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Author Topic:   Help with Pluto
KAMcA10
Knowflake

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From: Houston, TX, USA
Registered: Dec 2012

posted October 30, 2013 06:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Howdy.

I have Pluto least dominant in my chart. It's in Libra at the end of the 2nd house at 27 degrees. It conjuncts Saturn at 29 degrees Libra (3rd house) and makes a couple of other aspects including a quincunx to my Sun at 29 Taurus as part of a Yod.

Anyway, I don't get Pluto! It's easy for me to see the Marsian or Solar or Mercury energy in my life and I've studied Saturn aspects carefully enough to kind of start to get him. But Pluto transits are sooo slow and I can't really pinpont Plutonian energy in my life or what it's doing.

My girlfriend has a dominant Pluto in the 10th and I look at what she does and sometimes I completely don't get it.

If someone asked this question about Mars I'd ask them, "When was the last time you did something, woke up the next day and were filled to the brim with energy and rearing to go because of it?" "What is something out of the ordinary you did to get something you really wanted?" Things like that. Could someone help me get in touch with my inner Pluto?

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PlutoFish
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posted October 30, 2013 06:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PlutoFish     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have Scorpio ascendant with Pluto & Jupiter in Scorpio both conjunct .. to find your Pluto you need to go into depths, look up deep knowledge, look at things intensely, or behind the covers ... look inside your self and burn through to come out reborn ... I wouldn't know how to describe it if you havn't already experienced it yourself, if its in your 2nd house its going to come into how you handle material obejcts and value things & money ..

------------------
Rising Scorpio
Sun in Ophiuchus (1st)
Moon in Capricorn (2nd)
Mercury in Sagittarius (1st)
Venus in Scorpio (11th)
Mars in Leo (9th)

Know Thyself

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KAMcA10
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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted October 30, 2013 06:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by PlutoFish:
I have Scorpio ascendant with Pluto & Jupiter in Scorpio both conjunct .. to find your Pluto you need to go into depths, look up deep knowledge, look at things intensely, or behind the covers ... look inside your self and burn through to come out reborn ... I wouldn't know how to describe it if you havn't already experienced it yourself, if its in your 2nd house its going to come into how you handle material obejcts and value things & money ..


Ooof. Alright.

What about this? Think about something about yourself or something that concerns you - not something that happened to you but something you do, desire, like, are working on or what have you - that you would NOT want someone you don't know or don't trust to know about you. Is that a Pluto thing?

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MorpHnStorM
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posted October 30, 2013 09:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MorpHnStorM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have a question about this my self. Is being Scorpio dominant similar to being Pluto dominant? I def. identify with the Plutonian energy, but Merc. is my dominant planet.

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StarlightSmileSupreme
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posted October 30, 2013 09:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for StarlightSmileSupreme     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If Pluto conjuncts the south node, does it mean it is dominant?

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anonymidarkness
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posted October 30, 2013 11:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
If Pluto conjuncts the south node, does it mean it is dominant?

I don’t think that it will make Pluto dominant but it will play a major role in this lifetime. Pluto gets obsessed with things, are you obsessed with your past? you may have a hard time letting go. Pluto also rules regeneration so it could mean that all you need to do in this lifetime is to resolve conflicts from your past, heal and move on.

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anonymidarkness
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posted October 30, 2013 11:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by MorpHnStorM:
I have a question about this my self. Is being Scorpio dominant similar to being Pluto dominant? I def. identify with the Plutonian energy, but Merc. is my dominant planet.

They may be similar but their form of expression will be different. You may express it in Mercurian way whereas Pluto dominant people will express it in a Plutonian way.

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anonymidarkness
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posted October 30, 2013 11:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for anonymidarkness     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KAMcA10:
Ooof. Alright.

What about this? Think about something about yourself or something that concerns you - not something that happened to you but something you do, desire, like, are working on or what have you - that you would NOT want someone you don't know or don't trust to know about you. Is that a Pluto thing?


It’s a Pluto thing, planets in water houses or water signs may also behave in similar manner.

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StarlightSmileSupreme
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posted October 30, 2013 11:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for StarlightSmileSupreme     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by anonymidarkness:
I don’t think that it will make Pluto dominant but it will play a major role in this lifetime. Pluto gets obsessed with things, are you obsessed with your past? you may have a hard time letting go. Pluto also rules regeneration so it could mean that all you need to do in this lifetime is to resolve conflicts from your past, heal and move on.

I used to be bad about obsessing on past events now I have moved more into the present and future through my Piscean north node in six.

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Doux Rêve
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posted October 31, 2013 04:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
To me, Pluto is about being transformed / changed through an intensely emotional event.

