posted October 11, 2015 02:50 AM            

I can only link this to my Moon in the 4th because nostalgia seems like such a Cancerian thing.

I've also got Saturn in the 7th but the few people I know who share my obsession have charts loaded with Cancer placements.

I know someone with NN in the 4th and they want to be remembered as this nostalgic character. It hurts them when people don't appreciate the past.

posted October 11, 2015 03:10 AM            

And a Cancer moon I know actually incorporates books of history and their subject matter into romance. Seriously. (Don't get me wrong, I find this refreshing, but not what I'd have expected of anyone, not unless they were big on reincarnation which she's not.)

But most people I've known to LOVE (to the point of collecting and spending a lot of money on) antiques, antiquities, or even just the really old books, comics, and movies, are those with strong Capricorn aspects.

Though I have this very vague impression that I've known more than one Virgo (or major influence from Virgo in their charts), including on LL (the specific one I can recall offhand has since been banned), seemed to romanticize the generations before them (including in listening to the music, reading the books, etc, as if pretending they were of that generation today), though this was based on unrealistic portrayals, but I guess it counts and can suggest that it get a lot more extreme (just plug those aspects into Pluto, and make put this in 2H Taurus, and then aspect it to Cancer, as an example...)

posted October 11, 2015 10:44 AM            

4th House Moon (In Capricorn),

4th House Neptune (in early Capricorn, conj the IC in Sag)

and Sun, Ceres and Mars in 10th House Cancer.

I too love my history/looking into the past, I'm a collector of Wax Cylinder recordings from the late 19th century, up until World War I. I'm also a massive fan of Alternate History and occasionally write Alternate History stories (though not for publishing).

That said, though I find the past fascinating and would love to travel back to visit various times, I wouldn't want to have lived way back when-it's more of a case of using history to learn lessons for the future in my case.

posted October 11, 2015 03:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
Sometimes I feel I was born in the wrong time and that the modern world is just ugly, cold and unhuman

---

How so?

Just so you understand the source of my confusion, I'm thinking of just how BRUTAL our species has been. Torture, mass murder, vile executions, sometimes over the most petty of reasons and through glib xenophobia...it's terrible. Today, it's common to flame people on the internet for having a different opinion, but historically it was more common to burn them at the stake (or perhaps cook their eyeballs in their sockets, trap a rat and then heat where it's trap so that it escapes through the stomach of the condemned, brand them with heated metal, etc), hang them, drown them (sometimes burying them at low tide so they'll drown slowly hours later, among other ways, even putting them in a sack with say a cat to drown them so they'll get clawed to hell as well), decapitate them, dismember them, or exile them and let nature do it instead.

And I'm also thinking of how brutal life (nature, disease, disasters, how common starvation was even when there wasn't a warlord of one sort or another to take it all away, etc) often was as well.

posted October 11, 2015 08:45 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
@PixieJane: I'm thinking of 20th century after the 60s. Like being born a few decades earlier.
No age is perfect. But the world is becoming a place I don't really like.
Loss of cultural identity, kids can't play in the street anymore, chivalry is dying out, I see many girls walking around half naked in the street, life is so fast people don't take the time to talk to each other face to face. To walk in a garden, to pause a second and smile to the sight of nature or a beautiful animal. Buildings are getting taller and uglier by the day...

People my age make me sick, honestly. Only a few have the sensitity and try to properly educate themselves...

---

What bugs me the most about our time is how in America at least, classical culture is slowly being discredited as being outdated since it's mostly written 'by white old men'.

I was lucky enough to have a teacher who considered it very important to read all the European and Eastern classics (such as 1001 Nights).

Other teachers had us read things like The Hunger Games instead of Lord of The Flies.

I mean, there seems to be no unifying culture anymore.

posted October 12, 2015 02:42 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
@PixieJane: I'm thinking of 20th century after the 60s. Like being born a few decades earlier.
No age is perfect. But the world is becoming a place I don't really like.
Loss of cultural identity, kids can't play in the street anymore, chivalry is dying out, I see many girls walking around half naked in the street, life is so fast people don't take the time to talk to each other face to face. To walk in a garden, to pause a second and smile to the sight of nature or a beautiful animal. Buildings are getting taller and uglier by the day...

People my age make me sick, honestly. Only a few have the sensitity and try to properly educate themselves...

---

But there are a lot of good things that came with progress since the 60s. I guess, if you are a female or not white. But I guess if you are white, esp a white male then the older decades might look very nice.

Loss of cultural identity? At least in America there never was much cultural identity, America has mostly been defined with popular culture rather than a long history.

