posted April 01, 2015 04:20 AM            

The Asc is more contextual and subjective.
The Sun is the extension of Source.
The Moon being the "guide"/"tool" to how far/near one is to Source.

The Asc is the physical body, but more so, it is also contextual.

Contextual is the sense that it denotes the circumstances and condition into which we are born-as well as the subjective experiences from that place of birth.

It is NOT whom we are. But one can understand how easily we can confuse it with the core personality i.e "I am introverted", "I am a good listener" etc.

At the core of it all, we are LOVE(The Sun). But there is an aching need by Source(which is exactly what we all are) to "break" this definition down into manageable pieces, in order to remember itself once more.

And what better way to do this, then through reality? Through the relationship of the physical world and therefore the physical body(Asc) and all its subjective experiences?

So the Asc is more contextually based; moment in time,place of birth, family surroundings etc. And its role in the birth chart is to centre one in the context of "here and now".

A soul born with Capricorn rising often finds themselves in conditions that are less favorable/tenuous.

If the Sun is in Gemini, it may be souls wish to live frivolously and enjoy the many experiences of being oneself and expressing them

But upon the moment of birth, "forgetfulness" and circumstances unto which one is born under, make the Asc stronger.

So from birth,the serious need for accomplishment/ world fame or social advancement becomes the object of contextual attention.

But that individual is NOT the Cap.They are truly the Sun. And this becomes ever more clearer as they grow older and especially so, in the moment of death.

But often times, the Asc can define the individual so much, that he/she does not see himself as "separate" from the conditions unto which they have been born under.

The Sun in Virgo/Gemini Asc has a differing agenda. But still at the center of it is the joy of knowing the self.

The Virgo delights in a life that can have them appreciate the intricacies/details of life.

To take in all the symmetry, composition and synastry of it all. And perhaps to learn how to create the same whilst living?

A grand,beautiful,perfected piece of soulful expression; music, painting ,building ,writing etc.

But when born with the Asc in Gemini, there are many distractions that become clear to one from the moment of birth.

There is always,within that body,an incessant wish to experience everything and anything in a short space of time.This without giving due and adequate attention to any in particular(square).

But when one ages, the need to know all things becomes exhausted(Gem Asc). And one becomes ever more clearer about what was once one's goal(Virgo Sun).

So the expectations of others(Asc),become less important. And one now discovers the joy of knowing self(Sun).

The story doesn't always end this beautifully and "complete" for the soul's journey. It is NEVER done. And we can NEVER get it "wrong".

But we can stay in that state of "forgetfulness"(Asc). And let the opinions circumstances, physical state of the body in life determine whom we are.

It is only in death that we remember.That is why so many of us are filled with regret.

But that's because we don't know or do not internalize that the game never stops. we only think it does because the body ceases to exist(Asc).

posted April 01, 2015 06:40 AM            

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a person or thing performing or causing the stated action

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posted April 01, 2015 06:47 AM            

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Originally posted by Nine:
What does the suffix "-ant" mean

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posted April 01, 2015 09:47 AM            

Your correct angles and houses are not like our planets we don't feel them personally, until someone plops down on our couch, starts eating our potato chips and suddenly we realize we like them being there, inside our four walls....we realize they fit in. They can be part of our most basic needs....our roots, our grounding, they can be a part of our structure. How do we know they fit in? Because we FEEL it, we feel our structure and how they fit in with it.
That's what our house system is, our structure.

We don't usually go around feeling the physical walls of our house either, we just always know it's there. We don't really think about the energy of our home or how attached we are until we are away visiting and get home sick, still we think about the ppl in the home more than the actual home, we think about the emotions not the structure.
We take for granted that we immediately know when someone walks in if they fit or if they belong because we know our homes energy.
But what happens one day when that home gets blown away in a tornado. I live in tornado alley...I can tell you it's devastating. Try to sit back and imagine your home being gone, standing outside all your stuff blown away....your not sure where your going to sleep tonight.
It may sound dramatic but it's real.
Our house system has so much to do with our root Chakra, our grounding chakra that allows us to feel connected to our planet and know we belong, we are taken care of, we are wanted and protected by our mother Earth. The 4 angles you are given in your chart are exactly what you need in order to feel connected in the way you need to in this life in order to grow.

