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Author Topic:   My brother tried to kill his self today
Dons2angelss
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posted January 01, 2020 11:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My brother has had a really rough last year. Like, really really rough. In a nutshell, his fiancé (my former best friend) cheated on him and left him, he had to file bankruptcy, our mother's health is fading fast, and his relationship with his son has been rough. Today he had a a terrible breakdown and tried to kill his self. He's very spiritual and loves it when I do small astrological readings for him but I'm out of my league here on this one. It would be incredibly helpful for him to be able to connect what he's been going through to a deeper, soulful meaning. I can see some really difficult transits and a tough moon conjunct Saturn in Pisces 4H is really going to be hard to deal with, on top of Uranus on the descendant, and tr nn on his vertex. Please take a look at these charts so I can give him something to build from. Thank you


His natal and transits, birth time is accurate

Progressed and transits

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teasel
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posted January 02, 2020 12:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for teasel     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Saturn and Pluto look like they are opposed his Mars, and I'm editing right now, because I was looking at the wrong chart for the rest of what I said. I'm seeing two different charts here.

I'm so sorry. I hope he will be okay.

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Dumuzi
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posted January 02, 2020 12:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dumuzi     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i'm really sorry to hear that i hope he recovers and gets help

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Aries23Degrees
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posted January 02, 2020 01:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Aries23Degrees     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow...thats a lot of momentum. And quite a list of bottleneck situations which add a lot of pressure.

I notice there is a square from intellectual Merc in Libra to Mars in Cancer & to Uranus in Cap. And this encourages the native to be the type who makes unilateral decisions and jump to conclusions.

This tight square encourages action(Mars) based on thoughts (Mercury).And the addition of Uranus adds a lot of spontaneous decision-making support to that-for good or ill.

What's more is that progressed Sun is also in aspect to that tight square build-up. So there is a feeling from within that with the Saturn transit to prog Sun,life feels more "narrow", more "disconnected" from the support of others & also very lonesome.

Can you see how that can add to the natal Merc-Mars-Uran mix in spontaneous decision-making in such circumstances?

Not to mention that there is escapist Neptune clinging at the end of the natal T-square mix ie. The native wants a quick,effective painless way out and Neptune is often drawn to self annihilation or escaping the pain or to numb it somehow(and suicide is one very attractive route)

I always say that people who commit suicide, do not necessarily want to "die" per se. They just want to escape.Two fundamentally differing things that seem the same but are not.

When we "escape",we want to avoid the context of "what is". When we "die",we want eject ourselves from EVERYTHING-including the deliciousness of the experience of "what could be".


With his T-square, what can happen is that one can think a thought. Then they want to act on that thought with a lot of urgency (many times without due consideration of alternatives)

I would watch for that Moon in Aries. Yes, its not in aspect to the t-square mentioned but through mutual reception with Mars in Cancer(by sign), there is a lot of internal motivation for(once again) independent decision-making.

Its too tempting for Aries to act NOW to an otherwise undesirable situation. There is that "heat of the moment" action which completes the tension of the T-square.

Is this his first attempt at suicide ? His cardinal rich chart with Mars in Cancer as the highest point(anti-clockwise as the Mc is the "peak" of the chart),suggests someone who reacts to emotions....a lot.

I see also that Uranus is on the Dsc axis and square Mc/Ic axis.Uranus momentum can add a feeling of losing ground & having ones world turned upside down.

I didn't say much about Pluto as I feel that energy goes without saying. Pluto is powerful momentum and its lining up with the natal T-square mentioned can exacerbate or help heal. It all really depends on the pattern of thoughts the individual entertains

What can help(as I share similar placements myself and this transit is also working its magic on me) is to talk it out and gain some perspective(Merc in Lib).

If he feels the need to call someone in the middle of the night to vent spontaneously in great detail (Moon in Aries in 6th), he should.Or maybe to talk about a decision thought up suddenly (Uranus/Merc sqaure), he should do it. No second-guessing.

Everything can seem so urgent with cardinal energy-specially with an active Mars/Uranus in the mix. And the pain of disconnection can feel so "absolute"-even when its not.

