posted March 11, 2012 04:38 PM            

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Originally posted by YoursTrulyAlways:
You know my Chiron is in the 1st House. It conjuncts ASC and Saturn in the 12th House. It's more the size of a ship mine than a land mine, big enough to sink an aircraft carrier. There's no healing to it.

In fact a very dear one here (you know who you are) has been gently advising me to ease up on my father, and that relationship remains very strained, even though it's also respectful and benevolent. The bottom line is that the pain isn't going away at all, even after all these years.

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I hear you Ian. I am in the same situation.

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posted March 11, 2012 04:50 PM            

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
I think the forum might glitch again.

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posted March 12, 2012 03:48 PM            

"BUT despite this I`d say that there was some pain in my early childhood and home, which I realized just a bit ago.
But it was "secondary pain" leading to "primary fear"."

"I think that is the way I experienced Chiron, not as real abuse of my mother to me, but in the sense of the possibility of loss, which I react to more heavily than most other people I know."
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Thanks for sharing this. I think it's very insightful of you to realize your "secondary pain" leading to "primary fear"," for chiron in the 4th.

Those who believe in karma would call this "associated karma" or "karma by association," or "linked karma"(I think).
As an ex., if a husband has a certain karma (good or bad), then his wife would also be affected, and she would have Karma by association.

Just curious-do you feel this fear of loss (I think broadly also called fear of abandonment) only with your mother and close family or in your romantic relationships as well?

I would imagine having the fear itself would produce high anxiety. If so, how do you deal with the ensuing emotions?

posted March 12, 2012 05:23 PM            

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Originally posted by Ami Anne:

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posted March 12, 2012 05:27 PM            

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Originally posted by SaggiMC:
apologies

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Accepted Saggi!

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posted March 12, 2012 06:00 PM            

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Originally posted by RegardesPlatero:
my whole chart is a landmine

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You do have a very hard chart Regardes.

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posted March 14, 2012 04:20 PM            

Just curious-do you feel this fear of loss (I think broadly also called fear of abandonment) only with your mother and close family or in your romantic relationships as well?"
It might be the strongest with my family, as we are so tight-knitted, but basically, once someone has entry to my 4th house, the same fear.
Well, I also have retograde Saturn in Cancer in 8th house, squaring Chiron by 3 degree. Oh joy!

"If so, how do you deal with the ensuing emotions?"
Detachment. (Aquarius-Moon speaking).
Analysis. Reason.
And unfortunately worrying.
In the enneagram I am also a 6; there is no catastropic event I can`t imagine in my mind.
But anyway, by now I realize when I am going in circles in my mind, and break the circle by doing something else. Really DOING, like in: cleaning the windows. Something practical.
And I am spending time with the people I care for and love.

But ultimately I simply accept that this kind of fear is just a part of me. And since I did accept it, the panic attack haven´t struck anymore, and I am doing a lot better than I did for many years before that.

It was extra awful after the boyfriend of a very good friend of mine died in a motorcycle accident. He wasn`t even 25 years old at that time.

But it was on his funeral that it finally dawned on me, that detachment and keeping people at a distance is NOT reducing the pain in losing them; it simply robs you of the memory of shared happy moments.
Big lightbulb moment for me back then.

posted March 14, 2012 04:40 PM            

"Well, I also have retograde Saturn in Cancer in 8th house, squaring Chiron by 3 degree. Oh joy!"

Ouch!!

"But ultimately I simply accept that this kind of fear is just a part of me."

Very important--acceptance.

"detachment and keeping people at a distance is NOT reducing the pain in losing them; it simply robs you of the memory of shared happy moments.
Big lightbulb moment for me back then."

Yes! Yes!

Thank you for responding. I think you're a walking success story (in progress-as we all are LOL).

posted March 15, 2012 03:46 AM            

In the placidius 8th - I never was allowed to express my true feelings to my family of origin.

In the whole sign 9th house- I will always be hurt by the religious fundamentalism thrust upon me by my dad and his lot. I lost my childhood because of this and that hurts... a lot.

Now I have Chiron opposite uranus(3deg), neptune(2deg)and mars(4 deg).

