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Author
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Topic: Pluto conj the Sun
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 06:51 AM
  
Would like to know how this manifests. I am doing a chart with it in a woman. Thanks so much!------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 07:20 AM
Think of a Scorpio woman.
Take away all the petty BS that you usually think of when you hear that sign.
And turn it up a hundred notches.
Pluto does not screw around so she's had to deal w. hard losses on a personal level, with repression of her sexuality perhaps, with the overpowering influence of her father (whether or not he was around). A lot is bound up with the father w.this aspect. He gives her his power, he hands it down to her but what does she do with it. And more importantly did something screw up that process. Because if he wasn't as strong as she thought he should have been, if he abandoned her, then she's in for some hard lessons in relationships. She'll have problems relinquishing control, being vulnerable in relationships. They like to put on tough airs sometimes, or alternately a kooky/comedic air so that other people can't see into them, this is one way they mine for info 'on the sly', but they are v.fragile inside. They need strong partners who they can feel safe enough to open up to. A lot really depends on the relationship w.the father. Intuit it from that point, along w.the sign & other aspects. And also look at Mars and Saturn for more info on the masculine - mars/paternal - saturn influence in the chart. And look at the ruler of that conj & what it's doing in the chart. See if she's escaped his grip or if she's living in his shadow. They can have strong relationships w.their dads, but as adults, they need to learn to be solid/self-sufficient on their own. Steal some of his power for themselves, sometimes their dads die or like I said abandon the family while they're still relatively young so that this can take place. The danger of a woman having this aspect is for her to project it onto the men in her life. Sure she could be associated w.their power/influence/renown, and personally benefit from it, but she loses something core about herself in the process. I've seen this happen to Sun conj Pluto women and they are lost. The earlier a woman with this conj figures it out, the better.IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 07:39 AM
Lonake. I SO appreciate you. It is my Aunt. She has it in cancer in the 4th house. She is so strong. I admire her so much. When I talk to her, I get so much strength.She is such a role model for me. MY mother is her sister. My aunt was a wonderful, wonderful mother. Her kids are all amazing--all 3 of them.My mother's chart was so so different but they are sisters. My mother has an exact conj of Sun and Merc in Aqua( This exact conj conjuncts My Chiron in my 4th house. My Chiron conj Pholus and my name asteroid) What do you think about all that? ------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:01 AM
Ami  The addition of Cancer/4th? Adds elements of self preservation for one. That generation had it rough so there's a grit that clings to what others deem as junk, maybe sentimental things, whatever can be useful. They're tenacious, they want to secure things of financial means for them and theirs. Throw away notions of Cancers as being helpless. Not so. And then of course the motherly element, fiercely protective of their clan. Maybe also hard to let go, to let the children leave the nest. I'm happy that she's been good to you  The 4th is a compatible house for this conjunction in the traditional sense. For a woman to seek power in the home is not hard to achieve. There's a power that comes just from giving birth to another life. Of course women are still regarded by and large as being more essential to the well being of the child than the father, tho this was not the case back then as much. The men had more power. Would be interesting if her partner allowed her the power to rule the roost (4th). If he did then she would have been more comfortable w.this aspect in her chart.IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:11 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Lonake:
Ami The addition of Cancer/4th? Adds elements of self preservation for one. That generation had it rough so there's a grit that clings to what others deem as junk, maybe sentimental things, whatever can be useful. They're tenacious, they want to secure things of financial means for them and theirs. Throw away notions of Cancers as being helpless. Not so. And then of course the motherly element, fiercely protective of their clan. Maybe also hard to let go, to let the children leave the nest. I'm happy that she's been good to you
Lonake My Aunt is like a beautiful angel. She always has been. What is interesting about her is that she is very connected to her feelings.It is unusual for people to retain that.She can FEEL what is going on with her and honors that. Do you know what I mean, Lonake?
Thank you for your kind words. My Aunt is so beautiful. She looks exactly like Linda Goodman. They could pass for each other, almost.
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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:17 AM
quote:
She can FEEL what is going on with her and honors that. Do you know what I mean, Lonake?
