posted November 30, 2013 04:55 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
There's no such thing as late on set schizophrena
It's something people get in their late teens or early twenties. Anytime after it's dementia or something else.

Are you asking what aspects indicate dementia? Probably afflictions to Mercury or the Moon. Remember the moon rules the mind, Mercury the intellect.

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posted November 30, 2013 04:57 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
There's no such thing as late on set schizophrena
It's something people get in their late teens or early twenties. Anytime after it's dementia or something else.

Are you asking what aspects indicate dementia? Probably afflictions to Mercury or the Moon. Remember the moon rules the mind, Mercury the intellect.

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posted November 30, 2013 04:58 PM            

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Originally posted by charlie:
late onset Schizophrenia have been documented in people as "old" as 40.

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posted November 30, 2013 05:02 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
There's no such thing as late on set schizophrena
It's something people get in their late teens or early twenties. Anytime after it's dementia or something else.

Are you asking what aspects indicate dementia? Probably afflictions to Mercury or the Moon. Remember the moon rules the mind, Mercury the intellect.

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Totally, absolutely, beyond a shadow of a doubt, NOT true, SSS. But ONLY in the technical sense.

'Late onset' schizophrenia can simply be undiagnosed schizophrenic spectrum disorder.

Now. If someone's diagnosed with SPD around the usual time, (late teens / early twenties) and later believes they're developing positive schizophrenia? I would seriously check the diagnosis for misrepresented schizotypal, or schizopheniform NOS.

posted November 30, 2013 05:04 PM            

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Originally posted by Rosalind:
Could be undiagnosed Schizophrenia.

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Or spectrum. Undiag'd schizophrenia isn't too common because of how they present with positive symptomology early on. That tends to get checked out.

posted November 30, 2013 05:08 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
I've read differently.

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Again. It's they were always on the spectrum.

A 'neat trick' I saw happening a lot in the late '90s (up until the next decade) was to diagnose someone as bipolar, stick 'em on drugs, and then 'marvel' at 'psychotic disorder NOS' (which is THE biggest wastebasket 'diagnosis' you've EVER heard) in their thirties and forties.

Sometimes, I hate my field. Well, it's practitioners.

They were ALWAYS on the spectrum - THAT's the take-home message here. And, hey, we're not gods. We make mistakes. But sometimes those 'mistakes' are driven by, oh, kickbacks, or ego, (yes, ego) and a host of other things you really don't want to believe your doctor is doing at your expense.

If only I were paranoid, and not an insider. I'd probably be a more optimistic person that way.

posted November 30, 2013 05:09 PM            

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Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
Totally, absolutely, beyond a shadow of a doubt, NOT true, SSS. But ONLY in the technical sense.

'Late onset' schizophrenia can simply be undiagnosed schizophrenic spectrum disorder.

Now. If someone's diagnosed with SPD around the usual time, (late teens / early twenties) and later believes they're developing positive schizophrenia? I would seriously check the diagnosis for misrepresented schizotypal, or schizopheniform NOS.

I'm also really leery of 'diagnosing' by astrology. I've got a rather open-minded approach, but I'm still a scientist - and it's fingernails on a blackboard for me.

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posted November 30, 2013 05:21 PM            

Go get checked out. If you're having auditory hallucinations - get checked out. If they're visual - GET CHECKED OUT. If you're noticing something akin to dysthymia - don't sit on it. If your affect is flattening - check. that. out.

I've been on the schizo spectrum since I was 20 (or younger). All negative, no positive symptoms. (Some 'odd beliefs' - like, you know, astrology. So, take some of it with a shaker of salt.)

Unless you guys aren't real. In which case ... I guess I'm in trouble ....

All jesting aside? Get checked out. I'm sure I've had all kinds of 'those' transits over my 33 years. No psychosis. Not even a single psychotic episode.

posted November 30, 2013 05:28 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
[b] Totally, absolutely, beyond a shadow of a doubt, NOT true, SSS. But ONLY in the technical sense.

'Late onset' schizophrenia can simply be undiagnosed schizophrenic spectrum disorder.

Now. If someone's diagnosed with SPD around the usual time, (late teens / early twenties) and later believes they're developing positive schizophrenia? I would seriously check the diagnosis for misrepresented schizotypal, or schizopheniform NOS.

