posted July 17, 2019 07:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
"no **** that's actually exactly how i see it, i think karma acts on the principle of will and people convincing themselves they deserve punishment will bring it to themselves." BINGO!!!!!!!!

"I think with relationships you can't really measure their success by whether or not they last long term in the same manner you thought they would, just whether or not they have meaning." I completely agree, this is my chill side which was in the driver's seat until I started to feel the effects of the eclipse and my dramatic side then become in charge, and everything felt very life or death with it activating my eros in leo in the 8th.

"from what i can tell you're an amazing person, and i don't doubt that you'll find plenty of other people who see it and i'm sure at least one of them will appreciate you the way you need them too."
Dumuzi thank you so much for your support and kindness, and you are right.

TBH this eclipse has made me very dramatic, it has brought out my dramatic side big time this past week maybe bc it was activating exact my Eros in Leo in the 8th. I can already tell today I feel completely different and the chill side of me is taking over now and back in the driver's seat, thank god. I feel myself again. I have noticed I tend to feel the effects of the eclipse at its highest a week before and up to the eclipse. It seems this eclipse really brought out my Eros in Leo in the 8th, I think I Like my Chill Happy Go Lucky Live Moment by Moment and Just flow side more. My Eros in Leo in the 8th is too dramatic and too romantic and intense.

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well at least the dramatic intense side of things is wearing down lol and you can see a little bit more clearly now

of course i'm right though, i'm always right, but i'm glad you've come around to a place where you can see it

maybe the eclipse just needed to pull all that to the surface so you could sort through it

on my end it's made me feel more and more comfortable with just being friends with my ex and moving forward with this guy

all her crazy scorpio/pluto **** being put into perspective and the distance have been really good and the eclipse definitely helped that along to where i'm in a place where i don't really feel obligated to deal with it the way i would've

going to chill with her on saturday probably, date with that guy on tuesday, should be interesting

though she could really tone down the occasional spite here and there that ends up in conversations, she's apologized a couple times when i've called her on it but it's sad that she's like that

posted July 17, 2019 10:48 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
well at least the dramatic intense side of things is wearing down lol and you can see a little bit more clearly now

of course i'm right though, i'm always right, but i'm glad you've come around to a place where you can see it

maybe the eclipse just needed to pull all that to the surface so you could sort through it

on my end it's made me feel more and more comfortable with just being friends with my ex and moving forward with this guy

all her crazy scorpio/pluto **** being put into perspective and the distance have been really good and the eclipse definitely helped that along to where i'm in a place where i don't really feel obligated to deal with it the way i would've

going to chill with her on saturday probably, date with that guy on tuesday, should be interesting

though she could really tone down the occasional spite here and there that ends up in conversations, she's apologized a couple times when i've called her on it but it's sad that she's like that

nice that it's not my problem though, there was a lot of **** i let slide out of feeling bad for her and because i knew her so long but i don't feel that same sense of responsibility anymore and it's great

---

That is huge Dumuzi, I am happy for you.

I love my intense, passionate dramatic side actually but I need to learn when to turn it off and be more selective maybe of who I share this side of me with.

posted July 18, 2019 12:31 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
That is huge Dumuzi, I am happy for you.

I love my intense, passionate dramatic side actually but I need to learn when to turn it off and be more selective maybe of who I share this side of me with.

I think we all have a ton of soulmates but if twin flames exist they are literally your other half, your first soul division. Whoever my other half is, he will love this side of me as much as I love it.

---

yeah, there's this small part of me that feels like i must be kind of an ******* for being as done with her as i am in some ways (particularly on an emotional level) but i just have no desire anymore to deal with that stress and responsibility

a couple years back she had what she thinks was a stroke (paralysis on one side of her face etc change in behavior and personality and **** ) but she wouldn't go to a doctor for it or listen to me and it's made a lot hard because her face went back to normal but her personality not so much

i'm the sort of person who prefers to keep promises i've made to someone, but in this case that's just not going to happen

she's being self destructive and stupid but she's in this place where the only way to be her friend is to pretend that's not the case and that she's always right and let her do what she's going to

she'll see that i'm right eventually, and i'll be far enough away from the mess for her to not be able to scapegoat me which i'm good with

in the meantime i get some peace, and i don't feel obligated to **** myself over trying to make her **** better anymore because i've done that for years so when everything crashes down around her it's on her this time

i had a lot more guilt and feelings about it pre-eclipse though tbh, but now i'm over it and it's a nice place to be

