported by the Magi Society. It’s become somewhat of an esoteric concept that due to many factors is no longer commonly used in Magi Astrology.

posted February 05, 2012 06:05 AM            

I checked his chart, and

he has Sun precisely contraparallel Neptune on 22.15 S and N (it is actually only 3 SECONDS from being exact!)

Additionally his Sun was parallel (and Neptune contraparallel) his Mars and Uranus.

Amazing.

EDIT:
I was checking my paternal grandmother`s chart, cause she turned 90 last year, and through all ailments she certainly had, she is a picture of health and an amazing regeneration.
She was twice diagnosed with Cancer, had to have surgery last year because of a skinrelated Cancer-like symptom (it was not malign, thank God, but a surgery in her age is always a risk) including a transplant of skin to her nose; she has had Diabetes for as long as I can think.
Yet at the same time she is a picture of health, recoverd from all these ailments which left the doctors quite puzzled to be honest.

Anyway I did not see a Sun-Neptune aspect in geo.
But she has a close triple conjunction of Sun, Mars and Pluto with a Sun-Mars planetery ecclipse, and all three are trine Uranus.

A proximity enhanced quinkunx of Chiron and Jupiter, and Chiron is also trine Neptune.

In the heliocentric Earth is quinkunx and very closely latitude Neptune.

Proximity enhanced and transdimensional Mars-Pluto-conjunction, trine Uranus, square Earth and square Chiron (Earth opposes Chiron, also almost precise)

Mars latitude Jupiter

I think that suffices to illustrate the unbelievable stamina and perseverance she has had in her life. She has been through a lot of traumatic experiences; every single of them would have sufficed to break a person easily, but she stood strong.

posted February 05, 2012 07:35 AM            

"My, my, you have been quite the active poster recently."
Sorry, I guess my enthusiasm just carried me away a little. I`m like that, when I am intrigued with something.

"linier logical thinkers"
It`s what pulled me in the first time around; the consistency with which they seemed to stick to their rules; I had noticed that other astrologers had their own set of rules as well but were bending them to make something "fit". I found that to be very "lacking" and inconsistent.

"All that being said, if you try their methods and it works for you, then I strongly suggest you pay the $80 dollars and become a member. Having access to the Magi Society member’s only websites is well worth the membership investment."
Yes, it`s tempting, and I certainly do not shy away from investing the money; what I don´t like is becoming a "member". What does this mean? What does it imply?
It`s my personal taste, that I really try to avoid to become member of any group, if I can avoid it at all. Unfortunately this would be the only way to even buy their software, which I would love to.
But I don`t want to be forced to sign any kind of contract (that is what "member" is, right? )just in order to by their software.
Yes, maybe I am a bit weird that way; but I don`t like to commit to an organization like that. Not because It is the Magi corporation, I don`t like to do that with any organization. Which is the only reason I do not already have the software.

"In Magi Astrology the heliocentric dimension, both longitude and latitudes, is used concurrently with the geocentric dimension. Both are vitally important. The qualitative difference is minimal."
So if a Venus-Chiron linkage or a Saturn-Chiron clash happened in the heliocentric, it would be just as good or bad as if it was in geo?

"In geocentric declinations when you have three or more planets in alignment you may expand the orb for one aspect up to 1.6 degrees."
Wow! I didn`t think I was allowed to expand the orb that much; is the same true for CAC`s?

" It is not a Magi Pyramid."
What does consitute a Magi Pyramid?
Do all planets have to be either parallel or contraparallel?
Or do the included planets have to be Sun, Venus, Jupiter, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto or Chiron?
Is that so, because these are considered beneficial or in the case of Pluto, powerful?

"That would be a valid interpretation. The Venus in and of itself would not specifically point to exclusively verbal communication."
Yes, I was thinking that maybe Mercury contributes the communication-part (verbal and nonverbal) and Venus would give it some grace/ diplomacy.

"The Magi Society has stated that no natal aspect is provably bad or negative."
So it really depends on the symbolism of the planets I guess?

" Magi Astrology interpretation of that alignment would be a wise person who is a gifted communicator, possess copious amounts of common sense, and is especially adept at diving deeply into subject matter. "
Wow, that is a really positive interpretation, and I naturally love it.
It would be a tad arrogant of me to say it fits, but well, at least I am trying to be like that. And I love delving deeply into matters that really interest me, especially mentally.

"If you would like to share the chart data, I will take a look.
"
It`s my own chart. My data is: 18th december 1974; 7:07 a.m., Dülken/ Viersen in Germany (6e20; 51n15)

"Again, importance in a chart is relative. Without seeing the entire chart it’s very difficult to ascertain what the order of importance is."
How do I know if it is important or not?
Does that depend on if there is other stronger planetary geometry or not?
Let`s say in one chart there are numerous Grand trines and Yods, then the planetary synchronization including the weaker aspects, would not be as relevant as in a chart wher there is no dynamic symmetrical planetary geometry, then the simple planetary synchronization would be more important?

"Anytime you expand the orb, the alignment is weakened somewhat. The smaller the expansion, the less the weakening. "
Yes that makes sense.

"Yes."
I was wondering. Since it is my chart, I know that I am placing much importance on faithfulness, BUT in a previous post you said that Juno also rules "illusions", and I was wondering if that might also denote a certain uncertainty about one`s own feelings?
I have noticed that sometimes I am not really certain if I am really in love, of if I am just "dreaming it up"?
And conversely sometimes people pointed out to me that I was radiating that "being in love" feeling clearly to the people around me when in the presence of a certain someone, when it never even had crossed my mind.
It`s a pretty peculiar thing and difficult to handle, cause how can I commit if I don´t even know it`s the real thing and not some illusio,t hat I momentarily think of as truth?

Are doubts a symbolism of Juno? Or this doubting, what would symbolize it?

"t would not be ethical for me to share their thoughts on the subject in this public forum. "
Yes, I respect that. I did not know it was unpublished knowledge.