Losing your physical home is somewhat like losing a family member, your foundation has been ripped from underneath you. You didn't realize how much you relied on it until it's gone and your standing there with all our ppl....but no structure or protection for them or you. That's when you get it, you feel it...you feel what those 4 walls/angles are in your life.

Our astrology house structure has always been there for us from day 1. We were born into it, so we think we don't feel it because we don't know anything different, there is nothing to compare it to. So yes, we don't feel it in the same way as a planet, but we do feel it!

posted April 01, 2015 11:10 AM            

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Originally posted by bananaz:
Okay. I KIND OF get it. Lol I understand the part about the transits. Obviously we need the ascendant to map out our birth charts, conditions of present life, etc.

The part I don't get is where the ascendant begins and the sun ends when it comes to our persona. Are you saying we are a mixture of our sun and ascendant and that both of those signs are influencing the essential "makeup" of who we are? If that's the case, what exactly is an ascendant? Is it an added layer of energy? If it's not the surface of who we are, what is it?

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Your ASC shows the conditions in your life as well as your outlook. Its like your own unique world. The Sun represents what energies may INFLUENCE you in that world..

Your not supposed to "feel" your ASC. Its a path, not an energetic influence like the moon.

When ppl say that the ASC is just a "mask", they are saying its something that you can turn off and on, which is nonsense. Your rising is a very DEEP part of your spiritual make-up. The planets are outside influences. Sun being masculine influences like your dad, teachers. Moon being feminine influences like your mom, senses, and reactions. Saturn being Karma, where you need to learn lessons etc..

Lets use my moon in Libra and IC in Gemini as an example. My moon in Libra is about balancing my emotions in a diplomatic and artistic way. And the relationships i have/had with others drew these energies out of me as a reaction.

But my IC represents my upbringing and my development.

My IC in Gemini had me being raised differently from my sister. I was raised in an environment where communicating and learning in a certain way was important. It had nothing to do with what I personally felt like my moon would show. It simply was, what it was. To this day I still don't understand where my writing talents and constant need to talk to myself comes from lol. You may not feel your rising in aries as much because of a particular moon position in another house, or other planetary influences in your chart like your Sun being in your 12th

posted April 01, 2015 11:21 AM            

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Originally posted by Valentine:
Thanks Gabby, for the good explanation.

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Originally posted by PixieJane:
That was well written, Gabby!

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posted April 01, 2015 11:28 AM            

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Originally posted by Gabby:
The 4 angles/4 walls your born into, these are there for structure, foundation, grounding, protection and support. These 4 walls/angles give you protection from the elements and safe haven to call home as you grow.
We are given structure in all the most basic ways,
AC....projection protection/structure
IC.....family structure
DC....relationship structure
MC....providing for ourselves, work structure

Your correct angles and houses are not like our planets we don't feel them personally, until someone plops down on our couch, starts eating our potato chips and suddenly we realize we like them being there, inside our four walls....we realize they fit in. They can be part of our most basic needs....our roots, our grounding, they can be a part of our structure. How do we know they fit in? Because we FEEL it, we feel our structure and how they fit in with it.
That's what our house system is, our structure.

