posted August 01, 2012 02:11 AM            

He's an Aquarius with Libra ASC, (which is weird because I swear he had Scorpio ASC) and Cancer moon (another weird thing, I swear it was Capricorn) Mercury in Capricorn, and Venus in Aquarius, Mars in Taurus. His birthday is February 10th, 1957. I know he was born at night and between 9 and 11 at night in Price, Utah.

posted August 01, 2012 08:54 AM            

I think that he's trying to have his cake and eat it, too. He got caught, but doesn't want to accept the possible consequences.

Telling someone to "get over" an affair is, frankly, ridiculous. It's very highly invalidating and deeply disrespectful of the betrayed person's feelings. It makes light of the betrayer's behavior and rationalizes it.

I think that the first thing he has to do is acknowledge and accept that his actions hurt people. Then, he has to accept that he chose to do those actions. After that, he must accept that there are consequences, such as possibly losing your mother, having his family distrust him, not having the respect of his family anymore, etc. I think that he is honestly in denial about what he has done, or at least in denial/not wanting to accept the severity of what he has done.

I don't feel like you can necessarily get through to him other than to be very clear that there are consequences for his actions and to reinforce them. He has to figure this out on his own or with the help of a qualified therapist--one who will not allow him to defend what he has done or one that will make excuses for it.

I think that maybe with his Mercury in Capricorn, he has an overly unemotional and strongly practical thought process, and I see it coming out in this situation. People with Capricorn placements tend not to like emotions or want to deal with emotional messiness. He's being that way by saying that people should "get over it". Mars in Taurus would be susceptible to being very sensual when it comes to sex. A good person with this placement who was an evolved type would do this within a relationship, and could be a very in-tune lover (as in, very aware of the body and its senses). A lower-evolved one, on the other hand, could be likely to stray and to be hedonistic. In a lower-evolved individual, Aquarian influence could lead to detachment, being unemotional/wanting (like Capricorn) to avoid emotions, being overly intellectual about emotional things, and having unconventional views (such as being able to excuse cheating). Aquarians have a strong desire for freedom, like Sags, and sometimes even being a fixed sign can stray due to a fear of being smothered, seeing a relationship as a trap, not believing in monogamy or fidelity, etc. There are faithful Aquarians out there--I know several--but a lower-evolved one might use their desire for freedom and their general tendency to rebel/go against rules and authority as an excuse/rationalization for shady behavior.

At the end of the day, though, no sign, planet, aspect, or position force a person to cheat. People CHOOSE that action. The stars don't hold guns to your head. Free will trumps astrology.

posted August 01, 2012 09:05 AM            

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Passion, Lust, Desire. Check out my journal

posted August 01, 2012 09:57 AM            

He's commuted back and forth for work for 5 years now. He's whining how much he hates his job, he's depressed and lonely where he's at, and poor him. And I'm beyond furious for it. I get people have emotions (I'm not THAT ignorant!) but there are so many other avenues you can take than cheating. He's a dog. And when I got furious with him, he told my my anger was misplaced. Uhm... no it isn't. I just don't even know who this guy is because he was always a "black and white" person my whole life and now he's like a sissy.

By the way, I think he's trying to have his cake and eat it too. I think he's excited we know about his secret life now and hopes my mom will file for divorce (because he never would. That would make him look bad to everyone and he's super concerned about that. *rolls eyes.*)

posted August 01, 2012 10:57 AM            

Hanna, that's your dad Sweetheart not your husband so he didn't cheat on you. This is not an issue you should be involved in.
(even though it does affect you)

Sex does not mean the same thing to a man that it does to a woman. We associate it with love and commitment but most men look at it as just a bit of fun. This could be his mid life crisis where he is questioning his mortality. A fling is an insensitive way to build themselves up but men don't always think with the head on their shoulders.

Right now he's full of regret and wants back into the family fold. Put a little love in your heart and let him in, discuss it and then drop it.