The trick is to acknowledge that this is all temporary(no matter how "permanent" the pain feels) it DOES subside.

Sometimes it can feel like ones heart is aching so bad that it could explode from ones chest.The body gets the wind knocked out its lungs and one feels like collapsing as the feeling of absent emotional wellbeing is so hard to ignore right now.

Jupiter-Venus in Scorpio can definitely support this tendency of swinging between emotional extremes. Not to mention the internal fears and phobias that can be entertained.

Take it from a another Ven in Scorpio with Pluto in Sco,it DOES pass.I would encourage him to find a lifeline for those dark days.

People do not mean to hurt him, they are not meaning to be insensitive etc. He is just at a place where emotional feelings are heightened right now.

So every rebuff can feel personal or unkind. To a natal chart that suggests an open wound, a brush can feel so jarring. Don't personalize it too much. Its not an attack

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teasel
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posted January 02, 2020 02:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for teasel     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^^ Yes, I can relate to some of this. The urgency, especially. I learned to stay curled up on one side, when it was at its worst - and then to get myself into the shower, and cleaned up (even if I had to curl up underneath the shower for a while). One day, I got into the shower three times, and was in there until the water started to go cold.

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SecretGeek
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posted January 02, 2020 02:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SecretGeek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
...

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Graham
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posted January 02, 2020 03:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Today he had a a terrible breakdown and tried to kill his self.

Do you know the exact (or approximate) UT time and date of this "event", D2a?

Progressed Sun crossing natal Mercury has been (and is) activating the natal configuration in the image below ... and my guess is that the Moon was the actual event timer.

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GalacticCoreExplosion
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posted January 02, 2020 08:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for GalacticCoreExplosion     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Don't have anything to add to the astrology side of things.

Just wanted to say that I will send some positive thoughts and energy his way, and ask my friends to try to help him.

And hugs to you Dons.

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Dons2angelss
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posted January 02, 2020 09:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you ♡

It was around noon when this happened.

Aries, he is very much the kind of person to act on his emotions without thinking about the consequences. The Merc, Mars, Uranus t square definitely shows.

He hasn't tried this before and we were all quite shocked. His behaviour has been erratic and I'm pretty sure he had some kind of psychotic break. He had been up for 3 days straight (not drug induced, they ran a tox screen at the hospital) and he keeps talking about the devil trying to get him. This was before and after he attempted suicide. Talking to him today in the hospital, he just was not the same person I've known for 25 years. He had this wild, scared look in his eyes. I'm really worried this goes a deeper than I first thought. It's not just extreme depression but more like a psychotic meltdown.

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TrueScorpio
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posted January 02, 2020 09:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TrueScorpio     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm so sorry. I know how your head is spinning and your heart is aching. Thank the Universe your brother is alive and that my friend is the first step. I know you're in pain. So is your brother. We can't fix everything or ourselves. Sometimes we have to walk through with the pain to get to the other side. Having companions on that path is a gift. Let your brother know how much you love him. Sometimes we all need to be reminded. Blessings.

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Ami Anne
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posted January 02, 2020 10:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I am so sorry. Please, put in aphophis

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Dons2angelss
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posted January 02, 2020 11:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ami Anne:
I am so sorry. Please, put in aphophis


Progressed apophis is conjunct his Merc by less than a degree, tr apophis conjunct the moon/Neptune conjunction in his 4H

Natal apophis in the 12H opposite his moon

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Ami Anne
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posted January 02, 2020 11:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Aphophis seems to be a factor in suicide so I think the Merc/Aphophis was a factor. I am glad he is still here.

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Ami Anne
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posted January 02, 2020 11:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What is Jupiter doing?See if any asteroids in transit conj it.

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Graham
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posted January 03, 2020 03:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
It was around Noon when this happened

Noon Eastern Standard Time? … So 5pm Universal Time?

