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Author Topic:   We Need Unions Again
Faith
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posted August 10, 2013 02:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AG, you're only prolonging the agony and setting the stage for future meltdowns unless you let the weak die off.

Asking the Federal Reserve to cover the a**es of the reckless power elite translates to inflation (QE to infinity?), jeopardizes the dollar, and basically keeps everything teetering at the edge of disaster. It doesn't have to be that way.

Pixie, you're too good to me. All these cool links. Thanks!

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AcousticGod
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posted August 11, 2013 01:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What you're saying doesn't represent any true understanding.

If you don't want future meltdowns, put the regulations back in place that would have protected against the meltdown. Reinstate the Glass-Steagall Act.

QE hasn't caused inordinate inflation. I don't know who's propagating that myth, but it certainly is a myth. Inflation requires consumer demand or limited supply. Makes sense, right? You can't charge more if people don't have any more money, and aren't showing any desire to pay any more. Consumer spending is still coming back. QE doesn't touch either side of the transaction. It didn't put money in consumer's pockets (unless consumers were invested in the stock market), and it didn't affect corporations ability to provide goods or services.

QE hasn't significantly done anything to the value of the dollar either. It's neither in jeopardy, nor in any relative worse state in the relation to the rest of the world's currency.

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Faith
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posted August 12, 2013 09:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Since US dollars were now the cornerstone of the international monetary system, they were in demand. The US dollar itself became America’s No. 1 export, with the highest margins of any export item ever produced.

Say’s Law, however, tells us that “products are paid for with products” – you have to produce things in order to be able to buy things. That is normally true. But not when you’re printing up the world’s reserve currency. Then you have the exorbitant privilege of needing only to produce “money.”

The factories that would normally have fabricated the products needed to buy other products from other people in other places decamped to other places themselves. Between 1978 and 2010, the Bureau of Labor Statistics tells us the that the US lost 78% of its workers in the garment industry, 69% of those in “primary metals,” 67% of those in the textile industry and 26% of those in “transportation equipment.”

To look at it another way, the accumulated trade deficit since 1971 is roughly $8 trillion. That’s how out of balance the products-for-products exchange has been.

The foreigners produce the products; Americans produce only money.



http://inflationdata.com/articles/2013/08/01/inflation-americas-1-export/

It can't go on like that forever, the s*** will eventually hit the fan.

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AcousticGod
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posted August 12, 2013 01:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
From your site: http://inflationdata.com/inflation/Inflation/AnnualInflation.asp

Inflation's not an issue.

Furthermore, your article isn't about QE. It's about monetary policy from pre-1970's to present. When he talks about the dwindling means of the middle class, he's talking about how the wage gap is increasing, and about how wealth is being consolidated at the top of the income ladder (which is essentially Capitalism under less regulation). In the historical context he's chosen, he's certainly not zeroing in on any particularly modern monetary policy.

That author is also remarkable consistent in his views: http://dailyreckoning.com/the-claptrap-behind-the-minimum-wage-debate/
In this article he mentions "Says Law" again, he mentions the U.S. buying foreign products again, and he mentions getting off the gold standard again. He's an advocate of sound personal financial principles such as saving over spending, and when it comes to national monetary policy, he'd like a return to the gold standard. We've had the system he hates for over 40 years.

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Faith
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posted August 12, 2013 03:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
^ Interesting! Of course, it wasn't my intention to endorse all of the author's opinions and writings. I suppose you meant to counter my point about exporting inflation, but I don't see how your response actually accomplishes that.

I hold to the view of the Austrian economists: money production equals inflation, ie:

quote:
Observe that we don't say, as monetarists are saying, that the increase in the money supply causes inflation. What we are saying is that inflation is the increase in the money supply.

https://mises.org/daily/5953/Is-Inflation-about-General-Increases-in-Prices

I believe QE is harmful to our economy and consolidates wealth at the top.

I don't know what your view is; I thought you were a liberal, but you seem to favor policies that help the rich at the expense of the poor (like bailouts and QE.)

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Faith
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posted August 12, 2013 10:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This convo reminds me of one of my favorite political jingles:

Why the Banksters Keep Us Dumb

No offense, Ian!

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YoursTrulyAlways
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posted August 14, 2013 12:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for YoursTrulyAlways     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
That's cool, Faith.

I'm neither a central banker nor a trading huckster. I'm also not a private equity chop-them-up artist.

I lend money to support companies and projects, both of which better our collective lives and suport job growth. I support the building of hospitals, highways and bridges. I support both natural gas projects and also renewables. I fund both consumer products companies and services companies, and I neither fund defense equipment manufacturers (unless you consider Boeing and GE defense companies) nor arms manufacturers.

