Posts: 4554
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
Registered: May 2009

posted August 25, 2009 04:38 PM         

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Or anyone who may know....

I was interested in joining an online writers group. Something with a community feel to it, like here, where you can share your stories/poems whatever and maybe help one another. I'm a little paranoid about someone stealing or using my words. Not totally paranoid, but you know, it is the internet.

So I was wondering if you knew of any? I know I could search, but I'de rather join one that someone else can recommend.

Thanks !

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Posts: 1317
From: meet me in montauk
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posted August 25, 2009 04:49 PM         

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Posts: 3479
From: Bay Area, CA
Registered: May 2009

posted August 25, 2009 04:51 PM         

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I used to know of a few which may or may not be good, but I've been more interested in person-to-person workshops/groups. I spend too much time online in general lol.

Alternatively, you could try the Meetup.com groups in your area, but those never really appealed to me since they're often based more on encouragement and less on discipline/constructive critique.

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Posts: 4554
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
Registered: May 2009

posted August 25, 2009 05:40 PM         

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hmm thats an idea! Give me something to do, outside the house. So I just go to that website and it will tell of meetings in my area?
I miss my college classes with the critiqing, it really is helpful.
My poetry prof told me that whenever you write something, you should mail it to yourself and not open it. Not as good as a copyright, but it shows when the peice was written at least.
I know what you mean about not writing something good enough to steal. But still, my words are mine, and I want to keep it that way. Plagerism is a loathesmome thing to do. I hate theft of any kind. Low, low, low!

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Posts: 3479
From: Bay Area, CA
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posted August 25, 2009 06:02 PM         

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Not to sound too weird here, but the chances of people stealing one's work is very slim. Just from my experience as a writer.
Not saying there's no chance of it - sure there is. But I don't think it should be the sole determining factor of seeking a group.

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From: Bay Area, CA
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posted August 25, 2009 06:04 PM         

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Yes, your prof is right about sending your stuff back to yourself. That's what I've always done. I post my stuff everywhere, and have always had copies.

But 'my' words are not mine if I want to share them. That's a risk you'll always have to take to an extent. If someone really wants to plagiarize your work, they will.

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posted August 25, 2009 10:38 PM         

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My experience has been that people often inadvertently steal my work in subtle ways--my tone, cadence, certain images and metaphors. A friend told me my work had "influenced" her and really changed her writing--she wrote me a long thank you letter after she had basically sort of kind of plagiarized me!!!

It freaked me out, because I was scared that, what if she got really famous with MY work (in the sense of work like mine), and then later people thought MY work was derivative of hers.

If you have a unique voice, you are basically safe once you are relatively known/famous...then when someone's work is derivative of yours, everyone who reads it is like, "Ohhhh, that person must've been influenced by Writesomething," instead of the other way around.

Before you are known, I agree that plagiarism of various kinds is a hazard, especially on the internet.

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Posts: 4554
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
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posted August 26, 2009 07:23 AM         

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We had a discussion similiar to this in school. Like, really, what is plagiarism? Is it one word, two words, a sentence? Surely we all do that. My prof said it was very hard to define. Unless of course it is a blatant rip off copy.
But in a sense we are all influenced by someone/thing we've read.
Every time I read or re-read Anne Rice books, I have a major creative spurt. Then when I look back at the poetry, I can see what book it was I had been reading. Some of these things are hard to avoid.

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Posts: 3479
From: Bay Area, CA
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posted August 26, 2009 05:09 PM         

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It's true that when one is just starting to find their own writing voice, or even find a writer that they admire, they tend to emulate them in some way. I'm not talking about blatant rip-offs, phrase for phrase, word for word, but the general feeling of imitation. Imitation is NOT plagiarism.

Methinks writers have HUGE egos in general. We want to be admired for our writing but also get all weird about having our words or whatever 'stolen'. You've got to take the good with the bad.
Our words and our writing do not belong to us... the moment we share them, we put them out there to the universe and whoever. Even when we copyright something, there's still a risk of having stuff we write twisted. And so what? Isn't imitation the most sincere form of flattery?

It's all about killing your darlings and knowing that no matter what you've written, you will always write again, write more, and do even better.
If there's anything I've learned from years of writing (and, *re-writing*) it's to surrender my hold on 'my' work.

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From: Dayton,Ohio USA
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posted August 27, 2009 02:53 AM         

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That is good advice, MVM, and you know what I've learned, now this is going to go against everything anyone has ever learned in a class, lol, if you take them.

