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Author
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Topic: Mars/Saturn: George Zimmerman & Trayvon Martin
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Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 08:25 PM
  
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. His girlfriend allegedly told him to run. She stated that he told her he was going to walk instead. An altercation ensued when Zimmerman caught up to him. Bad judgment (Jupiter Saturn square) + Undisciplined energy (Mars Jupiter square) + Consequences for asserting the self (Mars Saturn opp) .
. Other transits for that day,  What else do you think influenced his decision on that day from an astrological perspective? or Do you have a different interpretation for his t-square? IP: Logged |
Linda Jones
Knowflake Posts: 404
From:
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted April 11, 2012 08:55 PM
Wow Lonake, it's amazing how you put these charts together!Do you think transit Pluto at 9 Cap also had an effect? BTW, Zimmerman has been charged w/ 2nd deg. IP: Logged |
scrappydog
Knowflake Posts: 943
From: Texas
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 09:38 PM
Not sure about this chart, but I know the worst person I have ever known, he was psychotic and extremely abusive. He had mars in scorpio opp saturn in taurus 1*. I read somewhere that oppositions between scorpio taurus or 2nd and 8th house are some of the hardest to overcome because of the fixed, stubborn nature of them. IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 10:12 PM
Can we have a chart for Zimmerman so we can do a synastry???IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 10:19 PM
Hi LJ, do you mean to Mars? Mars/Pluto trine can show feeling of being invincible so that may -have- added.
I saw that about Zimmerman, he is one to watch w.his transits. Saturn in Scorpio comes up as a Saturn return for him around Nov. He has self-destructive energy headed his way after looking at his progressions, etc. Also his Sun next year will be in direct hit of the Uranus/Pluto sq because it sits at 11 Libra. Not much peace & balance around him.scrappy, Sorry hun  It is said that the fixed signs are not much hungry for change. IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 10:20 PM
Zimmerman's progressions day of murder,  Synastry,  Data from AFA. IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 10:35 PM
hmmm, don't know why, but I always see Venus activity in murders, and accidents, and such things. Here we can see pVenus in an applying conjunction with n/pNetpune.I see he has pSun sq pMoon - Progressed First Quarter. This denotes intense internal pressure to do something, or build something. As a square it's felt as a challenge and uphill climb. I will speculate, as if being a teen isn't hard enough, he may have felt immense tension in his life. Probably didn't know how to exorcise those energies & tried to suppress them. Unfortunately, he attracted violent agents to play out the internal dynamic and things went terribly wrong. IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 10:45 PM
^ I see a bit of this in his natal with Mars sq Pluto. Sq for the internal tension.IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 11:05 PM
Just looked at Zimmerman's chart again. He has a Mars/Jupiter/Saturn set up in his chart at the time of the murder as well  Martin's n.Pluto sits on Zimmerman's SA Saturn & squares Zimmerman's Mars.
Kind of gives credence to the idea that maybe Zimmerman was really scared of him.
But then again he was under Mars/Neptune opp & is natally primed for hair trigger incidents w.Mars sq Jup/Uranus. IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 11:23 PM
quote:
^ I see a bit of this in his natal with Mars sq Pluto. Sq for the internal tension.
Yes. The pSq is tense in itself, but it will also highlight corresponding latent energies. Observe Trayvon's pMars @ 18 Leo retrograde. This Mars is in applying opposition to his nSun @ 16 Aquarius. Also note how this aspect (Sun opp Mars) is projected OUT into the synastry with Zimmerman - Trayvon's pSun @ 3 Pisces is opposed Z's nMars @ 3 Virgo. Also take not that Zimmerman's has a 9 lifepath (10.5.1983). In numerology,to some, 9 is governed by Mars. So it could be said Zimmerman's is an agent of Mars. Zimmerman may have been sexually frustrated, with pVenus conjunct pMars in Virgo and dying for a release. Well, as you know I've never been a big fan of Venus/Mars, this because Mars is too combative. In the Synastry I see both were born on the 5th, this is attraction, as in their stars were bound to collide in one way or the other. Trayvon's Mars conjuncts Zimmerman's Venus in Leo in the Natal charts. By progression Zimmerman's Mars (remember his pVenus-pMars conj.) is in exact trine to Trayvon's pVenus. nMoon oppose nMoon. This with Zimmerman's Lunar Return and pMoon oppose Trayvon's nMoon makes for incompatibility. What may have ignited the spark, for me, was Trayvon's pSun @ 3 Pisces oppose Zimmerman's nMars @ 3 Virgo. This is a HOT aspect as they say. Taken with the individual tensions, the attractive yet incompatible elements in the synastry ( Moon-Moon, Venus-Mars), individual biases brought to the encounter and we can see why things got exploded. IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 11:46 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Nine:
Observe Trayvon's pMars @ 18 Leo retrograde. This Mars is in applying opposition to his nSun @ 16 Aquarius.