Chivalry is still alive. Our culture just doesnt impose on it as much. I dont mind, because it lets me see WHO will actually go the extra mile to open a door for me. It means more to me that someone will be nice for the sake of being nice rather than because thats what society dictates.

Also, I like having the freedom to dress how I wish, even if I dont stretch that freedom. But if you hate it, then it lets you see who to AVOID plain as day. If women werent allowed to dress like this, you would never know who wants to show off all her goods and who doesnt care to!

posted October 12, 2015 11:22 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
@PixieJane: I'm thinking of 20th century after the 60s. Like being born a few decades earlier.

---

Okay, I get that.

When you said you had a history degree and liked the classical, historical stuff, I took that to mean you were talking centuries back in time, minimum, from classical music (from generally a couple of centuries ago) to even the classical age much further back. Not the 1970s.

posted October 12, 2015 11:23 AM            

Of course it had its dark side as well, and people were generally paralyzed over topics like the Cold War (and possibly nuclear) as governments were being overthrown around the world, and it would soon be followed by the Satanic Panics. (Btw, if you weren't raised in it then I doubt you can understand how paralyzing that fear was. I can't, not at a gut level, but on a mental level I understand that it was firmly tied to the survival instincts, not just tribal. One guy explaining it to me said that it sent SHOCK through him to hear in Terminator 2 that "the Russians are our friends now" as it was so radical.)

Violent crime was such that many assumed America would fall (and some argue that had abortion not been legalized that it very well may have followed Romania into falling in large part due to angry kids with nothing to lose, or at least being splintered). Both left and right wing terrorists groups were active in the US back then as well (and Americans were taken hostage around the world, and meanwhile back home was Nixon, the Kent State massacre, etc), as were murderous cults (including Jim Jones) that made even the 90s look calm in comparison.

The first high school shooting by a student happened in the US (though school shootings and worse were already part of American history, just by adults), which would be followed up a few years later (same decade) when a known mentally ill girl was given all she needed to shoot up a school by her father as a Christmas present despite that she had asked for a radio (he also refused to give permission to have his daughter committed).

On the (dubious) plus side, women were more likely to be targeted by serial killers rather than mass murderers (the Son of Sam, who called himself Mr. Monster, said he was "hurt" to be called a misogynist ) though that didn't stop them from having girlfriends (like Veronica Compton trying to help out the Hillside Strangler).

Feminism was really angry, close to the straw feminists (that is "fake feminist" that even many on LL mistake for "ordinary feminist" which is why I give a link defining it) today...though when I learned what went on back then, I can't say I blame them...after I learned what it was like I thought I might've been burning my own bra had I been alive then. I recognize it as a regrettable but necessary step, and I'm glad I missed that.

And the horror stories gay people have told me about being alive back then... And that was an improvement over previous decades! Some of whom endured lobotomies (a vile practice that even the Soviet Union banned in 1950 for being so inhumane but was still being used in the United States in the 1970s when the US Government finally established a commission to look into it).

Though it's not like others had it so well, especially if you weren't a white male, and even plenty of white males could have it hard. (I think the most haunting story to me was of a girl who was told by her parents that she had to shoot her pet dog for "staying out too late." The girl shot herself instead. The parents weren't charged as they had broken no law.)

One thing that made me laugh was reading about Tex Watson (who led the Manson killings in 69) feeling hopeful when the soldiers involved in the My Lai Massacre getting off (only one got a slap on the wrist, and the nation supported this--just as many in the nation also supported the Kent State shooting) meant that he and the Manson family would get off "because we only killed a few."

Forgive my gallows humor, but such naïveté in a homicidal person who has no ability to understand the double standards of society is surprising to me...and shows me that he was a sociopath rather than psychopath (the latter would have understood the difference, they may not respect the difference, but they understand how their prey thinks and delude themselves, while the sociopath doesn't, the sociopath is pretty much like many people, only in unacceptable ways, whereas if channeled "correctly" the sociopath is called a hero).

posted October 12, 2015 07:26 PM            

Why do you insist on the idea of white males? Do you have something against men in specific?

I wish I was back in the time there were actual jobs, people weren't half naked, pierced and tattoed all over the place. Now everybody runs all over bumping into each other. I see terrible rudeness everyday. Lack of vocabulary, Reading skills and rampant ADHD.

I don't like it and I don't have to. I'm not conformist but I believe there are limits and people don't know where the lines are anymore.

