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Author Topic:   Mars-Pluto and child abuse.
Lava Flower
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posted March 18, 2012 06:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lava Flower     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I recently came across an article that is about astrology of tragic, horrific, unthinkable abuse and ultimate murder cases of these poor innocent little children CAUTION: EXTREMELY DISTURBING.
http://theastrologyplace.blogspot.com/2011/09/astrology-of-child-abuse-and-murder.html

I cried while reading this article. I have always wondered why my parents abused me and not my sister. Not that I wish they would have abused her, no, just curious because her and I are very much alike. We were both quiet, thoughtful, obedient, every parents' dream kids. Being young, I didn't think much about the way they treated us, I thought perhaps its because I was older and they expected a lot more from me. Now, I realize how unfair it was, and I do get bitter about it from time to time, yet after reading that, I now know how lucky I truly was. It was bad, but noting even close to what some children go through My God, how heartbreaking Those heartless, soulless, people , what a waste of creativity they are.

I have Pluto in the 4th square Mars in the 7th 2*.

My sister has Pluto in the 5th trine Mars in 9th 4*.

One more thing I read in that article was that even during the transit of Mars negative aspect to Pluto, you have to beware of attracting violence!!

For those of you who have this aspect in their natal, have you endured abuse? How has this aspect played out in your life in general?

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Doux Rêve
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posted March 18, 2012 06:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
.

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Lava Flower
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posted March 18, 2012 07:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lava Flower     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I imagine that was really hard as well I remember when my parents would argue (I only remember it being physical a few times), they would ignore one another after. Not for days, but weeks and months at a time. This happened often too. I remember how my sister and I would feel so torn, and we even talked about how it would be better if they were mad at us, because at least then they would at least speak to one another LOL

My mom is a Libra moon and my dad is a Saggi Moon so im sure it didn't bother them as much. My sister and I on the other hand are water moons. I am a Cancer moon and she is a Cancer rising with Pisces for a moon.

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SaggiMC
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posted March 18, 2012 11:00 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
lava flower, I haven't read your link but typical mars/pluto aspects can be hard, but they CAN also 'give out' violence as well as attract it to.

Now a lot depends on the house placements and other aspects and what house mars and pluto rule to is important.

basic astrology forum, Mars in signs and Houses http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum12/private-jjLYZw161/HTML/000695.html
To enter this forum you need an extra password – astrology….

Basic astrology forum discussing Pluto in houses http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum12/private-jjLYZw161/HTML/000663.html
To enter this forum you need an extra password – astrology….
http://www.celestialperspective.com/library/marspluto-aspectswhat-determines-theyre
mars/Pluto aspects by Donna Cunningham

great article by Ms cunningham..

I always look a bit deeper when I hear or see an outer in 4th house as it ain't great. But on the other hand I am very spiritual and believe that my Soul wanted to be born in this family condition to 'learn something' so as to grow and develop on a path that might not otherwise could go...

I've known charts with hard mars/pluto aspects go to mid life and still cannot identify how such a thing can play out. But on deeper questioning it turned out she 'counselled' abused women who had been beaten and violated....

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Ami Anne
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posted March 18, 2012 11:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
To all victims of child abuse

------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal


http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/

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scrappydog
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posted March 18, 2012 12:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for scrappydog     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I know a female with the conjunction and a male with the opposition and they both "give out" the violence. I know another female with the square and she recieves it.

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Capriquarius
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posted March 18, 2012 12:21 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have Mars square Pluto but whatever happened to me at home/early schooling wasn't out of the ordinary where I lived. E.g. I took piano lessons from a teacher who hit her students with a stick for messing up. Americans would deem that abusive. But interestingly, you don't get students who attempt mass murder in that country, unlike over here in the U.S. where they're coddled. The physical abuse imposed on kids where I was born uses up the Mars-Pluto energy LOL

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Moonfish
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posted March 18, 2012 12:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moonfish     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
wow, Sad article

I have Sun conjunct Mars conjunct Pluto in Scorpio 8H. I wasn't abused directly, but my mother and I emotionally suffered from my father who was a acoholic.
To my younger relatives I was the bully, I was just a kid myself at the time :[

I know someone who has the same birthday as me and she's was abusive to other people.

