Posts: 3549
From: Pluto, next to Ami Ann
Registered: Jul 2010

posted April 24, 2011 05:41 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by rajji:
Blaming coffee for intentionally starting a sensitive topic is something I dont understand..Coffee was insulted and then inturn was blamed for provoking!

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coffee directly stated that he was gauging reactions, thats why he was blamed for provoking, then he cried bully and said people reacted with emotions

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What happens on Venus stays on Venus

-Nasa

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Posts: 2236
From: Australia
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2011 05:47 PM            

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 24, 2011 07:25 PM            

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Better to leave it. Some Forums have the search still working. I haven't fixed the others yet, but I know how to.

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Posts: 1093
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 25, 2011 01:58 PM            

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sounds creative, and perhaps a reasonable idea..

i don't think the mods should be picked. why do moderators have any thing over non moderators for choices?

moderators just do jobs that releive strain and pressure from the admin, its a dustbin man's job.

no reason in my opinion to turn dustbin men into "officials" of some sort for a committee.

if this is to be a truly justifiable idea and committee, then i think that the people part of it, should be voted for by the community.

if its going to be chosen completely by the powers that be (mods/admin) or by people who are allies in cliques, then its pointless imo. it would be a flawed idea since the committee will have natural bias inside it.

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 25, 2011 03:26 PM            

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I agree 100 percent; however, likewise, I don't think a person should be excluded simply because they are a Mod. Maybe an eclectic mix across the board (pun intended).

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"All deaths are suicides, do you realize that? Every single one. The only distinction is that, with some people, suicide is a subconscious choice, and with others it's a conscious choice. Otherwise, those who commit suicide and those who succumb to accident, illness or "old age," die for exactly the same reason: belief in the inevitability of death." Linda Goodman

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Posts: 39
From: Cardiff
Registered: Mar 2011

posted April 27, 2011 05:19 AM            

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quote:

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For what it's worth, I've been on sites without moderators and it wasn't pretty. This site does have moderators and it's as bad as the ones that don't have them.

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Yes.

quote:

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In some ways worse because the mods are people who are supposed to keep things running smoothly not contributing to the problem and in all honesty, as it is, the posisition is a joke.

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That's 100% right.

quote:

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My suggestion Randall, is you clean house. Keep the mods that at least try to do their job well, and let them do it, and get rid of the ones that aren't cut out for it. A mod should not have to be moderated by others- that's a good place to start with the determination.

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Precisely.

quote:

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Then if necessary bring in new people based on how well you think they can do the job, not on who raises their hand.

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What you say makes complete and utter sense. A number of mod's are even-handed, fair, and mature but i get the sense Randall likes to run with the hares and the hounds and like to be popular and so anyone who sucks up to you is given preferential treatment. I think a stronger way to run your moderators is to choose them by merit. By their mental stability, maturity, and integrity. It's almost like a bunch of sychophants are running things, who when the going gets tough crumble immediately, and are constantly embroiled in the very things they are supposed to prevent. Honestly Randall what Pisces Moon has said is 100% true. People have left, you've banned people - and what now - it's just as bad if not worse. Furthermore the very suggestion of needing a committee composed of half non-moderators implies that the current moderation system is failing completely. Because now you're going to have moderators assessed by non-moderators during committee discussions!!! It's almost like the lunatics have taken over the asylum already. And anyone sane who doesn't go along with the farce is banned or has the sense to leave.

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Trying to be good, feels good.

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Posts: 9106
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010

posted April 27, 2011 06:23 AM            

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Dear RIAFC
I hear what you are saying .Lala and Randall do exemplify that to which everyone should aspire.
I really,really hear you ,RIAFC. I think where your logic breaks down,is the human factor.
Also, there is another important fact you may not know about Randall.
Randall is gifted as a mentor. Randall can take Audrey Hepburn in My Fair Lady and make her in to a lady.
In a world of precise things,you may be right.
However,in a human world,I don't think you are.
LL is a human world.That is why you and we love it so much.
That is why most of us stay and fight to stay.
We are a human family. A human family is not pretty at times but it DOES have heart.
We have heart,RIAFC. I bet that is why you are still here and care enough to write this post.
I,personally,appreciate you very much.
You have been kind and gracious to me when
I was in one of my worst spots in my entire time on LL.
I aspire to the standards of Randall and Lala.
I have not gotten there,yet. You are very right about that.
However,I am trying.

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If you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will forgive you
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses,neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


He who controls his Spirit is greater than he who controls a city
Proverbs

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Posts: 373
From: u.k
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 07:57 AM            

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RIAFC
You speaka my language

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Posts: 39
From: Cardiff
Registered: Mar 2011

posted April 27, 2011 08:37 AM            

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What i'm saying is if someone does something they require the qualities to do it. And that is the same with moderation - because it's a position of responsibility, requiring stability, control, integrity and poise - which you don't have. Because others are reliant on moderators to look after their BB experience it is not right for many to suffer just because a handful moderators are being allowed to 'have a go' at moderating when it so clearly goes wrong time after time after time. What annoys me most is all the nasty bickering one minute, then false love the next, then back to bickering again. It's so false and bitchy.
I also feel Randall is emotionally held to ransom somewhat. He can't run this properly now with the bod's he's got and to get rid of the more emotionally unstable ones might have emotional consequences. The result of this is the quality of the forum continues to decline. He's between a rock and a hard place but in fairness it's his own doing because of his selection criteria or lack thereof.

