posted August 13, 2021 04:06 PM            

According to Aroyo, the water houses (H4, H8 and H12) are also called the "trinity of soul" or "psychic trinity". Apparently it is very difficult to interpret the way planets in the water houses manifest because they largely operate from the subconscious. I am very curious about the experiences of other people with planets in water houses, how they feel it impacts their personality and if they see any link with (past life) Karma.

I'll go first. I have a stellium in H8 with Venus, Jupiter and Sun in Taurus. I also have Mercury in Gemini in H8, but on the cusp of H9. I am very guarded when it comes to showing certain aspects of my personality. I like to test the water before I reveal more about myself. Also, I am very aware of power structures and almost immediately know who has the upperhand in certain situations and why. My childhood has not been easy, but sometimes I do feel my trust issues may come from something deeper than that.

posted August 13, 2021 06:49 PM            

But just wanted to say (for now), that book by Arroyo is one of my favorites. Yeah, he has a few notions that are old fashion/yester year (especially when it comes to different forms of sexual preference), but otherwise he strikes me as a very deep and perceptive astrologer.

posted August 13, 2021 09:37 PM            

I wonder about mine. I usually explore my sidereal to see karmic or pastlife clues. Between Scorpio+Pisces in sr, I have a trine between them. http://astrologyking.com/mars-trine-neptune/

*pls don't quote*
I'm one of a very small group that sees decans as useful.

My Neptune is actually  in Mars decan, Mars is in Jupiter's decan. The classic ruler of Pisces. Seeing this play out, Natal Saturn
(karma, time, lessons) is in the Mars decan. As well Jupiter is in Saturn's decan. So my Karma brought in is very much related with Mars, Jupiter +Saturn. Asteroid Karma aspects both Jupiter and Saturn. My chart has a terrible opposition between Jupiter/Saturn.  (in trop - because it's more 3 dimension - in my opinion) dealing with my career sector, it was mostly jagged. Mars in opposition to Mc/Uranus. A dynamic that gave me several towers (in tarot speak). A huge red X (masculine) in my chart indicated the troubles I would have fallen into. Which if I had consulted long ago with an astrologer, perhaps it may had been avoided.

I always did as I was told but in my later positions, too many chiefs - just one lil worker bee (trained specifically for an area) Couldn't satisfy them all and ran into rogue bosses, that when I wouldn't  agree to sleepovers, it was damaging to say the least.
Maybe in my former life I abused power over other's whom were under me in some way. Idk. I strayed away from excelling, I just can't fathom brown nosing or sleeping with any person to get ahead or stay happy. Good thing I quit before too long in my quest to become a model/actress. I'm not built for that.
*casting couch* not for me.

posted August 14, 2021 08:44 AM            

That is an interesting theme with Jupiter, Saturn and Mars. Can you see this pattern as well when you look at draco to natal?

I think it's important to live by our internal values. And to me it certainly seems like you have made the right choice. It looks like your Jupiter is stronger than your Saturn and Mars. Is this something that resonates with you?

posted August 14, 2021 08:49 AM            

Uranus as the ruler of your DSC and Venus in your H4 does seem important. Is this highlighted by aspects to your Uranus or maybe the placement of your traditional DSC ruler Saturn?

posted August 14, 2021 11:51 AM            

I know his books and like to hear what he has to say, execially affecting my chart

uranus, nep and saturn in 4th
karma yes my nn is there too, opp sun, mother has own sun at IC, contrasting my MC sun opp IC...

posted August 14, 2021 11:53 AM            

More specifically, my Moon is in early Libra widely conjunct late Virgo Saturn, the faster moving ruler of my Aquarius Venus and Desc. Saturn is closely sextile Uranus in Scorpio and the 4th.

The ruler of my Moon, Venus, is in the 7th House and square Uranus in the 4th.

I was VERY close to my mother. She was my earliest best friend, we were born on the same day, she was my first spiritual teacher, and we had a close emotional, spiritual and psychic connection. She, not too surprisingly, was a predominant Venusian--Venus was in her 1st House and closest Planet to her Asc (in my chart, it's represented by a combo of Libra Moon and Venus in the 7th).

Anyways, despite all that closeness and deep love between us, there was also a lot of pain and extremes as well. When I was 8 or so, she became romantically involved with a man who is very clearly sociopathic. Course she wasn't fully aware of that at the time, and was somewhat naive to his darker side. She knew he had a dark side, but she thought it was just woundedness and that her love could change/heal him. While she did have a positive influence on him, she ended up being mostly wrong.