We don't usually go around feeling the physical walls of our house either, we just always know it's there. We don't really think about the energy of our home or how attached we are until we are away visiting and get home sick, still we think about the ppl in the home more than the actual home, we think about the emotions not the structure.
We take for granted that we immediately know when someone walks in if they fit or if they belong because we know our homes energy.
But what happens one day when that home gets blown away in a tornado. I live in tornado alley...I can tell you it's devastating. Try to sit back and imagine your home being gone, standing outside all your stuff blown away....your not sure where your going to sleep tonight.
It may sound dramatic but it's real.
Our house system has so much to do with our root Chakra, our grounding chakra that allows us to feel connected to our planet and know we belong, we are taken care of, we are wanted and protected by our mother Earth. The 4 angles you are given in your chart are exactly what you need in order to feel connected in the way you need to in this life in order to grow.

Losing your physical home is somewhat like losing a family member, your foundation has been ripped from underneath you. You didn't realize how much you relied on it until it's gone and your standing there with all our ppl....but no structure or protection for them or you. That's when you get it, you feel it...you feel what those 4 walls/angles are in your life.

Our astrology house structure has always been there for us from day 1. We were born into it, so we think we don't feel it because we don't know anything different, there is nothing to compare it to. So yes, we don't feel it in the same way as a planet, but we do feel it!

**Side point for another thread someday....I've often wondered what has happened to the homeless ppl, what happens to their root chakra that allows them to feel they deserve no structure or home. I've wondered if maybe many of them could have saggy AC's or IC's or possibly a very unbalanced house system that leaves them feeling out of place

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posted April 01, 2015 11:48 AM            

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Originally posted by NYCdodger:
THANK YOU for this! Its like a "contract" we sign with the universe. You may not feel it, but its there.

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posted April 01, 2015 12:18 PM            

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Originally posted by Gabby:
Exactly!! Our house system is just as personal to us, chosen by our higher selves, as our planets...only difference is it directs the way our energy flows while the planets are the energy that is flowing.
Water doesn't feel or acknowledge the basin, ditch or gutter it's flowing through or know that it's being directed by that structure to a specific place but yet it's still happening. That our house system, without it our energy would not have a direction.
That's why I'm not a huge fan of the whole house system, you'll miss the more subtle directions of energy flow in a chart or potentially the places the energy doesn't balance or flow well. Of course the ideal is an exact grand cross because it has the exact amount of stress and friction to spur the person on to peruse their life's purpose...when a chart isn't in a grand cross the person will find some areas too easy and other areas they don't have any stress to drive them to accomplish what they need in those areas, it creates an imbalance in their lives.
I'm researching a theory that these house imbalances can potentially create or leave some vulnerable to emotional/personality disorders because of the energy flow imbalances they create. Our life force is electric energy and your brain functions through the neurological pathways firing directed by that energy, it makes sense if our foundation for energy flow is out of whack, we could be to.

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Would you say that you Ascendant is like your higher self? That sets up everything else in life as well as what planets would be influencing certain areas?

I believe the moon is what influences our emotional responses. The Sun is what influences our self-esteem. And the Ascendant is the higher self that structures and provides over the conditions in our lives

posted April 01, 2015 02:49 PM            

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Originally posted by NYCdodger:
Would you say that you Ascendant is like your higher self? That sets up everything else in life as well as what planets would be influencing certain areas?

I believe the moon is what influences our emotional responses. The Sun is what influences our self-esteem. And the Ascendant is the higher self that structures and provides over the conditions in our lives

Even when i read my horoscope i read my rising sign and not my sun. Its much more in depth on whats going on in my life

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Just to chime in...

I wouldn't exactly call the Rising sign the higher self because that sounds pretty transcendent, to me. I think the Rising sign is very grounded in your day-to-day experience of life. The North Node, in my opinion, is your higher self because it pushes you out of your comfort zone. The Ascendant is more so a part of that comfort zone.

From what you're saying, I think you're kind of talking about the super-ego, which, in psychology, is the part of ourselves that structures our lives and tells what to do and what not to do. But, this is the reason why I think the Ascendant can become a little limiting, if taken too far. Leaning too heavily on your Ascendant can make you too concerned with people's expectations of you, if they'll approve of you or not, and what kind of impression you made on them. It can make you very self-conscious, a little too wrapped up in the image you're putting out there.