Therefore, I'm not the banker you guys think I am.

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AcousticGod
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posted August 14, 2013 03:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
I hold to the view of the Austrian economists: money production equals inflation, ie:

Perhaps, you should have started with that. There was concern about QE causing inflation, and that debate has played out. It turns out QE didn't cause massive inflation, and that inflation is still within normal boundaries. QE also wards off deflation.

quote:
I believe QE is harmful to our economy and consolidates wealth at the top.

In the sense that you have to be an investor in order to profit from QE, you're right. (Notice that it doesn't trickle down.)
Wealth was already consolidating at the top long before QE ever existed. When CEO's make 354 times the amount of the average worker, wealth is going to be consolidating at the top.
With regard to the economy, without QE lots of companies would be a lot worse off, so I don't know how you think it worsens the economy.

quote:
I don't know what your view is; I thought you were a liberal, but you seem to favor policies that help the rich at the expense of the poor (like bailouts and QE.)

Your Pisces Moon is too much for me sometimes. Trying to pull the, "I thought you were a liberal" card is kind of ridiculous. Mostly, because these actions are happening under a liberal (if you hadn't noticed), but in the event that a Republican were in office, these things would still likely be happening, because the best minds in economics in our country would have still been pushing for these policies.

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AcousticGod
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posted August 15, 2013 01:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
U.S. jobs, inflation data support tapering of Fed bond buying

By Lucia Mutikani

WASHINGTON | Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:06pm EDT

(Reuters) - The number of Americans filing new claims for jobless benefits fell to a near six-year low last week and consumer prices rose broadly in July, which could draw the Federal Reserve closer to trimming its massive bond-buying program.

The government reports on Thursday suggested an acceleration in job growth in early August and hinted at pockets of pricing power in the sluggish economy, which could ease concerns among some Fed officials that inflation was too low.

While data on manufacturing was less encouraging, economists were little fazed and said it merely suggested the improvement in factory activity was slower than had been anticipated.

"It looks like the weakness in employment last month was a fluke and the breadth of gains in CPI suggest that there will be less push back against tapering because of low inflation," said Ryan Sweet, a senior economist at Moody's Analytics in West Chester Pennsylvania. "A September taper is still on the table."

The U.S. central bank has said it plans to start trimming the $85 billion in bonds it is purchasing each month to keep borrowing costs low later this year.

Shares on Wall Street fell and yields on U.S. Treasuries jumped to a two-year high on the data. The dollar briefly climbed to a near two-week peak against the euro.

First-time applications for state unemployment benefits dropped 15,000 to a seasonally adjusted 320,000, the lowest level since October 2007, the Labor Department said. Economists had expected initial claims to come in at 335,000 last week.

The four-week moving average for new claims, which irons out week-to-week volatility, fell to its lowest level since November 2007, offering hope of an improvement in labor market conditions after hiring slowed a bit in July.

Carl Riccadonna, a senior economist at Deutsche Bank Securities in New York, said new claims and the four-week average at pre-recession levels were consistent with a pick-up in the pace of hiring, if not in August, then some time in the next couple of months.

"The critical component is going to be the August jobs report. If that comes in at least where it was in July, then this is going to keep the Fed on track to initiate tapering at the September (policy) meeting," said Riccadonna.

Employers added 162,000 jobs to their payrolls last month, with the jobless rate hitting a 4-1/2 year low of 7.4 percent.

BROAD GAINS IN PRICES

In another report, the Labor Department said its Consumer Price Index rose 0.2 percent, in line with economists' expectations, as the cost of goods and services ranging from tobacco to apparel and food increased.

The CPI had increased 0.5 percent in June. In the 12 months through July, the CPI advanced 2.0 percent, the largest increase since February, after increasing 1.8 percent in June.

The push in inflation to the Fed's 2 percent target suggested the downward drift in prices seen early in the year was over and could comfort some central bank officials who have warned on the potential dangers of inflation running too low.

Stripping out energy and food, consumer prices rose 0.2 percent for a third straight month. That took the increase over the past 12 months to 1.7 percent after core CPI gained 1.6 percent in June.

The uptick in prices fits in with Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke's views that the low inflation was temporary. Last month, there were also increases in the prices of gasoline, transportation and shelter.

Medical care services recorded a second successive month of gains in July. Medical care, which makes up about 10 percent of the core CPI, had been subdued in April and May.

The lack of pressure on health care costs had been attributed to the expiration of patents on several popular prescription drugs and government spending cuts that have cut payments to doctors and hospitals for Medicare.

Furniture prices posted their largest decline in three years, while airline fairs fell for second straight month.

News on the factory sector was a bit downbeat, with the Fed reporting that manufacturing output slipped 0.1 percent last month, held down by a 1.7 percent fall in the production of motor vehicles and machinery.

