posted March 31, 2012 02:06 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by SmilingHeart:
What kind of cruelty are you talking about, Ami?
More physical, sadistic or on an emotional, verbal level?

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posted March 31, 2012 08:02 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonake:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by SmilingHeart:
[b]What kind of cruelty are you talking about, Ami?
More physical, sadistic or on an emotional, verbal level?

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I know someone w.that aspect. Intense yes, he lost his job because he couldn't get his temper under control now finds it difficult to get work because of that assault. He rationalizes the whole incident. Saturn/Pluto is related to poverty. But poverty can take many forms, doesn't have to be financial.[/B][/QUOTE]

OK Lonake SWeetheart
I knew someone mentioned Saturn sq Pluto. Maybe it was you .

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted March 31, 2012 08:27 AM            

However,I have seen this with Ceres and also Eros conj Saturn. The person gets obsessed with trying to pull out the asteroid from Saturn's grasp.

In this case, I think taking Pluto out could be more intense i.e more cruel than taking Mars out.

Any thoughts?

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted March 31, 2012 10:02 AM            

Nah I don't consider myself cruel or vengeful. Sometimes people tell me I come across cold or aloof at first but then see I'm just a mellow and chill person.

posted March 31, 2012 08:05 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by scrappydog:
The most cruel, EVIL human being I ever met had mars in scorp opposition saturn in taurus 0*. I have heard that an opposition from scorp taurus is the Hardest to ever overcome because it is sooo fixed and stubborn. It made a T square with his moon in aqua, cappy sun, aries rising. He also had merc in cappy sqaure pluto 1* This is an underestimated aspect for cruelty in my opinion. Merc square pluto in a lower map is the most verbally/emotionally abusive person u have ever seen. There r emotional vampires. This person was a True psychopath, just being in his presense I could feel the horrible energy radiating from his very being. He spent most of his life in prison, most of his violence was directed at woman with the moon involved. I have never known a more evil person in my life, cold and cruel, he took pleasure in torturing other people and blamed everyone else, his delusion was unbelievable. If u have ever read much about psychopaths they usually consider themselves "victims" of a crual, unjust world. They do Nothing wrong themselves no matter how horrible, they always have an excuse. sickening!

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Hmm Mars in Scorpio oppose Taurus. So interesting. Sorry you went through that Scrappy dear

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted March 31, 2012 08:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by sand:
excuse the topic, it bores me actually but the astro was interesting to read..
http://www.esotericstudies.net/quarterly/Files060110/EQ060110-Lindsay.pdf

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posted March 31, 2012 09:23 PM            

my chart:http://www.astro.com/cgi/chart.cgi?cid=vwjfileKFJfdV-u1331894290&lang=e&gm=a1&nhor=1&nho2=1&btyp=2&mth=gw&sday=23&smon=3&syr=2012&hsy=2&zod=&orbp=&rs=0&ast=

quote:

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Originally posted by tautomer4314:
You are quite correct. I feel that mars opposing neptune aspect A LOT with many things that I do. Still trying to work on turning it into a good thing but it's difficult at times. Largely because I want to invert the problems it causes and that's just nor reasonable.

Neptune opposing mars is the reason for my nonexsistent temper as well. I honestly have never felt that "blind rage" feeling that many claim to feel. While I can get angry I can always contain it and I never allow it to lash out at anyone in impulse. The opposition basically mutes and dissolves acting out on impulse reactions. Which as you can imagine, is a double edged sword.

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posted April 01, 2012 01:37 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
I think Mars Saturn is a different kind of cruelty; it's that cold, calculated, heartless treatment, not really loud or emotional. More like extremely cold and indifferent, whereas whith the Moon, it's much more emotional and expressive, because it acts spontaneously.

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Great point Doux! You really help me with your word pictures. So,Mars/Saturn would be cold and calculated. Moon/Mars would be explosive which I have seen many times in people lol

Saturn/Pluto may be super calculated but dealing with more primal passions and deeper ones than Mars. Do you agree?
So, if we added a T square of Pluto/Saturn/Mars, could we say serial killer

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted April 01, 2012 02:27 AM            

But then, there are people I love like Mystic Melody and pixelpixie, that have Cappy moons too, and they are dolls.

posted April 01, 2012 05:32 AM              

- I think there are different forms of cruelty and each probably has a rather unique signature

- Cruelty is never a healthy balanced manifestation of a planetary aspect or signposition, but is definitely on the lower end of the valid range for possible expressions of a certain energy

- Outer planets, especially in tight and strong aspect, are often difficult to integrate in one`s psyche, as they are going beyond the experience of our everyday reality. At some times they can lead to cruelty, if the integration had failed totally. Especially Saturn and Pluto in aspect to personal planets are "known" to possibly be cruel.
Though Uranus and Neptune are no "innocents" either; Just a different kind of cruelty, but the act of disappearance if someone really needs your support definitely is a cruel act as well, and both Uranus and Neptune are capable of it.

