posted February 25, 2012 05:59 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Lioness:
With fishy...

Im the Mars in synastry
He is the Mars in parallel.

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Well, it is all synastric aspects, just one aspect is appearing in the longitudes, the other in declination.

But in your case it is not a "true conjunction" (this is such a stupid name, but I haven`t come up with another one so far); it only would be one, if your Mars was conjunct AND parallel his Moon, or if his Mars was conjunct AND parallel your Moon.

posted February 25, 2012 06:27 AM              

"A conjunction and a parallel are from two different schools of astrology."
No, not really.

The idea behind this is that astrology is based on the observation of the sky from the perspective of earth.
If we see that two planets are conjunct, it means that they seem to occupy the same spot in the sky, when we are looking up from the perspective of earth, where we are located.
Those planets would seem to be "one" from that perspective, merged with each other (though of course due to their different sizes and different distance from earth, one may appear bigger than the other other).
This "merging/ becoming one/ unite with/ being at the same place" is the definition of a conjunction.

But actually, even when planets are conjunct by longitudinal degree, they don`t always seem to be even close to each other when we look up.

They ONLY seem close to each other when they are conjunct (longitude) AND parallel (declination).

The reason for this is the ecliptic; It is the (imagined) circle or band, that is spanning around earth like a band, and against this we see the planets.
But the eccliptic is not really a line, it has a certain range in vertical terms.

Now let`s say we have Moon on 12° Aries and Mars also on 12° Aries.
They are on the same spot in the longitudes or on the horizontal band around earth.
But if Moon has a declination of 03° North and Mars has a declination of 12° North, they will not look as if they are at the same spot in the sky. Actually it may appear as if Mars is located above Moon.

For example we only have an ecclipse if Sun and Moon are conjunct AND parallel.

It is difficult to explain myself in English though, so I apologize if it is still confusing.

Anyway, I want to quote an article by Bette Denlinger here.

"When we erect a traditional chart (using the tropical Zodiac which has a measurable starting point at 0 Aries, the intersection of the ecliptic and equator), we place the planets in their longitudinal positions according to the signs. The signs are the area of space, divided into twelve segments, where we view the planet from a horizontal perspective. But declination is the placement of the planet vertically, above and below the celestial Equator. It is the measurement of how far into the pie-shaped wedges of the zodiac a planet lies.

If you take your chart form with its markings for each 30 degrees dividing the signs, and place an "X" on one of those lines, you notice you have room along that line for many other "X's". Place another "X" on that same line to represent a different planet that is conjunct the first. Planets conjunct by longitude run along the same line that appears to emanate from the chart wheel center.

If you then measure these two "X's" from the ascendant/descendant line, and draw a horizontal line, from right to left, that parallels the ascendant/descendant line, you will see that from that perspective the two "X's" are NOT conjunct. However, another planet located along this horizontal line would be in the same declination, and therefore, equidistant from the horizon. Not only is a planet (and I use the term planet to also describe the Sun and Moon for convenience sake) in a segment of the sky, but it also has a location up and down in relation to the Earth."
http://www.astrologysoftware.com/resources/articles/getarticle.asp?ID=33&orig=

"If you're asking for "true conjunctions" and parallels which would imply mathematically exact alignments... why is there a 3 degree orb allowance??"

You are right, ideally there should be a 0°00 orb in both longitude and declination for an aspect.

But from the point of observation, these points would seem to be conjunct even out of this orb. To be honest I simply picked the orb most astrologers seemed to agree on for both, but I definitely will do some more researchon this, especially in terms of the ecclipses, as these are defined in their length, and are the most apparent example of bodies which are conjunct AND parallel.

I find this to be an interesting article to understand the mathematic / astronomy behind it:
http://www.astrologyclub.org/articles/nodes/nodes.htm

Of course ecclipses are a special case as they can only occur if there is a New Moon or Fullmoon which has to be near the nodal axis.