probably best to share that passionate side with people who deserve it yeah

i imagine so anyway, i can't really relate entirely because for me to be intense and passionate it takes a lot, and it takes a while for me to get to that place

i can make people feel otherwise, but when they actually see that other side of me it's different and i have to actually hit a point where i let myself have feelings like that

i can reign in my feelings pretty well to the point where i just won't have them unless i let myself (in romantic situations) might be the cap mars that does it or having uranus on my moon and venus but i have an ability to really detach myself from what i feel particularly in the beginning

only 2 people have ever seen that side of me come to think of it

i'm not big on passionate intensity anyway though, it seems mostly frivolous a lot of the time to behave in that manner lol getting too caught up and too many feelings it's all messy and just a lot

idk about a ton but i'm sure people have a few, as for the twin flame thing i don't necessarily see that as a beautiful and romantic thing

i mean it can be when it's good, but it's also a bit like having a chain around your neck tying you to someone else for an eternity on the flipside

maybe i'm just cynical lol

posted July 18, 2019 10:51 AM            

Hypatia, as I understand?, you are married to a man, and that he has 'agreed' to an 'open marriage' relationship.
{That confused me for a long time.. sorry.}

I endeavor to keep an open mind, and view the world according to how 'you' see it -- and how in your conversations you view and define what 'commitment' (or not) means to you.

What I say here, is from the other point of view.

Commitment (married-like, for me) means a Consecrated-Union with ALL that the other person 'is'-- Body, psyche/soul/emotions, and spirit.

Two people who make a contract (yes),
or/and,
a Covenant-based union, working together for the common-union and welfare of the 'unit' as one.

From detached viewpoint--
Single-I can 'bodysex' you.
You are a bodysex object to me-- another animal-I.
Climax, and it's 'just' an 'animalbody' getting-off some energy.

Nothing 'personal' in it. They leave as they came {pun, literally}. Sort of 'empty-feeling' relationally.. Just physical. No other bonding.

The physical doesn't mean anything past that.
It's just "using" human-flesh instead of a vibrator. ~Whatever.

A committed and married-type of energy is more!
When *I* sex you, I join my powerful spirit soul psyche in a consummate joining climax together that happens on MORE than just the physical-- Our astral-soul particles are sooo joined, that it's like God is in the shared-mix.
The flesh is a cruel boundary, a barrier that keeps us from the TRUEST and most-complete Union. The flesh keeps us 'from' each other--
.. I recall those days.
I recall the sense of an existential kind of frustration that my soul couldn't enter the body of my husband, to feel the perpetual complete oneness. I didn't just want to feel his heartbeat with my outside senses. There was a kind of anguish that the physical body would always keep us separated.

Mars Cancer H7 trine Juno-Scorpio,
also within trine of Neptune-r Libra H10;
H8 Cancer Stellium,
.. including a Vesta Cancer trine
Saturn-rx Scorpio.

Pluto (Leo) e.o. 8th House, cusp of 9th.

The TWO shall be as 'one'.

Cancer energy is emotional.
'You are cared-for and "HOME" with me'

(We just had Cancer-involved eclipses.)
Emotional bonds.

Not at all to diminish your own personal "styles" -- Dumuzi and Hypatia. I'm only 'adding' from the Cancerian sense of relationship.

You are both able to dissociate the emotional-bonding needs, and sense of fidelity involved.

Including sex WITH your partner's emotional needs (which could unconsciously include fidelity), this is a way that really really really lets you get into 'who' your partner is, in totality--

Sex is beyond the bodyanimal act.
Sex is an emotional-spiritual merge, too.

When the 'full engaging' (of everything that the other person 'is') sexes/joins-with one's OWN{my} 'full engaging', then the sexual act can generate something that goes beyond (sometimes), into a 3rd most-wonderful Union-experience.

The body-and-soul side of the "committed" sexual FULL relationship becomes a "sacred and sanctified" ground.

If your partner is a Commitment-oriented person-- they may want 'more' than just the physical animal body-release. When you are going off to 'plug-into' another person's body for your pleasures, this can be (on subtle layers) a kind of defilement of the sacred that 'two' people establish.

I remember my 'early' years, where I had 'sewn my oats' {adage}. Early periods of physical bonding experimentations with others. I was not looking for a "real" relationship. Was 'just' into the needed physical animal release, and shunned most of the emotional component to relationship with the other. It had 'the emotion value added' of being physically contacted, (like a hug), as this being is its own nutrition.

