posted April 16, 2013 08:14 PM            

For the record, I think he's overstating things (but no more than the father to two girls probably has the right to).
But also for the record, there's a kernel of truth there.

Note: ag: When women on this board have explained how, in their POV or that of others, women have to be wary of men/which men they trust, this is what they're talking about.

And the article that clued me in (since I don't have cable): http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/culturebox/2013/04/lo uis_c_k_feminism_oh_my_god_on_hbo_proves_comic_a_feminist.html

posted April 16, 2013 08:48 PM            

I can't say that *I* particularly feel that way, but I've known women that have, not out of spite but due to prior personal experiences or prior experiences of friends or loved ones.

In the interest of understanding, I thought that it would be a useful bit.

Edited to add: I know that my Mom - 5'2", under 100 lbs until she hit menopause, and a former victim of sexual assault - was a nervous wreck when I began dating for the reasons stated in this video.

I hung out with/liked mostly geeky, hyper-intellectual guys, though, and just didn't see her problem.
Now, as a parent to (ohmygawd) three girls, I kind of do.

Edited again to add: And my husband's building his gun collection

posted April 16, 2013 09:24 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mockingbird:
Edited again to add: And my husband's building his gun collection

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Not to worry he'll scare all the guys away with a shot gun. "You think your dating my daughter".

posted April 16, 2013 10:04 PM            

'Cause it seems like you didn't.

This wasn't about entitlement, this was about the possibility of getting assaulted by someone 50+ lbs heavier than you.

posted April 16, 2013 10:09 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
i'm just going to be brutally honest, the whole thing ticks me off. all these parents are doing is raising girls to think they are above men and have huge entitlement complexes. Why dont parents raise their daughters to treat men with respect as well , it should be a two way street. All I hear is parents telling girls that boys are the enemy while they stroke their ego and tell them how beautiful and perfect they are and no man will ever deserve them. These same parents are very harsh on their sons and talk to them like dogs. We have all this going on in our society yet we always want to talk about how hard girls have it. am i the only one seeing a huge imbalance here?

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posted April 16, 2013 10:22 PM            

That's weak as hell.

Edited to add: And he doesn't even bring up his daughters. I inferred that having daughters reaching dating age may have led him to ponder these matters.

posted April 16, 2013 10:26 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
No, I didnt have to watch it. I know it may not be about entitlement but thats what that type of parenting breeds.

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Ph.

That's like a kid saying that he knows he won't like green frosting because he's tried broccoli and knows that he doesn't like green things.

posted April 16, 2013 11:05 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by juniperb:
Mockingbird, I only have one daughter and oh! the years of worry until she grew up and became a woman. To think of 3 lovely lass`s is ... With you & hubby at the helm, they will do just fine!!

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posted April 16, 2013 11:48 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
Well its relates to what i'm talking about. I do not like the whole dynamic where parents raise their sons to respect girls while they raise their daughters to disrespect boys/men and think badly of them.

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quote:

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I was raised to respect girls and do all kinds of crap for them and its been the same for all the guys I know. But these same parents tell their daughters to be suspicious of men and teach them that men are guilty until proven innocent Imo that is messed up.[/B]

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For the first part of this statement, I'll say that's awesome.
I've known quite a few stellar men such as yourself, and a few boys who've not been.
And I'll also say that, in my opinion, males are getting a bad rap in much of our popular media.
In much of what you'll find, it's primarily the immature, the dishonorable, the foolish, and the weak which is on display.

I think that's wrong, and it's one of the many reasons I'm so grateful that my husband is as he is - so that our daughters may have manhood modeled for them, so that they may know both what men can be and what they should be. Now, I might be coming at this from a slightly antiquated angle - for instance, my husband opens doors for me and probably will until the day he's no longer physically capable, and I think it's the most dear thing in the world.
But, regardless, our daughters are being raised to at once expect civility and gentility and to return such respect in kind.

...But we're still going to have to have a talk with them one day about how not all boys can be trusted, and about the possible consequences of trust mislaid.

posted April 16, 2013 11:51 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
^ I think the whole gun thing goes way too far.

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I think my husband would disagree, and, if a man were to assault one of his girls, he would most likely shoot him in the head and push him in a river.