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Trying to be good, feels good.

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Posts: 9106
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010

posted April 27, 2011 08:58 AM            

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Well I hear you RIAFC
I really,really do
However,just speaking for myself, if Randall had not believed in me,I would not be this wonderful vision of maturity you see right now

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If you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will forgive you
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses,neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


He who controls his Spirit is greater than he who controls a city
Proverbs

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 09:30 AM            

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With all due respect, this is a gross exaggeration. The Forums have not declined. Spats are infrequent. Very few have been banned over the years, and the ones that have deserved it. And no, droves haven't left. People leave for a number of reasons...mostly due to just life...but the number of people leaving over arguments have been overstated. The only thing on the money about those comments is that the Mods have been joining in the fray. I think that is now resolved. I have confidence in my Mods. A restructuring of the rules was in order, and I expect them to enforce them. And no, Lindaland isn't "as bad as sites that have no Mods." Wow. Really? C'mon. Over 99 percent of the time, things run smoothly here. And now that the rules are more concrete, I am shooting for 100 percent. In doing so, yeah more people will likely get banned, because much of the trouble in the past has been due to my reluctance to do so. My bad. I own up to it. And I aim to rectify it. If everyone will play nice, and if the Mods will keep a watchful eye, then things will not blow up every time we have a disagreement. Yes, the Mods have joined in before, but that has to change. The past is in the past. We have learned from it. Onward and upward!

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Posts: 172
From: u.k
Registered: Oct 2010

posted April 27, 2011 09:36 AM            

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I too am familiar with unmoderated forums, and tbh, they can be LETHAL. If you are unaware of forum 'rules', and you inadvertantly break one, you are in line for some grief. That's why I like LL - it's not too often somebody oversteps the line and gets rude/abusive, and I like that there's a 'safety net'. Plus, no swears!

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 09:42 AM            

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And the idea of the committee is not to do Mod duties. Mods enforce the rules and act in a peacekeeping fashion. The committee would determine when a topic crosses a line beyond free speech into inflammatory. Astrology 2.0 is almost entirely free of drama. There's no reason why other Forums can't be the same (and usually they are).

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Posts: 9106
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010

posted April 27, 2011 11:21 AM            

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I think the other thing about LL,RIAFC,is that it is an organic thing.
It grows and changes based on outside and inside stimuli.
Say,there were perfect Mod's who performed their duties in an almost perfect fashion.
Where would the life in LL be?
Randall is the first to say that HE grows and changes.
That is humility on his part and more importantly--HUMANNESS.
I,for one, was told I had to be perfect.Perhaps,you were,too RIAFC.
LL and Randall does not demand that.It can be a first for some of us.
Isn't that better than a robotic environment where you are thrown out when you don't color between the lines

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If you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will forgive you
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses,neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


He who controls his Spirit is greater than he who controls a city
Proverbs

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Posts: 5281
From: Pleasanton, CA
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 11:43 AM            

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The idea that people have painted too poor a picture of the forum are offset by those making an overly rosy picture of the forum. Lots of people have left. That's true, and it's observable if you were to say go back a year in the history of this site in the various forums. It's true that not all of them were banned. Many have left voluntarily. Many have left in protest of some condition here.

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 11:52 AM            

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I've already stated that very few were banned. And many people grow and leave not in protest, just for many various reasons. Life happens. Some did leave in protest (some over Valus and other offending members, and some left due to disputes), and we should wish them well. If they don't feel like Lindaland fits them, then why try to keep them here against their will? Some return, some don't, but all should be wished well. I take responsibility for the ones who left over quarrels, and I'm reasonably certain that any such contention in the future will be doused early on.

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 12:01 PM            

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Let's keep my string on task, please. This is to discuss whether or not we will benefit from a committee of sorts used specifically to decide whether or not a string such as Coffee's recent one about mothers crosses the line and is too contentious.

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"All deaths are suicides, do you realize that? Every single one. The only distinction is that, with some people, suicide is a subconscious choice, and with others it's a conscious choice. Otherwise, those who commit suicide and those who succumb to accident, illness or "old age," die for exactly the same reason: belief in the inevitability of death." Linda Goodman

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Posts: 9106
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010

posted April 27, 2011 01:44 PM            

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I think the only thing that should be protected is what is INHERENT to a person such as race and religion.
I don't think one's role as mother/father etc is a protected status.
People can have a variety of opinions on that and each person's opinion is his right.