For example, generally people with a strong Pluto go through a sort of "death" (read: extreme agony) when they mourn something or someone.

If they fall in love with someone, really fall in love, they're bound to become very intensely involved with that person, on a psychological / emotional level.
And if things turn to sh*t, and they have to break the relationship, it will feel like their insides are being torn apart - not just the usual tears and sadness, but something very deep and primal, like being dismembered while your soul is being annihilated.

And it plays out in a similar way with other things - you get intensely focused, immersed in something, and want to reach your goal... And if you fail, it feels like you're being destroyed, and your world is crumbling.
That is, until you try again and again to reach your goal.
That's how focused and intense Pluto is (in its "pure" form).

With Pluto in the 2nd it can be about money or possessions - a hunger for material wellness or even wealth. Or it could be about your talents and your skills - what you can offer to the world. It can also be about your self-esteem in general - the things that are valuable in you. So you could want to work on that and it could be the main focus in your life.

If it's more in the 3rd house, there could be a fixation on the way you talk and communicate your ideas - maybe you want your words to be powerful and have an impact on those around you, maybe you want to write inspirational or informative things and want the world to recognize your intelligence / talent.
Pluto / Saturn in the 3rd could also point to issues with siblings or an overall oppressive environment while growing up or during teenage years. The neighbors may be (or have been) a problem, for example.

Pluto also creates crises in the house it's in, so if you've had some severe losses in your finances / possessions or some intense frustrations when it comes to your self-esteem, communication skills or your "intelligence", that'd be quite Plutonian as well.

Hope this helps some.

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Ellynlvx
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posted October 31, 2013 06:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ellynlvx     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
With those two in Anaretic Degrees (Exalted Saturn and Sun in Taurus) I wonder what's up with your Venus?

Off the Pluto track a bit, but might point out an answer.

(Fate Degree.)

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ellyn,

Can you expand on the Anaretic degree, a little bit?
I have three planets at the anaretic degree (29°) but I'm not sure if it has any effect or not.

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KAMcA10
Knowflake

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From: Houston, TX, USA
Registered: Dec 2012

posted November 01, 2013 12:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ellynlvx:
With those two in Anaretic Degrees (Exalted Saturn and Sun in Taurus) I wonder what's up with your Venus?

Off the Pluto track a bit, but might point out an answer.

(Fate Degree.)


Venus is at 12 degrees Cancer in the 11th House. She semisquares Sun, biquintiles Jupiter and Uranus, and sextiles the Moon and Mercury.

She's currently being opposed by Pluto in Capricorn.

I think the way people talk about the Anaretic degree causes a lot of confusion. People say "the Anaretic degree is weak" but I think that just means it's a weak signifactor of the sign it's in. It doesn't say anything about the strength or weakness of the planet there.

Basically the Anaretic degree is the last degree of the sign. Any planet there is at the end of the sign and is about to go into the next one. A lot of astrologers have said that the Anaretic degree doesn't express the traits of its sign as well, because it's about to leave that sign. It's already learned the lessons of that sign.

quote:
Pluto also creates crises in the house it's in, so if you've had some severe losses in your finances / possessions or some intense frustrations when it comes to your self-esteem, communication skills or your "intelligence", that'd be quite Plutonian as well.

I suppose I've had some of those. I have experienced one very dramatic reversal of fortune relating to my academics / earned income and relationships, which changed my life.

My ex-girlfriend from college and I broke up in my first semester of law school right before final exams in my first year and I didn't deal with it that well and it messed up my grades. Normally I can handle that sort of thing but the timing of it had a powerful impact. Those grades were really important and it's made it hard for me to find a job. Combine that with the recession when I graduated, and I became obsessed with not letting that happen to me again. I didn't want to let a woman close to me for years and I just focused on sex and a sense of companionship but never wanted to get in deep with one because I didn't want to expose myself to the kind of risk and loss I experienced at that time.

Pluto at 27 Libra is conjunct Saturn at 29 Libra and you can see the Second House and third House issues kind of working together there to make things tough for me. I've had to work really hard at overcoming this. I have a girlfriend and a job now but between the ages of 23-29 my life did not resemble what I thought I was working towards at all. It was actually very awesome at times, but there was a lot of very unexpected difficulty.

I've really had to work hard on communication issues at various points. And my frustrations relating to intelligence are based on people (esp. teachers and parents when younger) expressing a lot of dissatisfaction because of what they expected from me.

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 04:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KAMcA10:
She's currently being opposed by Pluto in Capricorn.

How do you experience that transit?
I'm curious as to how that plays out for you, if you're comfortable telling, of course.

quote:
A lot of astrologers have said that the Anaretic degree doesn't express the traits of its sign as well, because it's about to leave that sign. It's already learned the lessons of that sign.