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Capriquarius
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posted March 18, 2012 12:58 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
]http://theastrologyplace.blogspot.com/2011/09/astrology-of-child-abuse-and-murde r.html

Thanks for linking the article.

Some of those incidences of physical abuse sound uncannily familiar!

But clearly, the abusers are completely at fault, Mars-Pluto being no excuse. They used a weaker being as an outlet for their inner frustrations, rather than stoically and impersonally meting out discipline in order to shape the young person into a well-behaved adult.

~Mars square Pluto/Mars trine Saturn

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Wild-flower
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posted March 18, 2012 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Wild-flower     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting. I don't have any Pluto Mars aspect but an unexact semisextile, yet my mother was very violent towards me. I do have some bad moon aspects. How my sister was treated couldn't have been more in contrast, she was my mum's "best friend"...... however, sister has Mars Pluto conjunct and suffers with the guilt of how I was treated and how she encouraged it at the time.

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Doreen
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posted March 18, 2012 04:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doreen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That article made me cry those poor poor babies
The people who abused them should have been killed in the exact same way they killed those children
They can't be normal people they must be possessed

------------------
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong - Mahatma Gandhi

You must be the change you want to see in the world - Mahatma Gandhi

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KarkaQueen
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posted March 19, 2012 03:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for KarkaQueen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I got my friend's chart today.

He has Scorpio Rising conjunct Pluto squaring Mars with an Unaspected Moon.

He told me that he was abused by his mother as a child.

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Faith
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posted March 19, 2012 08:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lava Flower:
I recently came across an article that is about astrology of tragic, horrific, unthinkable abuse and ultimate murder cases of these poor innocent little children CAUTION: EXTREMELY DISTURBING.
[URL=http://theastrologyplace.blogspot.com/2011/09/astrology-of-child-abuse-and-murder.html]http://theastrologyplace.blogspot.com/2011/09/astrology-of-child-abuse-and-murder.html[/ URL]

I cried while reading this article. I have always wondered why my parents abused me and not my sister. Not that I wish they would have abused her, no, just curious because her and I are very much alike. We were both quiet, thoughtful, obedient, every parents' dream kids. Being young, I didn't think much about the way they treated us, I thought perhaps its because I was older and they expected a lot more from me. Now, I realize how unfair it was, and I do get bitter about it from time to time, yet after reading that, I now know how lucky I truly was. It was bad, but noting even close to what some children go through My God, how heartbreaking Those heartless, soulless, people , what a waste of creativity they are.

I have Pluto in the 4th square Mars in the 7th 2*.

My sister has Pluto in the 5th trine Mars in 9th 4*.

One more thing I read in that article was that even during the transit of Mars negative aspect to Pluto, you have to beware of attracting violence!!

For those of you who have this aspect in their natal, have you endured abuse? How has this aspect played out in your life in general?


I'm so sorry you had to go through that!

As for the Pluto-Mars aspect, I have the trine, and my siblings did complain that I received too much favoritism.


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popcorn
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posted March 19, 2012 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for popcorn     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I say the same as Ami. (((To all victims of child abuse ))

Im sorry for the people who cant handle useful aspects on a good way.

My mothers mars square pluto helped me and my siblings. She fight for us. She really protect us. She talk to the school and everyone if someone hurt us.