"It’s become somewhat of an esoteric concept that due to many factors is no longer commonly used in Magi Astrology. "
Thank you, so I don`t have to rack my brain about this, and will still be somewhat able to find out insightful points in an analysis.

"As an FYI, here is a pretty good Magi Astrology Glossary: http://makeagreatchoice.com/insights/glossary.php "
Thank you.
Yes, I regularly read on the four mentioned websites. They are a really great source of information, but some things become clearer in direct communication.

I was also wondering about the Nuclear and the Heartbreak Clash.
I have the uncanny ability to draw people into my life with whom I form th Nuclear Clash (usually multiple ones actually). I read that this is the worst clash, but I haven`t personally experienced that way.
Of course it is not like walking on sunshine and there often are discussions and disagreements, but all in all I experienced this more on a mental or philosophical level and usually "deal-able", when in comparision the Heartbreak-clash really hurt, a really painful experience, especially since usually there were feelings involved, but it just did not work out, and that was of course painful. Even in transits the Heartbreak transits, were exactly that: heartbreaking (I have just been through one,w hen Tr Saturn was opposing my Chiron in october, luckily it will not complete that transit again during his retrograde motion).

Have you experienced that as well, that the Nuclear Clash is less difficult on an emotional level, even though of course still postes serious challenges regarding coming to an agreement on philosophical / life-style-issues?

Thank you for your patience.
If I am getting too pushy or greedy for your taste or you do not longer wish to communicate with me, just let me know.
I tend to not notice the subtle signals of someone else`s tiredness/boredom with a subject, if I am totally immersed in it enthusiastically.
So I sometimes need a verbal hint that I am overdoing things.

posted February 05, 2012 04:17 PM            

There is no contract on the membership, no membership card, no newsletters, no membership directory etc…. There is a fairly restrictive agreement that you may accept or decline when you activate their software. If you have previously purchased investment analysis or stock analysis software it’s in line with what’s expected in that industry. It’s probably a little more restrictive than most astrological software company’s use. The Magi Society has copyrighted and patented some of their proprietary elements and they don’t want it pasted all over the internet. So if you purchase the interpretation modules you may not post their content on the internet. You also may not post their proprietary charts on the internet without their permission. When I activated my software I read through it all twice before I agreed and I found nothing that I felt was unfair or overly restrictive. I’m a business man, I understand that they want to protect their proprietary interests and none of their stipulations constrict me in the slightest.

Re: So if a Venus-Chiron linkage or a Saturn-Chiron clash happened in the heliocentric, it would be just as good or bad as if it was in geo?

Essentially yes, if you put a gun to my head I would say geocentric is ever so slightly more important, but the difference is very slight.

Re: "In geocentric declinations when you have three or more planets in alignment you may expand the orb for one aspect up to 1.6 degrees."
Wow! I didn`t think I was allowed to expand the orb that much; is the same true for CAC`s?

Yes

Re: What does consitute a Magi Pyramid?
Do all planets have to be either parallel or contraparallel?
Or do the included planets have to be Sun, Venus, Jupiter, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto or Chiron?

Again I will refer you to the helpful Magi Astrology glossary here http://makeagreatchoice.com/insights/glossary.php

Re: Is that so, because these are considered beneficial or in the case of Pluto, powerful?

These are research based parameters. These combinations are stronger success indicators.

Re: "The Magi Society has stated that no natal aspect is provably bad or negative."
So it really depends on the symbolism of the planets I guess?

For the most part, yes, the combined symbolism is the meat and potatoes of the interpretation.

Re: "Again, importance in a chart is relative. Without seeing the entire chart it’s very difficult to ascertain what the order of importance is." How do I know if it is important or not? Does that depend on if there is other stronger planetary geometry or not? Let`s say in one chart there are numerous Grand trines and Yods, then the planetary synchronization including the weaker aspects, would not be as relevant as in a chart wher there is no dynamic symmetrical planetary geometry, then the simple planetary synchronization would be more important?

In Magi Astrology symmetrical geometry is king. The more planets in synchronization the more powerful. The more pure enhancements in the geometric configuration the more powerful (i.e. grand trines and conjuncted trines are more powerful than yods). Tight orbed geometry is more powerful than larger orbed geometry. Geometry that includes Jupiter and/or the financial planets carries more weight. This would be an area where there are less hard and fast rules and more guidelines, as you are almost never getting an apples to apples comparison and the variables are such that experience goes a long way in establishing an order of importance as there are multiple value judgments where you are comparing and evaluating different criteria. Yet, most of the time you can get a clear idea of the most important alignments in a chart without a whole lot of difficulty.

Re: "Anytime you expand the orb, the alignment is weakened somewhat. The smaller the expansion, the less the weakening. "
Yes that makes sense.

Magi Astrology is very logical.

Re: I was wondering. Since it is my chart, I know that I am placing much importance on faithfulness, BUT in a previous post you said that Juno also rules "illusions", and I was wondering if that might also denote a certain uncertainty about one`s own feelings?
I have noticed that sometimes I am not really certain if I am really in love, of if I am just "dreaming it up"?

You have trans-dimensional Saturn-Juno (trine in geocentric , square in heliocentric) and they both have exceptionally tight orbs. This will often manifest in being way too optimistic and way too pessimistic about attractions, but struggling to find a reasonable balance of what is really there.

Re: And conversely sometimes people pointed out to me that I was radiating that "being in love" feeling clearly to the people around me when in the presence of a certain someone, when it never even had crossed my mind. It`s a pretty peculiar thing and difficult to handle, cause how can I commit if I don´t even know it`s the real thing and not some illusion, that I momentarily think of as truth? Are doubts a symbolism of Juno? Or this doubting, what would symbolize it?