Men are human too, even Dads.

posted August 01, 2012 11:46 AM            

I think I would react differently if he lived with us, or even in the same state but he doesn't. And the fact he's torn between my mom and this mess of a woman....my head is going to explode.

posted August 01, 2012 12:28 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:

---

I think mars in the 7th has a large hand in his wanting to have an affair.

At the end of the day, what he did was extremely hurtful and dishonorable to his wife and to you. I'm really sorry you have to go through this. I know it's love-hate right now for you. I think, you and your mom should get away, take a vacation, sort your own emotions and thoughts regarding this.

Also, with his 4th house packed and with chiron there. I'm sure family life is important to him. So if he tells you to "get over it", tell him that you've had enough and tell him to find a new family and "get over" it himself. That will really open his eyes. Trust me he'll be aching for you guys the moent you act just as cool, collected, and unaffected by this. (Exactly the way he's acting toward you two. He's being very matter of fact right?) I guess what I'm trying to say is pretend you don't care about him and don't want him part of your family.

I know that strategy is playing with fire, but as far as I see, he burned your family to the ground without a second thought and doesn't seem to be wanting to genuinely help rebuild you guys up again.

He needs to really see how it feels. He needs to see your point of view. hte best way, is to let him mull over what you may or may not be thinking. Just refrain from getting in his face and telling him each and everything you think of. Let him WANT to know what you feel and think. Let him feel the consequences for having CHOOSEN to do what he did. Let him wallow in guilt. Yes, there I said it. Let him feel guilt and reflect.

As for your mom and you, you need to seriously drop the subject, even between yourself. In the heat of the moment and with all these emotions swimming around, it's not a good idea to make a decision one way or another. Let like teach you what you must from this. The lesson aways takes time to appear, so wait for it.

Also, make sure you and your mom go out daily for a walk or to the gym. Exercise is known to imporve the mind. Basically, you need to be your mom's cheerleader now.

There is no reason to be a saint right this minute and forgive him completely. The issues against that is:
1. You are not prepared mentally to do such a thing.
2. You need time to think through and reflect.
3. More importantly, he needs time to think through and reflect.
4. You need to build a happy self, your mom needs to do the same, regardless of the outcome.
5. The most negative outcome is not that he leaves you guys. It's that he stays and continues to do what he has done or that he comes back, gives hope, and then leaves.
This is why he needs ample time to feel guilt, reflect on his life and choices, and figure out what he really wants and if he's truly remorseful.
6. He should feel the pain of what he might potentially lose. Do not become nagging and hurtful now. You don't want him to think, "Ah, I give up. Good thing I cheated; it was impossible to live with them anyway."

These are jsut some things I think you could do. Once you do it though, commit to it. Because you do anything halfa$sed, his response will be in kind--halfas$ed.

posted August 01, 2012 12:54 PM            

Natally, his venus in aquarius in 4th, mars in 7th in taurus, and sun in aquarius, lends to a very detached person in terms of relationships. Is it possible that he was always detached only you didn't see it until now?

His pluto in the 11th, uranus in leo, with his mars palcement definitely lends to the over sexual nature he has. Maybe the other woman was a friend he had to keep him company. This then developed into a sexual liason?

posted August 01, 2012 02:07 PM            

You need to think about your relationship with your Dad. You love him and no he's not perfect and what he did to your Mother is wrong but loving someone is accepting them for who they are warts and all. Trying to change them will just break down communication and the relationship. So remove yourself from that.

Your Mother, help her move on with as little bitterness as possible
(a good settlement will help here )
Compromising and going back to a relationship with severe trust issues almost never works, unfortunately

posted August 01, 2012 04:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dreaming111:
Is it possible that he was always detached only you didn't see it until now?

His pluto in the 11th, uranus in leo, with his mars palcement definitely lends to the over sexual nature he has. Maybe the other woman was a friend he had to keep him company. This then developed into a sexual liason?

Also mercury square neptune lends to lying and deception. I've experienced this a lot. He'll tell you what you want to hear, but he won't mean it.

---

That's exactly what it was. I always thought we were close because we thought alike (scary...) and had fun together. We were more like friends, not father and daughter.