This man made my life a living hell growing up, but some of that was hidden to my mom, as he was a lot meaner to my full brother and I when she wasn't around, and would lie constantly. (He is represented by Pluto closely square my Sun in Cap).

Then, she became sick with cancer when I was 16. She somehow miraculously pulled through depite having 3rd stage ovarian and cervical cancer and a large tumor growing inside of her, and after surgery and chemo, eventually got better and had a couple relatively good/healthy years.

But then she got sick again when I was 19, and died not long after I turned 20. It was a pretty difficult/challenging thing. And her leaving had other effects/ramifications. She was kind of the glue of my larger family. It was like my family started to disintegrate after she left. It was because she was very loving and inclusive, but after, more and more of us just went our own separate ways more and more.

Anyways, to say that all that has deeply impacted my psyche and life, is probably a bit of an understatement. But her passing was also a powerful catalyst for spiritual growth and change on my path in a lot of ways. If deep suffering doesn't break you, it tends to strengthen you on some deeper levels.

posted August 15, 2021 04:58 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by PlutoWasHere:
Hi MoonMystic, thank you for your reply!

That is an interesting theme with Jupiter, Saturn and Mars. Can you see this pattern as well when you look at draco to natal?

I think it's important to live by our internal values. And to me it certainly seems like you have made the right choice. It looks like your Jupiter is stronger than your Saturn and Mars. Is this something that resonates with you?

[b]Edit: "I usually explore my sidereal to see karmic or pastlife clues."
What do you specifically look for in sidereal when searching for karmic clues?[/B]

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posted August 15, 2021 06:21 AM            

H4 [Cancer/Moon]: your roots, ancestors, family, homeland, childhood environment, deep-rooted influences;

H8 [Scorpio/Pluto&Mars]: shared resources, intimacy, social taboos, hidden knowledge, crisis, death and resurrection;

H12 [Pisces/Neptune&Jupiter]: self-undoing, the repressed shadow self, selfless service, psychic energy, past life influences, secret enemies.

Aroyo mentions that the water houses can be indicative of various types of fear: returning to the helpless childhood state (H4), social taboos (H8) and chaos (H12).

Personally, I do recognize the potential of fear connected to my H8. However for me it's not related to social taboos, but more about vulnerability and fear of rejection. I did feel a bit of an outcast in my childhood and teens. Like a sideline observer while the rest of the world was living their live.

posted August 15, 2021 06:32 AM            

The importance of your relationship with your mother does connect with the IC and Moon in your chart. According to Aroyo certain planets in H4 - especially Uranus and Mars - diminish the chances the person will express tranquility in this area. It seems to me that you have integrated the struggles of the past in a very mature way though.

posted August 15, 2021 06:43 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
I’ve Sun/Mercury/Juno in 12H. I don’t know about past lives stuff. I feel that I’ve been finding my identity / voice my whole life. Have dealt a lot with misunderstandings and misinterpretations which is a part of my identity search. After every significant event, I became a slightly different person.

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I don't have any planets in H12 but I still feel there is work for me there. My draco Sun, Jupiter and Venus fall into my natal H12. I had a very strict childhood and my wants were usually ignored so I have trouble identifying and expressing them. Not only because I feel vulnerable when I do, I also find it difficult to feel what they actually are. So what you wrote also resonates with me.

It's kind of funny, but my H12 cusp Sabian is Virgo 17: A volcano in eruption.

quote:

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Originally posted by Hikaru29:
Juno in 12th also indicates the possibility of getting into karmic relationships.

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posted August 15, 2021 06:59 AM            

If Jupiter is your chart ruler it probably is a very important planet in your chart. Are there any parallel's or contra-parallel's involved with your Jupiter?

I find Saturn and it's connection to Karma very interesting. Even though Saturn is seen as the greater malefic, I feel it is also a planet that can bring good things. It helps you to grow but it takes time to reap what you sow.

Saturn has a prominent place in my chart. It is in my H10 and conjunct my H7 ruler Mars. And it is also part of a Thor's Hammer pattern aspect I have with Neptune and Chiron. I haven't figured that one out yet.

posted August 15, 2021 07:11 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by TensionEmpire:
uranus, nep and saturn in 4th
karma yes my nn is there too, opp sun, mother has own sun at IC, contrasting my MC sun opp IC...