The Saturn-Juno influence can certainly be doubting what is real. You are more vulnerable to not seeing your love life with clearity when Juno by progression or transit is enhancing your romance planets. Cinderella progression’s and transits tend to bring in sobriety of thought on your love life helping you to identify what is helpful and remove what is not. Here is a Magi Society article on the subject: http://www.magiastrology.com/a_new_way_to_know_for_sure_if_this_person_is_special.php

The good news is that Juno’s influence in most cases cannot hold up over time. In relationships, time is on your side. Taking things slow, letting things play out in a relaxed non-rushed manor will turn the tables on Juno. Over time you will see things much clearer and have much greater confidence in the viability of your connection.

Re: I was also wondering about the Nuclear and the Heartbreak Clash.
I have the uncanny ability to draw people into my life with whom I form th Nuclear Clash (usually multiple ones actually). I read that this is the worst clash, but I haven`t personally experienced that way. Of course it is not like walking on sunshine and there often are discussions and disagreements, but all in all I experienced this more on a mental or philosophical level and usually "deal-able"

Keep one very important thing in mind when it comes to Saturn clashes; the more intimacy the more impact. If you are sleeping with someone you form the clash with or you become business partners with someone you form the clash with, then it becomes more powerful. If you are the Saturn person, it sometimes will not be as turbulent for you. One of the primary symbolisms of the Saturn-Jupiter clash is irreconcilable differences. In some connections, it can be the case that those irreconcilable differences can be acknowledged and even though they are usually an elephant in the room, you agree to try and work around them. Although my experience is that eventually the number of elephants you are trying to work around become untenable and because of the inherent volatility of the Jupiter-Saturn connection the parting of the ways is rarely congenial or peaceful. The key thing with this clash is that it almost always impedes your combined judgment to a significant degree. Therefore combined success at any chosen endeavor is usually a very grueling road to travel.

Re: when in comparision the Heartbreak-clash really hurt, a really painful experience, especially since usually there were feelings involved, but it just did not work out, and that was of course painful. Even in transits the Heartbreak transits, were exactly that: heartbreaking (I have just been through one,w hen Tr Saturn was opposing my Chiron in october, luckily it will not complete that transit again during his retrograde motion).

You have a heartbreak clash as a part of the combined natal geometry of your Moon, Saturn and Chiron. It could be said that you might be sub-consciously and/or emotionally attracted to that energy.

The Magi Society has previously stated that the trademark of the Saturn-Chiron Heartbreak Clash is that it starts out as illusionary where you think the other person is someone or something that they are not and it leads you to being fully emotionally invested in them, and then over time, sometimes a large portion of time, you eventually become disillusioned as you come to the realization this person is not really who you thought they were, and due to the significant emotional investment it becomes very painful.

Re: Have you experienced that as well, that the Nuclear Clash is less difficult on an emotional level, even though of course still postes serious challenges regarding coming to an agreement on philosophical / life-style-issues?

I have found both to be emotionally taxing to a great extent. One of the characteristics of both of these clashes is that they become even more volatile, more vicious, and more actively destructive during the very worst times in your life. They are in the category of when it rains, it pours.

Re: Thank you for your patience.

posted February 06, 2012 04:03 AM            

"There is a fairly restrictive agreement that you may accept or decline when you activate their software."
So it is in a nutshell simply accepting the condition to not publish/post/upload their software or charts drawn with their software somewhere on the net?
I could live with that I think.
But why do I have to bcome a member for one year or more?
Has that to do with receiving updates, limited to a certain timeframe?

" I understand that they want to protect their proprietary interests"
Yes I certainly can understand that as well.

"

" if you put a gun to my head"
I wouldn´t dare to.

"Yet, most of the time you can get a clear idea of the most important alignments in a chart without a whole lot of difficulty."
Thank you for the explanation and I agree. I think I just have to study more charts though.

"This will often manifest in being way too optimistic and way too pessimistic about attractions, but struggling to find a reasonable balance of what is really there."
Yes, that`s very true. Though I tend to more often lean to the pessimistic side.

"You are more vulnerable to not seeing your love life with clearity when Juno by progression or transit is enhancing your romance planets. Cinderella progression’s and transits tend to bring in sobriety of thought on your love life helping you to identify what is helpful and remove what is not. Here is a Magi Society article on the subject: http://www.magiastrology.com/
a_new_way_to_know_for_sure_if_this_person_is_special.php"
Thank you, that is very helpful to see it written in such a concise manner.

For example I am going to have Tr Chiron conjunct natal Jupiter and quinkunx Pluto, are these Cinderella transits as well?

"concilable differences can be acknowledged and even though they are usually an elephant in the room, you agree to try and work around them."
Can it also be sometimes that despite genuine affection, or even love, people simply cannot be together, because of circumstances or having very different views on what they want in life?

"You have a heartbreak clash as a part of the combined natal geometry of your Moon, Saturn and Chiron. It could be said that you might be sub-consciously and/or emotionally attracted to that energy."
Yes, I can see how that would work.

I also ran a short check on my parent`s charts, and it turned out that my Dad also has in his natal a Saturn-Chiron-square (his is exact though), and my mum has a Saturn-Jupiter-opposition in her natal.
His Jupiter/Saturn-mp is quinkunx her Chiron; her Saturn/Chiron-mp is quinkunx his Chiron.
(are these as strong as clash aspects of Saturn to Chiron or Jupiter?).

in the CAC`s with my parents my Dad and me share a double Saturn-Chiron-quinkunx (each of us being Saturn), my Mum`s Saturn is quinkunx my Jupiter.

The thing is, my mum and my dad love each other very much, and have been having a good marriage so far (almost 40 years).
They are still holding hands, going out, socializing, talking with each other constantly (of course they have their discussions, as well, but they always come to an agreement).

And my parents have always cared for us children very well, as a matter of fact they still do. Especially my dad is very supportive and generous. He`s never let me down in any way, so I was suprised to find the double Heartbreak clash between our charts.
The nuclear clash with my mum, well, this one makes more sense.
We do have our disagreements and harsh discussions and difference of opinion, but underneath it all I always can count on her and she on me, and I am actually very close to both my parents.
(my mum`s Venus is quinkunx my Chiron, and her Chiron conjuncts my Sun - so I bet that helps a little; both my parent`s Pluto are trine my Chiron).