It is scary, to me, to restrict free speech beyond this.
I will never forget George Orwell's book 1984.

In Skokie Illinois, the Nazi party marched through a suburb of Holocaust survivors.

They were defended by Jewish lawyers.As horrible as this is ,I agree.
Free speech is as precious as diamonds. Ask the people who don't have it

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If you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will forgive you
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses,neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


He who controls his Spirit is greater than he who controls a city
Proverbs

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 02:33 PM            

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True, those groups are not protected by discrimination laws, but I think what we are trying to determine is to what extent other such groups should be protected here. In some cases, the people so vocal about free speech are the first ones to cry foul when they see something they find personally offensive to themselves. But I think the main thing is that in the presence of a controversial topic, if one cannot control one's temper, then it's best to not respond. Mods have every right to voice their own opinions as well, but once insults are hurled, the Mods should then go into Mod mode and switch from contributing opinions to more of a peacekeepng role...and then they can go back to voicing their opinions again.

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"All deaths are suicides, do you realize that? Every single one. The only distinction is that, with some people, suicide is a subconscious choice, and with others it's a conscious choice. Otherwise, those who commit suicide and those who succumb to accident, illness or "old age," die for exactly the same reason: belief in the inevitability of death." Linda Goodman

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Posts: 1093
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 03:12 PM            

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one thing irritating about the community here is how touchy and personal everybody is, its quite irritating for someone who has no intention or desire to leave, just desire to see good posts talking about something that does not feel draining to read.

you know the one thing i do like about the way the community is nowa days is the end of that asteroid/soulmate era.

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 03:24 PM            

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At least we are engaging things in thought and discussion to explore constructive solutions. I do love how Astrology 2.0 avoids conflict. There's no reason why the other Forums cannot do the same.

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"All deaths are suicides, do you realize that? Every single one. The only distinction is that, with some people, suicide is a subconscious choice, and with others it's a conscious choice. Otherwise, those who commit suicide and those who succumb to accident, illness or "old age," die for exactly the same reason: belief in the inevitability of death." Linda Goodman

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Posts: 9106
From: Pluto/house next to NickiG
Registered: Sep 2010

posted April 27, 2011 04:42 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by Randall:
At least we are engaging things in thought and discussion to explore constructive solutions. I do love how Astrology 2.0 avoids conflict. There's no reason why the other Forums cannot do the same.

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I think in Astro 2,we are too busy learning Astrology to bother with people's business

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If you forgive men their trespasses, your Heavenly Father will forgive you
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses,neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


He who controls his Spirit is greater than he who controls a city
Proverbs

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Posts: 1799
From:
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 04:57 PM            

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I think, at least for me, this place was where I did open up about some aspects of myself that were hidden even to myself. talking about spirituality... astrology...

so it becomes somehow a place that I feel is mine and sometimes I don't want to share it. or I want my values to prevail. of course not all the time. and to some extent many people here do that, I think.

so yeah may be a committie to hold onto some objective common values... that is an interesting idea. if ther is any real need for a comittee in the first place. but how to get there? that is tricky.

I regret your discourse randall that if people want to leave they can, they will find a place that suit them somewhere else and all that jazz. It feels like being spat on the face to be told that you can leave and go some other places if this place where you felt at home once is not anymore. ok, there is a part of truth in what you say. and may be you are just expressing some pain to be left or threatened to be left. I don't know.

but do you think anyone coming here for years doesn't thinks he belongs to this place, and vice versa?

if they fail to adapt to whatever new form this place shift to, does it mean they are wrong? do you get me? do they have to adapt to the place or do the place has to adapt to them?

and who is "they"? I suppose I would not name the same as you or as ami ann for example.

but I honestly believe that "they" exist. and I even dare to think that they are not always the loudest. and not always thos who agree with you or with everything.

may be they should be asked to be that "committee", and not thos who nominate themselves. it all depends on which direction do you want YOUR forum to take randall. that of a facebook'friend's list or that of a spiritual forum.

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Posts: 942
From:
Registered: Nov 2010

posted April 27, 2011 05:05 PM            

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quote:

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Originally posted by letram:

you know the one thing i do like about the way the community is nowa days is the end of that asteroid/soulmate era.

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HA just for that I should start posting about asteroids and soulmates! :P

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Posts: 7993
From: The Goober Galaxy
Registered: Apr 2009

posted April 27, 2011 05:19 PM            

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No offense was intended, Pire, but "they" are whomever--who for whatever reason--decide to leave. We should wish "them" well on their journey. Lindaland changes and grows, and those changes may not suit everyone. If it did suit them, they would remain, no? Lindaland in my opinion, is now complete, and I'm adding no more Forums. So, the issue now is simply to keep outbursts to a minimum, so that the majority of people who come here to enjoy what we have are not obstructed, distracted, or turned off due to the contention caused by a few. I respect and appreciate contributions from the past (which is why I keep all of the older posts), but IMHO it is not our place to question the free-will decisions of people to leave or to stay...or to return one day.

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