From the link I just gave:

"For an Eclipse to happen at all, the Sun, Earth, and Moon must be aligned, not only in Celestial Longitude, but also in Celestial Latitude (and therefore, in Declination). However, while this alignment in Celestial Longitude happens every 29.53 days, the alignment in Celestial Latitude can only happen near one of the Nodes, or the Nodal Axis. So, an Eclipse requires that there be either a New Moon (Solar Eclipse), or a Full Moon (Lunar Eclipse), near one of the Nodes. The limits upon Eclipses are called Major and Minor Ecliptic Limits.

Major Ecliptic Limit: A Lunar Eclipse MAY occur if there is a Full Moon within 11° 38' (Celestial Longitude), of a Node, and a Solar Eclipse MAY occur if there is a New Moon within 17° 25' of a Node.

Minor Ecliptic Limit: A Lunar Eclipse MUST occur if there is a Full Moon within 9° 39' (Celestial Longitude), of a Node, and a Solar Eclipse MUST occur if there is a New Moon within 15° 23' of a Node.

If a New or Full Moon occurs within 5° of a Node, the Eclipse will be Total or Annular.

Additionally:

For a Lunar Eclipse to occur, the Moon's Celestial Latitude at Full Moon cannot exceed about 55', and for that Lunar Eclipse to be Total, Celestial Latitude cannot exceed 26'.

For a Solar Eclipse to occur, the Moon's Celestial Latitude cannot exceed 1° 27', and must be less than 58' for the Solar Eclipse to be Total or Annular."

posted February 25, 2012 08:35 AM            

My Asc is 23degs 23mins 36secs N
His Dsc is 23degs 23mins 6secs N

posted February 25, 2012 10:58 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Can you do me a favour and check if you have any antiscia/contrascia-connections within at most 2 degrees (preferably within 1°) with him, which involve at least one personal planet or angle? And can you also list, if those appear, which houses they rule in the natal (placidus)?

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DD,

-My Antiscia Mercury conjunct His Descendant (exact)
-My Antiscia Moon/Neptune conjunct's his Natal Saturn (exact) (rules his 1st house)
-My Antiscia Moon/Neptune conjunct's his Natal Mercury (exact)
-My Antisica Vertex conjuncts his Natal Vertex (1 orb)

posted February 26, 2012 06:26 AM            

His venus conj my saturn 1-2
His mercury conj my saturn 3-4
His AC conj my mars 2
His AC conj my N.N 2-3

His Venus 12,25 S Parallel My saturn 11,53 S. The relationship last in many year, 15. I felt this relationship was karmic and meant to be already from start.
His mercury 14,39 S P My Saturn 11,53 S-This one seems to be wide but his mind and thoughts affect me so much so I must count it.
His AC 23,22 N P mars 23,49 N
His AC P NN 23,26 N

This is the only man who I really loved and got true conj with....

Maybe true conj are important in synastry to make an relationship last...

Follow is out of this topic but

I've like lioness most parallels in my own chart
True Parallels
Sun 10 conj AC 10 in leo
Sun 17,31 N P AC 17,32 N

also this is in parallels to my chartrulers AC/SUN
jupiter 17,32 N P
moon 19,18 N
pluto 19.19 N
venus 18,34 N

I think my parallels are to much and enough : ) in a relationship to someone. Synastry and many true conj triggers to my chart will never last.(That's what I think)..but...

My exhusband trigg all my parallels by his parallels
mars 18 N
uranus 19 N
valentin 18 N
SN 18 N

ContraParallels
karma 19 S
NN 18 S

posted February 26, 2012 06:53 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Mermaid:
Ceridwen,

My Asc is 23degs 23mins 36secs N
His Dsc is 23degs 23mins 6secs N

I always think of him as my twinsoul but I found this only after reading your thread
Is it important?

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Yes, I think it`s important. I guess your AS is also conjunct his DESC then?

Friends of mine share this as well. Her DESC is conjunct and parallel his ASC (and Sun).
They always seemed like a "natural pair"; somehow even when they were not together, it seemed like they belonged.
They`ve been together for 12 years now, married for 7, and as far as I can tell they are doing a pretty good job at it.

posted February 26, 2012 07:07 AM              

the second paragraph is a repetition of the first one. I don`t know if you noticed that.
if your Mercury is on the antiscion of his DESC, then of course his DESC is also on the antiscion of your Mercury.