Anyway I disgress.
I was just wondering: are relationships with nuclear clash or heartbreak clash really "doomed"? (I usually do not believe in "doom", but of course I might be wearking rosecoloured glasses sometimes).

Even though of course no linkage or clash cancel each other out, would it help to have good linkage to raise a bit more of understanding even though the differences will not go away?

For example: since the nuclear clash probably indicates a serious incompatibility, would it be helpful to have Vesta-linkages or Jupiter-linkages to Sun, Moon, Venus, Jupiter, Neptune or Chiron?
And for the heartbreak-clash, would it help to have linkages of Chiron to Venus, Jupiter or Neptune?

Just like in the case of Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward, who also shared a Heartbreak clash. And they surely experienced heartbreak in their marriage (didn`t one of their sons die?), but somehow they had enough love to battle through it together.

In the case of my parents it probably was very heartbreaking for them, when my brother was being born with Down syndrome. But they stood together, and just adapted to the new direction their life had taken, and in fact founded and participated in two organizations helping to raise integration and understanding for people with Down syndrome.
So they accepted that "fate" and used their knowledge and experience to support others, and that has become a very uniting factor for them I think.

" then over time, sometimes a large portion of time, you eventually become disillusioned as you come to the realization this person is not really who you thought they were,"
Yes, I´ve also experienced that in friendships over and over again. Just recently actually. Interestingly I connected to that person when the heartbreak transit was applying, and ended it, when it had passed. It was very "timed".

posted February 06, 2012 03:18 PM            

I picked 5 couples, which are being considered successful (at least so far in the case of Banderas and Griffith), and then I picked 5 couples, who made the headlines with their volatile relationships, passionate break-ups, a "can`t-live-with you- can`t live with out you" theme and in some cases also with the premature death of one of the partners.

I wanted to know if there are any of these bad clashes in the stable couples, and if there are, is there a difference in quantity as compared to the volatile couples? (of course one has to take the whole charts into consideration)

The "stable" ones
-------------------
(1) Banderas - Griffith:
2 nuclear clashes

(2) Cash - Carter:
2 nuclear clashes

(3) Newman - Woodward:
2 heartbreak clashes

(4) Browning - Barrett-Browning:
1 nuclear clash

(5) Hanks - Wilson:
1 nuclear clash
1 heartbreak clash

so far it seems that couples with at most 2 of these clashes, can "make it", under certain circumstances (though every clash probably takes its toll).

the "volatile couples"
-------------------------
(1) rivera - Kahlo:
4 nuclear clashes
4 heartbreak clashes

(2) Sinatra - Gardner:
1 nuclear clash
4 heartbreak clashes

(3) Burton - Taylor:
2 nuclear clashes
6 heartbreak clashes

(4) Law - Frost:
4 heartbreak clashes

(5) the Curie`s:
(their relationship was not volatile as far as I know, but he died in an accident during their marriage; definitely a premature death and tragedy)

3 nuclear clashes
3 heartbreak clashes

To be honest, I am pretty amazed at the clarity of that.
I know, then charts are not nearly enough, but I found this to be an interesting tendency that is being displayed here.

posted February 06, 2012 10:57 PM            

Re: But why do I have to become a member for one year or more? Has that to do with receiving updates, limited to a certain timeframe?

I would not be the Magi Society membership structure expert. I have been a Magi Society member for a long time and they have always had the categories of one year membership, two year membership, etc…The length of membership as I understand it is tied to the purchase of additional modules for the base software. As you get to certain dollar amounts purchased they just extend your membership as a part of the sale. But, things can change, and I would recommend you contact them on a good astrological day and ask for membership information. http://www.magiastrology.com/contactus.php

Re: For example I am going to have Tr Chiron conjunct natal Jupiter and quinkunx Pluto, are these Cinderella transits as well?

Yes.

Re: Can it also be sometimes that despite genuine affection, or even love, people simply cannot be together, because of circumstances or having very different views on what they want in life?

In my experience that is one of the most common expressions of Saturn clashing with Jupiter.

Re: His Jupiter/Saturn-mp is quinkunx her Chiron; her Saturn/Chiron-mp is quinkunx his Chiron. (are these as strong as clash aspects of Saturn to Chiron or Jupiter?)

Yes. Also, I would advise you to use a narrow orb for midpoints. The Magi Society says in their second book to use a 2.0 to 2.5 degree longitude orb in declinations and 1 degree in declination. I have found that 1.0 to 1.5 degrees in longitudes and less than .50 in declinations seems to be where they create more impact. Don’t get me wrong, I think the Magi Midpoint Orbs are valid, but when you get to the outer limits of the orb the energy is significantly diluted.

posted February 07, 2012 01:41 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by JayR:
Yes. Also, I would advise you to use a narrow orb for midpoints. The Magi Society says in their second book to use a 2.0 to 2.5 degree longitude orb in declinations and 1 degree in declination. I have found that 1.0 to 1.5 degrees in longitudes and less than .50 in declinations seems to be where they create more impact. Don’t get me wrong, I think the Magi Midpoint Orbs are valid, but when you get to the outer limits of the orb the energy is significantly diluted.

---

Thanks. For some strange reason I used 3 degrees for the midpoints; have to recheck the orbs of my parents clashes then.
(Edit: both are well within orb)

Anyway, is it true that with the midpoint-axis we only consider conjunction, trine, quinkunx, square (so no opposition, sextile, semisextile)?
And is that true for the declinations as well? do we consider the contraparallel here or the parallel?

posted February 07, 2012 05:34 AM            

I have definitely a weird relationship with Magi astrology. If you were googling for my old username and Magi astrology, you might find very conflicting views.

Currently I am in my "fascinated-and-I-want-to-learn" phase.