I'm also really leery of 'diagnosing' by astrology. I've got a rather open-minded approach, but I'm still a scientist - and it's fingernails on a blackboard for me.

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... It's an anachronistic term for what MAY be schizoaffective, but is diagnosed on a 4-factor model.

No offence, but I kinda feel like you're copy-and-pasting from wikipedia, and we're straying from the issue - which is the OP needs to not look for transits which may 'mimic' psychosis, but go to a trained practitioner and investigate his symptoms, ASAP.

And, I should add 'plain dementia', is like diagnosing someone with contusion of the knee. But there's a similar misconception regarding 'vertigo'. Just as a contusion is a secondary 'disease', so is vertigo - and dementia. In other words - yes, you've got a bruise. But you don't end the conversation there.

posted November 30, 2013 05:31 PM            

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Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
... It's an anachronistic term for what MAY be schizoaffective, but is diagnosed on a 4-factor model.

No offence, but I kinda feel like you're copy-and-pasting from wikipedia, and we're straying from the issue - which is the OP needs to not look for transits which may 'mimic' psychosis, but go to a trained practitioner and investigate his symptoms, ASAP.

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I checked wiki for the spelling that's it. I have read about it before because I have an interest in psychology and I have read that schizophrenia is diagnosed in people in their late teens or early twenties. That is the preferred age group for this particular diagnosis and schizophrenia is not the only psychotic disorder in existence. So, when you go on in thinking you have it, determined to get diagnosed by a doctor, chances are less you will actually get diagnosed. They look for lack of insight, it's a symptom of thought disorder.

posted November 30, 2013 05:45 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
I checked wiki for the spelling that's it. I have read about it before because I have an interest in psychology and I have read that schizophrenia is diagnosed in people in their late teens or early twenties. That is the preferred age group for this particular diagnosis and schizophrenia is not the only psychotic disorder in existence. So, when you go on in thinking you have it, determined to get diagnosed by a doctor, chances are less you will actually get diagnosed. They look for lack of insight, it's a symptom of thought disorder.

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... C-. Passing, but with just enough to do damage. So, speaking of insight, let's start there.

Schizophrenia is, and remains, one of THE most complex of all potential psychotic disorders.

I feel you're addressing the theory of anosognosia - rather its potential role in the diagnosis of schizophrenia. I'm not sure it applies - unless, at the end of the day, Charlie says, 'No, there's no way I HAVE schizophrenia. I'm just experiencing some tangential thing that's mimicking it, like a transit,' to which I have to concur. Yes, that would apply.

But, let's not put the cart before the horse.

I only have 3 years of formal study regarding the schizophrenic spectrum, and a lot of it was in the early Naughts. New breakthroughs in the realm of neuroscience are being made on a damned near yearly basis. I'm simply not qualified to say anything beyond, 'go get checked out.' And frankly, neither are you.

I feel this thread may be crossing over into that dicey liability zone, so I'm going to politely refrain from further commentary.

I've said my piece, and Charlie, I wish you all the best, and urge you to see a qualified specialist.

posted November 30, 2013 05:54 PM            

Usually, the person experiencing a psychotic break do not believe anything is amiss and others are the ones who are wrong. Others are quite concerned and can tell the person is out of touch with reality.

posted November 30, 2013 05:56 PM            

Family oral history dictates that she started having delusions around age 13. Just for funsies, I pulled up my mother's transits for that year.

My mother has natal Sun and (retrograde) Mercury in Aries in the 12th. In her transits for that year, she had Chiron going across both of them, with Neptune trining them both from the 8th, and squaring her Moon/Uranus conjunction in Leo. Uranus and Pluto were going through her 6th in Libra, opposite her natal Sun/Mercury.

I hesitate to say that any of that is "indicative" of the onset of schizophrenia...but in retrospect, it sort of looks like a "perfect storm" of sorts, with transiting planets all hitting the planets you might fear, as well as going through all the relevant houses (6, 8, 12).

posted November 30, 2013 06:05 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
They don't usually have even that much insight. Schizophrenia is, supposedly, the most impairing of the psychotic disorders so they have to be kinda severe to get a diagnosis and psychiatrists are really careful about it because they don't want to be too hasty in diagnosing it.