I think the idea that the Rising is a mask is because it's a very external expression. And when you start getting too focused on the external part of yourself, you start missing the real meat and potatoes of who you are, on the inside. It's not that you're being fake or something when you express your Ascendant. I think we become so used to doing it that it DOES become a part of us. It's just that you're focusing on or worrying about how you're coming off when you're in Rising sign mode, which we all do, to a certain extent. But, doing that too much can become unhealthy and erode true self-confidence. We compensate for our insecurities with our Rising sign, especially when we're just getting to know people. And it can inhibit you from being more like your Sun sign.

That's why some astrologers, including Dana Gerhardt who I think is amazing, have said that you need to learn how to control your Ascendant and its expression more, instead of letting it control you. I think the more truly confident a person gets, the less they rely on their Ascendant (particularly if it's not conjunct any personal planets). It's hold on us becomes looser. It's a way of being you can fall into, when necessary. But, we can learn to not always go to this persona when we're feeling unsure (the joker for Sagittarius Rising; the caregiver for Cancer Rising) and lean more so on the principles of our Sun sign, which will help us build true self-assurance.

posted April 01, 2015 05:15 PM            

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Originally posted by bananaz:
Based on what everyone has said, I don't see how the mask analogy is way off base. Maybe not a mask, but more like our skin and clothes. You use the words external/ conditions of life/ etc. In the house metaphor it's the outside/ structure. (Which, by the way I loved reading! Thanks for writing that Gabby!) Still part of us, but not the core of who we are.

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posted April 01, 2015 05:31 PM            

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Originally posted by furrybunny:
doesn't that make ICMCDES important then?

i personally think if theres no aspects to the ascendant, it really is just a mask. theres people out there who don't leave much of an impression. u forget them in an instant. thats just my personal observation.

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posted April 01, 2015 06:25 PM            

i have a sag 4th house and personality wise i relate more to sag. i have a virgo ascendant with many aspects to it due to a stellium in the 4th house. i love history /art history and I am really laid back/ care free. i moved alot for school and vacations and what not.

posted April 01, 2015 07:46 PM            

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Originally posted by furrybunny:
oo gabby just reading ur past posts hehe.

i have a sag 4th house and personality wise i relate more to sag. i have a virgo ascendant with many aspects to it due to a stellium in the 4th house. i love history /art history and I am really laid back/ care free. i moved alot for school and vacations and what not.

physically i have wiry hair red skin undertone athletic yet i lack zero fire in my chart. I retain the virgo shy quiet demeanor and can be critical but meh. not sure what else virgos are known for. so yeh i do think my virgo is a mask. could be me being bias though hehehe.

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posted April 01, 2015 08:00 PM            

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Based on what everyone has said, I don't see how the mask analogy is way off base. Maybe not a mask, but more like our skin and clothes.

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This is due to a confusion of terms. Often people use Ascendant/Rising Sign/Ascendant Sign interchangeably. Ascendant sign & Rising Sign mean the same thing, but Ascendant & Rising sign are not the same. The Ascendant is the point, like say the NN, with its inherent qualities. The Rising Sign or Ascendant Sign would be one of the 12 signs through which the Asc expresses its unique energy.

posted April 01, 2015 08:18 PM            

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Look at it this way...
Your AC is like the front of your literal home....
When ppl pull up to your house what do they see?
What are you showing everyone about who you are? What color is your house? Did you plant flowers? Is it neat and tidy? Is it a cottage in woods, a bungalow in suburbs or a downtown loft?

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Close. However...

posted April 01, 2015 09:14 PM            

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Originally posted by Nine:
Close. However...

The Asc is the house itself, a physical structure that can be called a home. The paint, roof, doors & windows or lack there of, that would be the Rising Sign/Ascendant sign. Where is this house located?; the country, in the city, woods, on the water - that's the Sun sign.

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