I am not surprised though; antiscia/ contrascia seems important (and as a matter of fact often coincide with paralell / contraparallel, if these planets are not in direct conjunction / opposition; in the case of the Sun it seems always the case).

"My Antiscia Mercury conjunct His Descendant (exact)"
What house does your Mercury rule?
I wouldn`t be surprised, if it either ruled a water house or the ASC-DESC-axis.

"-My Antiscia Moon/Neptune conjunct's his Natal Saturn (exact) (rules his 1st house)"
Saturn also seems to play a role frequently.

"-His Antiscia Sun conjunct my Natal Moon/Neptune (3 orb)rules my 10th house."
Bingo!
A connection of a complimentary pairing (Sun/Moon) over Antiscia.
Those "mirror points" should not disregarded, as a matter of fact I am pretty convinced that they definitely will come up in important places in soulconnections.
There is an interesting interconnection between these "reflection-points".

"Just think of it:

Aries - Libra: Virgo and Pisces
Taurus - Scorpio: Leo and Aquarius
Gemini - Sagittarius: Cancer and Capricorn

Unlike with the opposition, here is always a connection between a female and a male sign. All elements are included in such a sequence. IT just lookes so WHOLE. COMPLETE"

"
But with the antiscia / contrascia there is also always something "hidden from view".
Also, I think that both persons can learn something, but not in the sense that the other one really teaches. They learn from each other just because they are how they are."

"With the solstice points or antiscia (it is the same, just a different name) it`s more working from the SUBCONSCIOUSNESS to the CONSCIOUSNESS.
It`s like you are saying to yourself: "I don`t know why I am attracted to him. He`s so not my type. He`s not what I expected the ONE to be. He`s kinda different. But there is something, I can`t name it. But it`s intriguing""
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/018644.html

I know I disgressed a bit here, but I just find these antiscia so intriguing, and I thend to look at them right after having checked for conjunctions and oppositions (though they are more "subtle").

EDIT:
LOL
I just noticed that I have posted this here, in my exact birthminute.

posted February 26, 2012 07:14 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by VenusDiSirius:
Ceridwen,how about conj with Juno?
I have this with a boy,his Sun/Moon conj my Juno,also exact parallel Sun/Juno;I remember him because he provoked sentiment in me that is not like me,namely,marriage,prim and proper,girly satisfaction of having a partner.

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Yes, of course it works with asteroids as well, though some of them can be really far oob, whereas the planets usually stay close to the ecliptic and just exceed the 23° about a few degrees, whereas asteroids can really get very far away from that.
For example in my own chart EROS is at 54.12 N in declination. There is NO way a planet can be paralell or contraparallel my ERos (though other asteroids might).

I don`t know maybe it works differently for the four "classic" asteroids.
And also maybe it means that it is even more rare for asteroids to be parallel/ contraparallel than planets, and if it happens it might even be a tad more significant,a s it is more rare.

But really it comes down to if you want to apply asteroids or not I guess. I want to.
I have noticed that friends of mine share a VERY tight parallel and conjunction of his Vesta to her Moon, and it makes complete sense in their relationship.

posted February 26, 2012 07:21 AM              

"His Venus 12,25 S Parallel My saturn 11,53 S. The relationship last in many year, 15. I felt this relationship was karmic and meant to be already from start."
It makes complete sense that it felt karmic with the Venus-SAturn conjunction and parallel.
Actually I have seen true conjunctions with Saturn in quite a few long lasting relationships.
Usually it was Saturn conjunction/parallel to Venus, Mars, ASC and NN.
Maybe Sun and Moon would pop up, too, but I just haven`t seen it so far.

"His mercury 14,39 S P My Saturn 11,53 S-This one seems to be wide but his mind and thoughts affect me so much so I must count it. "
It really is too far. I think his Mercury or 3rd house ruler (Placidus) might be aspecting you on another level, too.
Also, even if the parallel is not in place, you still have the conjunction.

"His AC 23,22 N P mars 23,49 N
His AC P NN 23,26 N"
Wow, no wonder there was a strong effect!