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According to Aroyo's book, Uranus can be a difficult planet to have in H4 because it brings instability. Is this something you can relate to?

Do you feel your Saturn and Neptune in H4 have impacted your childhood or home situation in any way?

quote:

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Originally posted by TensionEmpire:
subcontiius, sure, i dont give longer thoughts about mine, or the term in general, but lets say those planets at that house my affect ones core

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posted August 15, 2021 11:21 AM            

i have noticed the foggy characteristic of neptune now that i grew older

saturn is maybe the thinks that i see that should be easy to accomplish and help home life, but its not me the one to say so or to be given ears

i think one think that i should learn of this is to dont react impulsively,so i dont get nervous.
if u do it enough u figure out its no good for you, avoid the situations and so on.
and yes i believe therrs still thinks to work on jst trnt 30, and eaven if not the traces and marks would be there.

posted August 15, 2021 12:19 PM            

I went through a brief phase during childhood where I was into and identified with my Scottish Highlander side, but it didn't really last all that long. I eventually viewed it as very limiting, ego centered, and materialistic in nature. But I guess it has carried over some in the sense that the Scottish accent is perhaps my favorite to get into/mimic.

*My partner and I somewhat continued this pattern in that we ended up moving a lot for awhile, but about a decade ago we changed that pattern when we got a house and have stayed put since. No more gypsy life. We have tried to foster a more tranquil and harmonious home life, despite that neither of us had that growing up. We also rent a couple rooms in our house so that can be a bit of a challenge at times, but housemates/tenants that are more in-sync with us, seem to really appreciate the atmosphere we try to and usually do foster--one of inclusivity and harmony but also independence and space. One of our housemates has been with us for over 3 years. He is bi polar, but manages it pretty well, and aside from that body imbalance is a pretty cool/good guy and it feels/seems that we have helped him a lot on some deeper levels. And it seems like he really appreciates that we are all in each other's lives. He's fairly introverted, and somewhat a loner by nature, but he'll talk to us for hours at times, but at the same time we also let him "come to us" and give him plenty of space.

(Btw, don't know if it relates astrologically or not, but perhaps with having Scorpio IC, and Venus ruler of the Moon almost exactly trine Pluto [and Venus is Pluto's Sign ruler], it's probably no big surprise that my Mom also had a strong Scorpio signature, with Scorpio Asc, and I think Pluto was relatively near her MC and definitely the highest planet in the chart).

posted August 15, 2021 03:48 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosionV2:
(Btw, don't know if it relates astrologically or not, but perhaps with having Scorpio IC, and Venus ruler of the Moon almost exactly trine Pluto [and Venus is Pluto's Sign ruler], it's probably no big surprise that my Mom also had a strong Scorpio signature, with Scorpio Asc, and I think Pluto was relatively near her MC and definitely the highest planet in the chart).

---

posted August 16, 2021 03:40 AM            

I still have a difficult time understanding it. That probably is the 12th house clouding me.

Since I was young I probably came into earth on karmic terms. I stopped breathing after I was birthed into the world, and had to immediately be taken to nicu and I stood in there for a few days before I actually went home to my family. I even have a graduation certificate from nicu when I was finally released lol

I feel like internally Ive never truly had peace (maybe everyone is like this? Im not sure). In my family I felt no one understood me, Id cry and deal with my emotions all alone. Ive learned to confide in myself and have always been very introverted to my own detriment.

I was 16 when I experienced clinical depression, where I almost took my own life, but Im too coward to go through with it. Even since then I have not been the same, I dont think I ever will. I was diagnosed with OCD and looking back I probably was born with it. It's a horrible curse of the mind I wish I could get rid of it but I cant. My mind is just wired that way. Definitely had to be a punishment of some sort. And I cant find a good therapist for anything.

I worry everyday I'll lose it. I am afraid of the unknown and my mind always has to go to the worst, darkest place and I am terrified of it. It's helped me cope knowing that it's OCD doing this to me but I even doubt that!

I have terrible dreams, that just reaffirm my fears.

There are some things about myself I am grateful for, but even those traits Im not sure are really me.
When I compare myself to others I am much less self assured and very confused. This makes me be reliant on other peoples views because alone I cant seem to know what's true or not, what's real or not, what wrong or not. I cant seem to trust myself.

Deep down I realize how afraid I am of a lot of things. I try to find myself but I realize that due to my confusion , I cant ever define myself so I just gave up.