Ami do you have any idea what the opposition means here...

posted March 15, 2012 07:29 AM            

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Originally posted by Anglerfish:
I have Chiron in cancer.

In the placidius 8th - I never was allowed to express my true feelings to my family of origin.

In the whole sign 9th house- I will always be hurt by the religious fundamentalism thrust upon me by my dad and his lot. I lost my childhood because of this and that hurts... a lot.

Now I have Chiron opposite uranus(3deg), neptune(2deg)and mars(4 deg).

Ami do you have any idea what the opposition means here...

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Hi Angler Sweetie
When you say"now", do you mean Transit? I think you have Chiron in the 9th as religion seemed to have hurt you the most.

I will wait for your answer about Transit or natal? Please include all houses- degrees etc together so I can meditate on it! Thanks Sweetie.

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posted March 15, 2012 01:11 PM            

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posted March 15, 2012 01:12 PM            

With asteroids, one must do one’s own research, as there can be precious little information available. I have been checking out Pholus in charts and have come to this conclusion. Pholus explodes what it touches. If Pholus touches Chiron, the planet of pain, a person will explode with his pain. If Pholus touches Ceres, the asteroid of unconditional love, the person may be a teacher who gives unconditional love to her students. This was the case in a chart I did. If one persons Pholus touches another persons planet, the Pholus person can make the planet person “explode” in that area. By explode, I mean come forth and break open. I liken it to an infection which comes to a head. Then, it can open and heal.. Each energy is part of being human. One must embrace each part of the chart as one must embrace each part of oneself.

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posted March 15, 2012 01:12 PM            

I have named Pholus the “Ape in the China Shop” Asteroid. Pholus explodes on the scene. He can explode with whatever emotion is bothering him. He emotes, with little sensitivity to his environment. After he explodes with emotion, he does not have a sense of the havoc he has wreaked. Then, he, usually, blames someone else. Pholus is not manipulative, as much as childlike. If he wants to emote, you can be sure he will: the devil may care.

A woman had a man’s Pholus conjunct her NN. Indeed, it was an explosive relationship. It was not violent, per se, but high drama.

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posted March 15, 2012 02:02 PM            

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Originally posted by Linda Jones:
Ceridwen,

"Well, I also have retograde Saturn in Cancer in 8th house, squaring Chiron by 3 degree. Oh joy!"

Ouch!!

"But ultimately I simply accept that this kind of fear is just a part of me."

Very important--acceptance.

"detachment and keeping people at a distance is NOT reducing the pain in losing them; it simply robs you of the memory of shared happy moments.
Big lightbulb moment for me back then."

Yes! Yes!

Thank you for responding. I think you're a walking success story (in progress-as we all are LOL).

I like your introspective nature, and deep insights into a lot of inner stuff. There's something very compelling about you which is why I guess I keep dogging you w/ questions (along w/ a few others on LL)

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Thank you for your nice words.
And yes, I consider myself as a "work in progress". There are better days, and then there are those during which I relapse. But it seems I can pick up again where I left the path, far sooner than I used to.
And today definitely is one of the good days.

posted March 15, 2012 02:47 PM            

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Originally posted by KarkaQueen:
I have chiron(scorpio) opposite moon in 9th, not sure how this would work though.

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I think you would feel Chiron's wound in your emotions but go back and forth with it like be able to get away but then be called back.The opposition goes from pole to pole. So Chiron is in the 3rd. Do you have great trouble expressing yourself? If so, how does it manifest?

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posted March 16, 2012 05:45 AM            

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Originally posted by Anglerfish:
I have Chiron in cancer.

In the placidius 8th - I never was allowed to express my true feelings to my family of origin.

In the whole sign 9th house- I will always be hurt by the religious fundamentalism thrust upon me by my dad and his lot. I lost my childhood because of this and that hurts... a lot.

Now I have Chiron opposite uranus(3deg), neptune(2deg)and mars(4 deg).

Ami do you have any idea what the opposition means here...