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posted February 26, 2012 07:58 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Mermaid,

Yes, I think it`s important. I guess your AS is also conjunct his DESC then?

Friends of mine share this as well. Her DESC is conjunct and parallel his ASC (and Sun).
They always seemed like a "natural pair"; somehow even when they were not together, it seemed like they belonged.
They`ve been together for 12 years now, married for 7, and as far as I can tell they are doing a pretty good job at it.

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posted February 26, 2012 08:50 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Yes, of course it works with asteroids as well, though some of them can be really far oob, whereas the planets usually stay close to the ecliptic and just exceed the 23° about a few degrees, whereas asteroids can really get very far away from that.
For example in my own chart EROS is at 54.12 N in declination. There is NO way a planet can be paralell or contraparallel my ERos (though other asteroids might).

I don`t know maybe it works differently for the four "classic" asteroids.
And also maybe it means that it is even more rare for asteroids to be parallel/ contraparallel than planets, and if it happens it might even be a tad more significant,a s it is more rare.

But really it comes down to if you want to apply asteroids or not I guess. I want to.
I have noticed that friends of mine share a VERY tight parallel and conjunction of his Vesta to her Moon, and it makes complete sense in their relationship.

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Thanks
That's some Eros you got there!
I use Juno,Eros and Psyche; Aphrodite sometimes (for fun)

posted February 26, 2012 09:18 AM            

I have an example of a 'couple' who had a Venus/Mars conjunction OUT-OF-SIGN orb about 7-8, and EXACTLY Parallel (out-of-bounds also! 25'**)

They hated and couldn't get rid of each other.. sex was the only thing that drove them together.. again, again and again for yearssss.
No Pluto or other significant aspects to confirm it... untill I saw that EXACT parallel of their out-of-bounds Venus/Mars ... so maybe??

~~

Ceridwen, thanks and you're right! I wanted to mention it but didn't...

posted February 26, 2012 09:37 AM              

"Its widely conjunct 7 degrees,if you can call it that and thats why I was surprised when I saw it.So I wouldn't consider it a true conjunction at all but it should help with the parallel being so tight "

I wouldn`t call it a "true conjunction" either, BUT imo this occurance might explain why sometimes aspects, esp. conjunctions, with a wider orb feel so much stronger than they should, and at another time they seem to have much less impact even with a lesser orb.

In these cases where they feel stronger, I often see that the wide conjunction is accompanied by such a strong tight parallel.

Maybe you should make a declination chart/ longitude equivalent chart to see how tight the orb would be?

Here is a link as refernce for the declination chart, transposed on our usual chartwheel:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/declination/
http://www.solsticepoint.com/synastry.html
(if you compare the placements of your longitude equivalent chart / declination chart to those of his, you will easily spot the parallels and contraparallels in form of conjunctions and oppositions).

Don`t compare the declination chart to the normal natal chart (longitudes) though. I know the author suggests to do that, but this is probably comparing apples with oranges. Or maybe it`s valid, but I am not certain of that yet.

posted February 26, 2012 09:54 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by VenusDiSirius:
Thanks
That's some Eros you got there!
I use Juno,Eros and Psyche; Aphrodite sometimes (for fun)

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Yeah, I always look for these as well. and some more (including Vesta and Ceres, Karma, Valentine and Amor).

posted February 26, 2012 10:06 AM              

"Yea.. you see that a lot, conjunctions AND antisca points with an orb of 7/8/9 which are exactly Parallel. "
I agree. I have seen it a LOT, too. Even in my own chart. Moon is very widely trine Pluto with an orb of 8°, which I would not consider at all. But at the same time Moon is contraparallel Pluto by 0°35, it is not a "true aspect", but the parallel might bring the Moon-Pluto-theme into it.

"I have an example of a 'couple' who had a Venus/Mars conjunction OUT-OF-SIGN orb about 7-8, and EXACTLY Parallel (out-of-bounds also! 25'**)

They hated and couldn't get rid of each other.. sex was the only thing that drove them together.. again, again and again for yearssss."
This made me laugh, as it reminds me of my ambivalent stance on a certain celebrity.