Absolutely. My grandmother was my favorite person, she was a Cancer Sun, also Pluto in Cancer tho not conj & I don't have time of birth. Born in 1919. Passed on in 2000. She kept our family together like a rock Never hid her feelings but had us all under her wing in perfect protection and love. I feel blessed to have spent so much time with her when I was growing up.P.S.,
I edited last post after the thumbs up for more info re:the house. IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:19 AM
edit------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:24 AM
I hear about age differences in relationships for women whose Sun is connected to Pluto/H8, and now you're bringing it up to me here. So that's interesting to see it again, usually it's something I connect to Saturn/Uranus. But Pluto makes sense when you think of it in the same terms as Saturn, a person who is in a position of power as seen by society.
Yes the weakness is something that Pluto is not fond of.
The abandonment lets them figure it out on their own, what they will prize & place importance on. It's not dictated in such a forced fashion. Tho she met that w.the husband.
I wonder if she submitted to him do you think, or was it rocky between them re: power struggles in the home, if you want to comment.IP: Logged |
Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:26 AM
-duplicate-IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:30 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Lonake:
I hear about age differences in relationships for women whose Sun is connected to Pluto/H8, and now you're bringing it up to me here. So that's interesting to see it again, usually it's something I connect to Saturn/Uranus. But Pluto makes sense when you think of it in the same terms as Saturn, a person who is in a position of power as seen by society.
Yes the weakness is something that Pluto is not fond of.
The abandonment lets them figure it out on their own, what they will prize & place importance on. It's not dictated in such a forced fashion. Tho she met that w.the husband.
I wonder if she submitted to him do you think, or was it rocky between them re: power struggles in the home, if you want to comment.
It was rocky. She talks about it. She is open about her emotions but has very good boundaries which is something I really admire about her as it is a hard balance.
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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:41 AM
Honestly, I wished I was my Aunt's daughters. My whole life, I looked and wanted to be one of them, so badly. I felt like the "Little Match Girl" story which always makes me cry if I tell it. However, these two girls were very unattractive and did not marry until late and maybe settled just to get married.Please don't quote this. My Aunt will hate me if she reads it.One girl was made fun of in school due to her looks. Both achieved a lot in life like a super professional types-- Ivy league on and on. They still have my Aunt who is such a gift but they had these struggles------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:43 AM
No problem. What you're bringing up tho has the sign of Cancer, obv a feminine sign, written all over it. And that is really interesting re:the husband. It's like he sensed the conj in her chart, it's house, and danced along to its tune as well. So interesting. You don't really hear that about men v.often.IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:48 AM
Hmmm--what was your actual point in saying this Lonake, Sweetie? My point was that the charts seem to RULE and trump all family background etc. Do you agree? Like my aunts daughters were made not attractive from the charts, I think(Please, don't anyone come to argue with me. I don't have the energy.I am burnt out doing charts. If someone comes to argue with me, I will just erase everything)Lonake, do you know what I mean? ------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 08:53 AM
I see it as both, the charts and then the nature of the family dynamics, how people respond, to see how it will go. After the fact I *will* take a more deterministic approach, but that's solely based on the choices that the person has made. The key I've found is to see how the person is using their chart. It really helps to have some knowledge of them & how they operate. It lets you see what the likely trajectory will be, present and future.IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:55 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Lonake:
I see it as both, the charts and then the nature of the family dynamics, how people respond, to see how it will go. After the fact I *will* take a more deterministic approach, but that's solely based on the choices that the person has made. The key I've found is to see how the person is using their chart. It really helps to have some knowledge of them & how they operate.
Hmmm- the interaction. This is my larger question. Can one see what one's parent will be like the moment the baby takes the first breath? I am thinking "Yes"
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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 08:56 AM
You know I struggle with this question, Lonake, with my own situation.------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
From:
Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 09:01 AM
I think you can see what the child takes away from the interaction. The issue with this, is to ask people about how they view family matters, their home life. I mean, we're talking about something that how many millions of people are in therapy for, how many people drink & drug & otherwise occupy themselves to forget. To get an honest assessment from the native, I think you need to get them older, when they're moved out, detached a bit, seen their parent as an adult with their own problems & strengths. What I'm getting at is you can point out what to you looks obvious but for the native it is such a touchy subject matter that to take their word for it, esp when v.young, is not really getting the entire picture.I guess that's the crux of the matter.
Perception of parents and of the early home environment is dependent upon memory (Moon) but memories are not static, they fluctuate based on new life experiences that are incorporated that change perception. Let me know if this isn't making sense as I feel that I'm on a tangent now. IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 09:02 AM
OK lol I will be back as my mind is tired. I was doing a chart as we were talking. I think your last post was brilliant but I am too tired to appreciate it  ------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 09:07 AM
I mean the fact is we're born with these expectations. I mean, really. And these expectations are basically demands, tho they don't seem v.forceful at the outset. But we expect a certain experience, a certain treatment. There it's lodged and there it stays.