He is a Hatfield, after all

posted April 17, 2013 01:00 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by mockingbird:
I think my husband would disagree, and, if a man were to assault one of his girls, he would most likely shoot him in the head and push him in a river.

He is a Hatfield, after all

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posted April 17, 2013 05:13 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
am i the only one seeing a huge imbalance here?

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I think you are the person that takes it furthest.

quote:

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Originally posted by aquaguy91:
well that would be understandable. my only gripe about the whole thing is it seems parents only tell their daughters about the negative side of guys and never the positive.

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How would a parent tell their children the good side? I'm curious in fact, to find out what you believe is the good side of men. It seems to me, that your answer would be; masculinity, they will protect you, pay for you, keep you safe, look after you, marry you etc. That is quite an out dated view, and somewhat sexist.

There will always be a disparity between sexes, there will always be different things that we can offer each other.

I can completely understand how the world can be a terrifying place for a woman. If we walk down a dark street at night, we think absolutely nothing of it. Whereas a woman may take that trip and be extremely concerned about any potential aggressors. Despite the fact that muggings, assaults and sexual assaults at least in the U.K are extremely rare.

My point is that the vast majority of women are no match for a guy. Can you honestly tell me, that if a woman stepped out from a shadowed corner or whatever, and accosted you, that you would be afraid and let her mug you or physically assault you?

Look at it from a woman's perspective, a man steps out from a shadowed corner or whatever and accosts her, to mug her or assault her. Do you honestly think she is not afraid and will resist as much as possible?

In both scenarios, resisting is what should be done, most attackers' look for a victim, trouble free and easy. If you fight back in any way, make sounds, get angry, they will generally be surprised and leave you alone. There are very few who would escalate to a more violent confrontation, again in the U.K.

Women are typically shorter, weigh less, and not as strong as men. They are at a physical disadvantage. Then they are shown by society that they are incapable of enforcing themselves on life. This is not the case, the unbelievable amount of media, has the female lead as helpless and cowering, needing to be saved. Women are taught that to be loud and aggressive is wrong, and even in some cases to acquiesce to men in the hopes of it not getting worse.

Why should women have to live their lives, without being able to do what they want, why should they have to go through life being afraid? All these articles about 'boys will be boys' and physically or sexually assaulting women, 'you shouldn't dress like that if you don't want attention' etc. How is it the right of anyone to tell a woman what she can and cannot do. Why should she be treated differently just because she is a woman?

I am not saying men are bad creatures, the majority are okay. Again it is the few who spoil our reputation, who make women feel afraid. I do think that women need to be a little more assertive in their life, ask for the things they want, and show they won't stand for the kind of things that men do sometimes throw at them.
Such as objectification, leering, and the like.
They should learn basic streetwise self defense to help them feel safer, and react more positively for themselves in situations.

I am by no means attacking Men and saying we are fully to blame, although we do have a lot to answer for. I realise that the world is not always a friendly happy place for our female co-habitors, and to think that they need a man in their life to protect them from that is sexist, and out dated. They should have the same freedoms to live as men do.

posted April 17, 2013 06:11 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by PixieJane:
What a vivid imagination you have to imagine you heard so many parents say that (and not anything else).

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posted April 17, 2013 06:34 AM            

I just want to add that in my experience, it's VERY common for men to be sexually aggressive and push the envelope.

And I am plain looking, but even I have been in many situations where I was feeling threatened because some guy much larger and stronger than me decided to put his hand on my leg or worse. I don't want to go into details, but it's been a lot worse.

And many of the women I know have been in the same situation. I know so many girls who were date raped in college... along with the more public scandals like when one class president was accused by several girls of date rape and, of course, he just got some minor school punishment, not jail time.

Aren't you outraged by that aquaguy? Because you say you want to see women protected.

As a mother of course I'm going to worry about my daughter being mistreated by men..it would be reckless of me not to make sure she is aware of the dangers.

Sorry if decent, courteous men have to suffer being stereotyped or feared because of how SOME of them behave, but aquaguy is constantly stereotyping women, so I don't see why it bothers him that men are stereotyped as well.

posted April 17, 2013 12:10 PM            

It's hard for me to abandon my idea that your views are based on where you live when you say the things you've said here. You've never seen a young women raised to respect men? That means that all of their fathers are d-bags or else absent...or do you think that girls that have fathers they respect still have no respect towards men?