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alaz7200
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posted March 19, 2012 11:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alaz7200     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Not attempting to devalidate the traumas endured by those with Mars/Pluto aspects, but one must always be wary of natives with this energy as well as Scorpio energy: they feel things deeper and more intensely than the rest of us; what the layman might deem trivial, the Mars/Pluto individual would render with inordinate magnitude. I speak from experience having lived with a brother with the opposition. While we both received an equal amount of physical punishment growing up (fairly, sometimes too much so), he tends to exaggerate himself as having been savagely beaten, when this was not the case at all. I've seen this with other Mars/Pluto individuals as well. It's as if they convince themselves of the trauma so as to validate any harbored anger they may direct toward others. These people sustain a lot, so as to precipitate a HUGE violent explosion of anger somewhere down the road. This is because Pluto is too powerful for their Mars to handle. Mars cannot radiate on Pluto's wavelength -- because after all, Pluto is spiritual in nature. It takes some effort to harness this energy, but until the natives do, it's going to be an uphill climb of childlike temper tantrums. Thank Mars for those.

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popcorn
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posted March 19, 2012 11:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for popcorn     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mars and pluto aspect are powerful. Look at Anders Brevik and all the children he killed in Oslo. His mars trine pluto 0-1....so everyaspect could be dangerous if the aspect are in wrong person.

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FireWire
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posted March 19, 2012 11:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FireWire     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by alaz7200:
... they feel things deeper and more intensely than the rest of us; what the layman might deem trivial, the Mars/Pluto individual would render with inordinate magnitude. [...] he tends to exaggerate himself as having been savagely beaten, when this was not the case at all. [...]

So, if they experience things in a way that is deeper and more intense than other people, where does the exaggeration come in? At the feelings themselves or the acts that produce the feelings? Or, perhaps, the perception of the acts? Just thought I'd ask to have you flesh out that idea a bit more, as I am curious!

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alaz7200
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posted March 19, 2012 11:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alaz7200     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FireWire:
So, if they experience things in a way that is deeper and more intense than other people, where does the exaggeration come in? At the feelings themselves or the acts that produce the feelings? Or, perhaps, the perception of the acts? Just thought I'd ask to have you flesh out that idea a bit more, as I am curious!

You're getting technical there, because at day's end, we all experience things differently, which is precisely what I touched upon. They're more sensitive and prefer to wallow in self-pity, if you will. They succumb to to "the state of having been abused." Clear enough?

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FireWire
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posted March 19, 2012 11:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FireWire     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by alaz7200:
You're getting technical there, because at day's end, we all experience things differently, which is precisely what I touched upon. They're more sensitive and prefer to wallow in self-pity, if you will. They succumb to to "the state of having been abused." Clear enough?

I have the conjunction, so that was actually why I was asking. Grew up in an abusive household on every level imaginable. Could have died, but I didn't, I survived. The last thing I do is wallow in pity, and people I've known for years are just now hearing about some of the things I went through. I've finally developed the courage to share because other people who experienced similar things can grow and heal as well as share there stories also.

But to be clear--I don't blame this conjunction for anything that happened to me or anything I experienced. I also am hypersensitive about harming and or offending people in anyway due in part to some of the things I had to experience and witness as well. It made me even more sensitive than I otherwise might have been.

So yes--clear enough.

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alaz7200
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posted March 20, 2012 12:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for alaz7200     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FireWire:
I have the conjunction, so that was actually why I was asking. Grew up in an abusive household on every level imaginable. Could have died, but I didn't, I survived. The last thing I do is wallow in pity, and people I've known for years are just now hearing about some of the things I went through. I've finally developed the courage to share because other people who experienced similar things can grow and heal as well as share there stories also.

But to be clear--I don't blame this conjunction for anything that happened to me or anything I experienced. I also am hypersensitive about harming and or offending people in anyway due in part to some of the things I had to experience and witness as well. It made me even more sensitive than I otherwise might have been.

So yes--clear enough.



Dandy. Clarifying furthermore, I find Pluto to exaggerate itself in every pairing. For example, I have Venus conjunct Pluto and experienced HUGE abandonment issues growing up (Venus). Like you, I never made anyone aware. Pluto tends to do that. Tells you not tell others; that this makes you stronger. Sadly, it only makes you more lonely. Mars would exaggerate the physical, Moon with Pluto would exaggerate the emotional, Mercury the mental, etc. etc.

