posted January 06, 2022 10:06 PM            

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Originally posted by GalacticCoreExplosionV2:
Women are most definitely higher in empathy and awareness/acceptance of feelings in an average, archetypal sense than men, while men are definitely higher in linear logic, analytical and intellect focus on average and in an archeytpal sense.

Just as the Yin Feminine Signs of Taurus, Cancer, Scorpio, Capricorn (actually a rather deep feeling and sensitive symbol), Pisces, etc tend to be more empathic and/or feeling oriented.

And just as the Yang Masculine Signs of Aries, Gemini, Leo, Sagittarius, and Aquarius tend to be more action and/or intellect focused than the Yin/Feminine signs. Funny how that works, no?

Are there exceptions to this? Of course, I happen to be one. Was born a hyper empath. But over the years, I've started to incorporate more and more of a "left brain" (symbolic of linear logical, analytical, individual parts perceiving, detached from feelings, etc type perception- balance to all that heart/empathy/feelings and intuition that I was born with (and not surprisingly, I have Pisces South Node in the 7th, with Moon, ruler of the 12th conjunct the ruler of my Sun and Mercury and co-ruler of my Venus [which in turn rules my Moon, and is almost exactly sextile Neptune and trine Pluto] and that ruler of Sun etc is widely square Neptune, with Neptune parallel my chart ruler the Sun, and Jupiter retrograding back into the 1st House).

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posted January 06, 2022 10:08 PM            

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Originally posted by Belage:
I will readily admit to being unfamiliar both in terms of personal experience and knowledge about non-binary people, especially those who are also aromantic and asexual.

I am wondering if in previous times, people like you were more drawn to the monastic life as mystics or maybe found it an easier accepted societal outlet, and as such, were more likely to join religious institutions where they could live a life of celibacy as monks and nuns.

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posted January 06, 2022 11:06 PM            

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Originally posted by ItsKikigirl:
Do you mean like innately? For me I believe that it’s more of a cultural and societally taught way of learning to socialize. I believe that those are not innate things. Even when we look around the world our concepts of masculine and feminine are different. And it makes me curious how that parallels to peoples understanding of astrology around the world! But my apologies not to get too deep in that and away from astrology. But it does make me curious how it changes the perceptions of others in how they interact and interpret astrological aspects and such!

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I think "some" is cultural influenced, to be sure, but if we look at it purely biologically and evolution wise, and look at many different traditional-ancient cultures (and generally accepted evolution theories), it is very clear there are significant differences between female and male bodies in some ways in these areas.

The female body is genetically/biologically more geared towards connection, socialization, and empathy, partly because it is the female body that is physically weaker and yet has to form and carry the child. Mothers typically bond very emotionally strongly with their children and this is a strong biological impetus. That bonding relates a lot to empathy and feelings, which is why there is the saying that a mother's love is often that which comes closest to unconditional love.

Again, speaking to general trends and overall archetype. There are always exceptions to every rule.

Meanwhile male bodies tend to be stronger, more hormonally geared towards aggression and hyper/singular focus, and in most cultures the males were the ones that went to hunt, which required a different mindset and attunement. Hundreds of thousands of years of such repeating genetic patterns do not get suddenly erased by a couple hundred years of different, unusually cushy and easy modern living and cultural trends.

Just comparing more male hormones with more female hormones is pretty illustrative in and of itself. Testosterone which is far higher in male bodies than female bodies (and why men build muscle so much easier, faster, and more bulky as compared to women) has been called the "f#ck it or fight it" hormone and rightly so. I remember going through puberty and having my testosterone levels being through the roof. It was like trying to control a bucking bronco. Sex drive/focus and tendencies towards aggression and/or expressive/outward directed anger were through the roof.

Meanwhile, every mostly straight guy who has been in relationships with mostly straight women for any length of time knows that when the female partner starts to get near her cycle, things get real dicey emotions/feelings wise, because the way we experience/perceive it is, often times reasoned logic and analysis goes right OUT the window and pure, nonobjective feeling takes over, and not just very intense emotions/feelings, but also highly sensitive (quite a combo, and extremely Lunar in archetype, which is why the Moon is associated with lunacy i.e. lack of grounded reasoning skills and unchecked emotions/feelings and/or fears). I've been with the same partner for 20 years, and NO ONE can tell me this doesn't have truth to it (I've experienced it roughly 240 times!), and my partner is more Yang balanced/in touch than many women.

Your studies/education in and of themselves were most definitely influenced by culture and politics. It seems like you need to factor in biology and evolution more. Btw, not saying there haven't been "some" cultures which bucked some of these common trends. Again, there are always exceptions to the rule.

Astrologically speaking, what this translates to, is that on average, there are many more men who are more highly attuned to Mars, Saturn, Jupiter, and/or Sun (i.e. more Yang polarized symbols) than Moon, Venus, and Neptune and Yin energies. In turn, on average there are many more women that are more highly attuned to Moon, Venus, and/or Neptune and Yin energies than strongly Yang energies. But there are exceptions and extremes.

Some of the trend is probably cultural, but a lot is biological. And the inner consciousness/soul of a person, can definitely influence and change this from some to a lot. Again, like I was born a hyper empath. Fairly unusual for one connected to a male body. But did I have that hyper empathy when 13 to 17 or so, when testosterone was flooding through my body and all I could think of was sex and/or had more tendency to temper? Not so much. (It was still there within me, but more in the background).