And YES this woman was a friend of his at work at first! He knows no one where he's living and initially despised everyone he worked with because he said they were petty. Hmm. Look who's petty now. She's married as well. I have already expressed a lot of emotion towards him which I regret. It's like trying to get an ex-boyfriend back by being dramatic and getting embarrassed at your behavior later. It's reaching for something/someone who isn't there and doesn't want to be.

My mom and I also comment on how we don't really believe him and his apologies. He just keeps saying over and over that he's "picked" my mother, why can't I see that (uhm...because you're not here and you didn't try to work on your marriage before you jumped the boat in the first place.)

I am SO my mom's cheerleader right now! She has some proof of unfaithfulness and is gathering more, but she's still talking to him every night on Skype and they'll weave in and out of conversation. I finally said "MOM! Let him wonder what you're doing....don't talk to him for a week." And she's listening, so...yeah. We're dealing with it as best we can. She's an Aries with a Libra moon, Mercury in Pisces, and Venus in Libra Mars in Cancer by the way. I'll post her chart later if you're interested.

posted August 01, 2012 04:42 PM            

I hope your parents figure it out.. Infidelity really destroys and kills everything

posted August 01, 2012 04:54 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:
Regardes, thank you for your kind words.

He's commuted back and forth for work for 5 years now. He's whining how much he hates his job, he's depressed and lonely where he's at, and poor him. And I'm beyond furious for it. I get people have emotions (I'm not THAT ignorant!) but there are so many other avenues you can take than cheating. He's a dog. And when I got furious with him, he told my my anger was misplaced. Uhm... no it isn't. I just don't even know who this guy is because he was always a "black and white" person my whole life and now he's like a sissy.

By the way, I think he's trying to have his cake and eat it too. I think he's excited we know about his secret life now and hopes my mom will file for divorce (because he never would. That would make him look bad to everyone and he's super concerned about that. *rolls eyes.*)

I see the famous Aquarian detachment in him now very blatantly. It's like nothing we say or anything sinks IN. And I know this is my parents' battle but I'm an only child and it's just been the three of us... anyway, he seems to be able to turn the water works on and off when he pleases but apart of me feels like it's a LITTLE genuine. Maybe it's because I want to believe that. He actually told my mother he thought he loved this other woman (took it back since then.) and she's really laid back and fun, that my mother would like her if she met her (WHO DOES THAT.) and when he came clean to me and I'd finally calmed down enough, he told me sometimes him and this woman couldn't even have sex because he felt so guilty (Capricorn anyone? ROFL. What kind of person tells their daughter that...)

---

It sounds like he really does not handle emotions or social situations very well.

It bugs me a lot that he seems to want pity. What he did is unforgivable and undefendable.

I wonder if maybe he was just too afraid to divorce, or else to voice his emotions. That would be very Cap and Aqua. If he was feeling intense emotions, he should have come to you guys or gone to a counselor instead of cheating. There is never any excuse for cheating, ever, it is always wrong and it always hurts people.

He also seems to lack basic understanding of human interaction. I would be furious with him. Where does he get off saying that "your anger is misplaced"?! What, like he tripped and oops landed on another woman?! Yeah, it's her fault as much as his (if she knew he was married), but you have every right to be upset with him. He betrayed you and your mom. It's not something that you can just get over. You'll likely never forget it, even if you do forgive later.

It doesn't seem to be sinking in to him at all. I think that maybe he felt justified because of his emotions, but really, there is never any justification for cheating.

posted August 01, 2012 05:00 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:
That's exactly what it was. I always thought we were close because we thought alike (scary...) and had fun together. We were more like friends, not father and daughter.

And YES this woman was a friend of his at work at first! He knows no one where he's living and initially despised everyone he worked with because he said they were petty. Hmm. Look who's petty now. She's married as well. I have already expressed a lot of emotion towards him which I regret. It's like trying to get an ex-boyfriend back by being dramatic and getting embarrassed at your behavior later. It's reaching for something/someone who isn't there and doesn't want to be.

