Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 09:26 AM            

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Is anyone else getting annoyed with the Tropical - Sidereal zodiacs, the sign of Ophiuchus etc.

Why isn't this a primary concern to the astrologers, the tropical needs to be updated or the sidereal needs to be classified as official, something needs to happen, at the minute i am completely stuck inbetween what is the right and wrong zodiac, if the sun signs are wrong, etc..

I seem to be the only one determined to get this changed, we can't be using a 2000 year old birth chart that left out major aspects of astrology .. this is sort of a rant, but is any one else feeling this way, or just using the natal chart as it is?

I'v just come to say i'm a Sagittarius (One of the primary source constellations) but i bear in mind that Ophiuchus is where the Sun was when i was born, so i guess an Ophiuchus filtered through the constellation of Sagittarius

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 09:50 AM            

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Looking at the head of Ophiuchus, the fixed star, ras alhague, i have it in my 1st house 5 degrees from sun, i don't know if this would symbolize Ophiuchus & the Sun would stay in Sagitarius? Asklepios is also in my first house

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 09:52 AM            

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A discussion needs to be opened on this subject ...

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:06 AM            

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If i use each fixed star of Ophiuchus on the fixed star selection, every single one is in the 1st house of my natal chart. Perhaps the Sun stays within the 12 tightest constellation of the ecliptic (12 sign zodiac) while every Star of ophiuchus is also in the 1st house.

But the sun still does pass through Ophiuchus, for longer than both Sagittarius & Scorpio, aswell as in the Feminine lunar zodiac, which is more personal to us. Ophiuchus is ment to be a changing factor in our evolution so i defiantly say that it does in fact need to have some sort of effect on the zodiac, and probably the same with Cetus, maybe we need a 14 sign zodiac, sounds much more modern.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:20 AM            

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"Thirteen is part of a lunar matriarchal society that presaged the Roman empire, and was ruled by the Moon. The Romans replaced the 13-month lunar calendar of 28 days with one day left over, with their Solar 12-month calendar, with odd numbered days and 1/4 of a day left. Like history books, the calendars are written by the victors. The Romans destroyed the female power base by fire and steel, and Ptolemy likewise enslaved her astrology in service of Roman aggression and its bloody atrocities. Modern Tropical astrology is the spawn of the apologists and propagandists of male tyranny, and its use is actually a genuflection to an ideology that represents the worst of human nature.

The Romans officiated a long term misogynist backlash against women that also removed Ophiuchus from the series of eponymous constellations of the Zodiac. Ophiuchus is the symbol of the snake handler—a feminine presence, at least androgynous, which was once ubiquitous and held in reverence, a key position in the establishment of the tribal communities of the day. The ejection of Ophiuchus from Zodiac calculations and the downfall of the lunar-based matriarchy occurred at the same time, and for the same reasons: men wanted to usurp the power of strong women. Men burned witches at the stake as they eliminated Ophiuchus from the skies. It could be that in order to really understand what the stars are doing to us, we'll have to return to the 13-sign ephemeris. There is one immediate improvement to our charts, using the 13-sign system: No more intercepted planets! This impossibility—two constellations in the same house—is a result of a 12-sign system, and wrecks whatever hope of accuracy there can be.
"

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:20 AM            

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"There are problems--and miraculous cures, much of Ophiuychus is concerned with improving and alleviating their own suffering. There's a bright side to Ophiuchus, caring, kind, warm, rich, enthusiastic, devotional, deeply moral. This brightness is the healthly breath of air they want. They are breaking out of an egg; they are gasping for life. Transformation and overcoming difficulties is very important, critical, life-or-death.

Ophiuchus has dark qualities also. Her brooding makes her withdrawn or irascible, prone to extreme feelings. Perfectionist, overly sensitive, and jealous. She is also very harsh and judgmental. She can also be cold, selfish, and self-absorbed, using people as objects for her own ends. She feels that others have too much control. She is somewhat insecure. This is the look of a prisoner released from a windowless jail cell, blinking in the sunlight.

Sometimes Ophiuchus withdraws from the light, like a rat--other times, she hides behind a different, less obvious persona, the male Ophiuchus often disguise themselves as women to avoid violence. Early male shamans had to dress like and live with the wash-women to avoid being hanged or burned at the stake. The Ophiuchus brand of transformation and change frightens the male ego, and since time immemorial, the male power structure has made it a priority to kill Ophiuchus and try to steal her magic. If ever we needed magic--or what appears to us as magic, now is the time. Women's power and even supremacy must have confounded men for millennial, and they have always responded with violence. Ophiuchus has to step on Scorpio's tail to rise. For this sign it's always a risk no matter how much they try to hide. Everyday we are learning more about this remarkable sign. For both men and women of this sign, this year, ending in 13, really seems to be one in which many of these shamans, natural explorers of dark matter, are released from their fears, and can employ their amazing powers to SAVE us in spite of ourselves"

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:27 AM            

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"Ptolemy's ignorance—or treachery—has corrupted astrology for the last 1900 years; now it is time to eradicate his useless tropical ephemeris, and throw it on the garbage heap of history. You will NEVER reach your destination if you follow this old fool's maps.