But when I got past all that, and came closer to my first Saturn Return, what I valued began to change.

I wanted 'more' than just the animal-release. I wanted a truer whole-person exchange--

Became interested in a joining that went FURTHER than just the body.

We all have our vulnerable times, at some point.

Our bodies can become ill or sick.
That is the time we need to be 'wholly' accepted, 'as we are', and valued as more than our body and things we 'do'.

The 'body' is sacred ground. The Temple.
The soul and spirit of the Other lives inside that body.

So. Rejecting your partner because they are ill-bodied, incapable of fulling "my" need, wants, desires-- to leave them behind at that point-of-vulnerability {and less-than whole}, can be a really fear-infused terrible wounding for the 'other'-- for the time you had been together sooo long.

Like.. (gently)..
You wanted me when I was young, and my animal body was vibrant.
Now my animal-body has 'age' and not feeling as well-- and that brings 'emotional' needs to a higher-priority.
You go out to **** other people now.
You created a 'division' in what was once a life-circulating mutual health-giving energy exchange.
You are taking what belongs to 'me' {under the same roof}, and giving it to someone-else? {subliminal dynamics}

I remember reading about midlife-transits
in the book
'Liquid Light of Sex' by Barbara Hand Clow.
{She renamed the book now.}
This is a sense of what I read in her book.
.. If there are times where committed relationships go through crises, it's during this time period. Corridor of our 40's.
(Uranus opp Uranus, and other transits).

She advised that couples resist the urge to completely-sever that committed-relationship bond, during this time period.

Once you get past your Chiron Returns, there's a whole-other level of renewal that can occur.

You may be very glad to have your familiar 'friend-other' for the approaching shared older years.

A committed relationship has growing periods.
Sex is described to be the 'glue' between committed partners.

I understand how during certain times {like in illnesses, and body-changes} that the partner may not be at same vigor they 'used' to be.

I guess extra-marital sex during that time, between those individuals, would vary with what is truly acceptable or NOT-acceptable? (Maybe, just 'temporary'? Depends on situation/circumstances? .. but that's tricky.)

For some individuals, the 'emotional' comfort bond is a linking-bridge, between animal-urge and spirit. I've heard of relationships where the partners didn't mind, EXCEPT for the case of 'emotional fidelity'.. (risk falling in-love, with the other person being "used" for sex?)

Just thoughts that I'm adding.

Some folks might think,
oh-- that's so old-fashioned? traditional?
Humans should be able to **** anyone at anytime?

Well...

The other concern between couples is venereal diseases. These can make you VERY sick, and in a matter of time, you make your partner "bodysick" too?

A bodysick person has a harder time sexing the other--
diminishes bonding.
That holistic healthbond in a relationship gets cut by 1/3rd -- "body"-sharing. soul-sharing. spirit-sharing.

So....
Thanks for your open conversations.
Helps me grow and understand more about others.
Helps me see things through another point of view.

My hope is that I added and helped with understanding possible-subtleties involved, in longterm partners? -- from H8 Cancer POV.

Hoping things work-out for 'the best'.

posted July 18, 2019 11:27 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:

i mean it can be when it's good, but it's also a bit like having a chain around your neck tying you to someone else for an eternity on the flipside

maybe i'm just cynical lol

---

hahahahahahahha OMG Dumuzi when you put it what way it sounds awful! hahahahaha

I see your point. You might have just cured me of my twin flame fascination, I think I will stick to soulmates only.

posted July 18, 2019 11:38 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:

i can reign in my feelings pretty well to the point where i just won't have them unless i let myself (in romantic situations) might be the cap mars that does it or having uranus on my moon and venus but i have an ability to really detach myself from what i feel particularly in the beginning

only 2 people have ever seen that side of me come to think of it

i'm not big on passionate intensity anyway though, it seems mostly frivolous a lot of the time to behave in that manner lol getting too caught up and too many feelings it's all messy and just a lot

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Interesting, yes probably uranus on your moon and venus is why you are like that.

posted July 18, 2019 11:40 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
hahahahahahahha OMG Dumuzi when you put it what way it sounds awful! hahahahaha

I see your point. You might have just cured me of my twin flame fascination, I think I will stick to soulmates only.