Well, Jude Law (and please can we not go about that cheater-thing again? ).

Anyway, he is the one celebrity "I hate to love". Well, not love as in personal love, maybe I should say I hate that he seems to trigger an emotional response in me (even before that cheating-merry-go-round started, which is none of my business anyway, and does not bear any importance on the fact that he is an amazing actor, more so on stage, than on screen though).

Anyway, it happens that his Venus is conjunct my Mars by 7-8 degrees, but his Venus is at the same time parallel my Mars by 0°09. lol

(his Venus is also widely conjunct my ASC by 6 degrees and parallel my ASC more closely. Plus a gazillion other aspects I wish there weren`t, including my Pluto square his Sun, his Pluto square my Venus, and a one degree conjunction of his 8th house ruler Sun to my Venus, ruler of my 5th house. Just seeing this makes me want to curse like a cabman. ).

posted February 26, 2012 10:08 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by woah cakes:
we have one true conjunction, kind of an odd one. his MC cjs my AC natally by 2 degs and by declination they are exact by one tenth of a deg.

oh and we have a true opposition too. are you counting those by chance (my question mark is not working!). we have moon opposite moon and by declination moon contraparallel moon.

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I definitely count oppositions/ contraparallel!

And also the MC-ASC one is a very strong one, it also means that you have DESC-IC, and this is something I found in most relationships that are being considered soulmates, a connection of DESC and IC, be it that the angles themselves were in strong aspect, or the ruler of DESC to ruler of IC or IC, or the ruler of IC to DESC.

It`s not the topic here, but without a strong connection to the IC I donīt believe that two people are soulmates, as the IC is the deepest point in our charts and our soul (it is the "home of our soul", which is often reflected through conditions in our childhood / original family, but limiting it on just home and family in that worldly sense doesn`t do this angle any justice.).

posted February 26, 2012 10:41 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Mermaid,

In these cases where they feel stronger, I often see that the wide conjunction is accompanied by such a strong tight parallel.

Maybe you should make a declination chart/ longitude equivalent chart to see how tight the orb would be?

Here is a link as refernce for the declination chart, transposed on our usual chartwheel:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/declination/
http://www.solsticepoint.com/synastry.html
(if you compare the placements of your longitude equivalent chart / declination chart to those of his, you will easily spot the parallels and contraparallels in form of conjunctions and oppositions).

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posted February 26, 2012 10:49 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Mermaid:
I checked the first link you mentioned but when I click the tab to enter the particulars,I'm getting an error message.
Does the second website provide the declination charts for free ?

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Hmm, it works for me. I think there might be a table elsewhere though.
http://www.astrologywithdonnalyn.com/articles/dec_conv.html
http://www.astrologywithdonnalyn.com/articles/Declination_Table.pdf

posted February 26, 2012 10:56 AM              

apparently she was bored.

Well, I`ve seen him last august on stage (just about 1,5 metre away) and I, as well as my friend, were really swept away by the raw intensity he spread.
It was exhausting just watching him and being exposed to this kind of energy.

You certainly wouldnīt expect that from watching his films, as he seems so intellectualized in them. The screen may emphasise a certain handsomeness, but really does not capture this raw physicality and emotionality he unleashes on stage.
It was scary almost.

Well, maybe the transits were right for that this weekend, as I remember a T-sqare / Grand Cross that week:

Tr Pluto: 5 Cap
Tr Mars: 6 Cancer
Tr Uranus: 4 Aries
(Tr Juno: 5 Libra).

It aligned with his natal:
Sun: 7 Cap
Pluto: 4 Libra
MC: 8 Libra

and of course I was affected very muchm yself as:
my Venus: 6 Cap
my Pluto: 9 Libra
my MC: 5 Libra
my IC: 5 Aries

posted February 26, 2012 11:02 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
Hmm, it works for me. I think there might be a table elsewhere though.
http://www.astrologywithdonnalyn.com/articles/dec_conv.html
http://www.astrologywithdonnalyn.com/articles/Declination_Table.pdf

http://www.astrologywithdonnalyn.com/articles/dec_to_zod.html

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