My mom and I also comment on how we don't really believe him and his apologies. He just keeps saying over and over that he's "picked" my mother, why can't I see that (uhm...because you're not here and you didn't try to work on your marriage before you jumped the boat in the first place.)

I am SO my mom's cheerleader right now! She has some proof of unfaithfulness and is gathering more, but she's still talking to him every night on Skype and they'll weave in and out of conversation. I finally said "MOM! Let him wonder what you're doing....don't talk to him for a week." And she's listening, so...yeah. We're dealing with it as best we can. She's an Aries with a Libra moon, Mercury in Pisces, and Venus in Libra Mars in Cancer by the way. I'll post her chart later if you're interested.

---

He "picked" your mother?! Didn't he do that, you know, when he married her?

I really don't think that he gets it. I don't think that you can make him get it, either. He really needs to go to therapy or a relationship counselor or something--to someone who knew professional techniques. He does not seem to be processing the fact that his actions affected other people, let alone caused deep and lasting pain. He seems out of touch with reality and expects what he did to be neatly cleaned up without emotional mess or fallout. It's like expecting the site of nuclear meltdown to be radiation-free the next day. Not reality.

He doesn't seem to be validating you and your mom. I think that maybe he's been through it all in his head, so maybe for him, it's all done, but he doesn't seem to understand why you feel as you do, nor does he seem to take you seriously. Again, there's a disconnect between what he thinks should happen and reality/the consequences of what he did.

I also agree that your mom needs to get some time to herself away from him--to cheer her up and take her mind off of things, to give herself time to think and heal, and also to send the message that what he did has consequences. Talking to him too much/too soon and/or not giving herself time to really experience her emotions and process things might leave some things unresolved/might cause some things not to heal right.

posted August 01, 2012 05:24 PM            

Ouch, this must be even more painful. ANd even though it's about his fidelity toward your mom, she is someone you love and he was supposedly someone you looked up to, trusted, and he betrayed you too. Especially seeing how close you were, I can see why you are emotional and betrayed as if it was your own marriage. I would be that way too.

And YES this woman was a friend of his at work at first! He knows no one where he's living and initially despised everyone he worked with because he said they were petty. Hmm. Look who's petty now. She's married as well.
Wow, well she's a keeper. *Sarcasm* Even if your mom decides to leave him and it should be her decision to leave or stay not your fathers, but your father will not be happy with this new chick. I mean she is really scummy isn't she. If she's married herself. Jeez. But make sure your mom makes the decision before your father.

I have already expressed a lot of emotion towards him which I regret. It's like trying to get an ex-boyfriend back by being dramatic and getting embarrassed at your behavior later. It's reaching for something/someone who isn't there and doesn't want to be.

I broke up with someone recently and this is how I ended up feeling. I felt like he refused to listen to what I needed him to listen to. He refused to see the truth. I went from letting him figure it out, to telling him, to getting annoyed at his lack of change, to bluntly telling him and often, to stopping. What's the point really? Why hold onto someone who mentally checked out anyway? What do I get in my hands? Nothing.

So I ended it, he wanted me to stick around, but for what? He wouldn't even acknowledge or try to understand the problem nor me. He kept telling me he missed me, loved me, blah blah. But I learned loving is showing not telling. He never needed to utter those words for me to understand and feel his love had he truly loved me. Fact is he probably really didn't love me.

Your scenario is really similar to what I felt. I felt like I was talking to a wall. So I decided to stop talking altogether.

Also, if your dad, disgards your mother and your relationship like that, he never really held very much value for it. That's hard to digest but something that must be understood. Sometimes men don't get things. Sadly some never will. He's not a young man who will change. Even if he stay with you, you can't help but wonder why.

Was it because the other girl refused him?
Was it because hte other girl's husband wanted to beat the crap out of him?
Was it because he wanted to look good in front of coworkers?
Was it because he didn't know where he stood with the other woman but knew that you two were going nowhere?
Was it because he was waiting for the other woman to get a divorce and in the mean time enjoy the stability you two bring to his life?
Was it to beat lonliness?
Was it because he needs someone in old age and he can't count on her?
Was it because he doesn't have a stable r/s to ditch you guys for?