I'm not sure what to think of it. Hm.
All I know is that they're definitely still in the sign they're in, and they don't have traits of the next sign...
Some people say a planet in the last degrees of a sign acts a bit like the next sign but this is not true in my experience.

quote:
Pluto at 27 Libra is conjunct Saturn at 29 Libra and you can see the Second House and third House issues kind of working together there to make things tough for me.

Makes perfect sense.
I have Mars in between two houses and it affects them both, so if I deal with the matters of one house, the matters of the next house are affected as well.

Glad to hear you're in a good place now!


Ps. Ellyn you'd better read this and reply to me.

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KAMcA10
Knowflake

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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted November 01, 2013 05:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As far as how the Pluto opposition is playing out right now... that's kind of the thing, I'm not really sure. I'm having trouble identifying the Plutonian energy and what it's doing. Here is what I've come up with though:

I guess the 5th house is what, dating and informal romance, speculative business and gambling?

My deal with my ex from college made me at first clear out the entire 8th House. Coincidentally she was an Aries (my 8th House). Pluto in the 2nd House in my chart has been seeming to say to me for a long time, "Until everything about the 2nd House of earned income is completely under control and going swimmingly, the 8th House of deep intimacy and shared finances be damned."

With Pluto transiting in the 5th, starting in 2008 I guess Pluto started finding a way for me to have my cake and eat it too. Namely I got really good at "serial dating" and after awhile I started to really enjoy it. I'd date, have fun, often several women at a time and the moment things got too close to 8th House territory I'd get out.

Around the time the Opposition really kicked in a girl I was casually dating along with several others started getting really pushy about Venus issues like emotional commitment and real relationships. I liked her and didn't want to just let the ultimatum happen so I went for it but ever since I've been struggling with my desire for those Venusian things and my desire to keep advancing down the path I was on and just "have fun" with dating without risking myself until I feel absolutely ready to do so.

The only real complication in this story is that although this woman is emphasizing Venusian issues she has Pluto and Saturn co-dominant. When I make a bold statement about how I want to do what I was doing before and don't want the heavy duty commitment thing going she gets really horribly confrontational about it. It's quite strange.

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 06:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oy, thanks for sharing!

Makes total sense.

That's definitely Pluto / Venus for you. Oh yes.
She's the Pluto though! And you're the Venus!
That's what the opposition is about.
You're playing Venus and you've attracted a woman who plays out Pluto for you (the part where she wants commitment and exclusivity, and is confrontational about it - yep, that's Pluto).
Venus isn't about commitment, she's about sensual pleasures of all sorts and superficial associations. While Pluto wants depth.
See what I mean?

Astrology is fascinating. I'm always amazed at how accurate it is.

quote:
It's quite strange.

She's probably fallen for you and doesn't want to let you go, or share you.

It's a tough situation you're in.

Venus rules the 2nd house... Pluto rules the 8th. Uh oh. What are you gonna do?
Remain in the safety of the sensual pleasures or dive deeper and explore the messier parts of the human mind and heart? Time will tell.

One thing's for sure though, you're gonna have some crazy stuff hapenning.

Good luck!

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KAMcA10
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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted November 01, 2013 06:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh great. Playing Venus isn't something I do all that well though. Neither of these planets is really a strong suit for me. The whole Plutonian, won't share won't let go won't do things your way either... I don't like having to interact with that from a Venusian perspective because it's not really how I am looking at it to begin with.

I have to somehow tap into the power of Mars, the Sun or possibly Jupiter or Mercury in my chart to get this thing working for me.

If the relationship is being built on a foundation of Plutonian power dynamics with me not having the power it is only a question of when the relationship will end because it will end.

She actually made me so angry with the possessiveness thing that at the end of June I broke my hand by punching it into a steel elevator door.

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 06:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That sounds pretty crazy.

The thing here is that... Hm, how do I put it.
I mean, it depends on what each of you wants from the other.
Sounds simple, but the thing with Pluto is that it tends to mess with the mind - so you could be thinking one thing, but deep down, it's about something else... Conscious vs. Subconscious stuff.

I think that woman probably has some unresolved issues concerning her self-worth and maybe a biased vision of men (again, this can be subconscious and not openly expressed), so she attracted you (or you attracted each other) to work on those issues. Yours of course are about the fear of getting too close to someone because of past experiences, and everything that entails.

I'm not sure I'm making myself clear.
Sorry if that sounds too... pseudo-psychological or something.

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KAMcA10
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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted November 01, 2013 06:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
That sounds pretty crazy.