In a way, I for the moments see it "isolated" from my other astrological approaches.
It`s not easy to explain.

"definitely think that some of the Magi Astrology ideas are interesting."
Totally agree.
I especially love that they use such tight orbs, and the planetary synchronization, emphasizing triangles and of course the declinations as well.

I also remember that sometime ago - in my sceptical-refusal phase- I checked some CAC`s of longstanding couples for Chiron/Venus, Chiron/Jupiter, Chiron/Neptune to prove that they were wrong about it.
I failed. I had to realize with amazed surprise that indeed these aspects were so frequent, it did not seem to be possible it is a coincidence.
Maybe I am going to repeat that check-up.

I still think tat as much as I love Chiron-Neptune, it often is very generational, and I would like to see it combined with personal planets. Now for a conjoined trine of his Venus conjunct her Neptune, trine his Chiron - THAT sounds more individual to me.

" Only I disagree with the symbolism they assigned to Juno as being all about meaningless sex ect."
I would have agreed with you some months ago. Actually I would have very determinedly said that it is all about commitment and NOTHING ELSE: PERIOD.
Yeah. I iprobably would have shouted it. lol

Even though, I definitely am not sold on the "meaningless sex" and "infidelity" thing, I modified my view on Juno a bit.
It is not simply about commitment. What I observe is that Juno-aspects are very passionate. I think the sexual attraction with Juno is definitely there, which of course does not need to mean indifdelity will follow.
But thinking about the mythology, infidelity was a theme, as well as power, just that it was not Juno who cheated. She was more on the receiving end.

I am still keeping an eye on that Juno, and for now I simply observe that it definitely is being found frequently in marriages, and that there comes attraction with it as well.

Like you I have a Juno-aspect. Well Juno is exactly trine Saturn, but what I was talking aobut was the aspect in the declinations of Juno, Moon, Uranus being parallel and all being contraparallel Pluto.

No, I am not unfaithful, illoyal or simply interested in sexual gratification.
BUT I also notice that I seem to be more discontent than other people. I don`t know, I compare that to my best friend, who is in a very stable relationship, founded on friendship and raising kids, but lacking that romantic spark. And I couldn´t do that. I rather be alone, than be with someone without that spark. I often have that feeling of: Is that it? What if there is something else, something more, something deeper?

I am not unfaithful, but I guess I am a bit of a "restless soul".

Maybe that is Uranus-Juno. I don´t know. I think Venus-Juno would be different though.

All I know is for me I could not be content with the "status quo" in relationships. There has to be that inner flame. I don´t know. I guess I simply want too much.

"and intend to remain celibate until in a serious commitment…."
Same here.
Oh and I also have a strong Vesta aspect in the declinations if I remember it right.

"If some Magi Astrologer looked at my chart they would probably assume I’m some type of floozy…. Nothing could be further from the truth."
I`m not sure about that. Like all astrology it probably has to be seen in the context of the whole chart.

In my case I have it both there, the signs of a "wandering soul" and a "faithful devoted heart".

"’m not so convinced that Chiron equals ’True Love’, "
At first I thought so as well. Interstingly though, even in traditional astrology Venus-Chiron conjunction is sometimes referred to as "true love".
nowadays I see it like this.
I don´t relate to the Cinderella-happily-ever-after stuff, but Chiron seems to be a point where we are most vulnerable, pretty much defenceless, and if someone has a linkage to that part of our souls, especially from Venus, Jupiter, Neptune, all so smooth gentle kind energies, then ti could be like balm for our soul.
Maybe I wouldn´t call it Cinderellay, but I`d think the possibility of "healing love" is there, very much.
Of course if someone puts a square of Mars to our Chiron, it could be like a bulldozer on that very tender spot.

"It’s great when you have someone who knows your pain and yet accepts you anyway…"
Yes. I agree with that.

posted February 07, 2012 07:48 PM            

Heartbreak Clashes and Nuclear Clashes and their discussion in astrology forums tend to be some of the most commonly misunderstood Magi Astrology concepts, in my opinion.

Ceridwen, although this post is addressed to you as I am answering your direct questions, because this seems to be a very global issue related to Magi Astrology, please know that while you are reading this that my answer is both for you and for others who may follow this thread.

In the massive amount of romantic couples research the Magi Society conducted in 1990’s they found that Saturn clashes with Chiron were the single most common interaspect in the CAC [synastry] of committed romantic relationships that did not last. The Jupiter clash with Saturn was the second most common element for committed romantic relationships that do not last. The Magi Society has never said at anytime, or anywhere that these clash aspects are fiat accompli. They have never said it is a 100% certainty if you have these clashes in your relationship CAC (synastry) your relationship will fail. They have never said or even insinuated that there are no people who have successful committed long-term relationships with these aspects in play.

What the Magi Society has said is the each of these aspects is an exceptionally strong indicator of relationship turmoil so significant that the relationship has a high likelihood of failure. It is very much akin to a visit to the physician and finding out you have a catastrophic illness. The physician may tell you that 75% of the people with this diagnosis will die from it, but that does not mean you are going to die. It is likely you will die, it is probable you will die, but there is also a chance you may not die. The physician’s prognosis is based on scientific research and the probabilities that research revealed. The Magi Society is no different than the physician in this example. Their prognosis is based on the research and the probabilities it revealed.

The Magi Society has also said that the day you meet someone for the very first time and those transits to your chart on that day play a big role in the outcome of the relationship. Furthermore they have also said that the marriage chart is extremely powerful and if you get married on day that is astrologically auspicious in and of itself, AND the transits of that day make it a particularly auspicious day for both the charts of the husband and wife, that a fabulous wedding chart can help couples overcome very difficult clashes in their CAC. Notice the language. There are no guarantees. There are no hundred percent certainties, just probability and likelihood. When you see couples that are able to overcome these Heartbreak Clashes and Nuclear Clashes, it’s most probable that they met for the very first time on are very astrological auspicious day for them, and if they are married chances are that they were married on an astrologically auspicious day.
But also note that just like what your brief investigation uncovered, the more clashes you have the lower the probability they can be overcome.