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FireWire
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posted March 20, 2012 12:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for FireWire     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by alaz7200:

Dandy. Clarifying furthermore, I find Pluto to exaggerate itself in every pairing. For example, I have Venus conjunct Pluto and experienced HUGE abandonment issues growing up (Venus). Like you, I never made anyone aware. Pluto tends to do that. Tells you not tell others; that this makes you stronger. Sadly, it only makes you more lonely. Mars would exaggerate the physical, Moon with Pluto would exaggerate the emotional, Mercury the mental, etc. etc.

Very valid point. It does make you more lonely. And getting the chance to talk about it and open up those wounds really does allow the healing to occur.

quote:
Originally posted by alaz7200:
It takes some effort to harness this energy, but until the natives do, it's going to be an uphill climb of childlike temper tantrums.

I think this is very, very true and an EXCELLENT point. And I think in order to 'harness' the energy and use it constructively, the healing has to occur or it can be very, very devastating and destructive--to self first, then possibly to all others.

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Betty Boop
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posted March 20, 2012 01:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Betty Boop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
I am a Cancer moon and she is a Cancer rising with Pisces for a moon.

I know so many people who have either a Cancer Sun or Moon who felt strongly abused as kids.. whether psychologically or physically, sometimes both.
This is so strange from my perspective purely because Cancer Moon is meant to be dignified so it's meant to be a pretty nice Moon showing a caring/affectionate mother figure. I have a Capricorn Moon and Mars sextile Pluto. I love my mum with all my heart. I see her as my best friend. But the things they say in the Cap Moon description re: parents are SO negative. It's strange because.. this stuff applies more to the Cancer Mooners I know.
I don't really get it.

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Betty Boop
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posted March 20, 2012 01:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Betty Boop     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Also - I am completely aware of the fact that there are many other aspects to take into account than just the Moon sign.
But it has to be more than mere coincidence that I know *so* many Cancer Sun/Moon who have these problems.

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Lava Flower
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posted March 26, 2012 01:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lava Flower     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
FireWire, I have also kept my abuse a secret. Honestly, I feel somehow ashamed and weak for it. Only my family knows about what went on, and a lot of what im told happened by my sister and my cousin who were there, I don;t even remember. Just snip bits of the helplessness I felt. I tried desperately to keep the abuse that happened between me and my ex a secret, but HE told people

Betty Boop, that's so strange about those cancer placements. My moon IS in the 12th and opposed by saturn 0*, but besides the erupted violence in the house hold, I WAS taken care of. My mom tried her best for us. I grew up in Ukraine, so things like candy, good food, nice clothes, etc, were kinda scarce to the middle class. She always tried to get us ice cream, candy bars, bananas, she made sure to take care of our clothes so we always looked nice, worked really hard in growing our food, spent time with us, and we relocated half way across the world, leaving careers behind to give us a chance at a beautiful future. That's the cancer moon part The rest made me a survivor.

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Lonake
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posted March 26, 2012 04:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lonake     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by alaz7200:
Not attempting to devalidate the traumas endured by those with Mars/Pluto aspects, but one must always be wary of natives with this energy as well as Scorpio energy: they feel things deeper and more intensely than the rest of us; what the layman might deem trivial, the Mars/Pluto individual would render with inordinate magnitude. I speak from experience having lived with a brother with the opposition. While we both received an equal amount of physical punishment growing up (fairly, sometimes too much so), he tends to exaggerate himself as having been savagely beaten, when this was not the case at all. I've seen this with other Mars/Pluto individuals as well. It's as if they convince themselves of the trauma so as to validate any harbored anger they may direct toward others. These people sustain a lot, so as to precipitate a HUGE violent explosion of anger somewhere down the road. This is because Pluto is too powerful for their Mars to handle. Mars cannot radiate on Pluto's wavelength -- because after all, Pluto is spiritual in nature. It takes some effort to harness this energy, but until the natives do, it's going to be an uphill climb of childlike temper tantrums. Thank Mars for those.

Love this post. You are so right.

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