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Chiron in Cancer or the Fourth House: This person feels like a fish out of water. They often express feelings of "otherness". Some joke about being adopted or being space aliens because they feel so different from their home and cultural groups. There can be indications of childhood abuse, abandonment by the father, and early childhood trauma, if other aspects support this, or there are hard aspects related to family. Chiron in Cancer can indicate difficulties in starting one's own family later in life. Some actively refuse to start families of their own because their early life was so insecure. http://www.aquarianage.org/west/planets/ch-nat01.html

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Chiron in the 8th house: What a great sex therapist you can be. A more likely scenario is that you have the ability to bring out the sexual best in a romantic partner, while giving yourself the short end of the stick (no pun intended). But the 8th house rules more than sex. You could also get stuck with taking care of partnership resources because "you're so good at it," or, conversely, keep getting partners who want to "take care" of it and do you out of your fair share. Perhaps you become too dependent on money from others for support, or too much of what you earn goes to support others. You might tend to accept other people's values (your family, group or society) too readily. One other thing. The myth of Chiron can actually come alive with this placement. You could have a talent for healing or rehabilitating others, but not yourself.
Chiron in Cancer: The superficial interpretation would be that there were childhood troubles with the mother. Brilliant deduction. Hey, who didn't have some childhood problems with both parents? The real key here is how we dealt with it. The positive part of Chiron in Cancer is that you can be very nurturing. This is a very good position for therapists and caregivers of any sort. The negative side is that you find it difficult to nurture yourself or let others nurture you. Everybody has some degree of difficulty in growing up and severing that psychological umbilical cord with mama. Chiron in Cancer people tend to take a longer time than most to do the job. Once you do this, though, and learn to accept as well as give nurturing, you should be fine. So stop whining and complaining. http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/chiron21.5.html

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CHIRON IN THE 8TH HOUSE – creates a major life struggle—“a gigantic karmic crisis—over earthly desires: sex, money, power/fame, and immortality. This struggle tends to, in one way or another, impact strongly you and everyone around you. There is the need to comprehend true power—an earthly throne can be easily toppled. True power is the inner power that comes from self-mastery. If, for whatever reason, your environment stifles any show of legitimate power, you will tend to express your inner rage in a destructive manner, such as actually becoming violent or developing cancer. CHIRON in your 8th house does not indicate a violent person so much as it reminds you that it is important that your true self not be stifled. “The resolved and high side of this position is an absolute mastery over desire resulting in a deep and essential knowing about the motives of others.” It gives you a “penetrating mind, a great facility for exacting research, and an intense understanding of primal life forces.” You must learn never to misuse your power to manipulate others. With the development of self-discipline and a higher consciousness, you have the opportunity to balance much negative karma.
It is imperative that you NEVER turn over your power to another person.

CHIRON IN CANCER – signifies a “crisis over cultural roots and/or of personal protection.” This CHIRON placement can be difficult because CANCER is tied to the past and you tend to feel safe only as your environment is safe. Thus, you can feel very threatened by the chaos presently occurring on Earth. Your body cells remember your parents’ struggles for survival during World War II. You may feel intense insecurity. Letting go of a structured environment is difficult as you see the changes taking place on our planet. It is important for you to understand that what you focus your attention on manifests in your life. Gloria Karpinski, in her book Where Two Worlds Touch states: “Worrying is praying for you do not want.” Once you realize just how powerfully your thoughts can manifest, you possess the capacity to be “at the forefront of manifesting true security for Earth…. Meanwhile, [you] will either be desperately seeking a means for real security or [you] will have [your] crab shell around [yourself] and be hiding.”
You “are meant to be a leader in the battle to alchemize the Earth.” Therefore, it is essential that you learn to resonate with your own power. Study your 5th house to determine where your creative juices are to flow—because “the only real power is the power of creativity.” Also study the house in which CHIRON is located because it is in this area of life that you feel restricted, where you need to learn to let go and let God work through you.
Involvement in natural healing techniques that bring forth the deepest of wounds and assist the patient in releasing that inner pain may interest you. Our cells are filled with memories from the past, including our ancestors’ past. http://www.pathwaytoascension.com/astrology/lesson6.html

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chiron in aspect to uranus and neptune are generational but the aspect to mars will be felt more personally. These can be read on my thread in Basic Forum where this information has come from...
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum12/private-jjLYZw161/HTML/000698.html

seems to be that wherever house position of chiron, is where you can 'help others' but not yourself....