The US is a very violent country. It was not like that where I live. We had a dictatorship but after it was over the country developped pretty fast. Gays only had to be discreet. No one would look inside the walls of your house or lobotomize you. There where several famous homossexuals, people just didn't talk about it publicly.
Marriage is legal for everyone now.

posted October 12, 2015 07:33 PM            

I think it goes without saying that most people's nostalgia comes from the love of art and music (and other collectibles) and not some diabolical Conservative agenda.

posted October 12, 2015 07:43 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
I love the music, the clothes and the politeness.
I hope the diabolical conservative agenda isn't directed at me, since I'm far from that actually LOL

---

posted October 12, 2015 09:46 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:

I'm an european young female. And history isn't just about mummies and sarcophagi LOL
I majored in contemporary.

Why do you insist on the idea of white males? Do you have something against men in specific?

I wish I was back in the time there were actual jobs, people weren't half naked, pierced and tattoed all over the place. Now everybody runs all over bumping into each other. I see terrible rudeness everyday. Lack of vocabulary, Reading skills and rampant ADHD.

I don't like it and I don't have to. I'm not conformist but I believe there are limits and people don't know where the lines are anymore.

The US is a very violent country. It was not like that where I live. We had a dictatorship but after it was over the country developped pretty fast. Gays only had to be discreet. No one would look inside the walls of your house or lobotomize you. There where several famous homossexuals, people just didn't talk about it publicly.
Marriage is legal for everyone now.

We lost the colonies but many black people stayed and since there was a turn to the left, people learned to live with each other. And 95% of the people don't care what race you are.

---

Its funny when peopel talk about "white males" its not like we have anything against them, but throughout history they are the people that kind of took over, and of course, set the rules so that they would benefit the most. History itself was written from a male perspective that is the only perspective we have. But that is all it is, THEIR perspective. I for one, am really glad that women are starting to actually become RELEVANT in society rather than mere backdrops.

If you arent part of the status quo, its glaringly obvious what that status quo IS. Maybe you havent had the opportunity to be hindered by your race or gender, but I have, and I know it was much worse in the past. Interracial dating wasnt allowed. And are you forgetting the civil rights movement? And women gaining the right to vote? Did you know that domestic violence wasnt even CONSIDERED a crime in america?

So what if people are half naked? They arent harming you. Or are they making you feel insecure? Either way, just ignore em! We have the freedom TO be half naked and that is a great thing. Like I said before, it lets you see plain as day what people to steer clear of. Same with piercings and tattoos, its nice that we have the option to do whatever we want instead of feeling like we have to conform to some creepy stepford wife ideal to survive. And if you hate tattoos, well...then they have a permanent mark on their body that says avoid me!

Also, maybe youre just exposed to the wrong people? There are so many intelligent people out there, with large vocabularies. (Though to me, a large vocabulary signifies pretentiousness rather than real intelligence..) There are polite people, people that wont bump into you.

posted October 13, 2015 12:12 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by whaaat:
I think it goes without saying that most people's nostalgia comes from the love of art and music (and other collectibles) and not some diabolical Conservative agenda.

---

If I had more money than I'd ever need and could afford anything, I'd live in a Victorian style home filled with antiques (and not just Victorian)...and steampunk.

For example, my computer would look something like this:

I love all sorts of music, from classical to cutting edge, downright avant garde. I think my favorite is when classical and modern instruments are mixed in a band when it gives the impressions of roots in the ancient past reaching to an unknown future (and aware of the history without being bound to it, like a half-drawn map with more to chart), with a close second being classical instruments used to play modern songs.

My guess in regards to the astrological reasons is that this is my Libra Saturn (in stellium) sextile to 5H Sag Uranus-Neptune-moon (in stellium). The Libra Saturn can appreciate traditions almost as well as Cappie and Taurus while the creative 5H Sag Uranus-Neptune loves to put a new spin on them, and the moon taking emotional comfort and pleasure from it.

I suppose my Neptune-moon sextile Pluto would also help explain why I like viewing, and touching if possible, that which is old that was somewhere (or used by) someone that was historically significant, it helps me "feel" the reality of it (a Capricorn inspired me to do this, though I know I did it before but without conscious realization of what I was doing).

posted October 15, 2015 08:13 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by whaaat:
Kudos to those who stayed on topic. Thank you for all your responses; I'm always on the lookout for fellow antique lovers

I think it goes without saying that most people's nostalgia comes from the love of art and music (and other collectibles) and not some diabolical Conservative agenda.

---

I stayed on topic, from my perspective. You said you have an obsession with the past. People with obsession LIKE to talk about these things. In fact, they tend to annoy others by talking so much about it, and my partner (a history teacher, btw) is so obsessed with Greek history that she had me read books just so that we could talk about them as she was so starved for some intelligent conversation about her interests. It's why I thought my chatter and banter would be welcome (though in part I was still waking up so "thinking out loud"--ETA: the thread was screwy in posting for me which accounts for some time stamps, but I don't want to explain that).