Sigh, the number of times I've seen Sun/Mars in murder victims is off the charts."Also note how this aspect (Sun opp Mars) is projected OUT into the synastry with Zimmerman - Trayvon's pSun @ 3 Pisces is opposed Z's nMars @ 3 Virgo."
---Another piece of the puzzle  So with this Martin's p.Sun and n.Pluto ties into Zimmerman's natal set up for explosiveness. "Zimmerman may have been sexually frustrated, with pVenus conjunct pMars in Virgo and dying for a release."
---I can honestly say I had not thought of this with that combo in particular. To me Mars/Saturn is indicative of sexual frustration. "nMoon oppose nMoon. This with Zimmerman's Lunar Return and pMoon oppose Trayvon's nMoon makes for incompatibility."
---I wouldn't look at the Moons myself since there is no tob. "What may have ignited the spark, for me, was Trayvon's pSun @ 3 Pisces oppose Zimmerman's nMars @ 3 Virgo."
---Makes sense to me, when you factor in Zimmerman's Uranus turning it into a tsquare.
This brings up in my mind t.Neptune/Chiron on Martin p.Sun = Martyr for the cause? "I am Trayvon Martin" everywhere? What do you think? "and we can see why things got exploded."
---I see where you're going now w.the sexual energy. To me the explosiveness will involve Uranus. They also have a tight Venus/Pluto square in their synastry but in this case Venus killed Pluto. IP: Logged |
Linda Jones
Knowflake Posts: 404
From:
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted April 11, 2012 11:48 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Lonake:
Hi LJ, do you mean to Mars? Mars/Pluto trine can show feeling of being invincible so that may -have- added.
I saw that about Zimmerman, he is one to watch w.his transits. Saturn in Scorpio comes up as a Saturn return for him around Nov. He has self-destructive energy headed his way after looking at his progressions, etc. Also his Sun next year will be in direct hit of the Uranus/Pluto sq because it sits at 11 Libra. Not much peace & balance around him.
Lonake, thank you for posting Zimmerman's charts also. I hesitated to ask 'cause I didn't want to trouble you (I've no idea how much time goes into preparing charts like these-but they're fabulous). So I just left it at mentioning his name.  Anyway, about Pluto yes, I meant any aspect (I saw he has a natal sq. w/ Mars), even a soft one from a transit could worsen the energy vortex, if you know what I mean, specially given his age. Poor kid. But, as so often happens in such cases, his death is going to end up bringing about some sort of legal/societal change. Even the Pres. weighed in on it. So do you think looking at Zimmerman's chart, he'll get away with it? Legal *pundits* say the charge will be a difficult one to stick. Prolly depends on how long the trial lasts and what transits and progressions are going on at that time. Anyway, excellent teaching/learning opportunity here. I'm going to keep coming back to read what others have to say. IP: Logged |
aquaguy91
Knowflake Posts: 1365
From: tennessee
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted April 11, 2012 11:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by scrappydog:
Not sure about this chart, but I know the worst person I have ever known, he was psychotic and extremely abusive. He had mars in scorpio opp saturn in taurus 1*. I read somewhere that oppositions between scorpio taurus or 2nd and 8th house are some of the hardest to overcome because of the fixed, stubborn nature of them.
i have taurus moon in opposition to pluto in scorpio, lol is that bad?IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 11, 2012 11:58 PM
quote:
This brings up in my mind t.Neptune on Martin p.Sun = Martyr for the cause? "I am Trayvon Martin" everywhere? What do you think?
Possible. But I see Neptune's energy as representing the night when the incident occurred an the fact we won't know exactly what happened. IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 12, 2012 01:48 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Linda Jones:
But, as so often happens in such cases, his death is going to end up bringing about some sort of legal/societal change. Even the Pres. weighed in on it.
I hope that the law changes. Under it Zimmerman is covered even if he did approach Martin  My feeling on the matter (haha woman introducing feelings) is that Zimmerman knew the law, saw what in his mind was suspicious behavior, went after Martin, and took advantage of the law. But with no one as witness who is to say one way or the other and technically he shouldn't get jail time just based on the police reports, etc. Doesn't excuse what he did obviously. But the people have weighed in and pressured the system, the state of Florida looks racist & negligent if they don't push to find any shred of evidence to convict. In my mind, this is bringing back shades of Casey Anthony. Not in the nature of the crime, but in the nature of the populace to this time get justice. To me it is so up in the air for that reason. I'm not naive enough to think that those involved in the legal/justice system in Florida aren't working as hard as they can to save their jobs; because the public has that power when in full force as in this case. quote:
Originally posted by Linda Jones:
So do you think looking at Zimmerman's chart, he'll get away with it? Legal *pundits* say the charge will be a difficult one to stick.