The main things is: does he pick to stay with you guys because he loves you?

And if he loved you, would he have ever cheapened your value this way?

My mom and I also comment on how we don't really believe him and his apologies. He just keeps saying over and over that he's "picked" my mother, why can't I see that (uhm...because you're not here and you didn't try to work on your marriage before you jumped the boat in the first place.)

Simply stop listening to him say things. Tell him to prove it without uttering a word. Tell him his words hold no merit for now and that he needs to prove it in other ways if at all....he even wants to.

I am SO my mom's cheerleader right now! She has some proof of unfaithfulness and is gathering more, but she's still talking to him every night on Skype and they'll weave in and out of conversation. I finally said "MOM! Let him wonder what you're doing....don't talk to him for a week." And she's listening, so...yeah. We're dealing with it as best we can. She's an Aries with a Libra moon, Mercury in Pisces, and Venus in Libra Mars in Cancer by the way. I'll post her chart later if you're interested.

Good for you! You need EACH other now, more than ever. The best thing is to stop talking about it with him though. Let him do what he needs. You need to watch.

They say if a person shows him/herself to you, BELIEVE it. It's a quote I have to continuously remind myself of, because I end up believing the stories about the person I made up in my mind. That quote gives me a reality check almost.

Also another quote that might help keep perspective in this time is: Bad things fall apart for better things to take it's place. I think it was something Liberty Ross referenced from Monroe. It seems really relevant.

Maybe your mom is to finally meet her true love. Someone that will treat her like a queen.

Maybe your father was doing other things in the past for which he never got caught and now this is karma? He's exposed? Also, why on earth would he tell you guys that she's a nice person that you would like and that he was in love with her? That's just cruel.

Wish I could give you two a big bear hug.

Hold on to one happy aspect of your life right now. Hold on tight. Life is very bumpy sometimes we need to just hold on til the wave passes.

Also, refrain from making anymore huge decisions. But don't fall weak and make compromises for anything utterly unacceptable.

Btw, I'd love to see your mom's chart.

posted August 01, 2012 07:50 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Junethird:
Iam sorry to read this Hanna

I hope your parents figure it out.. Infidelity really destroys and kills everything

Stay strong

---

Thanks June

posted August 01, 2012 08:04 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:
Thanks June

What kills me is my mom is still willing to give it her all to fix this. It kills me. All this time I thought my mom was all these bad things and now I realize she's the person who REALLY cared about me - not my father. He provided well for us but in my mind possessions and things can only be taken so far.

---

Hanna,

She has to fight for her marriage so she doesnt live with regret. It is her path and right. After all those years of marriage... It would be hard to just walk away from everything that you build with someone.

How she handles and accepts the betrayal is gonna be huge and whatever she decides try and be supportive.

Its hard all around. I cannot write out how bad your father did, or how misguided his actions were. How a selfish act and little remorse is destroying and hurting the people he loves most.

Sometimes being detached is like a protective shell of not wanting to see the broken pieces.

Focus on repairing your faith in family, marriage, bond and your relationship with your dad. Support your mother regardless whether you agree or not with her decision... The future cannot and should not be decided in a heartbeat or as an emotional knee jerk reaction. Its a hard and painful process.

Iam sorry your family is living thru this... I experienced indfedility in one of my past relationships and the one thing i learned and helped me cope was forgiving him because in that moment when you confront your partner you get all your answers and you can now let it sink in and take your time deciding what would be best for you and your future.

Granted mine was not a marriage but i loved him very much and his indiscretion had a huge impact. I forgave. I cried. I talked. I yelled. I cried but was no closer to cutting ties and walking away until almost a year later.

Its a long, heart wrenching, draining process.