Yet when I saw this I let it go, figured it was my 3H Libra stellium combined with my 5H Sag stellium that makes me enjoy the talking about it. Sag loves the past as well as other nations, and 5H can find fun in such talk (as opposed to boring lectures where one is just to accept what one is told by neutered history lessons that teach nothing because they've been drained of about anything that could be considered controversial and/or unpatriotic). A packed 3H loves to chatter, especially when it's Libra (and includes Mercury). And given that I can find plenty who want to talk about what interests them (especially if they're obsessed with it) both on and offline I made the mistake of thinking you were the same way, as was Solzte who actually took classes in it, but chose to drop it in respect to your apparent wishes. (I also didn't point out that art, music, and antiques aren't the same thing as "obsession with the past.")

However, Soltze seems to be taking my remarks personally and thinks I'm promoting a politically correct agenda from another thread, which was jumping to conclusions, and I think it must originate from the dropped subject material in this thread (I'll get to her next).

I was going to apologize for going off topic again before getting to Soltze, and yet looking over what you posted again, whaaat, I'm not going to. I look at your comments again and your remark about some "diabolical conservative agenda" (which I originally shrugged off not knowing why you said that) makes me wonder, did you think that's what I meant about those who like the past? Because that is ABSURD. (Ditto if in response to bansheequeen.)

posted October 15, 2015 08:36 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
I'm an european young female. And history isn't just about mummies and sarcophagi LOL
I majored in contemporary.

---

Obviously, the vast majority of my talk on historical events was contemporary (just decades ago), as opposed to sarcophagi and mummies which weren't even mentioned.

You seem to lack the awareness that there are multiple perspectives to history, even within a nation, and that makes it hard for me to believe you gained a degree in it. I suppose you have, but damn!

(If you were really obsessed with history then I might try to look up an old internet thread in which people from the UK and Argentina were arguing over the history of the Falklands--which is contemporary, FYI--I loved seeing how different their respective perspectives were, and how the history is taught--and even experienced by the living--in their respective nations, and that's pretty standard. But I'll stop boring you since you have no passion for history, not even contemporary history, only in some delusional romantic notions you have about how much better things used to be and how you're so much better than those around you who was put in your generation by mistake. But I'll grant that your Cancer energy can help explain why you're that way.)

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
We lost the colonies but many black people stayed and since there was a turn to the left, people learned to live with each other. And 95% of the people don't care what race you are.

---

Plenty of people say that in America, and it's not true. I'm betting it's not true in your nation, either.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
I wish I was back in the time there were actual jobs, people weren't half naked, pierced and tattoed all over the place. Now everybody runs all over bumping into each other. I see terrible rudeness everyday. Lack of vocabulary, Reading skills and rampant ADHD.

I don't like it and I don't have to. I'm not conformist but I believe there are limits and people don't know where the lines are anymore.

---

BS. If you're like that then there are others who value the past, and there are always all kinds of people present, you're not in the land of the hive minded pod people, and as long you're not hiding yourself in fear and try then I don't see why you can't find others like yourself (though you probably have but still feel bad that not everyone is like you). There are going to be subcultures and people who just don't fit in no matter where you go. Granted, these types may not be found in the workplace as you (as far as you know), but I bet even as a tourist in Portugal or whatever, I could find such. (Heck, I used to exchange emails with a Portuguese pagan with very traditional values, and he struck me as far more educated about history, contemporary and ancient, than you. I recall that his complaint was about a dominant "greengrocer" society in his country, back in the early 2000s, though I forget the details now.)

And I'm betting the "rudeness" you speak of is, at least in part, based that some people aren't just like you and that makes you feel uncomfortable, like they're judging you the way you're judging them.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Soltze:
Why do you insist on the idea of white males? Do you have something against men in specific?

---

Insist nothing! I was acknowledging different historical perspectives, and your question is scandalous given that you supposedly majored in history. And LOOK at it, I barely mentioned it, and yet you're making it out like it's the focus on what I was saying. (Either that or bansheequeen, and she was simply clarifying that she doesn't have that perspective which might make it look different to her--IOW, it's a disclaimer, and I didn't see it as intending to be a slam against you or men). Clearly the phrase makes you uncomfortable and feel judged and preached at, despite that history (including contemporary) SHOULD be challenging to grapple at times, and be filled with controversy as well as multiple perspectives that can disagree sharply with each other and yet still be valid without necessarily invalidating the other perspective.