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posted March 16, 2012 05:54 AM            

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Originally posted by sc0rpioRising:
Hello!
Ami, I dont know much about Pholus? can you give me a brief explanation on this? I have it at 0 deg. Taurus, and its trining moon and neptune, and opposition pluto.

Also about Chiron, I have read all the threads you have on it, and I think you are right, its a wound not to be healed, but maybe to heal others? I have Chiron in Gemini in 7th house. Yes every one to one relationship has had deep problems, I sometimes wonder how I got married! But yet I really give passionate advice when it comes to my close family and friends, and they do take it on board, which makes me feel a bit better about it.

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Chiron in Gemini or the Third House: The nervous system, communication skills and ability to tap race consciousness are all keywords of Chiron in Gemini. There can be early injuries to the voice, or painful shyness that comes from an early problem with self-expression. You may find that the native with Chiron in Gemini takes their time with thoughts and words, because they want to be certain that they express themselves correctly. Later in life, they may express themselves with painful precision to over-compensate. http://www.aquarianage.org/west/planets/ch-nat01.html

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Chiron in the 7th house: This one might spend all of their time taking care of a partner who has some debility. It is also someone who gives great advise on marriage, while their own marriage is on the rocks (or they might not even be married). This can work for business partnerships as well. You can take great care of a partner and teach them how to do the business better than you ever could. Watch out that they don't dump you as soon as they learn all that they can from you.

Chiron in Gemini: Gemini is communications. Those with Chiron here may talk compulsively, or, on the other hand, seldom speak. Both were, most likely, never listened to as children. The only difference is one keeps trying while the other gave up. This sounds something like Chiron in the third house, and, of course, there are similarities. Remember though, that the sign position shows how something acts while the house position shows where in your life it will manifest. Let's take a look at an example. Suppose you have two horoscopes in front of you. One has Chiron in Taurus in the 3rd house. The other has

Chiron in Gemini in the 2nd house. Yes, there are similarities. You could say that both will spend a lot of time talking about money, possessions, and values. Both could be quite good at giving financial advice. What's the difference? The one with the Taurus Chiron in the 3rd house will tend to talk in a slower, methodical, and more practical way because that's how Taurus influences function. They would also tend to give financial advice that is conservative and rock solid. The person with Chiron in Gemini in the 2nd house, by contrast, could just as easily talk about trivial financial matters. Or they may constantly shift from one financial topic to another. They would be more likely to give financial advice that is based on the latest up to date information (or the latest fad). It is always good to keep in mind the difference between where a planet works and how. http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/chiron21.5.html

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CHIRON IN THE 7TH HOUSE – presents a “dynamic of knowing the self through significant relationships on the personal level, and strongly affecting other people on a mass scale.” You can possess tremendous charisma and you may come to crave the adulation of the masses. If you allow your ego to be involved, this craving can become destructive. You need to understand how you affect others, as you do not see the power of what you do. You have “enormous potential to express the collective unconscious of our times” and an “uncanny ability to mirror the self-image of other people.” The essential truth to master is “I am you and you are me.” You will learn who you are through relationships, which can become so intense that you find yourself “unable to see the forest for the trees.” The 7th house rules our connection to extraterrestrials and as the time for interaction with them draws closer, you “will resonate with them with a special frequency.” Once you gain control over your life, you possess the capacity to greatly influence the masses for Good.

CHIRON IN GEMINI – indicates “a personal crisis about integration here on Earth, which affects balance and the nervous system greatly. [You] are highly attuned to the consciousness of individuals around [you] and to mass awareness.” You are a natural teacher and communicator. Richard Nolle stated: “Awareness is the keynote for persons born under this CHIRON sign, whose prime existential mission is to understand the way we think in order to effect changes in our mental realities.” Your Soul intends that you learn our thoughts create our reality. Therefore, we can change our reality with our thoughts. Self-discipline is essential in achieving balance as you are innately attuned to the sudden changes that Uranus can bring. Change for change’s sake accomplishes little, or nothing, of significance—thus the need for self-discipline. http://www.pathwaytoascension.com/astrology/lesson6.html

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chirons aspects are found in basic forum thread

hope this helps?

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