But admist those dark clouds you find your truth. A rainbow.

posted August 01, 2012 08:18 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:
Anyway, I was going to say he said "picked" in response to my text. He was pleading with me to be nice, he said he loved me. And I said it didn't matter now what he said because I know he picked this other woman (by the way we think there are others as well now that we are scouring the call logs) in his heart, or he wouldn't well up with tears when he heard about her crying in meetings at work saying she wanted to drive herself into a brick wall. When I bring her up sometimes he will tell me to stop and that it's over, that they're done, or to leave her out of it. Really? I could just pummel him. I'm cutting myself off emotionally or I'll just drown in despair with him. OH, this other woman also happens to do Tarot. He told my mom I'd get a kick out of that (in a calm voice too, and he's telling her all of this because she's trying to be calm and listen.)

---

I think him playing up the other woman is his detached way of saying hey she isnt a bad person. She is really nice... You would like her... etc.

Its not the right way or time to be like this but try and see it from his point of view... Try and see now he must be feeling. Maybe that will help with the inner anger, sadness, confusion.

I also truly believe that unless she was a personal close family friend the burden lies soley on your father. He knew he was married, he knew he had a wife at home, he knew he had a family. The other woman's loyalty is to her own family... How she chooses to express that is her choice...

posted August 01, 2012 08:18 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Junethird:
Hanna,

She has to fight for her marriage so she doesnt live with regret. It is her path and right. After all those years of marriage... It would be hard to just walk away from everything that you build with someone.

How she handles and accepts the betrayal is gonna be huge and whatever she decides try and be supportive.

Its hard all around. I cannot write out how bad your father did, or how misguided his actions were. How a selfish act and little remorse is destroying and hurting the people he loves most.

Sometimes being detached is like a protective shell of not wanting to see the broken pieces.

Focus on repairing your faith in family, marriage, bond and your relationship with your dad. Support your mother regardless whether you agree or not with her decision... The future cannot and should not be decided in a heartbeat or as an emotional knee jerk reaction. Its a hard and painful process.

Iam sorry your family is living thru this... I experienced indfedility in one of my past relationships and the one thing i learned and helped me cope was forgiving him because in that moment when you confront your partner you get all your answers and you can now let it sink in and take your time deciding what would be best for you and your future.

Granted mine was not a marriage but i loved him very much and his indiscretion had a huge impact. I forgave. I cried. I talked. I yelled. I cried but was no closer to cutting ties and walking away until almost a year later.

Its a long, heart wrenching, draining process.

But admist those dark clouds you find your truth. A rainbow.

---

I did, I told her I'd support whatever she decides. I'm still cutting my dad off though. He complained (post-revelation) that I only call for handouts, and that he doesn't like my mom's spending habits (...he just bought a $20,000 Harley....). He's just not THERE. I need to stop ranting about this to everyone who will listen but it's all bottled up in me still. I'm an extremely emotional person I guess.

Anyway, I'm sorry you had to ever experience pain like this. Sorry to everybody who has. I know this will teach me about my future relationships and to see people realistically instead of perfect.

posted August 01, 2012 08:21 PM            

Stay strong

posted August 01, 2012 08:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Junethird:
I think him playing up the other woman is his detached way of saying hey she isnt a bad person. She is really nice... You would like her... etc.

Its not the right way or time to be like this but try and see it from his point of view... Try and see now he must be feeling. Maybe that will help with the inner anger, sadness, confusion.

I also truly believe that unless she was a personal close family friend the burden lies soley on your father. He knew he was married, he knew he had a wife at home, he knew he had a family. The other woman's loyalty is to her own family... How she chooses to express that is her choice...

Again, iam sorry for this experience, I do not mean to offend... Just giving my thoughts... thank you for sharing your pain. Venting anonymously helps

---

posted August 01, 2012 08:25 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hannaramaa:
She knew he was married too. He showed her pictures of me and my mom to her, and our house here. But there's no pictures of us in his office or in his apartment. And he'd been to MidlifeBachelor.com, broke his MAC laptop after my mom found the computer then went and bought a whole new one and set up new passwords to everything. I asked him what song I should cover one time, and he said "Ours" by Taylor Swift, I remembered that the past week and looked it up and it totally describes his relationship with his other woman. I don't get how he can look at me in the face and ask that... that's borderline insanity to me, or being a sociopath...

---

Sad very difficult

The lure of lust and indescretion can be very powerful to break... Its like a drug.