One thing to be very clear on is that while these clashes can be overcome, they cannot be extinguished. The energy will be expressed in some form. The energy is definitely in play. If you research these couples you will find that, just like in the case of your parents, the energy will play out somewhere.

Re: For example: since the nuclear clash probably indicates a serious incompatibility, would it be helpful to have Vesta-linkages or Jupiter-linkages to Sun, Moon, Venus, Jupiter, Neptune or Chiron? And for the heartbreak-clash, would it help to have linkages of Chiron to Venus, Jupiter or Neptune?

posted February 07, 2012 07:57 PM            

In Magi Astrology the far and near midpoints are used concurrently. The combinations are conjunction/opposition, trine/sextile, square/square, and quincunx/semi-sextile. When referring to a midpoint aspect, you would use the most powerful expression of the pairing; conjunction, trine, square, and quincunx.

Note: Either the far and the near may be used in planetary geometry, regardless of the specific aspect the midpoint creates within the planetary geometry.

Re: do we consider the contraparallel here or the parallel?

posted February 08, 2012 08:18 AM            

"s said is the each of these aspects is an exceptionally strong indicator of relationship turmoil so significant that the relationship has a high likelihood of failure."
Of course, astrology is always about assessing the likelihood of something, but there are no 100% rules.

" It is very much akin to a visit to the physician and finding out you have a catastrophic illness."
Your example reminds me very much of someone who used to write or maybe is stil writing on the yahoo group.

"One thing to be very clear on is that while these clashes can be overcome, they cannot be extinguished. The energy will be expressed in some form."
Yes, that is how I understood it.

"There most likely is not enough attraction to begin with without some very powerful compatibility and romance linkages."
So probably if a couple had a lot of strong Saturn clashes, but no sexual or romance linkages, they would not be impelled to get closer to each other, instead there maybe would be animosity?
While if there were strong indicators of romantic and sexual attraction, it would most likely play out in a different way.

"Lots of helpful compatibility and romance linkages help, but they are not a cure all and they will not, in and of themselves, guarantee a successful overcoming of the clashes."
No of course not, but I was just thinking that maybe even though the differences are of course there, some of the helpful linkages would help to at least from time to time see the other side, or raise the understanding for the other person, even though they still may end up on different sides, so to speak.

I also found that often the first meeting chart will reflect the overall essence of the CAC.

posted February 08, 2012 08:26 AM            

So every parallel of Saturn/Chiron-mp to Chiron would also be considered as a Heartbreak-clash?

BTW I had a glimpse at the chart of the day the Magi Astrology published their first book "Astrology really works". Even though it of course is not the foundation date of Magi astrology, it was then that they "went public".
I was rather surprised to find that day had an exact opposition of Chiron to Saturn.

Of course there were also some other more positive aspects, but given the warnings they give about Saturn-Chiron, it surprised me to find that aspect in the publishing-chart. Though to be fair, it was at a time, they hadn`t published anything about Chiron yet.

(oh and there was a planetary synchronization of Sun cojunct Mercury, trine Jupiter and sextile Mars, as well as a pretty huge lineup in the declinations of Mercury, Venus, Jupiter, Uranus and Neptune, with Jupiter, Neptune and Uranus also having aspects in the heliocentric latitude to each other.
Longlasting (Neptune) success (Jupiter) in writing (Mercury) about the astrology (Uranus) of love and money (Venus as indicator of both)?

posted February 08, 2012 10:32 AM              

“PARALLEL: Two or more planets that are equal distant from the celestial equator, with each stellar body being either north OR south in declination. The influence is much like a conjunction” http://astrology.findyourfate.com/

Contraparallel :
An aspect formed when two planets are in opposite declination, that is, when they are the same distance from the celestial equator, one north of it and one south. Generally considered to operate like an opposition. http://www2.bitstream.net/~bunlion/bpi/Glossary.html#C

“CONTRA-PARALLEL: Two or more planets that are equal distant from the celestial equator, with one stellar body being north in declination and the other body being south. The influence is considered to be much like a opposition, although some consider similar to the conjunction.” http://astrology.findyourfate.com/

You can get these free from astro.com when you get your chart go to top left just above chart, see option. What to look for are when there is no aspect natally but a parallel in declination
View the additional tables (PDF)

posted February 08, 2012 10:55 AM              

quote:

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Re: Mystical Triangles—I have My Chiron trine His Neptune quincunx My Sun square My Chiron. However, My Venus is conjunct My Sun though at a wide orb of 4-5 degrees, therefore cannot replace My Sun in this Mystical triangle. But can it still have some sort of an enhancement effect on the triangle, enough to make it a Romantic Mystical Triangle?

---

Basic astrology forum, How to approach Synastry http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum12/private-jjLYZw161/HTML/000667.html
when you get this chart, please also post the *pdf file*, above left should be *view additional tables (PDF)* This will bring up the aspect grid –at a glance planet to planet. Post the whole PDF file, what we are looking for if scroll down to ‘partner comparison’ aspect grid
Please remember to reduce the orb ratio down to 40% as the max orb between planets is 3'

posted February 08, 2012 04:43 PM            

Can I just confirm about midpoint aspects in synastry from you please?

A Saturn/Jupiter midpoint trine say the Moon or Neptune or Venus or Chiron would be an emotional captivation? It acts just like Saturn in these matters?

A Saturn/Chiron midpoint conjunct Chiron would be an emotional captivation + heartbreak clash?

(Oh, and out of personal interest too, I don't find many Mercury magi aspects online, would a clash between Mercury and Neptune mean a lack of faith in what Mercury says for example?)

Thanks in advance for any information.

posted February 10, 2012 08:59 AM            

I am currently looking into planetary geometry, and saw that in a heliocentric CAC there was a Yod,comprised of Venus, Mars and Pluto.