It will be difficult to try it, to gather the evidence, to filter through all the lies & the ideal portraits that each side has placed on the party that they represent. I can see in Zimmerman's chart that his life is collapsing. He has the classic square for a dream that has kicked the dust, Neptune/Saturn (t. to sa.). t.Pluto is moving closer to opp his Sun, t.Neptune is moving closer to oppose his Mars. Both of which are self destructive aspects. We can accurately say that he shot himself in the foot regarding the decision he made. He is paying his price, his penance already, and it'll be getting worse, the brunt of which he is not yet aware. His Saturn Return is coming up in Scorpio of all signs. After that t.Saturn moves on to conj p.Sun in Scorp, Saturn relates to karmic debts. And to face facts Scorpio relates to death so this becomes clear. This is on top of his p.Sun/p.Saturn conjunction.Nodes move retrograde most of the time when in transit. Right now they're at 5 Sagittarius. The nodes will bring a fated event to Zimmerman late July/early August by the looks of things. What that means specifically I don't know. But we know how he's been using his chart, which is key. We don't have tob which is unfortunate. When the nodes come up to hard aspect a difficult natal configuration there is often a price to pay; the ill effects of how the aspect has been used become all too clear & the ramifications of carrying on that way are seen in cold hard light. In Zimmerman's chart it will be a grand cross involving the transiting nodes so imo that is a time to watch for him. I've read that he had been charged with assault of some sort against one of his ex's. There's some talk that he should not have had a gun permit. If I can find dates for court hearings for his criminal past I will bring new charts, maybe in a new thread.
http://www.planetwatcher.com/ This site is great for seeing at a glance where the transits are at any given time, if you just want a quick reference quote:
Originally posted by Linda Jones:
Prolly depends on how long the trial lasts and what transits and progressions are going on at that time.
I agree.
IP: Logged |
Linda Jones
Knowflake Posts: 404
From:
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted April 12, 2012 02:12 AM
Thank you Lonake for your detailed astrological input as well as for expressing your personal opinions. I like how you think.Oh, and thanks for the link. I've bookmarked the page already. IP: Logged |
Ceridwen
Moderator Posts: 2761
From:
Registered: Jul 2011
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posted April 12, 2012 04:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Nine:
hmmm, don't know why, but I always see Venus activity in murders, and accidents, and such things.
I was once reading a research on a schoolshooting on the astrodatabank.site, and the observation was that those kids who were shot had Venus angular or in strong aspects to the angles especially ASC I think.
Kids who didn`t have such a pronounced Venus were more likely to survive the attack. The explanation was that it might have been that Venus angular was attracting a lot of attention, which of course in the presence of a killer is a really bad thing. Maybe that makes sense in relation to your observation as well. IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 12, 2012 10:26 PM
quote:
The explanation was that it might have been that Venus angular was attracting a lot of attention, which of course in the presence of a killer is a really bad thing.
aaah. I agree. I know Venus is supposed to be attractive to everyone. I also read the Mayans used Venus "transits" to time warfare - She was a Goddess of War. In addition she was viewed as a Morning AND Night star - beginnings and endings. IP: Logged |
Desiring Shadows
Moderator Posts: 796
From: UNITED STATES, BABY
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted April 12, 2012 10:28 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Nine:
aaah. I agree. [b]I know Venus is supposed to be attractive to everyone.
[/B]
 IP: Logged |
Nine
Knowflake Posts: 971
From: The Cusp of Love
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 12, 2012 10:35 PM
quote:
Nodes move retrograde most of the time when in transit. Right now they're at 5 Sagittarius. The nodes will bring a fated event to Zimmerman late July/early August by the looks of things. What that means specifically I don't know.
Yes. The Nodes/Eclipses are transiting over his nNodes - he is having his 2nd South Node Return. He has SN @ 18 Sagittarius & SN ruler @ 7 Sagittarius. I'll have to do more research to give more details, but for sure he's walked a similar path before. IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 12, 2012 10:53 PM
^ Whatever it is, it's not happy.IP: Logged |
Aquacheeka
Knowflake Posts: 625
From: Toronto, Canada
Registered: Mar 2012
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posted April 13, 2012 06:16 PM
Trayvon was an Aqua??? (Gasps)Ohhhh, now it's even MORE tragic! IP: Logged |
Lonake
Moderator Posts: 7352
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 23, 2012 09:14 PM
Well Zimmy is out of jail and he is doing "much better."
Any more comments on the charts?Here are the transits for when he was released on bond
 And the police chief's resignation has been denied, which is a definite good thing.
We should not abide by Mob rule. Do you see the mob in Zimmy's chart?
And what factors do you think relate to mob mentality, astrologically? IP: Logged |
Lindaland
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