The thing here is that... Hm, how do I put it.
I mean, it depends on what each of you wants from the other.
Sounds simple, but the thing with Pluto is that it tends to mess with the mind - so you could be thinking one thing, but deep down, it's about something else... Conscious vs. Subconscious stuff.

I think that woman probably has some unresolved issues concerning her self-worth and maybe a biased vision of men (again, this can be subconscious and not openly expressed), so she attracted you (or you attracted each other) to work on those issues. Yours of course are about the fear of getting too close to someone because of past experiences, and everything that entails.

I'm not sure I'm making myself clear.
Sorry if that sounds too... pseudo-psychological or something.


Right... the relationships that are tools to work on other things

Don't have time for that lol. The bias towards men is definitely true.

Correct me if I'm wrong: The translation, "She is the Pluto" is basically, "She has the power here" correct?

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 07:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh gee, I'm sorry, I didn't see your post!
Tss. For some reason I thought you hadn't replied. My bad.

Well, no!
Metaphorically speaking, she is the Pluto, but in practical terms, you're probably the one who has the power, if you're less attached to her.
Isn't that obvious?

What's your synastry like? Any Pluto activity there?

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KAMcA10
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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted November 01, 2013 07:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
Oh gee, I'm sorry, I didn't see your post!
Tss. For some reason I thought you hadn't replied. My bad.

Well, no!
Metaphorically speaking, she is the Pluto, but in practical terms, you're probably the one who has the power, if you're less attached to her.
Isn't that obvious?

What's your synastry like? Any Pluto activity there?


Lol ok

Let me look at the synastry and I'll edit this post with what's in it

We were born only four months apart so we have a bunch of the slower moving planets conjunct like Saturn, Pluto, Uranus and Jupiter. Our synastry has some of my natal aspects in it for this reason like my Sun, MC and Mars oppose her Jupiter and Uranus the same way they oppose mine.

I also have her Mars and Venus squaring my Jupiter and Uranus the way they square hers in her chart.

Other stuff:
My Sun square her Venus
My Moon conj her Mercury
My Moon sextile her Moon
My Saturn sextile her Venus
My Saturn sextile her Mars
Her Venus and Mars conj my AC from the end of my 12th

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 08:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hm, so no Pluto?

Uranus and Jupiter seem to be prominent.
Both planets are about space and freedom.
Uranus is about unconventional relationships or unstable associations (on and off type of thing).

Seems to fit your situation, no?

Apart from that, the other aspects you listed are quite supportive - easy Saturn aspects can make for some seriousness and stability *but* I don't think they'll be strong enough to counteract the whole Uranus thing.

Venus/Mars conjunct ASC is quite magnetic, but probably mostly superficial - on a physical level.

Do you know her ASC?
Is there anything in each other's 7th, 8th houses? They're responsible for "serious" relationships and intimacy beyond recreational sex or romance.

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KAMcA10
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From: Houston, TX, USA
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posted November 01, 2013 09:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
Hm, so no Pluto?

Uranus and Jupiter seem to be prominent.
Both planets are about space and freedom.
Uranus is about unconventional relationships or unstable associations (on and off type of thing).

Seems to fit your situation, no?

Apart from that, the other aspects you listed are quite supportive - easy Saturn aspects can make for some seriousness and stability *but* I don't think they'll be strong enough to counteract the whole Uranus thing.

Venus/Mars conjunct ASC is quite magnetic, but probably mostly superficial - on a physical level.

Do you know her ASC?
Is there anything in each other's 7th, 8th houses? They're responsible for "serious" relationships and intimacy beyond recreational sex or romance.


Her Asc is Capricorn.

My Venus is in her 7th and my Moon in her 8th. She doesn't have anything in my 7th or 8th.

Uranus is actually my least favorite planet. Him in my 4th is the one thing in my chart I don't like.

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Doux Rêve
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posted November 01, 2013 09:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Doux Rêve     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KAMcA10:
My Venus is in her 7th and my Moon in her 8th. She doesn't have anything in my 7th or 8th.

Okay that pretty much explains it.
She sees you as a potential serious partner and you bring up intense and messy emotions in her.

I think the choice is yours, here.

Ha, yeah, Uranus can be quite difficult to deal with for us Fixed Suns.
It's too disruptive.

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KAMcA10
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posted November 01, 2013 09:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KAMcA10     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Doux Rêve:
Okay that pretty much explains it.
She sees you as a potential serious partner and you bring up intense and messy emotions in her.

I think the choice is yours, here.

Ha, yeah, Uranus can be quite difficult to deal with for us Fixed Suns.
It's too disruptive.


Are you an Aquarian?

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