When your brother's natal Mercury-Mars-Saturn-Uranus/Neptune figure was simultaneously being activated by ... Progressed Sun (at 22Lib15) : Progressed Mars (at 6Leo10) : Transit Jupiter (at 6Cap40) : Transit NN (at 8Can23) : Transit Saturn (at 21Cap24) : Transit Pluto (at 22Cap23) ... with Transit Moon moving through 21-24 Pisces from 6am to Noon.

So ... for astrology to help him ... that natal configuration has to be fully explored/understood.

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charlie
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posted January 03, 2020 04:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for charlie     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I would like to add to what Aries said.
My husband also has Mars/Mercury/Uranus in Cardinal signs and I’m always baffled at how he responds to his THOUGHTS! There is NO sense of stepping back and analyzing said thoughts they just seem to consume him and then he acts out.
We all can have erratic/bad/strange thoughts but not all of us act on these. What’s his “savior” I think is his Taurus Moon which acts as pillar for him when things become...uncertain. My husband has had a past with suicidal thoughts and behaviors in the past (way before me) which he got through but he still today can get very dark; like a black hole and this is coming from ME with a Moon sq Pluto that enjoys swimming in the darkness. I just happen to see that darkness as not frightening, lonesome or dystopian.

I wish I had more help to offer but I see he is quite young so I am certain that, like my husband, he will find a better path!

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Ami Anne
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posted January 03, 2020 07:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ami Anne     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
that sounds like Merc combust the Sun

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mirage29
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posted January 03, 2020 10:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mirage29     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I know that had to be frightening. *hug*

I had lost a first-cousin I grew up and played with every day as a younger child. The shock of hearing of his suicide earlier in the 2000's is still surreal.

Be there for him unconditionally, Dons2angelss.

Wishing you personal-emotional protections, and him and your family a strengthening and renaissance (rebirth) of the essentials of TRIBE-- Love, Caring, and Valuing each other. Being there and in-it Together.

Edit-Add
It is possible for someone to have a psychotic break, and pull out of it beautifully. Psychosis is not the same as some severe chemically-based mental illnesses.

Carl Jung had had a psychotic break that he described in personal journals called his Red Books.

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Dons2angelss
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posted January 03, 2020 10:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Graham:
[QUOTE][b]It was around Noon when this happened

Noon Eastern Standard Time? … So 5pm Universal Time?

When your brother's natal Mercury-Mars-Saturn-Uranus/Neptune figure was simultaneously being activated by ... Progressed Sun (at 22Lib15) : Progressed Mars (at 6Leo10) : Transit Jupiter (at 6Cap40) : Transit NN (at 8Can23) : Transit Saturn (at 21Cap24) : Transit Pluto (at 22Cap23) ... with Transit Moon moving through 21-24 Pisces from 6am to Noon.

So ... for astrology to help him ... that natal configuration has to be fully explored/understood.

[/B][/QUOTE]

I've been looking at these. Pr sun was right over his natal Merc focusing that already hectic energy and directing his erratic thought into who he thinks he is. He kept repeating he's the devil and thinking demons were coming for him. Uranus on Neptune can swing hard in that direction if there's no foundation to anchor it in a positive way. With tr Saturn and Pluto sitting right on it, I believe they're basically forcing him to bring all of his darkness to the surface and face them head on. I'm praying this will be his wake up call to find his path and begin to rebuild from this fall. We're all with him in this and are fully committed to being there 100%.

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Graham
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posted January 03, 2020 11:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dons2angelss:
I've been looking at these. Pr sun was right over his natal Merc focusing that already hectic energy and directing his erratic thought into who he thinks he is. He kept repeating he's the devil and thinking demons were coming for him. Uranus on Neptune can swing hard in that direction if there's no foundation to anchor it in a positive way. With tr Saturn and Pluto sitting right on it, I believe they're basically forcing him to bring all of his darkness to the surface and face them head on. I'm praying this will be his wake up call to find his path and begin to rebuild from this fall. We're all with him in this and are fully committed to being there 100%.

Saturn in sensitive Pisces and 4th house (of psychological foundations) dominates this natal configuration of ("unable to let go") 8th harmonic aspects. So, it is not a coincidence that transit Saturn is currently activating it … but we cannot isolate its impact via this event, because too many other aspects are simultaneously "unfolding as intended" in this lead up to his First Saturn Return.