The only way I feel useful in this world is if I act selflessly. And try to make the world a better place, and be some sort of light for people I come in contact with. But that's impossible given my circumstances and instability.

Also I have Chiron in the 8th house so that's a lot of fun too.

There's a lot I dont understand and I think I live in this vagueness for the rest of my life. I just hope I can cope with it without going off the edge.

I often wonder what my past life was, but Im also scared lol
I wonder what must have done to get all this 12th house stuff...

posted August 16, 2021 05:26 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by PlutoWasHere:
I have read somewhere that Scorpio/Pluto/H8 can be related to family karma. My mother’s father, my father and my brother all have Scorpio Mars. My brother also has Scorpio ASC and is from the Pluto in Scorpio generation. My father had his Scorpio Mars square Leo Pluto. He could have a nasty temper sometimes. Maybe that’s where my Saturn conjunct Mars in H10 comes from.

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Not sure about that, could be?

Oof, I could see Scorpio Mars square Leo Pluto going south real quick unless much of the rest of the chart counter balances it towards the more loving and faster vibratory.

So in your case, do you tend to bottle up your anger more so? That can be one manifestation of Mars conjunct Saturn.

posted August 16, 2021 05:46 PM            

For me, I positively ground by being in nature, and doing things like walking barefoot, hugging trees, listening deeply to her sounds, swimming in nature, etc.

Exercise is also another way to positively ground, and preferably outside and in at least some semblance of nature.

Then for attuning to and communing with Expanded guidance, this combo technique for meditation is very helpful.

Before you start your meditation, state an intention/prayer of, "I deeply desire and ask for the guidance, help, direction of only the most Love attuned, helpful, positive-constructive, wise and aware sources and those that these may send me to (Yeshua is one of former, and a leader among them)".

Then spend some time toning/chanting. A pretty good, more universal and balanced one, is to start off with a deeper Ahhh sound, go up slightly higher to a Arrrr sound, going up slightly higher to a Eeeee sound, going up slightly higher to a Ehhhhh sound, going up to a slightly higher Ohhhhhh sound, going up to a slightly higher Youuuuu sound, and then going slightly higher up to a Mmmmmmmm sound.

This activates the first 6 Centers of the body in a very balanced and harmonious way, allowing the stage for and right conditions of the 7th Center of the God/Creator/Source Consciousness to activate.

Anyways, do this kind of chanting/toning for a few minutes or so.

Then, spend some time remembering a memory or moment when you felt a lot of Love. It can be anything. An interaction with a family member, a friend, a pet, a lover, etc, etc. But let that feeling well up in you as you remember that memory. Then feel that positive feeling towards the Creator and all of Creation. Give thanks for the beautiful gift of being part of the Creator and the Whole, as an individual, self aware piece that can experience both.

If you have any important or pressing questions you would like help with, it is after these stages that you should ask these questions with no preconceptions as to the answer or how an answer will come, and after you ask, get very deep, still and quiet within yourself and just receptively listen.

The more you practice the above combo of getting more positively grounded, while also attuning to Expanded Guidance within, the more centered, balanced, joyous, aware-knowing you will start to feel. But like with anything in life, the more you practice it, the better you will get and the easier and more automatic it will become.

posted August 17, 2021 01:49 PM            

Thank you for your reply! I see you have been through a very rough period. Depression is a terrible thing to experience. My mother has been diagnosed with depression since she was 17. Luckily, she has had long periods where she felt good. The right medication was really key for her.

Having a 12th House stellium seems very Karmic to me. Karmic lessons usually are not very easy, but will come with great personal growth if you learn to master it. I think you are right to look at what works for you. You wrote that you feel useful when you can act selflessly and help other people feel better. I think that is a great starting point.

Would you mind sharing the location of your Saturn and your north node?

posted August 17, 2021 02:19 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosionV2:
Not sure about that, could be?

Oof, I could see Scorpio Mars square Leo Pluto going south real quick unless much of the rest of the chart counter balances it towards the more loving and faster vibratory.

So in your case, do you tend to bottle up your anger more so? That can be one manifestation of Mars conjunct Saturn.

---

I tried to find the article I once read about Scorpio placements, but unfortunately I couldn't trace it. I think it was mostly about Scorpio Moon but maybe I am just confused.

You are right. My father was not an easy man, but I alway felt loved and I know he tried to act in what he thought was in my best interest. He had his Aries Moon conjunct Jupiter.