Person A:
Venus: 6.9 Pisces
Mars: 5.9 Leo

Person B:
Pluto: 7.2 Libra

This is a Yod, containing the Venus-Pluto-linkage, and of course all of these are sexual planets.
Is this a sexual Dragon, or does a Dragon have to have JUNO as one of the planets forming the Yod or mystical triangle?

--------------

Another question concerns the Chiron/Jupiter. It is considered a Cinderella linkage, right? And very positive for a relationship.
But since Jupiter is not a romantic planet, aren´t linkages of Chiron to Venus or Neptune more romantic? Maybe even Venus-Neptune?
Wouldn´t the emphasis of Jupiter-Chiron be more on true compatibility, understanding, benevolence and simply feeling good around each other, which of course enhances true love, instead of arousing "lovey dovey" feelings?

Another question concerns Neptune and Pluto; if they are linking to Chiron those are considered Cinderella linkages as well, but how significant are they in actuality?
All three are moving so slowly, wouldn´t this be some kind of a generational aspect?
Wouldn`t these need to have some additional romantic aspects (like Venus-Neptune, Venus-Chiron, even Venus-Sun or Venus-Moon) to have the effect of raising the romantic attraction between two people so they may fall in love?

posted February 11, 2012 09:05 AM            

Re: A Saturn/Jupiter midpoint trine say the Moon or Neptune or Venus or Chiron would be an emotional captivation? It acts just like Saturn in these matters?

The Magi Society addressed this very issue in their article on the break-up of Sandra Bullock and Jesse James. http://www.magiastrology.com/sandra_bullock.htm

Re: A Saturn/Chiron midpoint conjunct Chiron would be an emotional captivation + heartbreak clash?

In the Magi Society’s second book, “The Magi Ephemeris and Other Secrets of Magi Astrology” they state that as far as midpoint crossings are concerned, you always go with the most powerful aspect, in this case that would be the conjunction. The clash would not apply in this example.

Re: (Oh, and out of personal interest too, I don't find many Mercury magi aspects online, would a clash between Mercury and Neptune mean a lack of faith in what Mercury says for example?

The Mercury clash interaspect with Neptune in a CAC is referred to in Magi Astrology as the “The Empathy Clash.” It also creates a general lack of ease in communication.

Re: Thanks in advance for any information.

posted February 11, 2012 09:50 AM            

Re: So every parallel of Saturn/Chiron-mp to Chiron would also be considered as a Heartbreak-clash?

No. The parallel is not a clash aspect in Magi Astrology.

Re: I am currently looking into planetary geometry, and saw that in a heliocentric CAC there was a Yod, comprised of Venus, Mars and Pluto.
Person A:
Venus: 6.9 Pisces
Mars: 5.9 Leo
Person B:
Pluto: 7.2 Libra
This is a Yod, containing the Venus-Pluto-linkage, and of course all of these are sexual planets. Is this a sexual Dragon?

Yes.

Re: Does a Dragon have to have JUNO as one of the planets forming the Yod or mystical triangle?

No.

Re: Another question concerns the Chiron/Jupiter. It is considered a Cinderella linkage, right? And very positive for a relationship. But since Jupiter is not a romantic planet, aren´t linkages of Chiron to Venus or Neptune more romantic? Maybe even Venus-Neptune? Wouldn´t the emphasis of Jupiter-Chiron be more on true compatibility, understanding, benevolence and simply feeling good around each other, which of course enhances true love, instead of arousing "lovey dovey" feelings?

In Magi Astrology all Chiron linkages to Jupiter are Cinderella Linkages. They are in the category of romantic linkages, but they are not the most romantic of the romantic linkages. The most powerful linkages in terms of purely romantic energy are linkages between romance planets; Chiron, Venus, and Neptune. In the Magi Society’s third book, “Magi Astrology: The Keys to Success in Love and Money,” Chapter 9: Special Linkages the are Signs of Love and Intimacy, is a helpful refresher. You can download it and the other the first 14 chapters here: http://www.magiastrology.com/mini-book.php

Re: Another question concerns Neptune and Pluto; if they are linking to Chiron those are considered Cinderella linkages as well, but how significant are they in actuality?

Very.

Re: All three are moving so slowly, wouldn´t this be some kind of a generational aspect?

Sometimes.

Re: Wouldn`t these need to have some additional romantic aspects (like Venus-Neptune, Venus-Chiron, even Venus-Sun or Venus-Moon) to have the effect of raising the romantic attraction between two people so they may fall in love?

“Have?” no; I would not agree they “have” to have those aspects. Would they be helpful to ignite the romantic fires as Venus rules both seduction and desire? Yes. Do not forget that the Magi Society symbolism for Venus is very different than mainstream astrology. In “Magi Astrology: The Keys to Success in Love and Money,” Chapter 13: Planets Have Personalities and Symbolisms the Magi Society devotes three pages of that chapter just to symbolism relating to Venus. Within that section it states;

“Venus rules adoration, emotional intimacy, attachment, desire, and infatuation, but in Magi Astrology, Venus does not rule love. This is because we at the Society are idealistic and think love is forever. Nothing with Venus is forever, though.”

posted February 11, 2012 10:14 AM            

"No. The parallel is not a clash aspect in Magi Astrology."
Yes, but what I was thinking was that if the near Chiron/Saturn-mp would be parallel some planet, wouldn´t the far Chiron/Saturn-mp would be contraparallel the same planet?

Though you said that only the strongest aspects to midpoints are considered,m and since I guess, the parallel is stronger than the contraparallel, the far midpoint, if contraparallel something would not be considered?

But if this is so, does that mean that there are no clashes with midpoints in the declinations? Because one midpoint would be parallel and one contraparallel and only the parallel would be counted?

"but they are not the most romantic of the romantic linkages. The most powerful linkages in terms of purely romantic energy are linkages between romance planets; Chiron, Venus, and Neptune."
That was what I was thinking, too. Thanks.