Do you know, or would be able to find out, what events were triggered when Saturn activated this natal configuration during its earlier transits through (any of) the signs of Pisces to Capricorn?*

[ * The key/"formative" event will have been when Saturn passed through 19Pisces36 to 23Pisces42 … which it did in three passes … from 14th April to 31st May 1995, from 11th August to 8th October 1995 and from 4th January 1996.]

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Belage
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posted January 03, 2020 01:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Belage     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just a quick look to his chart told me he is going through an intense transit Saturn and Pluto square his 12th house mercury and opposite his 9th of house of spirituality mars.

Last december's powerful New MOon eclipse in Capricorn ticked off his natal moon of Aries setting the stage for the conflagration to come when we have the lunar eclipse. That upcoming lunar eclipse January 12 will be conjunct his Mars and could have cataclysmic effect for good or bad. He might try to kill himself again, so make sure you are watching him.

I hesitated to post because I do not want to give power to astrology and the stars. I have come to believe that the real power is within.

I would say that at the root of all this is a lack of self-love. I don't care what the chart says, if you lack self-love, you will feel despair over failed loved relationships because you have transferred that love for self to someone else. No love relationship is worth killing yourself over. I repeat, no love relationship is worth killing yourself over.

Your brother is plutonian, so intense, plutonic, controlling, manipulative, life or death relationships are what drive him. And when they fail, as a plutonian, he turns scorpio's venon on himself.

Adding to that bankruptcy filing... and he feels like a failure.

Your brother does not need more astro readings, but he needs to do the hard psychological work of healing himself and his need to love someone more than he loves himself and to put value in things outside of himself. If he needs to see things in an astrological framework, tell him he needs to use his pluto powers both natal and transit to HEAL HIMSELF and TRANSFORM HIMSELF>

I truly wish him success. I have been there. And I know the pain. But the work of loving yourself is worth it.

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Dons2angelss
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posted January 03, 2020 02:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you all

Belage, I fully agree and that is at the very basic core of this entire situation.

Graham, he was born in 95, about a year later his biological father signed all rights over and the man he knew as his dad stepped in to raise him. He's since passed (in 2012)and he took that very hard.

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Graham
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posted January 03, 2020 06:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
[
quote:
Graham, he was born in 95,

1994?

quote:
about a year later his biological father signed all rights over

Might he have felt "abandoned" by his biological father?

quote:
and the man he knew as his dad stepped in to raise him. He's since passed (in 2012)and he took that very hard.

Transit Saturn retrograded from 23Libra42 to 22Libra46 and back to 23Libra42 from 22nd May to 29th July 2012. Did that coincide with the death of the man who raised him?

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Dons2angelss
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posted January 03, 2020 08:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dons2angelss     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Graham:
[ [QUOTE][b]Graham, he was born in 95,

1994?


Oops, yes 1995


quote:
about a year later his biological father signed all rights over

Might he have felt "abandoned" by his biological father?


Yes he did, my brother was the "dirty little secret" of that man's family and actually met him a little after the man he called dad passed away. It didn't go very well.


quote:
and the man he knew as his dad stepped in to raise him. He's since passed (in 2012)and he took that very hard.

Transit Saturn retrograded from 23Libra42 to 22Libra46 and back to 23Libra42 from 22nd May to 29th July 2012. Did that coincide with the death of the man who raised him? [/B][/QUOTE]

Yes, he passed on July 22nd 2012 very suddenly.

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Graham
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posted January 04, 2020 01:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Graham     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Oops, yes 1995

I'm wondering why your subconscious is insisting on you writing 1995 rather than 1994.


[Notes/questions :

1. The sibling dynamics/relationships within the family probably had a significant impact upon him/his self-worth during childhood. ... Did all of you have the same mother, with his two older sisters having the same biological father and his younger sister not sharing a biological father with any of her three older siblings?

2, Was he raised by your biological father; the biological father of your youngest sister or by someone else?

3. Was his fiancee/your best friend older than him?]

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