Usually, the person experiencing a psychotic break do not believe anything is amiss and others are the ones who are wrong. Others are quite concerned and can tell the person is out of touch with reality.

That doesn't sound like our Charlie who is questioning something is amiss, she just doesn't know what, exactly. That sounds like being in touch with reality imo.

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I am both in touch and out of touch but I can safely say that since February of this year something changed. I have gotten paranoid of my surroundings, I think people say things only so that I will start to believe it's me thinking but then it IS me thinking and at that point I don't know who's thinking what. I also have flashes and visions that come before me and the faces I see are always distorted as if in agony or half human half devilish.

I "feel" people also, as if they are me. Or me them. Sometimes I actually think there's a Candid Camera episode being filmed because of all the weirdness. I see numbers and configurations in letters and sentences and my brain automatically starts calculating forth a "message" that I later have to investigate to find a hidden meaning.

posted November 30, 2013 06:08 PM            

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Originally posted by charlie:
I am both in touch and out of touch but I can safely say that since February of this year something changed. I have gotten paranoid of my surroundings, I think people say things only so that I will start to believe it's me thinking but then it IS me thinking and at that point I don't know who's thinking what. I also have flashes and visions that come before me and the faces I see are always distorted as if in agony or half human half devilish.

I "feel" people also, as if they are me. Or me them. Sometimes I actually think there's a Candid Camera episode being filmed because of all the weirdness. I see numbers and configurations in letters and sentences and my brain automatically starts calculating forth a "message" that I later have to investigate to find a hidden meaning.

I haven't had ONE normal night of sleep since February which is when all this started. So now it's just a black circle of weirdness and tiredness but in between there are a few days when I am nothingness itself and then I can't sleep anyway because I feel neither tired nor awake so I just lay there.

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posted November 30, 2013 06:12 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
I've heard people talk about Alzheimer's patients exhibiting some of the same behaviors as people with certain types of Schizophrenia, particularly Undifferentiated. My aunt used to work in a care facility for Alzheimer's patients and she described some of the exact same disorganized behavior exhibited by some with schizophrenia in her patients. A few of them were diagnosed with dementia in addition.

My Aunt had Parkinson's she experienced auditory hallucinations and was never diagnosed with schizophrenia. So you see, symptoms can overlap and certain types of schizophrenia share characteristics with dementia.

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I don't disagree that there are some common symptoms...But I think it's taking it a bit too far to say that:

quote:

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
There's no such thing as late on set schizophrena
It's something people get in their late teens or early twenties. Anytime after it's dementia or something else.

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posted November 30, 2013 06:14 PM            

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Originally posted by StarlightSmileSupreme:
Hmm. That might require a doctor's advice. Did something happen in your environment? Were you the victim of a crime or something like that before the paranoia?

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posted November 30, 2013 06:14 PM            

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Originally posted by nove731:
The diseases have quite different physiological effects on the brain.

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... Sigh.

posted November 30, 2013 06:20 PM            

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Originally posted by charlie:
Just in my youth. I am simply questioning if I can be so extremely empathetic so that I am actually sponging up people around me and thus think it's me. But that thought scares me because it's not really scientific so hence my main question.

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I've read some doctors prefer to see the positive symptoms, especially auditory hallucinations and complete delusional systems in place before they diagnose schizophrenia. They look for some one thinking the CIA is after them and inserting thoughts in their minds they can hear out loud sorta thinking.

There's a Paranoid Disorder (not a schizophrenia) too that features (surprise!) paranoid thought patterns as the main symptom and you can bet many people have that since most people are paranoid about crime these days, hardly out of the ordinary to worry about that imo!

I do worry about your eyes playing tricks on you though. That might be worth checking out.

posted November 30, 2013 06:21 PM            

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Originally posted by IndigoDirae:
... Sigh.

Yes, the mechanism behind Alzheimers is in NO way related to schizophrenia. Again, this is where qualified, experienced diagnosticians need to take over.

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It's not related in cause but it can still manifest in similar ways so that symptoms can overlap. Two different diseases can create some of the same symptoms. Symptoms with different causes.