That, together with a drop in utilities production, left industrial output unchanged in July.

Separately, the New York Federal Reserve said its "Empire State" general business conditions index fell to 8.24 in August from 9.46 in July. A reading above zero indicates expansion.

However, details of the report were fairly encouraging, with strong gains in labor market gauges. The inventory drawdown continued, which bodes well for future production.

The Philadelphia Federal Reserve, meanwhile, said its business activity index fell to 9.3 in August from 19.8 in July, amid a slowdown in new orders growth and factory jobs.

But economists do not view this survey as a good barometer of national factory activity and were optimistic manufacturing will regain muscle, supported by a strengthening housing market recovery and firming demand overseas which is pushing up domestic exports.

"Growth in Europe and a pop in exports in June suggests we might see production growth resume after a flat first half," said Mei Li, an economist at FTN Financial in New York.

(Reporting by Lucia Mutikani, additional reporting by Paige Gance in Washington and Steven C Johnson in New York; Editing by Chizu Nomiyama) http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/15/us-usa-economy-idUSBRE97E0KS20130815

Incidentally, Europe has tentatively come out of it's longest post-WW2 recession.

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Faith
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posted August 15, 2013 03:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by AcousticGod:
Your Pisces Moon is too much for me sometimes. Trying to pull the, "I thought you were a liberal" card is kind of ridiculous.

It's not a card, AG, it was my honest opinion: you are hard to understand.

And lay off my moon or I'll start calling your Gemini Saturn a swamp beast.

quote:
Originally posted by AcousticGod:
Mostly, because these actions are happening under a liberal (if you hadn't noticed), but in the event that a Republican were in office, these things would still likely be happening, because the best minds in economics in our country would have still been pushing for these policies.

Who cares who the President is? Not me!

And these Keynesian economists are the best minds in the country, and they're the same exact ones who keep getting us deeper in debt and further towards a police state, by investing so much fiat currency in the military-industrial complex...and you think this might have a happy ending somewhere over the rainbow, AG? Do you? Because I really don't think so.

Post graphs all you want, the big picture is that too many people are struggling and will be worse off as time goes by.

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Faith
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posted August 15, 2013 03:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for explaining, Ian.

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AcousticGod
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posted August 15, 2013 06:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for AcousticGod     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You can call my Saturn whatever you like.
Some of the ways you word things are meant to manipulate in a way that is lacking in informational context. You give an emotional response or a pseudo-emotional response in place of an informative or informed response. That drives me crazy.

quote:
Who cares who the President is? Not me!

You've expressed that you do on many occasions, so that's a logical fallacy.

quote:
And these Keynesian economists are the best minds in the country, and they're the same exact ones who keep getting us deeper in debt and further towards a police state, by investing so much fiat currency in the military-industrial complex...and you think this might have a happy ending somewhere over the rainbow, AG? Do you? Because I really don't think so.

Post graphs all you want, the big picture is that too many people are struggling and will be worse off as time goes by.


This is all an attempt to get out of saying anything of substance. You'd rather paint a speculative picture than engage in any sort of honest treatment of the information. It's not about "Keynesian" economists. It's not about running up debt...debt which costs less in real terms when additional money is put into the system by the way. It's certainly not about a police state, or the military industrial complex. (I don't know why you think those speculations are pertinent to this conversation.) Do I think this might have a happy ending somewhere? Are you trying to manipulate me into adopting your brand of gloom and doom, which you deny having? This is the Pisces Moon I'm talking about: creating an imaginary picture in order to cast something in a different light than it actually is.

And then you end with the idea that I could be as factual as I want, and post as many graphs as I want, but I couldn't possibly see the big picture better than you. I couldn't possibly know that people will work it out, because there's no precedent for people adapting and working it out (Lessons 1 and 2 on How to be a Human). It's all designed to try to make you look like you know what you're talking about (without showing any comprehension of the material), and pose a vague question for the person posting factual information about the material.

How did we get down this rabbit hole?

If you can't tackle the information, but believe the information you've been relaying is correct, why aren't you questioning those that gave you that information? You've bought into all of these ideas, and when I question you on them, you come up shorthanded. Am I to think that you just can't communicate what you "know" very well? It's hard to deal with someone that's got an opinion about everything, but can't adequately tackle the reasons for the opinions. It's getting to the point where I wish you were Jwhop, because then at least I could be responding to the article that potentially misinformed you, rather than putting all of this burden on your shrugging shoulders. I'm coming quickly to the epiphany that the most opinionated people are those least able to defend their opinions.

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Faith
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posted August 16, 2013 11:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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Faith
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posted August 16, 2013 11:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Faith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
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