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lol you're welcome

posted July 18, 2019 11:47 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumuzi:
lol you're welcome

i have a lot of shared past life memory **** with my ex (well her and another ex, the witch) and trust me, deep bonds like that and promises and ties all sound romantic and beautiful, but life is rarely just those things

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posted July 18, 2019 12:00 PM            

And I very-much KNOW you would be there for me, Teasel. *hug*

If you've seen any of my other posts, then you know I am in a situation and circumstance with LONG-time 'outside'-generated nerve-stimulation. My nerve system has been being agitated-down from *sonics* {percussive-vibration} for YEARS, inside my home.

To begin with, I have a more-refined and sensitive nerve-system than most others. I've had to really try very hard to have a higher-tolerance (and compassionate attitude) to the outside-stimulation that I have NO control over.

I live with chronic-pain now, whenever the stimulation comes into the place I live. This makes my 'head' feel full and quite-raw with a burning-feeling. Inflammation. Some of this seems to also progressed to be inside the neck, chest, and general trunk of the body {especially left-side for whatever ?reason}.

Things do start to 'get better' whenever the *sonics* diminish. The awareness of pain can go away, and the inflammation reduces.

(My body is amazing in its ability to recuperate.)
Thing is, things having to do with the scientific advances in the compression of sound waves, has escalated. My body (after this 'long term exposure') is having harder time to keep up with the innovations of added-power to their *sonic* systems (woofers).

I' have not been able to work standard jobs to make money *because* of this, for years. Leaves me in a deficiency-loop, where I can't 'do' because of 'environmental hazards' that affect my body, that had affect my ability to make money to get out of here. Now, there's a *futility* that is setting in.

Sometimes I feel just soooooo sick.
Other times it gets worse, and I get these little-added things in the body that causes my mind to have fears that the body is not tolerating as well as I have kept it in the past.

Other times, when *sonics* have gone a break here, the sense of well-being in body has gone up, and added to confidence-- but this has become more short-lived now. I have to really 'enjoy' those times. Get as much as I can out of it.

Repeating...
I do not have a family to support me.
I deal with the 'added fears' of the 'way things are' in the reality-world for people who are considered 'orphaned elders' in our govt community. There just aren't resources made-available as they used to in decades-past. The plight is harder.

Soooo much abuse out there.

Once my roommate (who is older than me) is not able to have his apartment (medically, goes off, and has to be taken care of by his daughter and other relatives), then, I have 'no-one' and nothing left... but to be at-the-mercy of 'the system', without another familiar-soul to vouch for me, advocate. Someone who is 'familiar' with me. It really (with Saturn view, and modern-attitudes and trends) is quite frightening for me to ponder.
{arrrghhh. *sonics* sooo harsh right this minute!! I gotta wrap up my computer time, so I can get away!}

So. *smile*
The transiting Capricorn Saturn-Pluto (in my H2, .. temp H1 r), has me worried about material and security needs in the future? And with body-awareness of things, and the added-worries, is not good either? ..

So anyway... deep breath.
Thanks for caring enough to have responded.
Means a lot to me.

I have a lot of 'trust' issues...
Plus, I (humor!!!) really am not ready to kick-that-bucket yet!! LOL
NOOOO way!!!

I want to LIVE.
I have MORE in me.
I have had a RICH life of experiences.

I deserve a loving community, and support to surround me in my elder years, so I can continue Serving till I'm (haha) past my ???3rd Saturn Return??? (90's?)

I sincerely hope our planet Earth stays Livable that long, too--

for ALL of our human species.

MUCH Love to All!

This was an old 'protest' song from my earlier years..
Nothing new under the Sun?

posted July 18, 2019 12:08 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by hypatia238:
Mirage, I am very selective of who I a pursue romantically, … Sex for me is about the soul, love and passion.

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Thanks for your kind response, Hypatia.

posted July 18, 2019 12:10 PM            

commitment to me is giving yourself to another person, even on a deep soul level, it's promises and binding ties etc and so on

however just like you can have that with someone and have friends outside of it who you share emotions or whatever with i see sex the same way

there's different kinds of sex, and not all of them are intimate or reach into that soul level like some do (that kind of sex is reserved for a partner in that way) the sex i have with someone i love isn't on any level the same as sex i've had outside of that just to be clear

so i actually do agree with you, though i'd say that it's completely possible to connect with someone past the skin and flesh is only an imaginary barrier the same way space and distance etc are we're not limited to the material world we're used to

a connection with someone can be felt over a distance, and there's no barrier there

i've had sex that's been just that with my ex

however my sex outside of the relationship had nothing to do with her emotional needs (which weren't fidelity) and it's not what led to the current break