People that transition from one gender to another, HAVE to take a cocktail of hormones to more fully accomplish that, which right there shows us a lot about the power of nature and how much our biology influences us. I honestly don't understand how and when people think that most of this is just cultural. Did they ever consider that maybe the biology influenced/shaped the culture to begin with?

As I've made pretty clear earlier, my own personal perception is that as we become more spiritually developed, we become ever more balanced, integrated, and eventually merged between inner Yin and Yang sides of consciousness. We are starting to move collectively in that direction, but we have a LONG ways to go before we get there collectively in a deeper, more consistent sense. Meanwhile, what is the point of putting the cart before the horse?

posted January 14, 2022 04:48 PM            

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Originally posted by ItsKikigirl:
I wanted to start a thread on this because as we progress further and change how we’re conceptualizing gender, I wanted to re evaluate some of the ways we have thought about astrology, thought about aspects, and connections and how we’ve connected it to gender. Not everyone conceptualize gender this way but in my years of studying sociology and gender studies I have re evaluated my entire understanding of gender. Mainly because in the many years that I have learned astrology I have heard things like “the man in the relationship may feel this aspect in this way more than the woman” and so on and so forth. And firstly it really doesn’t take into consideration relationships with people who are both women or both men or even those who are non binary. Also I am okay with the idea of masculinity and femininity in terms of it defining certain characteristics and ways of being but it becomes tricky when we attach it to male bodied or female bodied people meaning that we perceive masculine things as being only for males to “feel” in an aspect and vice versa . One thing I think about is there’s no real constraints on what it even means to be a man or woman and that the woman, for example, in the relationship could be the more characteristically masculine person in the relationship. And so to say that certain aspects would be felt or more representative of one particular gender in a relationship is really constraining and in my opinion inaccurate considering every person in every relationship is going to be different and their gender wouldn’t really define how an aspect will be felt with them. Another example is when people say “it’s better if the man is this planet and woman is this planet in an aspect” which may not be accurate for every person in every relationship. This is my personal opinion, any thoughts on gender and astrology in regards to really anything?

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💛 Totally agree.

What society generally forms girls to be is not an expression of their inner or natural selves, but an expression of what society wants women to be. This is not a new phenomenon, so certain characteristics have been developing over centuries and catagorised as ‘male’ or ‘female’ as a way to describe men and women.

To make my point I want to go away from the gender aspect. When you look at written history, you’ll find that the main focus is power and those in power. There are many reasons for this. One being that only the ruling classes could read and write so they could give testimony and create their own narrative. They left a trace that historians could find and interpret. Does this mean that peasants were dumb or incapable to represent themselves? Couldn’t have written poetry or political commentary? No, but there was no opportunity. They weren’t allowed. They didn’t develop the mental/psychological/practical tools necessary to become a political advisor or advocate. To say it wasn’t in their (god given) nature to develop this way and become powerful, is degrading. And untrue. But it was said to be their nature, nonetheless.

The same goes for women and what women and men supposedly are – naturally.

For example: Women are not more caring. There are thousands of reasons why women do the care work (or are the caring part in relationships) and not all of them have much to do with caring. Girls and women are expected to be caring, so they adapt to the demand. Women get sh*t for not being caring *once*. So, they learn that there is punishment for not adhering to the societal standard.

People receive all kinds of feedback every second of every day (just spend time with infants and you’ll know) and find orientation in it. But, sometimes the feedback leads them away from who they are. It's culture, not nature. And the same goes for men. If you receive admiration for being adventurous, if you're allowed to be adventurous even as a little boy (or should I say "little man"), then you develop these character traits. The girl next door to this little boy who's been encouraged to climb trees, run independently and try new things, was discouraged to explore, get dirty or ruin the pretty dress. This dynamic gets replicated throughout society. Not because girls are naturally meek and obedient and boys are risk takers, but because these character traits is what women and men will need in their gendered societal and professional roles (with men being CEOs, presidents and military leaders and women being at home, prioritising family and their husbands).

Pavlov's dog holds very much true for human behaviour as well. You develop in the way you are allowed to and where you get most praise. This is being very general and one-dimensional, of course, because you could write a dissertation on this and not be done.

In regard to astrology: I would bring in socialisation. We are taught what it means to be a wo/man, so even if something would not necessarily make us feel one way or another, it could still lead to problems because of our learnt perception of ourselves and others as well as our societal and gendered roles. A husband might not have a personal problem with his wife earning more money, but a traditional family/social circle could turn it into a problem for the husband and the couple.

The statements you've read (how it's better that a woman's moon is conjunct the man's sun and so forth), I've read as well. They always make me uncomfortable, because they exclude me. And I don't think I'm the only one who's had different experiences and would appreciate a little less prejudice. At the end of the day, it's always a question of the power of a narrative. If you're only allowed to be a certain way, even if you're clearly different, you try and fit in and look at everything through this one lens. This cycle of repetition leads you to contribute to something that is damaging even to yourself, often times without noticing your role in it.

posted January 14, 2022 08:18 PM            

That doesn't mean that every person who identifies as gender neutral / non-binary will fit that definition of biologically sexually non-dimorphic.

I've made it a habit to not use presumptive pronouns in my astrology practice. Tendencies of most males and females do not make rules for the rest. Nor do they establish any astrological principle.

As a guy who fits the male heterosexual category, I'm interested in hearing the experience and contribution of persons whose relatively unique experience of being human — especially since so many have been surgically altered to make them 'right', degraded, or simply not heard. I want to hear from those who have not been heard until this point in history.

Speak, teach — and be true to who you are!

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The Declinations Guy | Expert Birth Chart Rectification