"The Keys to Success in Love and Money,” Chapter 9: Special Linkages the are Signs of Love and Intimacy, is a helpful refresher."
Yes, I have the book, and reread it. Especially the longer chapter on the special linkages is really a "Must read".
As well as the one on Romance Super linkages.

"Very."
So for example a Yod formed by one`s person Neptune-Pluto sextile to the other person`s Chiron would still be considered a possible sign of true love
Especially since it includes the lifetime Cinderella linkage of Neptune-Chiron?

"Do not forget that the Magi Society symbolism for Venus is very different than mainstream astrology."
Yes, I very much agree with the Magi astrology on this one. In fact I have always interpreted Venus as a sign of seduction, sensuality, romantic attraction rather than love.
Of course these things are often part of love, but they do not EQUAL love. And I find that Venus actually can be a bit on the selfish side, even if it is wrapped up in a smooth and sweet package. Seduction sums it up pretty much I think.

"othing with Venus is forever, though.”
Since Neptune rules things longterm, wouldn´t it make sense that Neptune appears quite often as a symbol of "true love".
That makes the Neptune-Chiron-linkage pretty much a strong linkage in terms of "soulmateship", doesn`t it?

BTW I read the article on Aaron Spelling and the mentioning of the IRON BUTTERFLY and FLYING EAGLE, would these two also have extra-significance if found in a CAC?

Which aspectfigures would be considered strongest in a CAC?

Grand trine, I guess.
Conjuncted trine, too?
(both containing three pure enhancements)

With a bit less impact the Yod?
(Still symmetrical, but not containing pure enhancements)

Mystical Triangle, too, though it is not symmetrical, but at least contains one pure enhancement somewhere?

Where on that list in term of signficiance for attraction would you see the IRON BUTTERFLY and FLYING EAGLE?

Also, I read about the GRAND SEXTILE, but it seems that the definition varies from the traditional one, and here one Grand sextile is made of of one opposition and three sextiles, instead of six sextiles?

posted February 12, 2012 09:54 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by JayR:
Hello Ceridwen,

Yes, without question Magi Astrology is very systematic and exceptionally logical. The Magi Society asserts that they are the largest association of scientific astrologers in the world. Theirs is a methodology based on research using generally accepted scientific protocols and it shows in how their brand of astrology is practiced.
.

---

It's been months since I am moaning about the system failure of astrology. If what you say above is correct, Magi astrology could be the one I am looking for.

Thank you so much !

posted February 14, 2012 08:46 PM            

Re: "No. The parallel is not a clash aspect in Magi Astrology." Yes, but what I was thinking was that if the near Chiron/Saturn-mp would be parallel some planet, wouldn´t the far Chiron/Saturn-mp would be contraparallel the same planet? Though you said that only the strongest aspects to midpoints are considered,m and since I guess, the parallel is stronger than the contraparallel, the far midpoint, if contraparallel something would not be considered? But if this is so, does that mean that there are no clashes with midpoints in the declinations? Because one midpoint would be parallel and one contraparallel and only the parallel would be counted?

It appears that you are not quite getting how midpoints work in declination. I believe the misunderstanding for you on this issue is that in declination and heliocentric latitudes midpoints are a strictly linear measurement, there are no far and near midpoints as you would find in longitudes, which is a circular measurement. When you have two planets placed anywhere on the circle there is equal distance to the near midpoint and equal distance to the far midpoint on the circle. In declinations, two planets only form one midpoint. In declinations there is no far or near designation. In declination there is only one place that is equal distance from both planets. For instance, if you have Saturn at 12 degrees of Southern declination and Chiron at 8 degrees of Southern declination then the Saturn/Chiron midpoint is at 10 degrees of Southern declination. Any planet within in the Southern declinations with a 1 degree plus or minus or minus orb from 10 degrees, essentially anything from 9 to 11 degrees of Southern declination, would be parallel to the Saturn/Chiron midpoint. Any planet residing within 9 to 11 degrees of NORTHERN declinations would be contra-parallel to the Saturn/Chiron midpoint at 10 degrees Southern declinations. Only the contra-parallels would be clashes as in Magi Astrology all Saturn and Saturn midpoints are considered to be clashes when they are in a contra-parallel aspect.

Re: So for example a Yod formed by one`s person Neptune-Pluto sextile to the other person`s Chiron would still be considered a possible sign of true love, especially since it includes the lifetime Cinderella linkage of Neptune-Chiron?

Yes, possible but not exclusive nor conclusive.

Re: Since Neptune rules things longterm, wouldn´t it make sense that Neptune appears quite often as a symbol of "true love". That makes the Neptune-Chiron-linkage pretty much a strong linkage in terms of "soulmateship", doesn`t it?

It would certainly be considered as one of the possible indicators. Also, Neptune does not have a monopoly on the longevity symbolism, in Magi Astrology one of the Chiron symbolisms is “enduring.”

Re: BTW I read the article on Aaron Spelling and the mentioning of the IRON BUTTERFLY and FLYING EAGLE, would these two also have extra-significance if found in a CAC?

Yes. (here it is for those of you who would like to read it http://www.magiastrology.com/aaron_spelling.htm )

Re: Which aspect figures would be considered strongest in a CAC? Grand trine, I guess. Conjuncted trine, too?(both containing three pure enhancements) With a bit less impact the Yod?(Still symmetrical, but not containing pure enhancements) Mystical Triangle, too, though it is not symmetrical, but at least contains one pure enhancement somewhere?

You seem to be on track with your logic here.

Re: Where on that list in term of signficiance for attraction would you see the IRON BUTTERFLY and FLYING EAGLE?

The Magi Society has not yet specifically categorized those alignments in relation to other planetary geometry, but based on understanding the core principles of Magi Astrology you could extrapolate that they are pretty significant.

Re: Also, I read about the GRAND SEXTILE, but it seems that the definition varies from the traditional one, and here one Grand sextile is made of of one opposition and three sextiles, instead of six sextiles?