the current break is a result of her own constant emotional and mental roller coaster **** , that's only gotten worse since whatever happened to her medically 2 years ago

she's become a lot like her mother (who is a legitimate narcissist) with an inability to empathize and a tendency to act out childish and selfish whims causing damage both to herself and others, mostly me, and scapegoating me for all of her problems and negative feelings

while i love her, and i understand health and mental issues and can be supportive it was her choice to take things where they are right now

i would've stayed indefinitely and dealt with it, but because she made that choice and now that i'm free from that i've reached a place where i've noticed that my own physical health (which isn't good) has improved and i'm not stressed all the time dealing with her roller coaster emotions and desires

i would never totally cut her out of my life (we're still friends i'm going to probably see her this weekend we've talked for hours calling each other and text for a bit pretty much daily), because i've known her almost 21 years at this point and we were friends first and i'll love her and have that connection to her and i value what we've shared

but is a romantic relationship with someone like that possible or healthy? no, not really

i'm 32 now, 33 next month, and i got with her (romantically) when i was 18 we were each other's first and i was monogamous with her for 7 years helped her raise her siblings on/off depending on her mother's whims and went through a lot with her where stepping away would've been better for me

i stayed out of love and commitment and the values you're talking about

yes eventually the open relationship i initially wanted happened and her and i shared a few people, but i never cheated or strayed past any limits that were set

most of the time i was just with her though

i didn't reject her on any level, i never have, but i'm also not looking to jump back into a relationship with someone who's going to throw and break things and have temper tantrums to get her way no matter what the case or consequences are

and i'm not about to self destruct trying to stop her from acting out and doing stupid ****

she's making a lot of mistakes right now, and i feel for her and i care about her, and i hope it doesn't go too poorly but my hands are tied because there's no warning or talking to her without destroying that friendship and i honestly feel like i've stepped in when she's ****** things up too many times over than what's healthy for me

it's not even about her not meeting my needs or wants or desires, because i've dealt with her not meeting those and would've

it's about her actively making it so that i can't meet my own needs, wants, and desires because she's selfish and wants to be catered to completely

i've done a lot, and i've put myself aside a lot and you have no idea the contents of that relationship and how much sacrifice was there on my part and how much i've put up with

i didn't create division, and i didn't give anyone else something that was hers

if she was sick and needed to be taken care of and would allow that i would be there for in a second and i never would've left, but that's not how things have gone and that's not at all where she's at

some people are who they are, and there's no helping that

she's got a lot of scorpio, a lot of pluto, mars square sun mars square saturn, mars square uranus etc and there is no making her listen or let me help her

i've tried, i've spent years trying now she doesn't want me to try and for the first time since i was a teenager i have some breathing space to care for myself and not her or what's going on in her life

sometimes people need to crash and burn on their own, and no amount of loving them or wanting to help does anything

i'm not letting go entirely, but i'm letting go enough for me to do what's right for me and this new guy and i click well and have a lot of clear deep ties that need to be explored and i'm seeing where that goes

i'll always love her, but sometimes loving someone isn't always the best thing for you

in this case, you'd have to know her to understand

i don't disagree with everything you're saying, i've experienced a lot of it, it's just not quite relevant in my situation

posted July 18, 2019 12:26 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mirage29:
You're a good person, Dumuzi. It's evident!
She's going down her mother's path.
Missing out on a really good-guy.

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thanks , and yeah she is going down her mother's path, and that stings because i remember being kids and her telling me she would rather die than be like her mom

but i guess the stroke or whatever brought that out, she always had issues but she wasn't like this, and it's heart breaking to see it but you know end of the day there's no way to be there for someone like that

i've tried to get her to get help, and of course part of me is hoping that when/if this current situation she's building for herself falls apart she reflects a little and seeks some kind of help for herself and doesn't cause further harm or damage from there

i imagine that's going to be a **** show and i'm likely to be the first person she goes to, and i don't really want to have to think about it until it gets there i'd rather enjoy my life and some peace right now lol

posted July 18, 2019 12:32 PM            

I tend to clock out during these discussions. My Asc squares the 24th degree of Cap. Nothing of note happened.

posted July 18, 2019 12:35 PM            

I knew that the Lindaland Chart was involved with these Cancer Eclipses. Saw that Randall bumped this thread.
(I have close synastry with the LL Chart!)

- http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/203529.html

posted July 18, 2019 04:40 PM            

"Its neither good nor bad, it just is."