- Saturn - Pluto on its own will not necessarily indicate cruelty; it is too generational for that (unless we are speaking about a generational trait here).
As a matter of fact I think that no matter if it is the distorted expression of SAturn or Pluto or Uranus or Neptune that leads to cruelty, it has to be in a close aspectual "circuit", involving personal planets.
Saturn-Pluto-square on its own may not mean much, but put it into a Grand Cross with Moon and Mars and the stress might increase unbearably.

- Cruelty often is also a "relational" thing. (unless speaking about psychopaths or sociopaths probably).
As in the example of a Grand Cross of Saturn-Pluto-Moon-Mars, it might not bother me much, if my personal planets are far away from its end, but if I have ASC on the Pluto-corner, Venus on the Saturncorner and Moon on the Mars-corner, I might watch the other`s reactions very closely.

- As Lonake already said: look out for solar arcs or progressions. A potential cruel natal configuration may lay dormant a whole life. But if it is being triggered by solar arcs or harsh transits to outer energies, the people involved might literally be "out of their minds" for that time frame.

- It is not a MUST, it still is simply a low expression of planetary energies. But the more energized (conjunction - square-opposition) a constellation get, especially with the involvement of the demanding outer planets, the more difficult it is to find a more balanced way to express these energies. The inner tension might explode, and affect the evnironment adversely.

- a danger with Saturn-aspects, especially to Mars, is the "pressure-cooker-syndrome" as I call it. Saturn is keeping the steam (Mars) from getting out of the cooker, which results in the pressure inside increasing and increasing; You may not see it from the outside, as Saturn is sitting on its top, keeping it all closed inside, and inside the pressure is still increasing in intensity (mars), until one day Saturn can`t keep it inside anylonger (usually when Mars is being triggered by an outer transit) and it all explodes. And when it explodes, it explodes big time, with all the pressure from inside erupting all at once (like a vulcano).

On the other hand if you know about that and let off a bit steam now and then in a controlled (Saturn) manner, the big explosion might not happen at all.
Mars simply doesn`t like to be blocked or suppressed in its expression, and unlike Moon - who might react with passive aggressive techniques or simply depression- Mars will fight the control of Saturn, unless the two of them learn to respect each other and work together within the psyche.

- "Cruel" configurations involving the Scorpio-Taurus-axis are often extremely difficult because of the brooding, fixed, obsesive / compulsive nature of this axis. Another difficulty is that they often involve the Aquarius-Leo-axis as well, and all of these are stubborn and fixed; an Aquarius can be surprisingly obsessive when it comes to mental matters. And their cruelty can be very cold.

- Aries and Capricorn are also not to be messed with, due to Aries impulsivity (highlighting Mars nature) and Capricorn`s controlledness (Saturn-sign).

- Of course other signs have their own ways to be "cruel". Ever encountered a Cancer`s ability for emotional manipulation and passive-aggressive behaviour?
Or a Virgo`s skill to dissect you with anayltical criticism until nothing of you is left?
(and every sign has their own way)

posted April 01, 2012 06:39 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ceridwen:
A potential cruel natal configuration may lay dormant a whole life. But if it is being triggered by solar arcs or harsh transits to outer energies, the people involved might literally be "out of their minds" for that time frame.

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posted April 01, 2012 06:52 AM              

quote:

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Originally posted by Lonake:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ceridwen:
[b]A potential cruel natal configuration may lay dormant a whole life. But if it is being triggered by solar arcs or harsh transits to outer energies, the people involved might literally be "out of their minds" for that time frame.

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Exactly what I had in mind when writing it.

posted April 01, 2012 08:25 AM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted August 27, 2022 06:23 AM            

The most malefic planets are Mars and Saturn with Saturn being the greatest malefic

But Aries is not as bad as people make them sound they could just be ill-tempered but they’re gonna be calm after some minutes

Now Capricorn is one sign I find it hard to understand why they can be so sadistic most times , Aquariuses are just big-mouthed but I won’t say they’re gloomy or unforgiving like Capricorn

Scorpios are not bad honestly even if they’re ruled by Pluto, Pluto is about death not necessarily cruelty but Scorpios are good with revenge