NO REVISING
Okay by that I mean, that the original thing you wrote is some kind of inspired thing, coming from some deep collective well, or sumin pretentious like that. Then we analyze and re-think and try to fit it into a box, until it is barely recognizable anymore.
I might add, this is more geared toward poetry. Fiction writing you have to revise, escpecially when your like me and your verbs and subjects are constantly sparring.
But poetry that comes out in one fluid, sublime moment shouldn't be messed with, or at least, as little as possible.
Just my two cents.

ETA: I always revised and changed them in school per my Prof, who became a dear friend and mentor to me. And HE even told me later, "I just made you guys do that stuff to use up class time!" He was kidding, kinda, but kinda not.

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From: Bay Area, CA
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posted August 27, 2009 03:05 AM         

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Ah, Gypsee, I wish you were living close to me, it would be awesome to have you in a writing group! I usually go all hard a$$ when it comes to working on a project and make sure we all do the work, so I like to crack a whip... maybe you'd hate that

But I agree with you about revising, esp poetry. I usually let it rip in my journals, forget about it, then stumble on it again like 6 months or a year later and I do a little tweaking, because then I feel I can see the big picture better or something

The good news is that I just found (I think, I hope) a very small, established writing group which meets weekly...very happy.
I am dying to finish my second book and need the discipline oh so badly!!!

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posted August 28, 2009 02:13 AM         

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A few fanfics of mine were heavily inspired by others. These are typically the ones that others got me to do for them (requests) that I tried to get through pretty fast rather than sit and think up a bunch of background stuff. In these cases, I've always given the source of such inspiration in my author's notes (front or end). But I didn't do it to be "fair" so much as to say, "Hey, if you thought this was cool, you might also want to read this, too."

One thing that upset me a little once was I was doing a fanfic where these nanites from an alternate world were causing people to go to sleep and rewriting their DNA and turning them into puppets that worked as a collective with each other. As I was finishing it up, The Invasion came out, and it turned out they'd changed the usual "pod people" into those infected by an ET virus, so very similar to mine! But these things happen, and I just try to shrug it off.

Should I post my original fic material, I plan to mail myself significant portions of it multiple times (these will have the date stamped on unsealed envelopes) and also take confidence that once something's on the net (which is often automatically dated), it can't ever truly gotten rid of. But I'd only be likely to care if some jerk stole my stuff and THEN tried to force ME to not "steal" from him...which has been known to happen (very, very rarely--and I've only heard of this with fanart on the net...and one funny was where someone reported someone for stealing her web page work when the person who "stole" it was just another alias of the one who originally did it which the person reporting the thief had stolen it from in the first place...and got HER site shut down instead. )

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Posts: 4554
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
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posted August 28, 2009 06:31 AM         

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YAY for you MVM, I'm glad you found a class.
I would so take your class if I were there. I would do everything you said, and then gripe and moan bitterly to anyone who would listen, lol.
I have placed twice in contests for poetry and adult non-fiction. Since I've only entered twice, I thought that was pretty cool.
I notice the problem lies in writing fiction. See, I can come up with the story idea, no problem.
It is the endings that drive me insane!
I think it has something to do with my lack of patience. Poetry writing is quick silver (for me) and adult non-fiction is something that actually happened, so I know the ending!!
If you only knew how many 3/4ths stories I have written, you would definetly give my slacking butt some Virgo discipline!

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From: Bay Area, CA
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posted August 28, 2009 11:56 PM         

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They say you should write your endings first and then work your way to there, Gypsee lol
I have no idea if it works.... I'm trying to give it a try myself

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posted August 29, 2009 01:26 AM         

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I'm also convinced that it's my NN in Capricorn (in the 9th) which cracks the whip, along with my Capricorn Midheaven. It's what got me to finish my first book and made me get it published. It's what cracks the whip.
The Virgo in me just whines about it sometimes

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Posts: 4554
From: Dayton,Ohio USA
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posted August 29, 2009 12:05 PM         

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Picturing a whipping whining Virgo is very difficult for me MVM! I've never met a whiny Virgo! But I'm generalizing, and you hate that so I'll stop now. Before the whipping.
lol.
Writing the endings first??? My Lands, I've never thought of that! I just wrote a fairy tale last night. Kind of a Rapunzel ripp off with a Cinderella twist. It was going so wellllll <<<<<says in a very whiny voice >>>>> But then the end had too many possiblities and I just threw my notebook across the room.
Add that to the story about the dude who gets kicked out of Atlantis. That one, in theory was pretty good. But, lol, it is a never ending story!

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