If we get any different, it's not going to fit with what pre-conceived notion we have in our minds. It will be reinterpreted to make sense in a way that we can understand. This you can see in the chart, the basic layout of these demands.
That's where I'm at right now on this issue.IP: Logged |
Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 09:24 AM
Also, I think the issue we're debating here is not an astrological one *exactly.* Or at least it's not astrology & astrology alone. It's veering far off into psychological territory. Into the territory of the subconscious too. These fields where scientists have theorized but really they are flailing in the wind just like us to get these essential questions of human nature answered. The nature or nurture debate for one.I think with this subject it's easy to get sidetracked, which is prob why I veered way off into that tangent on memory.
We're in the realm of science.
But science (nature) doesn't operate in a vacuum.
I side by Jung v.strongly, the archetypes that are within, that tie us to our ancestors.
I guess the real show to me is the interplay between those archetypes, which you can plainly see in the chart, and the forward movement of time. Progress never ends, people die but we keep moving forward. And how to pit that against what is inside, that harkens back to basic scripts is this repeating pattern. You can see the pattern of a life, the cycles of a life, in the chart. You can project it forward if you know how they're operating but there is still always going to be something unaccounted for imo. Maybe we're not meant to know it and that's the mystery. The interplay is incredibly complex, and the variables are always changing. You can see that in solar arcs, in progressions. Nothing is static, everything depends on individual reactions, on perception. Patterns are essential, being able to see repeating themes, but then human nature gets in the way - emotions, upset, anger. Life happens. You see yourself as being the kind of person who would never do "xyz" or date "so and so type" but then 10, 15 yrs later, there you are. You have the same natal so what's changed. I mean, I get a headache just thinking about how it's all supposed to make sense in a concrete direct way. That's where I am on this subject right now. .
.
. Short answer = Ask again when I have more clarity on the matter. IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 09:29 AM
 xxx------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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Lonake
Knowflake Posts: 9947
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Registered: Apr 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 09:34 AM
I know, I know  I should've written the short answer 1st & saved you some time.
Love you Ami  IP: Logged |
Ami Anne
Moderator Posts: 66010
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010
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posted April 16, 2012 09:37 AM
I love you, too Lonake
You made my day with your kind words------------------
Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal
http://www.mychristianpsychic.com/
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scrappydog
Knowflake Posts: 1070
From: Texas
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 06:05 PM
Female pluto conj sun 0* in libra here. I am living and breathing pluto in this lifetime. I have been to hell and back and im only 30, But I lived to tell the tale(so far). I am the phoenix that rises from the ashes of utter destruction. Unfortunately for me it has been dark, tragic, and sad. Many things I Wont share. Our very identity and life path is closely ensnared by trauma and crisis. No matter how far we stay away we just attract these things into our life, its necessary for our transformation which must be acheived for our souls evolution.
A short and very edited story of my life:Victim of child rape(and he got away with it!)
Both my parents, but especially my father completely rejected me from childhood. I was different and I was dark and I was completely unacceptable to them. I felt as if my very identity(sun) was under threat till I got out of that house.
I felt and identified with something dark and ugly like a demon or a vampire(this is actually very common with this placement as your identity merges with pluto and one can not see the other as seperate).
Two extremely abusive marriages with much emotional and physical abuse, but at the time I loved them so Deeply(venus also parelells pluto).
Alcoholism in myself and drug adiction in family and friends.
Insanity in the family and to a degree in my self(I am bipolar).
Constant power struggles and change in and out of the role as powerless victim to powerful victimizer.
I was forced to watch my only and beloved uncle die of Aids very young and it scarred me for life.
Surrounded by criminals from a young age and this continues now. (sometimes sun-pluto can be the ultimate criminal themselves, its common in the charts of killers and rapists, or sometimes we just attract them in our lives).
Near death experiences one from a violent attack and a second from my own hand.
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scrappydog
Knowflake Posts: 1070
From: Texas
Registered: May 2009
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posted April 16, 2012 06:09 PM
Haha Jung was a sun-pluto and I am a great fan of his, I have him on my facebook.IP: Logged |
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