The true nature of Ophiuchus can be traced back to Isis and Nephthys, sisters in ancient Egyptian mythology who used their power to bring Osiris back from the dead (see figure below). Ophiuchus is the embodiment of this magic—the Egyptians were experts at many potions, preservatives, herbs and poisons that are still a mystery, and mummification techniques that rival modern embalming methods.

Over the years, the original intent and description of the Zodiac has changed radically. Everything has been done for the convenience of astrologers. It may be that the truth is more complex than even a Sidereal system—which is also based on 12—can reveal. The true ecliptic includes the constellation Ophiuchus, which really completes the wheel.

The Romans officiated a long term misogynist backlash against women that also removed Ophiuchus from the series of eponymous constellations of the Zodiac. Ophiuchus is the symbol of the snake handler—a feminine presence, at least androgynous, which was once ubiquitous and held in reverence, a key position in the establishment of the tribal communities of the day. The ejection of Ophiuchus from Zodiac calculations and the downfall of the lunar-based matriarchy occurred at the same time, and for the same reasons: men wanted to usurp the power of strong women. Men burned witches at the stake as they eliminated Ophiuchus from the skies. It could be that in order to really understand what the stars are doing to us, we'll have to return to the 13-sign ephemeris. There is one immediate improvement to our charts, using the 13-sign system: No more intercepted planets! This impossibility—two constellations in the same house—is a result of a 12-sign system, and wrecks whatever hope of accuracy there can be.
"

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:28 AM            

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A official 13 sign chart.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:30 AM            

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrcYNrFxWnE

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:32 AM            

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http://www.upfirst.com/changingzodiacsigns.htm#The_Great_Goddess_and_The_Serpent_Bearer

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 10:34 AM            

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Read. ^^

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Posts: 4101
From:
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posted November 12, 2013 10:36 AM            

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I really am uninformed but I just read about Cetus. And then after a 16 constellation zodiac. With Orion and hydra. It was only light reading and I don't really understand.

What degree of Scorpio would start oph

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 11:01 AM            

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I think Scorpio would become a 9 degree sign, and Ophiuchus starts at 2nd December unto 17th December, about 25 degree's, but i'm not 100% on that.

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From:
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posted November 12, 2013 11:12 AM            

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I personally can't get on board with the information as is because I don't believe I'm a cancer. Cancer would actually become most First decan Leos - so unless the traits were different for cancer - this makes no sense to me.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 11:20 AM            

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If you use the fagan/bradley sidereal zodiac on astro.com, under extended charts selection, you'll get a rough idea of what your 13 sign chart would look like, i use the sidereal myself as do alot of other people, but you need to make the decision yourself on which you think suits you more. Most people want to stick with the tropical, but in my belief it's to pre-dated & simplified. The signs it shows are no longer in the same positions, i have alot of doubts about it, the sidereal seems to be the most accurate at the minute, for me personally.

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Posts: 684
From: Titan
Registered: Jun 2013

posted November 12, 2013 12:31 PM            

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The tropical zodiac is based upon the seasons, not the constellations. The constellations only served a purpose of marking 30 degree sections in the sky. A quick google search and you'd know this...

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 01:29 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by arcturiann:
The tropical zodiac is based upon the seasons, not the constellations. The constellations only served a purpose of marking 30 degree sections in the sky. A quick google search and you'd know this...

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Yes but the seasons were derived from the 12 closestconstellations, which have now changed, the suns & moons path is the seasons, and they go through the constellation of Ophiuchus. The seasons are connected to the constellations ..

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 01:35 PM            

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Even if you are the constellation of Ophiuchus, the tropical/western/roman chart is still 2000 years pre-dated and out of synq with the current seasons, constellations, equinoxes

The chart quite obviously needs to be changed, the sidereal chart works, which shows the constellations are a primary, the 13 chart i posted above you can see the way it would be shaped.

A theory of mine is the constellations are the defining charactericstic of the persona which then work with some sort of reflection to the planets, all the constellations will come into effect but they are all filtered through the ones within Earths aura (the ecliptic) which Ophiuchus is now inside of, more so than some of the others in fact.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 01:36 PM            

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Rant over.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 01:44 PM            

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What someones elses view on this topic?

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Inner Peace.

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 02:21 PM            

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Best article i can find on it, lol. http://www.onereed.com/articles/sidereal-tropical.html

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Posts: 994
From: the atman
Registered: Mar 2012

posted November 12, 2013 06:05 PM            

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how do you rack up one of those 13 sign chart jobbies?

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 06:08 PM            

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There is three websites i can find at the minute, one doing a 13sign Tropical and the others do 13 sign sidereal, Vedic i'd say would be the next best thing.

http://siderealist.com/
http://www.13signsastrology.com/astrology-readings
http://www.astrology13.com/

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Inner Peace.

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Posts: 994
From: the atman
Registered: Mar 2012

posted November 12, 2013 06:11 PM            

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thankies!

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Posts: 1963
From: Sumeria
Registered: Sep 2013

posted November 12, 2013 06:14 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by anno_lucis:
thankies!

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No Worries

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Inner Peace.

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